Nothing to Lose (psychedelic rock version)


Nothing to Lose (Folk version)

I posted the folk version of this song about a week ago and Floyd commented that he could hear a psychedelic rock version in there somewhere. I tried and failed to make anything besides a dogs breakfast. So I asked Floyd if he could help with the transformation. He said that since he got me into this "mess" in the first place he would help me out. I sent him the BIAB file and all the vocals I had recorded and he put together this version, quick stix, in usual Floyd style.

Comments Welcome

Edited to add link to folk version for those who missed it.

I really liked the first version, but I LOVE this version! You have completely captured the sound and vibe here - great work guys!

Bob

Floyd certainly has the golden ears!! This song works great in this style-I agree with Bob that it's even better. B3 is a perfect compliment to retroize it! This is great-a real treat!! Good work both of you. Take care. Greg

I like both versions. Well done.

That fj is a regular George Martin.



Regards,

Bob

Hi, Jo !:))


This is just superb !!!!....
must be one of your absolutely
best if not the one !!!!
I love this !!!!great !!!

Cheers
Dani

Wow!

Y'all NAILED it! Fillmore West, here we come!

I already liked the original song, and I was very intrigued by Floyd's observation that it would work as a west coast rock adaptation. In fact, I volunteered to participate by contributing a guitar track. Unfortunately, as soon as the opportunity to participate happened, so did a bunch of other things, and I'm afraid my contribution fell through the cracks. On one hand, I apologize to Floyd and JoAnne for writing a check I couldn't cash.

HOWEVER... I believe things tend to work out for the better, and I am absolutely sure in retrospect that what Floyd did with this song is so much better than any contribution I could have made! Floyd has a supernatural omniscience about how to make music that appeals to the musical sensibilities of listeners, and it is no small thing when Floyd offers to collaborate.

You had me right from the get-go with that intro! And the steady bass-drums groove really sealed the deal for me! Others have mentioned the organ, and I'd have to agree that it plugs the song directly into the music scene of that period... but it's not necessarily a Jefferson Airplane sound. In my mind it evoked images of 3 dog Night, especially the song's ending. Regardless of the inference, it's a very good association indeed!

One thing about JoAnne's delivery in this version that really stood out to me is that the backing track really encouraged and inspired a whole new energy in her presentation. The original version was much more tentative and emotive. I must admit to being a real sucker for strings and beautiful harmonies in the same song. (I've got to ask... did you record new vocals for this version? Or were the original vocals sped up to match the new tempo? Because it seems to me that there's more enthusiasm in this version. So, if you DIDN'T re-do the vocals, it is the energy of the arrangement spilling over into how I hear your singing. Conversely, if you DID re-do the vocals, it's interesting to hear how the arrangement influenced the energy in your voice.)

In the final analysis, I REALLY like both versions.. but interestingly , for completely different reasons! This serves as an example of how a song can succeed with different audiences by approaching the topic in a new way. If I had to articulate what I like about each version, the obvious observation is that Joanne's version sings from her soul. It is her natural presentation, and so it naturally works.

Floyd's version draws a whole bevy of new considerations into the equation, which adds interest and complexity in ways we would probably not expect to hear from JoAnne alone. Which is one of the most compelling aspects of collaboration: it forces us out of the comfort zone and introduces us to new ways of looking at our music.

I bow to you both! What an audio feast for this Thanksgiving day! I am thankful to call you my friends.

Good job Floyd and Josie. I agree this really captures the 60's vibe. Maybe the Wee Five sound. Two things come to mind. First, another 60's vibe this captures is that many songs were re-arranged from one genre to another by 60's groups. Second is to not overlook it takes a well written, quality song to accomplish such a feat.


Charlie

Joanne,

This is cool. I like the harmonies, the doubled vocals and the B3. And I'm relieved actually because I had the notion with him saying psychedelic and Grace Slick that FJ wanted you to emulate White Rabbit and scream feed your head feed your head with your lyrics.

Both versions sound good. Personally, I like the lyrics to this song a lot which is why I still prefer the original version best.

This is fun to listen to and well done all around.

Josie

Hi Joanne,

I liked the original but I like the new version better.
Great job by Floyd.
I wonder how the harmonies are done and like Pat I'd like to know if the vocals are just sped up. If so it's astounding how good they sound.
I really enjoyed this adventure.

Guenter

Hi Y'all...

A quick note before I have to go get the turkey out...

A little about how this was done... Joanne sent me the SGU and all of her vocals - 3 takes of the main and 5 harmonies - a high, 2 lows, and 2 generated.

