Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread
Print Thread
Go To
#67566 03/26/10 05:00 AM
Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 8,333
Veteran
OP Offline
Veteran
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 8,333
Thought I'd post this because even I ignore the sticky's at the top after a while, so read the top one just posted, though they need to fix the links. A lot of Realtracks were worked on in this, and you can see by the list that it includes a free Dxi synth from Coyote for 64 bit systems, and I compared that and my Ketron and with the standard midi files I was surprised by the quality.


John Conley
Musica est vita
Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 603
Journeyman
Offline
Journeyman
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 603
From the Coyote Readme file:

CoyoteWT works with any compatible DXi host program to allow it to produce
very realistic instrument sounds. It does this by using a database of recordings
of actual instruments, and playing individual notes back on command. The database is
a file called GM.dls, which is included with each copy of Windows.

So it doesn't present any sounds of its own. It's a mini sampler playing the bank that has always been provided with Windows. That bank is now a lot better than it once was; the result is good.


Larry
______
Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,609
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,609
I don't want to start any rumors, but I have heard that the DLS file format makes replacing the sounds pretty easy. Haven't researched it lately, but this may be the nudge I need!

Wiki'd-
"The DLS family is closely related to the proprietary SoundFonts format from Creative Labs. All versions of DLS to date are based on the wavetable music synthesis technique, however in principle the DLS file format could be used to represent instrument definitions for other music synthesis techniques. "DLS" is an acronym for "Downloadable Sounds", and also the initials of DLS 1 project leader Dave Sparks of Creative Labs."

My memory tells me there is a way to make soundfonts into dls files. Not sure if this interests others too.

Last edited by rharv; 03/26/10 06:51 AM.

Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 603
Journeyman
Offline
Journeyman
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 603
This part is not not a rumor: Violating GM.dls is the work of seconds. It lies there (or at least used to) unprotected in a Windows directory, just asking for it. One needs only to find or build a replacement.

DLS (no offense --I know you know) is the ancient "downloadable sounds" sample-format that never caught on before Soundfonts pushed it aside. I'm now hopelessly vague on the editing and the conversion possibilities. Never did much of it in the first place, and it was 12 years ago, or something. I seem to remember tinkering was no problem.

So maybe we should get fancy with this.


Larry
______
Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,609
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,609
As I edited above, I believe you can rename sf2 files to work .. but as you mentioned, it has been a while.

Time to pull out the olde backups of soundfonts this weekend.. and tinker a bit!


Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 603
Journeyman
Offline
Journeyman
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 603
That's the way I remember it, too -- SF2 conversion was a snap, and possibly amounted only to renaming.




Edit:

Here's something from Jennifer Hruska (whose word is good) in Electronic Musician in 2000:

DLS sound libraries are more difficult to find, but programs such as Awave and Audio Compositor allow you to open a SoundFont and save it as a DLS Level 1 or DLS Level 2 file. Be aware, however, that when you convert from a SoundFont to a DLS Level 1 file, you lose any filtering or layering programmed into the SoundFont patch.


The only ominous part is the bit about losing your layering and filters in DLS Level 1. Any good soundfont I ever made or acquired depended a lot on layering and filtering. Let's hope "DLS Level 2" preserves that stuff.

Her strong implication is that there is somewhat more involved than re-naming. But that software is common enough.


Larry
______
Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,609
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,609
Another learning spot -
http://spheredev.org/wiki/Changing_soundfonts

includes 'rules' for renaming DSL files..


Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 603
Journeyman
Offline
Journeyman
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 603
Cool.

GM.dls lives in Windows/system32/drivers.

I used Awave to make a Level2 DLS of my favorite (basically Jennifer Hruska) soundfont and shoved it in there as GM.dls. So far so good.

But El Coyote refuses to load it, 71 megs insted of the original 3 1/2. Size limit? Accepts no substitutes of any kind? Awave version of a DLS file defective? Mystery.

Forge ahead.


Larry
______
Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,609
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,609
Even being able to improve the MS wavetable is an improvement!
Forte probably does have some proprietary stuff

The free version is probably meant to not be tampered with..

Last edited by rharv; 03/26/10 10:06 AM.

Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 15,544
PG Music Staff
Offline
PG Music Staff
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 15,544
Yes, the Coyote Wavetable is a synth that uses the GM.DLS soundset that is included in Windows. This is the soundset that is used for the MS GS Wavetable synth. To my ears, the Coyote Wavetable sounds better than the MS GS Wavetable, possibly because the Coyote Wavetable has built-in reverb support. The Roland VSC DXi has slightly better sounds, and more sounds (but doesn't work on 64 bit Windows.).

The Coyote Wavetable also doesn't crash on BBW exit in Vista.

The Forte synth is different, and much better. It has its own sounds, and is configurable, works with other sounds etc.


Have Fun!
Peter Gannon
PG Music Inc.
Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 12,580
Veteran
Online Content
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 12,580
Hmmm, I don't have AWAVE, but I still have Audio Compositor. I'll have to play with it this weekend and see if I can convert one of my favorite soundfonts.


