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Posted By: DHD Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/14/12 05:48 PM
I'm looking for some guidance in using backing tracks.
I am hoping someone here, that may have tried the many different approaches to this issue, can lend me some advice as to the Pros and Cons that come with these different methods.

I have RealTrack drum and bass backing tracks that I have put together using BIAB and RB.
I've panned the drums to the right and bass to the left.
So that I can plug them into their individual channels on my PA, and have individual volume and eq controls of each.
I don't plan to expand my use of backing tracks beyond these two instruments (drums and bass).
These backing tracks would be used by a duo, consisting of male and female vocals and one guitar rhythm/lead.
We would be playing at Retirement Facilities with tunes like, Ain't Misbehaving, Girl From Ipanema, and Crazy.

I've been searching the internet for ideas on what might be a cost effective way to play these backing tracks
thru my powered Peavey mono mixer.
I've read that some folks use Looper pedals like the JamMan Solo, some use small battery powered MP3 players,
some have mixers with usb inputs and control the backing tracks thru their laptop.
and the one idea that I'm leaning toward is a DJ type single CD player with USB (for flashdrive).
I like the DJ CD deck idea because it can play a single song and stop, without having to reach for a pause button. This would also be very cost effective, with my present inventory of musical equipment.
Any and all ideas would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you

Bill
Posted By: filkertom Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/14/12 06:54 PM
I've got a few friends who carry their tracks on either MP3 player with a good playlist manager, or an iPhone/iPod/iPad. Just put your MP3 backing tracks on it, plug it into the sound system (stereo mini-plug to stereo 1/4" or whatever's appropriate -- you might want to keep a mini-to-mini and mini-to-1/4" with the MP3 player at all times), open your player program, and click Play.
Posted By: Rob Helms Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/14/12 07:15 PM
I like a laptop, which i do not have one right now. So i use my home build desktop it is installed in a cabinet with my mixer and such. Rolls on wheels, and all.
Posted By: DHD Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/14/12 07:19 PM
I've got a few friends who carry their tracks on either MP3 player with a good playlist manager, or an iPhone/iPod/iPad. Just put your MP3 backing tracks on it, plug it into the sound system (stereo mini-plug to stereo 1/4" or whatever's appropriate -- you might want to keep a mini-to-mini and mini-to-1/4" with the MP3 player at all times), open your player program, and click Play.

Hi Tom

I have read of folks doing that, but I have never heard the end results.
Did the sound quality, sound ok to you ?

Thank you for responding to my question.

Bill
Posted By: Danny C. Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/14/12 07:29 PM
I love the laptop, mainly because I have the chord sheet rolling in front of me at all times and when you do many, many tunes (and at my age) I don't even try to remember all the changes anymore. Been using one for too long to remember (oh, we already addressed memory) with no issues.

Break A Leg!
Posted By: DHD Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/14/12 07:31 PM
I like a laptop, which i do not have one right now. So i use my home build desktop it is installed in a cabinet with my mixer and such. Rolls on wheels, and all.

Certainly would have more control over the backing tracks, which would be really nice.
What would you do for an interface between the laptop and the mixer ?

Bill
Posted By: DHD Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/14/12 07:37 PM
Quote:

I love the laptop, mainly because I have the chord sheet rolling in front of me at all times and when you do many, many tunes (and at my age) I don't even try to remember all the changes anymore. Been using one for too long to remember (oh, we already addressed memory) with no issues.

Break A Leg!




The laptop idea is sounding more interesting.
My laptop's sound quality is terrible.
What laptop to PA interface are you using ?

Bill
Posted By: Rob Helms Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/14/12 10:40 PM
You can just go directly from the laptops audio output to the mixer.

In my desktop unit i have a M-Audio 24/96 card, and it has great sound. I have two 320 gig drives, in the system, and one TC Helicon harmonizer.
Posted By: Joe Gordon Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/14/12 11:06 PM
Hi Bill, Like you I only have Bass, Drums....sometimes Guitar....... on backing tracks.
I'm playing & singing, live on Guitar & Banjo.
My equipment is very low tech! Large Sony MiniDisc player adapted to play from a foot pedal. I set it on "Auto Pause".........Which makes it as seamless as possible for me.......no fiddling with hand controls.....most of my gigs are on stage, so I like to "present" things if possible. Another bonus with the Sony, is the ability to "edit" & change a running order to suit. Works for me! Joe G.
Bill, I use my iPhone into the house PA or my own PA to play .WAV files that I prepare. Before that, I used an iPod but any MP3 player would do. The 1/8" headphone output jack is the same on all of them, and is the same as you would use on a laptop unless you had an outboard sound module. I bring a 25' RCA to RCA cable split down the middle for when I plug into powered speakers. One end has the 1/4" phone jack adapters, and the other end has an RCA female to stereo 1/8" adapter.