It makes you realize how cool an SGU file actually is... Joanne had done the hard part - setting up the chords properly with part markers in the right places... (and recorded all the vocals). I swapped out all of the instruments from the original. I liked the original - Joanne did a tremendous job on the folk version. I merely had an idea that the same song could be done in this other fashion as well - the lyric and its phonetic cadence suggested something to me...

I listened to various things from the era to pick instruments - 12 string electrics, a busy bass (those guys always wanted to be heard), a busy drum, an organ a tambourine loop... with the intent that everyone would be playing by the end - they were bands, first and foremost...

Joanne's lead vocals were all VERY close to each other. So I chose one and hit it with A Nectar patch - "Rock - 1969". Hit one of the others with a different patch and panned them L & R by 10%... They made a great doubled vocal - a lot of "space". I spread out ALL the harmonies and hit them with "group" patches from Nectar - and made them loud enough to "be evident". It all came together quickly. The vocal sound fit the band sound nicely.

The original song was 85 bpm. The new version worked at that speed, but I decided to see if I could increase it without "losing the vocal" - and I figured that any artifacts would actually "work"... I settled on 100 bpm - the instruments remained stable and the vocal had a tiny bit of effect added - that, again, works for the style...

Joanne deserves a ton of credit for what a cool write this is - and all the up-front work she did...

BIAB (PGMusic) deserves a bunch, too, for making something like this possible (an fairly simple)...


RealTracks in song: 1009:Bass, Electric, HardRockThrash Ev 085
RealTracks in song: ~1029:Guitar, 12-String Electric, Fingerpicking Ev 085
RealTracks in song: ~1032:Guitar, 12-String Electric, Strumming Ev 085
RealTracks in song: ~689:Organ, B3, Background Pop Ev 085
RealDrums in Song: PopAmericanEv^6-a:SdStkBB4, b:SnrBB
Tambourine Loop 132bpm

Floyd, Thanks for the detailed description of how your magic works! VERY interesting!

In light of my previous comments about the energy in JoAnne's vocals, it is especially interesting to hear that you used the original vocal tracks. Wow. I totally didn't expect that to be the case.. I hear the two presentations very differently... and now I know that the difference comes from your arrangement, NOT because her part was sung with more enthusiasm. Cool stuff! (Something for all of us to plug into our thinking as we go forward with our projects! )

Still, the magician's technique is part of what makes magic what it is. You can describe what you do all day long, but the patented Floyd Jane alchemy can NEVER be cloned! You're one of those guys who is often imitated but never duplicated!

And we like it that way

;-)

Hi All
Happy thanks giving to all my American friends. I hope you didn’t all eat too much turkey.

This certainly was an interesting exercise.

I think for me the biggest lesson was one that Pat as alluded to. That it is that the arrangement more than the vocal delivery can affect the result. Floyd told me this on another project that we collaborated on. He said me that the way to get intensity in a recording was through the instrumentation rather than through the vocal. This is why he records the vocal against a very basic backing of bass, rhythm and drums and then add the “sweetners” to intensify the emotion. I have been using this technique ever since.

Floyd is right. BIAB is the most wonderful tool for collaborations.

THANK YOU, Floyd, for taking me on this journey and thank you Peter Gannon for such a wonderful product that I use everyday of my life. I cannot wait for 2015 to be released. Thank you Pat, Greg, Charlie, Josie, Guenter, Dani and Bob (times two) for taking the time to listen and to comment.

Josie,
I liked the 1st version and now I like the 2nd version equally.

Thank you floyd for your break down, I have many "2 version songs" and will try this method myself.

BIAB is such a wonderful program, I too look forward to 2015 because at each new version I update some of my old songs in this method, but with not so much success!!

excellent

Alyn

and thank YOU Josie, for adding your own follow-up thoughts and observations to the thread!

Joanne and floyd, When I first heard the song I didn't think floyd's notion of psychedelic would work. Now I stand corrected. floyd, your idea of easy may seem a little more complicated for the rest of us. Great job putting this all together. Now having said all that and realizing that floyd can certainly make his vision a reality, I still like version #1. Thanks to you both for posting this interesting project. Tom

Hi Josie,

Although we liked the first version very much, we must admit this really adds something.
Great version! Compliments for Floyd too!

Rob and Anne-Marie

This is an excellent version of the song. I think I like both songs equally as well.

Hi Alyn – Thanks so much for giving the new version a listen. I am waiting (not so patiently) for my 2015 to arrive. It would seem that the South African leg of the courier service is via donkey cart. I want to get going on mixing my Dylan and Denver album. There are so many new features I would like to use.

Pat – thanks so much. I am glad it has been an informative exercise.

Tommy – I agree that Floyd makes things like this seem easy. I tried to do exactly what he described but all I created was a dog’s breakfast.

Rob, Ann Marie and Scott – Thanks for giving the new version a listen and for commenting.

