Hi folks. Thoughts, please.

1st, I am not a techie kinda person, so speak to me as you would a child.

My dog is getting super lonely while I sit in my office/studio at my PC so much of the day/night with work and BIAB. I'm not kidding, he is one sad guy.

I need to get an inexpensive (as possible) PC laptop that would be dedicated to BIAB and a DAW to use in my den. Used is fine. I won't run any unrequired programs on it. No Office Suite (Word), etc.

What do you think would be the minimal parameters it would need? Or, any suggestions for make/models? Cheap. Used. I'll need small-ish monitors there also, so if you have suggestions, I'll take them.

Thanks.

We know that BIAB 2016 requires a PC that scores around 1500 minimum on the single-core Geekbench test (a free utility you can download). You could pretty easily test a candidate laptop.

KRK and M-Audio make pretty good small monitors for the money.

Can't help with the dog.

Goodwill stores in my area sell used desk and laptop computers. They refurbish them and update the operating system. Used laptops start at about $100.

Of course bigger is better but truthfully any present day laptop you get should handle Band-in-a-Box. The big difference you will notice is it will take longer for the program to open up because laptop hard drives normally are slower than desktop hard drives (5,400 rpm for most laptop hard drives versus 7,200 or 10,000 rpm for desktop). Once the program loads up it operates from the computer memory.

The laptop I'm using is four years old and works fine.

My personal suggestion;
Surface Pro
It may not seem worth it at first, but down the road you'll likely appreciate the choice.
Just my opinion.
I've seen these be very reliable workhorses in various situations. Value over time and all that ..
YMMV

You guys are the best. Thank you.

HA! He's gonna be so happy.

I have a 10 year old laptop, runs Vista and it will not run BIAB consistently. Freezes or takes 10 mins to load (then freezes). I can't upgrade the operating system. It's fine for surfing, but not much more.

Thanks for your help, Matt!

Newegg
has a number of refurbished laptops. You may want to take a look.

Also regardless of what laptop you purchase be sure to delete all of the bloat ware that comes with them. Also be sure to make a couple of backup discs.

Good luck.

Whenever I re-install from restore discs, or purchase a new computer, I always run PC-Decrapifier to get rid of the bloatware that comes pre-installed.

Thanks for the bloatware tips! And Decrapifier! What a great name.

I buy and lease real estate and I had an old, eccentric codger I dealt with... old wealthy family that owned a lot of real estate and radio stations and shopping centers, etc. His office was in an ancient, 2-pump Texaco gas station, dark and dusty/musty...creepy as hell, filled with filing cabinets and old newspapers.

He had a clause in all his contracts everyone had to include, entitled:

My Anti-Legal-Rip-off Clause.

We was my hero!

What a character I'd walk around with that contract all day every day, making everybody I talked to sign it... just to be safe!

Andy, not to be presumptive but it sounds like you could afford something nice.

I would get a newer lappy with at least 8 gigs ram and most importantly a minimum 256 gig SSD running Win 10 and a 1 or 2 TB standard HD for storage. You install the full Biab including all the RT's on the SSD.

Biab or RB opens in like 5 seconds and your songs generate in maybe 4 seconds. This allows you to do all kinds of experimentation to check out different styles or arrangements or adding different RT's without waiting for "eons" for the thing to regenerate each time.

You will be so much happier, trust me on this. Check out my sig I got my new system last July.

Bob

Yeah, but I'm a frugal guy.

I don't disagree, you are absolutely right about not under-buying. I've certainly done that before. I wish I'd have started out with a higher quality guitar when I was 15 and not have spent years incrementally "buying up."

I'm thinking because of the den's layout, I can't have large-ish monitors there and will need to do anything really serious at the PC. Not that I know how to mix regardless of the PC speed/monitors/blind luck, but I can goof around on the LT with instruments and tempo and such.

But I'm going to look at everything from all angles, so everyone's input is greatly, greatly appreciated. I definitely don't want to buy anything that I should have known beforehand would not even run BIAB.

Thanks guys.

IF you buy used or refurbished and If you plan on getting on the Internet then be sure to look for something that has Windows 10 installed. All other versions of Windows will be unsupported soon. Thus you will have to shell out another $100 USD to buy Windows 10.

Personally I wouldn't buy anything that doesn't have Win 10 installed but YMMV.

PS - If you never get on the Internet with this computer then it probably doesn't matter what OS you use. I say probably because I'm sure there will be or there already is software that require Win 10.

[quote=Andy A - USA]Yeah, but I'm a frugal guy. I don't disagree, you are absolutely right about not under-buying. I've certainly done that before. I wish I'd have started out with a higher quality guitar when I was 15 and not have spent years incrementally "buying up." /quote]

I didn't read every response.
I would only submit that I tend to think too many 'under-buy'.
In this context....being 'frugal' is one thing, being imprudent with a purchase of this nature is another.

I would suggest buy something that you will not grow out of in a short amount of time.

Happy spending....carry on.

BTW, Windows 7 (Service Pack 1) extended support ends on 14 January 2020.

Exactly, if you buy a pair of boots that lasts for a year for $60 instead of a pair that lasts for 5 years for $200, you lose out in the long run! The buy-it-for-life philosophy

Everybody's needs are different. Something else to consider is do you have a HD TV in the den? Win 10 has a great feature called wireless display. It's a two piece USB gadget you buy from MS for $50 that lets you use a high def TV as your computer monitor wirelessly. You don't then need a large lappy with a 19" screen. Or, like was suggested earlier, look at a Surface Pro because they all have SSD's. The new 4's are expensive for the i5 256gig models but the Surface Pro 3's sell used for $5-600 on Amazon. There are a ton of vids on YT about using a Surface Pro for music.