About the songs you play, I know the first two, "Ain't Misbehaving", and "Girl From Ipanema", but I'm not familiar with the third, "Crazy at Retirement Facilities". Wonder what those lyrics are.
Posted By: DHD Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/15/12 10:10 AM
Quote:


Bill, I use my iPhone into the house PA or my own PA to play .WAV files that I prepare. Before that, I used an iPod but any MP3 player would do. The 1/8" headphone output jack is the same on all of them, and is the same as you would use on a laptop unless you had an outboard sound module. I bring a 25' RCA to RCA cable split down the middle for when I plug into powered speakers. One end has the 1/4" phone jack adapters, and the other end has an RCA female to stereo 1/8" adapter.




I do not have an iPhone, iPod or MP3 player to experiment with, and know very little about these units.
Do any of these units have the ability to play a single track, without the user having to activate pause or stop ?
At some forums I have visited, some folks complained of occasional audible beeps generating from their MP3 device through the PA system, or when activating buttons on the MP3 device.
I would assume that these beeps could have been deactivated ?
I like the idea of using .Wav files over MP3.
Do these large .Wav file sizes hinder file retrieval ?
Does larger file usage effect, battery recharge intervals ?

Quote:


About the songs you play, I know the first two, "Ain't Misbehaving", and "Girl From Ipanema", but I'm not familiar with the third, "Crazy at Retirement Facilities". Wonder what those lyrics are.




"Crazy at Retirement Facilities"
I imagine it could have some very comical lyrics, if such a song existed.

Good catch Matt.

Some very poor sentence structure on my part. Sorry.

I changed it to read:

We would be playing at Retirement Facilities with tunes like, "Ain't Misbehaving", "Girl From Ipanema", and "Crazy".

Thank you Matt for responding to my questions and catching my mistake.

Bill
My players do not beep.

If I'm playing a song and want to prevent it going to the next until I am ready, I use the audio editor to add 30 seconds of silence at the end of songs. That way, if there is applause, I can take a moment before adjusting the player .

Wave files load with the same speed. Not all M3 players can use wave files, so check before buying. I don't think there is any difference in battery performance, only storage space, from using wave files instead of MP3s.
Posted By: Keebo Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/15/12 01:07 PM
There is an app for idevices that is tailored for live set list usage. It stops after each song until you press continue. IIRC, it supposedly allows you to easily find and play a song outside of the set list and continues where it started in the list afterwards.

I haven't tried it nor do I remember the name of the app off hand.
Keebo, if you remember what app that is, please post. Thanks.
If you go the iPhone route - remember to remove the SIM card or go into 'Airplane Mode' to prevent unwanted mishaps!!!

Kevin
Posted By: eddie1261 Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/15/12 07:13 PM
Quote:

Bill, I use my iPhone into the house PA or my own PA to play .WAV files that I prepare.




In airplane mode I can only hope..... unlike the young lady at songwriter circle one night who was pouring her guts out onto the stage when her iPhone rang.....
Posted By: eddie1261 Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/15/12 07:14 PM
Quote:

"Crazy at Retirement Facilities"




Okay, NOW it sounds like a songwiter's challenge to me.....
Posted By: Danny C. Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/15/12 07:14 PM
Matt,

"If there is applause" . . . I love that line.

Could be a song title.

Later,

PS: After hearing your stuff if there is no applause, the audience has no doubt expired.
Funny, guys.

I would like to add "Crazy at Retirement Parties" to my repertoire, though. Is it a blues?
Posted By: eddie1261 Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/15/12 07:36 PM
Sounds like it would be bossa, Matt, right in your genre!!!

"I can just imagine the posibilities
Crazy at retirement facilities...."
Posted By: jazzmammal Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/15/12 08:15 PM
Of course it's a blues, dummy... Where have you been?

<Med shuffle>

Chorus/Intro from the 5 "Them crazy old retirement facility blues yeah, yeah, yeah...."

Verse/ Now get up from those wheelchairs,,, swing them around...pull out those silly hearing aids and really dig the sound...Oh baby, yeah those cra_zy.. retirement facility blues...