I listened to the folk version...and the rock version.

I like them both.

I don't think I would call the rock version "psychedelic" however. It does have a strong 60's west coast vibe to it.

Groovy.....yes.... but not psychedelic.

Strawberry Alarm Clock..... that's psychedelic. I equate that style with the guitar playing..... and overall sound.

None of that style mislabeling takes a single thing away from the song in either version..... nice work from both of you on this.

Hello Josie,
I like both versions
Brite folk version, nice drive in the PR version.
Your voice is great. I believe everything you sing.

@Floyd
Thanks for sharing your production tricks, now I know what you mean with "give them some space"

I feel quite humbled in your company

Hi Herb – Thanks for the observations and the praise for the song. I was completely unfamiliar with this style of music when Floyd mentioned it to me (sheltered upbringing, I know!). I would never have dreamed it would be possible to turn this song around into something so completely different.

Hi Fred – Floyd is an absolute master at this sort of thing. And I am so honoured to have worked with him on a few projects. It would be time well spent going back through his (many) posts to glean some words of wisdom

Hi Joanne & FJ ...

Super job by both of you. It might be just a wee bit shy of psychedelic but it definitely has that Bay Area sound that was so poplar in the 60's. Regardless, it's great song and production. And Floyd has that mixing stuff down to a fine science. Of course, he had some pretty danged good material to work with.

Super song and production!

Alan & Di

I too like both versions, but I like the rock/expanded harmony version better. It reminds me a bit of the Mamas and the Papas, a definite late 60's west coast vibe. Psychedelic? I'm not so sure, though the label was applied to groups like Moby Grape that were often quite folky, as well as Strawberry Alarm Clock and others who used electric sitars, bizarre lyrics, and heavy drugs.

However you label it, it's a very well crafted song and recording!

Thanks,
Bruce

Hi Josie. Floyd's version brings to mind the Byrds.
Really enjoyed it! Beautifully written performed and presented.

I like both of them and this whole
exercise has been a clinic in the
power of BIAB in very capable
hands (both versions). For me,
regarding the sound of the new
version, Rich nailed it. Byrds.

Very cool.

J&B

Hi Alan and Di, Bruce and Janice and Bud - Thank you so much. Floyd certainly has this down to a fine art. It is amazing how he managed to make this song sound like a “full band”. I can see I am going to have to listen to some “Byrds”. Bruce, referring to my song as “well crafted” is a compliment indeed.

For anybody who is interested I finally got round to making a video for this song.

It is here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=co6m0fDAAms

Nice video. The picture of the autumn road looks like the main road to a cabin I once had in the mountains of North Carolina.

I wonder if anyone else caught the blond girl walking on the left sidewalk trip at the 1:11 mark. Keep watching just after that and you can see she acknowledges the slip to the folks coming toward her.

The video is a nice element to add to the song.


Charlie

Yeah, it really does look like someplace I've been on the blue Ridge Parkway! Good one, Charlie!

Joanne... I've already commented on the song... now I'm back to tell you how much I enjoyed your video! ("A LOT")
You always put the finishing touch on your songs... and the video makes a very nice bow for the top of an equally nice musical package...

I am so glad you are here on the forum, sharing your music and your friendship with the rest of us! Though in some cases we are separated by great distance, apparently music is larger than that. It envelops us all no matter where we exist in space and time, and brings us together in the same song. How cool is THAT?

Hi Charlie - Thanks for taking the time to view the video. It is interesting to see what clips appeal. That particular one of the road is definitely the one that appeals in this video. I did notice that the girls slips. I was thinking to edit that bit out but decided to leave it anyway. It is fun.

Hi Pat - Thanks you so much. Your friendship means a lot to me. Going forward, I am trying my best to put together a video for each original song released. I think a lot of music discovery is done via Youtube these days. But it all takes so much time (which seems to be in such short supply these days).

I'm really late to this party but I'm glad that I made it!

I really like this version, although the folk version is good also. I also thought of the We Five when I heard this and they still are one of my favorite groups. You can never go wrong when there is a B3 in the song!

You two should be very proud of this one. It is a keeper.

Hi Josie,

I have to say that I really enjoyed your folk version when I first heard it. Now, after hearing this second version of floyd's, I have no idea which version I like better.

What floyd has done is spectacular and showcases just how amazing the world of home-computer-created-music is. When I think of you in South Africa and floyd in the the US, it's incredible that technology (and BIAB) easily allows such collaboration.

I congratulate both you and floyd on a mesmerisingly outstanding trip in the style of the 60s. Words and phrases that sprang to mind as I listened were: creative, inventive, clever, very intelligent mixing, sound sculpting at its best.

A huge applause to both of you!
Noel