Hi all,

I love the pop and rock from the 60's through 80s - and now - 30+ years later, I'm actually able to perform these songs, thought memorizing and holding onto them is a real challenge.

That said - I haven't kept up with newer music, and the idea of playing for younger audiences has made me realize - they won't know many of these songs.

In the 'old days' - at least there were a few radio stations that told you the more popular stuff that people listened to. Perhaps it is still the same now, or is it ? I have no children to keep me in the modern music listening game. There are SOOOOO many genres and listening options - and a SOOOO much more music available - is it even possible to pick pop songs that would appeal to the widest audience of younger folks ?

Has anyone else addressed this and come to some way of picking newer songs that will appeal to younger audiences ? Or..., I can choose to just play for people close to my age, and if younger people are in the audience, let them listen to the old stuff : )

Joe,

Take the average age of your anticipated audience and calculate the year that they would have graduated high school to determine the popular songs of the day (and a few years either side ) then go to:

www.tropicalglen.com

Search for the appropriate genre. You will find a range of years to pick from.

The site owners pay their royalties so listen guilt-free.

Seems like a good start would be to ask the younger crowd what they like? They all stream. Check in with a few kids/grandkids of friends and ask what playlists they stream on Spotify, etc.

And what is the age? Don's link doesn't include millennials but should be very helpful for those older.

And, ultimately, are you really prepared musically and mentally to play the newer stuff?

Bud

This one is very popular.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYOjWnS4cMY




Regards,

Bob

Great song Bob, I have to learn that one, just to make it a little easier, do you happen to know the chords for it?

VERY funny! The problem is so much of millennial music is so far out from anything and I mean ANYTHING we can relate to. It's their world now and personally I would just stay out of it.

And then there's the picture of an old guy trying to play this stuff and butchering the hell out of it and the kids just laugh at you. I totally remember doing that in the 70's when I'd see a old lounge singer with plastic hair wearing a leisure suit trying to do the Stones. We would just laugh then too.

Most modern music is computer generated over one or maybe two chords. It's all production, no live players and the vocals are mostly young girls who's vocal range is in the stratosphere. Are you going to sing that stuff? I'm not saying ALL modern music isn't very musical just oh 90% or so. Lada Gaga is a pianist and she can do some good stuff, same for Nora Jones or Charlie Puth. But there isn't a whole of it that's for sure.

I try to not be that old guy with his head encased in concrete telling everybody how great it was back in the day. I hate that. I didn't get a whole lot of respect from my elders back in the 60's and 70's concerning my music so I try to give the kids now their respect. A month or so ago I pulled up the top 50 songs of 2017 on YouTube and started listening to them. Wow, just wow. Not that it was so bad, it really wasn't it's just that it's for DJ's not live players.

Bob

https://tabs.ultimate-guitar.com/tab/childish_gambino/this_is_america_chords_2380945



Regards,


Bob

Ha Ha

I took a look. What a complicated score! And fancy that they threw in a Dm and a Bb/D

(Just joking, of course )

I never imagined that my love for music (and inability to enjoy, relate and play newer music) would make me feel so old - I might need to look for another hobby to offset the feelings that this one sometimes brings - at least with respect to feeling "in the times"....

I'd say, keep playing what you know and are passionate about. The authenticity will definitely help the performance shine. Plus, I know a lot of younger people - myself included - love older music as much as they do the new stuff, sometimes maybe even more

I've been at bars/pubs where a there is a cover band playing. It doesn't matter if the entire place is packed with 20-somethings - if that band plays Don't Stop Believing, the whole place sings along.

That's true and it's the same for jazz. I've done small jazz gigs (they're all small now, sigh) where at least half the people are under 40 and they loved it. The problem is those gigs are outliers, far from mainstream musical tastes but it's enough to keep me happy.

I'm also in a classic 70's rock band where I get to do a lot of organ work like Santana, the Doors, Jeff Beck, blues etc. It's the same for those gigs, lots of younger folks who seem to really like it.

I'm not in the country scene any more but I was years ago when I lived in Calgary and I suspect it's the same. I've heard a lot of modern country and almost none of it has the emotional impact of Johnny Cash, Merle Haggard or Willie Nelson but it at least does rock out a bit and could be fun to play. The only thing about modern country is 90% of the songs seem to use the same drummer using the exact same beat, over and over and over...As a keyboard player it's almost funny to say I miss some good pickin guitar solos. Modern country doesn't have much of that. A few little licks here and there, that's it.