"I'm telling ya right now son, it's them crazy old retirement facility blues, ooohhhh yeeaahhhh" da dum, da dum...big guitar lick on the 5...

Verse 2/...Ok you guys write it.

Back to the mundane. If your laptop is noisy you probably have an old one or you're not using a ground plug and you're picking up ground hum. Try it with the battery, it it's quiet then you need a two prong adapter. The newer ones have very good mini plug audio outs.


Bluesy Bob
Posted By: Danny C. Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/15/12 09:34 PM
Quote:

Quote:

I love the laptop, mainly because I have the chord sheet rolling in front of me at all times and when you do many, many tunes (and at my age) I don't even try to remember all the changes anymore. Been using one for too long to remember (oh, we already addressed memory) with no issues.

Break A Leg!




The laptop idea is sounding more interesting.
My laptop's sound quality is terrible.
What laptop to PA interface are you using ?

Bill




I am using the 1/8 jack from the laptop headphone hole right into a little mixer via RCAs. From there 1/4 jacks to my powered speakers. Before the powered speakers I ran the 1/8 from the laptop right into the pa via RCAs.

I am sure you will find in todays (still using a old 6 year old Lenovo as a back up) laptops the sound quality is vast improved over the past. But unless you are running an antique the sound breakdown should not be with the laptop.

What interface do you use?

Later,
Posted By: Keebo Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/16/12 02:56 AM
Matt,

The name of the app I was referring to is BackTrax. I may have been a little misleading about it returning to the set list after going outside of the list and returning. I must have read too many app descriptions lately :-). Still, it looks quite viable for the live musician.

Good luck.
Thanks, I'll check it out!
Posted By: DHD Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 03/24/12 09:50 AM
I want to thank everyone for their hardware recommendations for playing backing tracks.

I just happened to come across this piece of DJ gear in a Mom & Pop Music store.

Cortex HDC-500

I just started playing with it and it seems like it's going to do the job for me.

It plays MP3 and wave files, has two USBs for flash drives, hard drives or even a computer keyboard.
RCA and XLR out.

Thanks again everyone.

Bill
I wanted to point out a link which can be useful :
SyncInside - Backing tracks advanced player
www.syncinside.net

[EDIT]

Camera Connection Kit and a Class compliant USB sound card are required to exploit the multitrack features.

[/EDIT]
Posted By: GDaddy Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 04/20/13 07:41 PM
Maybe I was one of the first to use the original Apple Ipod Shirt-Pocket
unit into my laptop and then inti a Akai Mixer.

Before that I often brought a Peavey Road Rack loaded:
Crown Base Station Amp (300 Watts)
Peavey 701-R vertical mixer
Side by Side Lexicon LX-1 and LX-5 Effect Boxes
Lexicon Vortex Non-Digital Effects Box
Side by Side Roland M3-R's with separate Editor
Yamaha Motif Rack Unit
Sound enhancer Box

Now I don't roll a rack around any more...heap everyghing on my motorized gurney!
Now I use two Keyboard Amps for my PA System. Move em with
my new Catapillar Front End Loader. Deisel Fumes pretty overpowering
but it does cover up the "Mary Jane" Breezes

I have a trained army of "Jazz Roaches" that drag in the guitars and keyboards.

Tip for long lived cats like me: Bring a couple of heaveyweight nymphos to help!

Posted By: Jivy Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 02/15/17 11:28 PM
Well, it's an old thread, but here goes anyway.

I may be the only person who has ever used backing tracks with a marching band. Many years ago I took a teaching gig in a small county high school. The band was pretty tiny, but, of course we had to show up every Friday night for the football halftime.

The band was severely lacking in low end - no tubas, no trombones, etc. Basically, it was flutes and trumpets! I got the idea of using band in a box to create rhythm section backups. Wrote 2-way harmony parts for the flutes and trumpets (even had a couple of clarinets). It was one of those communities where they really like polkas - so I put together a book of polkas for the band, and also sequenced a few simple published band arrangements.

One of the dads had a welding shop and he built a cart that would hold a 500-watt guitar amp, a 12-volt marine battery, and a heavy duty inverter. An Ensonic VFX-SD sat on top of the cart and furnished the sound -- and it put out A LOT of sound!

