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Here it is and it's great:

http://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-43056814

The judge said the words "Lacked the modicum of originality and creativity".

Gotta love it.

Bob
Very appropriate result.
Some people do draw a very long bow...
Quote:
Fox said the judge should have found an expert to rule on the originality of the lyrics, rather than interpreting them himself.

So they're going to contest the ruling on the basis that only "an expert in the music industry" is capable of determining if lyrics are banal. crazy
So if I write a song with lyrics of "Baby, baby, baby. Oh, baby, baby, baby" I can't sue if someone else writes a song with those lyrics?

Oh, wait - someone else already wrote that.
The copyright law is supposed to protect the profits of the author.

How is the Swift song going to hurt the sales of the original?

I felt the same way with the "Stairway To Heaven" and "Blurred Lines". I think the judge erred in Blurred Lines and I think we are too eager to sue for things that should be left alone.

A small, short quote from another song has a history long steeped in Classical, Folk, Jazz and even Pop music. I see it more as homage than theft.

But I'm not a judge.

Insights and incites by Notes
I wasn't even aware that this was going on. Crazy! I have to agree that it's a bit far-fetched to sue over that. People use snippits and lyrics within 10 seconds ( I think is the rule before you can call copyright, so long as you give proper credit) of other songs, especially in pop.
Originally Posted By: Matt Finley
So if I write a song with lyrics of "Baby, baby, baby. Oh, baby, baby, baby" I can't sue if someone else writes a song with those lyrics?

Oh, wait - someone else already wrote that.


Salt'n'Peppa are in their lawyers office right now!!!
So she and that judge are never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever ever getting back together?
Originally Posted By: Ember - PG Music
...... People use snippits and lyrics within 10 seconds ( I think is the rule before you can call copyright, so long as you give proper credit) of other songs, especially in pop.



not exactly. There is no specific time allowed where you can copy someone else's work and call it legit. There isn't for the most part a "fair use" clause that applies outside of a very narrow exception for religious and educational use. All other uses.... even use with no profit intended, requires the user to obtain a license at their expense to use those copyrighted snippits or the entire song, or a sample thereof. (Harry Fox Agency handles all licensing)

George Harrison was sued successfully over 3 notes. Others have been sued over the use of a short one second sample. In fact, the song and commercial use contracts I have to sign to place my music in libraries specifically states that I swear and avow that I own all the rights to all lyrics, music, tracks, and samples used in my music.

The issue in the Swift case, the contested lyrics were determined to be to ordinary to be considered copyrightable. And since that was the only part of the song that Taylor wrote that Sean Hall and Nathan Butler sued over..... the judge threw it out. In essence, Swift used a well worn cliche in her music and cliche's are in that category of being so commonly used that there isn't anything original in their use, and therefore.... not subject to copyright.
But..... each case would have to be decided by a judge and possibly a jury.

The judge was fair.... he gave them a second chance...."In sum, the lyrics at issue... are too brief, unoriginal, and uncreative to warrant protection under the Copyright Act," he wrote. However, he offered Hall and Butler one last chance to amend their argument before the case is settled on 26 February, "just in case there are more similarities between Playas Gon' Play and Shake it Off than Plaintiffs have alleged thus far"



I'm not a Swift fan but I have to agree with this decision.
Originally Posted By: eddie1261
Originally Posted By: Matt Finley
So if I write a song with lyrics of "Baby, baby, baby. Oh, baby, baby, baby" I can't sue if someone else writes a song with those lyrics?

Oh, wait - someone else already wrote that.


Salt'n'Peppa are in their lawyers office right now!!!

Eddie, I was thinking of Bieber. You mean someone else used those lyrics? It’s a banal conspiracy, I tell you!

Salt'n'Pepa - Push It
Originally Posted By: eddie1261



I'm not even gonna ask how you know that.......
Originally Posted By: Guitarhacker
Originally Posted By: eddie1261



I'm not even gonna ask how you know that.......