Bob

Joe, here's my take for whatever minimal value it might have:

I think you've hit on one of the major hurdles to all performing musicians these days. Used to be, you could learn a set of songs that could be played to any audience, but those days are long gone. As I see it, here are today's options:

1) become a DJ. I think the main reason DJs took over the wedding market is because the demographic at weddings is so varied that it would be hard to know enough songs to please everybody. A DJ can easily get a song list from clients and come prepared to play exactly what they want. If you want to perform, start by sprinkling a few performances in with the DJ songs to see how they go over.

2) Focus on the venue.
It has been my experience that live music hangouts all have their own unique crowd and music preference. Playing the wrong music for the venue is the best way to fail. Ideally, find a club or restaurant that caters to people your age, then play to that crowd (Maybe a VFW or other club type establishment whose members are typically older.) Ideally shoot for a recurring gig at places that like the music you want to play. By limiting the demands on your set list, you stand a better chance of mastering the material.

If you want to play at other venues, at least take the time to research the place and see what other musicians are playing at those locations. Failing to do so is a breach of due diligence that falls squarely on your head.

In my opinion, trying to enter the music world by throwing a bunch of spaghetti on the wall to see what sticks is an exercise in futility. The amount of work required to be ready for every type of gig is overwhelming. You'll almost certainly get discouraged and quit if you set that as your goal.

In conclusion: limit your target demographic to a set list you can master. Identify places where that group goes to hear live music, and try to form a working relationship with those places.

But be aware that it is hard to break in. As opportunities decline, the weak performers leave the business (or offer to play for free), and newbies hit the ground competing against the best performers in town, since they are the only ones who have survived. The one area where newbies can still get a foothold is private parties. Individuals hosting parties don't already have arrangements with other musicians, and most established bands don't want those gigs because they don't pay enough for a full band.

Focus on one specific goal and pursue it until you break in. Then build on your momentum. You might even want to start at your local open mic to hone your act. Best of luck...

Hi Pat. The DJ thing might be what happened in your area but not here. The real reason that DJs took off here was cost. DJs undercut bands by at least half. A good wedding band would cost $500 USD or more. DJs came in at $250. That ended most all of the wedding bands in this area.

Also a good wedding band should be able to cover all age groups. My wedding band had a repertoire of 350 songs, plus fake books and we could jam with no problems. We had no problems satisfying wedding crowds. Plus we were not unique as many wedding bands around here were the same as ours.

My advice Joe is very simple and that is play the covers that you like to play to the crowds that like to hear them. If you are not confident and not having fun playing the crowd will pick up on that very quickly and you will be toast.

as long as the older generation is alive, you can play the "good music" of the past.

You'd also be surprised how many "kids" are into the Beatles, Stones, Haggard, Jones..... so it's still a safe bet to play the good music.

I think this kinda links to that other thread about selling out. PLay what you enjoy and there will always be an audience who can appreciate the music. Nothing will make your night like a young millenial coming up to you and asking you for the name of the artist and song that you played that had the words.... "Michelle, my bell, then something in french." and saying "Man, That was a cool song"

Joe, have you played out anywhere yet? I’m just curious.

Talking about weddings Mario, I did one with a sax player buddy a couple years ago. The bride and groom were in their late 50's so the crowd was split right down the middle. Older friends and family of the bride and groom and all their kids who were late teens and early 20's. As soon as I saw that I knew we were in trouble. We did this as a duo playing lots of instrumentals and the dance stuff was 70's era midi files.

Gary and I did the old stuff right before and immediately after dinner and that was fine. Then we noticed most of the old folks were leaving which left all the kids and we still had two hours to play! A cute young chick saved us by coming up and very bashfully and politely asking if she could play a song off her iPad. I said sure but do the lyrics have any bitc*** and ho's in them? She laughed and said no, none of that. She had an adapter to run her iPad into our PA and the party took off. It was great, Gary and I started doing a bit of DJ'ing and we would play along with some of the tunes, me on keys and him on sax and everybody loved it. The girl had a ton of songs and she just ran them down or took requests from her friends. She didn't try to run the party, she just stood off to the side and played the tunes

That party was about to die hard and that girl was a lifesaver. I think that situation could be repeated if we get called for another wedding. There's always teens at those things and talking to the right one about what to play later when the old folks have left could work out great. Just make sure about the lyrics...

Bob

regarding weddings:

Around here it's the bride who plans the wedding and arranges for the music that she and her friends want to hear.

If the bride is 20, the music she wants is probably not in any fake books and probably can't even be played by a band. Unless the bride wants country music, her song list almost has to be played from audio files.

The parents are probably 40ish, and they grew up on 90s music, which is also probably not in any fake book. A band can play 90s music, but my set list didn't have very many songs from that period.

The grandparents know the music I wanted to play.. but there are (at best) 4 of them at any given wedding.