I clearly remember the first football game of the season. We had a long bus trip to some little town far to the south. We were a little late getting to the stadium. As we were getting off of the bus the other band was already in the stadium playing away. It was a fairly large band, probably a little over 100 players, and my kids were feeling a bit outclassed.

This was the first game of the season, and neither band was going to march on the field. We had agreed beforehand that the bands would play a "concert" in the stands during the halftime.

The home band played first. They did a reasonable job. Then it was our turn. We played a couple of tunes and I could not help but notice that everyone was pleasantly surprised at the great sound the little band was getting.

After a couple of tunes, I told the drum major to wait a few minutes and then start up on of our "special" polka arrangements. I wanted to go to the other side of the stadium and see how it sounded from there. I was about halfway across the end zone when the band began playing. It sounded great - like a 140 piece band!

When I got to the section of bleachers where the home band was, the band members were literally sitting there with their mouths open. I remember the band director's words, "Wow! How do you get so much sound from that little band? How many trumpets do you have?".

"Well I only have five trumpets", I replied. Then I pointed to the press box behind the band, "But I told them that I want that press box on the ground behind the stadium when we leave here!".

I never explained any more about how we did it. But now you know that Band In A Box has a marching band history!
That's a funny story. I bet the other band leader is still scratching his head....


Charlie
Posted By: AudioTrack Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 02/16/17 09:25 AM
Great story.
I love it when the underdog comes shining through!
laugh - thanks for sharing!
Posted By: Pat Marr Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 02/16/17 11:13 AM
what a clever solution, and great use for band in a Box!
Posted By: jazzsax Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 02/16/17 03:00 PM
As a retired band director I think that is halarious.
The closest I can come to that is that I once I had a Maestro woodwind sound system that was able to synthesize sounds. I would hook it up to a clarinet and have an instant bassoon in my elementary band.
I use an iPod touch that has all my songs listed in a playlist in alphabetical order. This Is way is done to match the way my sheet music so I can read my sheet music while I play. A lot of the songs I have memorized but there are some pan songs I still play to sheet music. I can't use a laptop becuase I have some songs that I made on an the either the 2014 version of BIAB or 2015, and some where given to me buy my steel pan teacher and there are on my iPod. Plus the nice thing about using my iPod is that it can jump right to the next song. However, the volume level of each song is inconsistent so one track may be quite while one may be loud, but not rock concert loud, as I play jazz, calypso, island, and pop, and soca tunes. If you don't know what soca is, it is the dance style of Trinidad and Tobago.
Bill thanks for starting this excellent topic. I have a question or two for Joe : Joe, are you still using this setup ? Would it be possible to pm you on this ? I'm also looking for something low cost that is simple and reliable. I play guitar and sing a little, and I might be playing soon with a drummer friend who also sings. It would be really cool if we could add a bass track and maybe another guitar or some synth parts, etc, for doing songs live. Could this be done without a soundman working a board out front ?

I'm also curious about how the sony mini disc player can be operated with a foot control. Would this be an ordinary Sony mini disc player ? I can't imagine how this could be operated with foot controls, but your setup sounds really compact and easy to use. I sure would like to duplicate what you're doing.
Posted By: jazzmammal Re: Hardware for playing backing tracks ? - 02/10/20 07:27 PM
I see this is your first post so you're forgiven for not realizing this thread was started 8 years ago then resurrected in 2017. Note the post before yours is February 2017. I haven't seen most of these people on the forum in years.

Your question is very common and it's very easy to answer. Get a tablet either Android or iPad. Both can store and playback MP3's or pure wav's. The wav's take up a lot more space while the MP3's are compressed. Don't be worried about that MP3 still sound great. If you ever listen to Youtube music, Soundcloud, iTunes etc they're all compressed too usually more than an MP3 is. Your phone has the same capability as a tablet but you'll be happier with the bigger screen on the tablet. Sound goes through the headphone out with an adapter cable so it can plug into your PA. As for apps for IOS there is Forscore:

https://forscore.co/about-music/

For Android there's Mobilsheets:

https://www.zubersoft.com/mobilesheets/

These let you create setlists, you can go from one song to the next with a bluetooth footswitch if you don't want to mess around with your finger on a touchscreen and both can link up to backing tracks so when you change songs both the leadsheet and backing tracks are ready to go.

If you already have a laptop you can use that as well but a laptop does not have easy access to these live performance apps you can get with IOS or Android. I'm sure there are probably DJ programs (not apps) for that but I'm not familiar with them.

Bob
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