John

Laptop-HP Omen I7 Win11Pro 32GB 2x2TB, 1x4TB SSD
Desktop-ASUS-I7 Win10Pro 32GB 2x1.5TB, 2x2TB, 1x4TB SATA

BB2024/UMC404HD/Casios/Cakewalk/Reaper/Studio One/MixBus/Notion/Finale/Dorico/Noteworthy/NI/Halion/IK

http://www.sus4chord.com
Band-in-a-Box for Windows
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 603
Journeyman
Offline
Journeyman
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 603
I am going to report no results in loading the CoyoteWT with new sounds. I tried 10 or so progressively-smaller soundsets converted and renamed to to GM.dls. I was able to get them to stick in the correct directory, but the Coyote player will not load anything except for the original Windows one.


Larry
______
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Go To

Link Copied to Clipboard
ChatPG

Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.

ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.

PG Music News
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 Review: 4.75 out of 5 Stars!

If you're looking for a in-depth review of the newest Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows version, you'll definitely find it with Sound-Guy's latest review, Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows Review: Incredible new capabilities to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs.

A few excerpts:
"The Tracks view is possibly the single most powerful addition in 2024 and opens up a new way to edit and generate accompaniments. Combined with the new MultiPicker Library Window, it makes BIAB nearly perfect as an 'intelligent' composer/arranger program."

"MIDI SuperTracks partial generation showing six variations – each time the section is generated it can be instantly auditioned, re-generated or backed out to a previous generation – and you can do this with any track type. This is MAJOR! This takes musical experimentation and honing an arrangement to a new level, and faster than ever."

"Band in a Box continues to be an expansive musical tool-set for both novice and experienced musicians to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs, as well as an extensive educational resource. It is huge, with hundreds of functions, more than any one person is likely to ever use. Yet, so is any DAW that I have used. BIAB can do some things that no DAW does, and this year BIAB has more DAW-like functions than ever."

Happy Easter! Holiday Hours...

2024 is well underway - it's already Easter Weekend!

Our Customer Service hours this weekend are:

Friday, March 29: 8-4
Saturday, March 30: 8-4
Sunday, March 31: closed

Regular hours resume Monday, April 1st - no joke!

Convenient Ways to Listen to Band-in-a-Box® Songs Created by Program Users!

The User Showcase Forum is an excellent place to share your Band-in-a-Box® songs and listen to songs other program users are creating!

There are other places you can listen to these songs too! Visit our User Showcase page to sort by genre, artist (forum name), song title, and date - each listing will direct you to the forum post for that song.

If you'd rather listen to these songs in one place, head to our Band-in-a-Box® Radio, where you'll have the option to select the genre playlist for your listening pleasure. This page has SoundCloud built in, so it won't redirect you. We've also added the link to the Artists SoundCloud page here, and a link to their forum post.

We hope you find some inspiration from this amazing collection of User Showcase Songs!

Congratulations to the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!

We've just announced the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!

There are 45 winners, each receiving a Band-in-a-Box 2024 UltraPAK! Read the official announcement to see if you've won.

Our User Showcase Forum receives more than 50 posts per day, with people sharing their Band-in-a-Box songs and providing feedback for other songs posted.

Thank you to everyone who has contributed!

Video: Volume Automation in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®

We've created a video to help you learn more about the Volume Automation options in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows.

Band-in-a-Box® 2024: Volume Automation

www.pgmusic.com/manuals/bbw2024full/chapter11.htm#volume-automation

Video: Audio Input Monitoring with Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®

We've created this short video to explain Audio Input Monitoring within Band-in-a-Box® 2024, and included some tips & troubleshooting details too!

Band-in-a-Box® 2024: Audio Input Monitoring

3:17: Tips
5:10: Troubleshooting

www.pgmusic.com/manuals/bbw2024full/chapter11.htm#audio-input-monitoring

Video: Enhanced Melodists in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®!

We've enhanced the Melodists feature included in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows!

Access the Melodist feature by pressing F7 in the program to open the new MultiPicker Library and locate the [Melodist] tab.

You can now generate a melody on any track in the program - very handy! Plus, you select how much of the melody you want generated - specify a range, or apply it to the whole track.

See the Melodist in action with our video, Band-in-a-Box® 2024: The Melodist Window.

Learn even more about the enhancements to the Melodist feature in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows at www.pgmusic.com/manuals/bbw2024upgrade/chapter3.htm#enhanced-melodist

Forum Statistics
Forums66
Topics81,398
Posts732,537
Members38,442
Most Online2,537
Jan 19th, 2020
Newest Members
danielsk, Mark Morgan, zagrajbarke, Ernest J, Izzy
38,442 Registered Users
Top Posters(30 Days)
MarioD 200
Al-David 127
DC Ron 115
rsdean 85
dcuny 85
Today's Birthdays
(charlie), WobblyGstring
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5