LOL!!! Because back in the day I was in the dance clubs. Playing and socializing on nights I was not playing! This song was a HUGE favorite of the DJs.
Okay, someone's gotta write a song called "Musicians gonna music". smile
Originally Posted By: jford
Okay, someone's gotta write a song called "Musicians gonna music". smile


As the homies say in my hood, "You done brung it up.... Do it."
Songwriters gotta ...

I give up. Woke up this mornin’,
I guess a lyrics description of my final profession wouldn't fare well in a song

"analysts gotta @n@l" LOL

Larry
Originally Posted By: Matt Finley
It’s a banal conspiracy, I tell you!

Ooooh... Banal Conspiracy? I think I've got my new band name. smile
Personally, I think the whole thing has gotten out of hand.

I can see copyright on samples, no matter how short. But a few words in an entirely different song? Come on.

But then, I am not the person who makes the laws.

Like I said, there is a long tradition in quoting others works in classical, folk, jazz, and pop recordings. As long as it doesn't interfere with the sales of the work quoted, I don't see a problem, and embrace the practice as homage.

Insights and incites by Notes
Originally Posted By: Notes Norton
Like I said, there is a long tradition in quoting others works in classical, folk, jazz, and pop recordings. As long as it doesn't interfere with the sales of the work quoted, I don't see a problem, and embrace the practice as homage.


The only reason that tradition exists is the original rights holder didn't push it. You mentioned classical and folk, most of that is public domain now but concerning songs from the last 50-60 years or whatever those "tribute musical quotes" are completely illegal. Plenty of stories about writers of songs who were broke and didn't have the money to hire attorneys to sue. They would have won.

Bob
Perhaps, but I don't think a small quote was even thought of as piracy, but homage.

Paul Desmond was famous for quoting snippets of melodies of songs from famous songwriters in his improvised solos. Songwriters who were still living and making a fortune on Broadway, Pop, and Cinema markets. They certainly could have and had the ASCAP/BMI guns plus money for lawyers. I just don't think they cared.

Now stealing enough to hurt the original is a different thing.

Personally, I think they are going too far with the lawsuits and quite a few should be thrown out. It's come more to gold digging than anything else IMHO.

Notes
Hard to think of the three word phrase, "playas gonna play" as "intellectual" property. Just sayin'.
Originally Posted By: jford
Hard to think of the three word phrase, "playas gonna play" as "intellectual" property. Just sayin'.


As originally performed by a bunch of people with absolutely NO intellect....
"Flugelhornists gonna fl..."

I still can't proceed.
Originally Posted By: Notes Norton
Now stealing enough to hurt the original is a different thing.


I have, on rare occasions, heard something with lifted parts and went back to listen to the original again, so the original actually benefited from the "piracy".

When swing made the brief comeback with Big Bad Voodoo Daddy, Cherry Poppin' Daddies, Squirrel Nut Zippers, etc.... there was a band called The Atomic Fireballs, and on one of their songs the sax solo started with a direct, exact rip from Clifford Brown's The Blues Walk. That caused me to go out in search of and found a great chart as revisited by Hal Leonard. Made me want to buy a Zoot Suit!!

And in that song was a subtle homage to Night Train!

This sampling lawsuit nonsense is just that. Phil Collins sued for lifting his snare drum sound. Now SOUND is a basis for litigation? I mean, Harrison lifted He's So Fine for My Sweet Lord, that was obvious. But a SOUND????

I have a big pill bottle full of dried Lima beans that I use for a deep pitched shaker. I hope The Jolly Green Giant doesn't sue me.
I've heard it said that musical geniuses never tell where they stole their ideas from....
Originally Posted By: Guitarhacker
I've heard it said that musical geniuses never tell where they stole their ideas from....


I heard the Mozart ripped a lot of his stuff from Das Beatles....
Wow - this is news to me! I didn't even realize this was going on. Can't say I disagree with the outcome of this one. It's insane to me how far they take this sometimes.
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