For me I already have a set up where I run a 25' HDMI cable from my bedroom, through the wall into the living room to my new 60" 4K TV and I'm telling you running Biab on that big screen is just great. If your den is small you can buy a 32-42" HDTV for a few hundred bucks. Use that wirelessly from a Surface Pro and you have something you can have some fun with.

I know you're talking about your den but what about your living room? If you have a big screen set up there with a nice home theater sound system guess what I would do? Get a Surface Pro and run it wirelessly in there using your sound system with Biab and forget the den.

Bob

Of course, I certainly agree, generally speaking.

But...on this thread topic, us music/recording junkies need to think 3-4 years down the road...minimum.
IE: over time, adding more intensive music programs/apps putting more demands on our system with FX/signal processing and a personal evolving that may incorporate recording with others of like mind.

I'd always recommend purchasing a system (or any hardware unit) that exceeds the criteria that we might erroneously think we can live with....going minimalist can frequently be a costly, shortsighted decision.

Personally....I'd never go refurbished and to my research homework.
I'd bite the bullet, put on a credit card if necessary, go new, get the warranty and record on.
But, that's just me and I have been wrong in the past.

Just things to ponder before pulling the trigger.

Not taking issue here...just qualifying my take on it.

Back to it....

Well, thanks everyone. Those suggestions gave me the minimums to shoot for and there are a lot of refurbed units out there that meet all of them and they're in the $350 range. Newegg has a bunch. Cha-ching. Throw some little monitors in and I'm good to go.

Frugal and Imprudent. Thrifty, economical, AND prudent, vs. rash, ill-advised and ignorant. Hmmm...

BIAB is important to me, but so are a lot of things. The money tree I ordered never came.

And like a lot of folks here I'm sure (and they could buy me out 10 times with the money they carry in their shoe), I owe no one. Conservative house, car, c-cards, all zeros. And that's a nice feeling.

That's great advice, Bob, and several of those comments came while I was writing mine, so I appreciate the restating, C1966.

I have a great room house (den/living room all one), but it's not huge (the house). I do have HDTV and the wireless application you mentioned is really interesting.

Thanks.

Haha....
Tis a research quagmire to be sure.

We're certainly not financially self sufficient and in the same fold as yourself regarding not carrying CC debt and owing no one.
Huh....I never received my 'tree' either.

Keep us informed of your success.

Back to it....

Good deal. Off we go!

thanks for the info. my new biab 2016 is running slowly. i am going to get a decent laptop. in one of your posts you suggested:
8gig ram, 256ssd, 1 TB drive. right now the regeneration takes 30 plus seconds, drives me nuts. program boot up is sometimes 2 minutes. what is the best bang for the buck in your opinion to speed things up?
thanks
ED

Ed, welcome to the forum. The SSD is a great idea, and also get the fastest CPU you can afford. These two things are the most important for BIAB speed.

For some users, one cause of long start-up time is virus checkers. Try setting yours not to scan the /bb folder and see if that makes an improvement.

thanks for the quick response Matt. no less than 8 gig then and 256 ssd. i believe asus has one on amazon for around 5-550. the reviews are very good. are you familiar with the brand? recommend?

Yes, Asus is fine; well regarded. But what CPU is in that laptop?

FWIW-I have an Asus Eee Notebook that is about 10-15 years old that is still running an everything is still original. It runs XP, has 4 gigs of memory and by today's standards is extremely slow. I have some backup data on it so I do use it periodically.

was just investigating this question as i want to take a laptop to gigs. i'm looking at an macbook air 13 or 11" with at least 256, probably 513GB and 8gb ram. anyone familiar with this as a gig set up?

I've been running BIAB for more than 25 years, on so many laptops I can't count, here is my 2 cents on what you might want to look at before shelling out $$$

1. i7 processor. I would say at least 2GHZ min.
2. Min 8 GB of RAM, even with 64 bit Win install you don't really need more.
3. Many people say get Win 10, but actually if you get rid of all bloatware and strip it down to use minimum resources, Win 7 64 is amazing.
4. An SSD drive these days is a no brainer, it has significant advantages over a 7,200rpm platter drive, it will run cooler as well. I highly recommend the samsung 850 EVO drives, 512GB will go a long way if you keep things organized.
5. ASUS, DELL, HP all have some great used models (within 2-3 years old)
6. Ccleaner, AVG free, Malwarbytes all have free versions to keep your laptop running in top condition.
7. Be sure to upgrade to BIAB 2017, the generation of RTs is much better.
Good luck, there are some fantastic buys on used laptops on ebay and craigslist.

Update: This is the LT I got. Not exactly what I wanted, but at the end of the day it works fine for me. $425 refurbished:

Intel Core i5 2520M (2.50 GHz)
16 GB Memory, 512 GB SSD
Intel HD Graphics 3000
1366 x 768
Windows 10 Pro
DVDRW

The only drawback is the lack of a hard drive. But, when I tacked that on the minimal criteria I wanted the price doubled, so I chose the SSD over a HDD.*

It flies. I'll need to store files externally once I near whatever the speed inhibiting limit is. I was only looking for a unit to allow me to work remotely on 1-2 songs at a time, so, so far so good.

(*Newegg, and buyer/beware. It was advertised as having both 512 GB SSD and a 512 HDD. I was unaware HDDs don't come in "512" size, and only discovered it after it arrived and I couldn't see the drive. And Newegg was a PIA about it. I had to escalate it a few times, and got a little store credit. Like I said, at the end of the day it works fine for me. AND I couldn't find anything better anywhere near the price...but they sure were jerks about it.)