I use BIAB 2012 for Windows.


I Audio Record playing a banjo tune with a Style and everything works except the banjo sounds very tinny.
I am using a Sony dynamics microphone (cheap one).
Is it the microphone causing this?

If I use the mic in Audacity to record, it sounds good, though.

(By the way, if I export from Audacity as a wav file into biab, the song is out of synch with the biab style playing in background - but this might be a topic for another thread).

I'll chime in...

If I understand you correctly and it's actually you playing the banjo.

IMO....a 'cheap' Sony dynamic mic would achieve less than adequate results.
If that's all you are going to be working with then mic placement is even more critical.
You'll have to be very close to the mic and then be aware of 'proximity effect' issues. (low frequency predominance).
So, your playing technique will also be part of the equation.

EQ'ing may help a bit.
Meaning, reduce the offending high frequencies and if you got lucky there are some mid frequencies on the original track to smooth out the take.
Others may have their take on it but I'd say get a MOR condenser mic to add to your recording arsenal.
They've become quite affordable over the years.

Something else to keep in mind that what may sound 'tinny' to your ears when soloing this track may sound very close or even acceptable in a final mix with other instruments playing.

If you are insistent on keeping the track and using that mic significant experimentation will be necessary.

Hope that helps...carry on.

Good advice above.

I'm just wondering - are you recording to the audio track in BIAB?

If so you will enjoy better results by opening your BIAB file in Realband and then recording your banjo track(s) there.

Hi Bob,

I've just read through your post and a couple of thoughts sprang to mind. They were ...

ONE
Chulaivet1966 and Sundance offer some excellent advice that would resolve the issue and is worth considering.

TWO
My take on the issue is that if the banjo records ok in Audacity and not ok in BIAB, then it's not really a mic problem because the audio would be tinny wherever it's recorded since both BIAB and Audacity use the same soundcard process to record.

This got me wondering about mono and stereo. A microphone is mono and if Audacity is recording in mono, it will be heard on both speakers when played back. If, however, BIAB is recording in stereo (BIAB's default) then only one speaker will be heard with the banjo on playback. This could sound "tinny".

To check my theory, try setting BIAB to record in mono and have a listen. To do this, refer to the image below and the instructions that follow it.

• Click on Audio (#1) then select Record Audio (#2).
• Now select Audio Options (#3) from the window that pops up.
• From the next window that pops up, set the Audio track type for THIS song to MONO (#4)

Now record and have a listen to the playback.

Regards,
Noel

Bob,

In relation to the audio recorded in Audacity that becomes out of synch when imported into BIAB, it's possible to correct by time-shifting the audio track as follows.

• Import the audio.
• Select Audio (#1) and then select Edit Audio.
• Now select Timeshift Audio (ms). (Note: 1,000 ms = 1 second.)
• Trial and error is required to get it right. Simply try different values. Negative values will cause the audio to come in earlier and positive values will cause it to come in later. I'd start with 500 ms (half a second) and see how that sounds.

Hope this helps,
Noel

Hi Bob, Welcome! Lots of good advice so far! Another thing to be considered, is the banjo itself......5 string? ....Plectrum?
As already mentioned, I use a moderately priced condenser mic....SAMSON CO1. I sometimes use 2 of them, depending on how I want the banjo to sound. Experiment with placings. Regards, Joe G.

Howdy, I've recorded a LOT of banjo over the last 35 years and have always found it challenging. Typically I was trying to give the banjo picker the sound that he or she desired. And often they referred to it as a "fat" sound. A 1930's Gibson will give this sound pretty readily but with a lot of banjos it requires more work.

For the last 15 years or so I've used a Rode NT1, AT-4033 or and MXL when recording banjos although it's been a few years since I last worked with one. From my experience a decent quality large diaphragm condenser mic (like those mentioned) is the best. I place the mic about 8-12 inches away favoring the bottom third of the "head." I would mix with a very small amount of reverb and perhaps slight EQ boost around 1K. Also I would avoid having the banjo face a window or other "bright" surface. Of course, now days, for me it's all banjo RealTracks!

Bud

In the band I was in during mid 70's we had a good banjo player for a couple of old select tunes but I've never recorded banjo.

Just out of curiosity what have you found to be the offending/challenging frequencies?
In my recording banjo ignorance I'd guess anywhere from 3K-8K or so but I'll let you correct me on that.

It also seems to me one would have to capture those mid frequencies (mic placement critical) well or carving away the offending highs would be of little help to arrive at a smooth, full sounding banjo track.

Carry on....

Thanks for all the advice. I use a 5 string and play clawhammer style.
I am able to export from Audacity to BIAB and with some equalizer adjusting things are sounding better (got help watching youtube video).

Sundance: I don't know how to mess with Real Band (?).
I see references to Real this and that but just ignore.

Noel96: will try your suggestion about the synch problem.

I've been recording banjo for years and it is one of the more difficult instruments to capture a great sound from. But here is my advice:

1. Use a large diaphragm condenser microphone.
2. Never close mic the banjo. The sound right up on the head is going to sound tinny. Get back 3 or 4 feet from the microphone.
3. I like to get the microphone up a little above the height of the top edge of the head pointing down. Don't aim for the middle of the head.
4. If you are still getting a tinny sound try moving back even farther from the mic. I've had to sometimes back up to 6 or 7 feet depending on the room to get the banjo to sound right.

It depends so much on the banjo that it's hard to answer. Some pickers want the bright sound and others want the tubby sound. I just learned what they wanted and try to EQ to their wishes. There was no substitute for a great instrument and a picker with good tone and chops. Just can't make the old silk purse out of a sow's ear.