As far as I can see, DJs are making a lot more than regular musicians, not less. What they bring to the table is the very thing many musicians mysteriously resist: they gladly play whatever the customer wants.

Regarding Jazzmammal's observation:
I can echo the same experience on multiple occasions. On one gig a bunch of Wake Forest students were having a graduation party, and they requested a bunch of songs. When I told them which ones I could not play live, they asked "we really like these songs.. can you play them through your PA if we provide the songs on a phone?" Naturally, I said yes to get the gig.

They were receptive to my oldies that I performed to backing tracks, but they went absolutely wild over their preferred songs. I had never even heard any of the songs before. The thought occurred to me that it would be so much easier to simply show up and play MP3s (yet so much less satisfying)

Not long after that I threw in the towel. I'm not willing to DJ, and I can't compete against the top-notch local musicians who are survivors of the live music apocalypse

Best way to play out is play in your own back garden or front porch, no stress involved, no one complains, and everyone likes and knows the songs you play.

Our bluegrass band played some wedding receptions, bank openings, Chamber Of Commerce stuff, etc. Why? The money was good and sometimes folks wanted that hillbilly hayseed ambience -- as they saw it. Matching flannel shirts and some hay bales scattered around? We eschewed that We hated it even though remarkably we were always well received. After a bit of that we decided irrespective of the money we would only play to crowds that understood and gave a crap about what we were doing. An advantage available to a band made up of folks who all had real jobs.

Pardon the off topic ramble. I'm old and it happens.

Bud

This guy has the right idea!

If a song is good, it's good. It just might need to be updated for a younger audience. Take Lenny Kravitz's "American Woman" as an example. I think it surpasses the original Guess Who version. "Sound of Silence" by Disturbed is every bit as powerful for a new generation as it must have been for Simon and Garfunkel listeners back in the day.

So rather than throwing away your repertoire, you might think of putting your own stamp on those songs. Is it bright and sunny? Maybe slow it down and make it heavier. Is it slow and ponderous? Increase the tempo and brighten it up.

Unless you are doing "tributes covers" trying to match note-for-note and tone-for-tone (and I saw great Heart tribute recently), then the song is yours to tweak as you see fit.

You have to listen to new stuff to like it. I have the Acoustic Favourites running on Spotify to hear acoustic and playable versions of new songs but I also listen to a lot of stuff with my 13 year old daughter in the car (She's the music boss and filters a lot.). There's plenty of good songs out there but you have to filter out the crass stuff. I put up a link http://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=485882#Post485882 to 2018 songs that I'm gradually bringing in to my set. At least you don't get asked to sing in Cantonese (I'm in HK)- now 'Cantopop' really is mind numbingly awful and how would you memorize the lyrics! I should add some Tagalog songs as well, but I'm too lazy unless there are English Lyrics (Anak - Child)

Quite possibly the best advice in this thread.

True but only to a point. As an old guy how would you know that some new songs you happen to like are the same ones a group of millennials would like at a party? You have to be part of that peer group to know that. You're still an outsider listening with your taste not theirs.

Bob

exactly. In my opinion, the single biggest obstacle to performing in public for mixed audiences is finding a set list that is well received across the board. Even on this group where most of us are older and grew up listening to the same music, there is plenty of disagreement about what's "good music".

A musician entering the live music scene doesn't have the luxury of always playing to an established demographic. You put an ad on Gig Salad or whatever and then accept whatever work comes your way. All age groups. Many different preferences.

Great advice from all you guys. I really value all your opinions, and it's great having a bunch of great friends to bounce things like this off of. I've known all of you for quite a few years now - thanks for all your sharing.

checkout the 9:00min segment of

Wow - thank you for sharing that! It's incredibly informative

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Deryk just gave the answer.

I work with, co-write with, and mentor a lot of really talented young songwriters and performers, many from the age of 8 to 10 up, and they play to mixed crowds of young and old.

Some are virtuosos at bluegrass songs that are 100 years old at least and play Merle Fest and the International Bluegrass Festival here. Others who who great songwriters and performers mention as idols: Pink Floyd, Led Zeppelin, the Beatles, Fleetwood Mac, Peter Gabriel, and on and on and on. I do not think there has been one mention of a newer artist and no covers of Katy Perry I can think of.

So, I think for me the moral of the story of if you are out playing your typical gig and you are not genre-focused, but are more of a singer-songwriter type with a band, just pick the very best songs you can from any era and try and do excellent versions of them, and also throw in some of your own.

I have seen absolutely no indication that the younger set needs to hear songs written by the current generation, or what's on the radio in order to be interested.

In my experience, they just like good music, the same as it always been been--so just play them good music and you will be fine.