I'd like to import songs out of America's Song Book or Real Book. Avoid having to type in all the chords, troubleshoot, try and find one of thousands of styles that is appropriate, and simply have the tunes to play along with and learn. Has anyone posted songs that can be downloaded and imported in Bnb or RealBand from Real Book?

Check out Notes Norton music:

http://www.nortonmusic.com/

There are a number of fake books and BiaB styles available. I have a couple of the fake book disks and they are spot on. They contain the correct chord progressions and a suggested BiaB style. You just load them into BiaB and hit generate.

Thanks. They are $50. I was looking for free downloads.

They're very good, but this was also duscussed a short while ago and there are more links that may help +++ here +++ and +++ here +++

Thanks for posting. There is absolutely nothing in any of those links. In case anyone is looking - there is nothing in any links I checked.

....what.
I just tried to attach a Bnb song... and this forum, PG Music Forum (the Bnb people), won't accept a Bnb file format?
.....what.

Yes, that's correct.

From the attachment manager: "You may upload the following file types: .gif,.jpg,.png,.jpeg,.bmp,.tif. Only image files are permitted. "
I think it relates to copyright material being posted and shared on the PG Music platform, which potentially could be unlawful.

However, you can upload the file to a file sharing service (e.g.Drop Box) and include a link within your post.

Damn! We really live in a society of freeloaders; everybody wants everything for free nowadays.

The bound version of the Real Book costs $40 on Amazon. And for only $10 more, Bob did all the work for you. Plus everything is correct? Where I come from, that is what's called a "smokin' deal."

If I was wanting to be a jazz player, I would be all over that like white on rice.

A number of those links do seem to have died, though there are still some working.

What I notice is that those that are still working tend to be "pay-for" which suggests a couple of things. One is that only the people charging can afford continue to host, one is that any that were not paying appropriate royalties to the writers have been shut down.

A third is that some were quite old and the people who made them available are no longer willing or able to do that due, perhaps, to advancing years.

Try here for one such: https://midkar.com/LES_GORVEN_STUDIO/Les_Gorvens_Home_Page.html

Thanks for the recommendation, Mario.

What I do with the fake books, anyone can do. But it takes hundreds and hundreds of hours to complete one, test, make corrections, and finish.

If you buy one, a percentage goes to the authorization company, credit card or PayPal, and the subcontractor who chooses the styles. (If I picked the styles myself, I'd end up using mine, because I know them best). Then there are monthly fees for the web hosting company, shopping cart, bank, Visa/MC merchant's account, insurance, secure SSL certificate, and so on.

I've been audited twice by BMI, so what I'm doing is strictly legal. What I paid for legal advice was worth it.

The Real Book is here, and it uses all Real Styles from PG Music. https://www.nortonmusic.com/fake37.html

There is a lot of free stuff on the Internet. I'm hoping all the work, care, and the benefit of my experience as a career musician and multi-instrumentalist makes my products worth the money. And from what I've found, it's much better than the freebies I've seen on the 'net.

If it's not right for you, that's OK. There is no one-size-fits-all.

Insights and incites by Notes ♫

I'm nothing close to a professional musician. This is 100% entertainment for me.

I was hoping the "forum" section from PB Music would offer users, enthusiasts an opportunity to share files on all matters Bnb, including Real Book songs.

I'm not interested in deep diving endless technical matters related to building songs, typing chords, intros, exits, turn arounds, endless review of styles. I like playing along with a "band" and learning some new tunes. The bonus long the way, get a little better at sight reading and playing songs.

So here I am on the "forum" - exploring whats out there for song files to share among users, enthusiasts. What I've found is some people trying to provide helpful ideas, links, pay for service, and another criticizes the effort as one of a "freeloader".

There is always "that guy" out there.

This looks promising! Thank you.

This looks promising - thank you!

Try here for one such: https://midkar.com/LES_GORVEN_STUDIO/Les_Gorvens_Home_Page.html

Ok, we'll try "Dropbox" and creating a link. Thank for the tip!

It's possible 'that guy' is a professional musician who may have spent decades learning the craft, paid hundreds for copies of the various RealBooks, thousands for software to experiment with the songs and create backing tracks, and now wonders why anyone would make a career out of writing music if it is all free. But that's just a guess.

Lots of possibilities who "that guy" might be. "Professional musician"... really?

"Professional musicians" calling people "freeloaders" because they want to share music, ideas, as a part of a community with a common interest.

Its quite honestly anything BUT professional.

I see it as a person who likes to slam other people. "That guy" takes pleasure in criticizing people. Couldn't keep their sarcasm to themselves. Wanted to get out there and spread it around.

"Professional" is the LAST word I'd use to describe another person that publically calls out people as "freeloaders".

But thats just me...

Ok. How about "thief." Because that is what someone who steals is and what you are suggesting is stealing intellectual property.

There's a reason why PG Music will only let you post original music.

Great... "that guy" is back.

Hi falcon1az,
I think one thing that you need to take into account is that this is a general, open forum with a broad range of participants ranging from totally casual members, who perhaps have little or no musical experience and are just 'social' visitors, all the way to professional musicians who rely on music for their livelihood. This other end of the scale invests heavily in developing and producing music products at a much more commercial level. They rely on a return on their investment for their survival.

There's plenty of free stuff out there, it may be low grade but also may do the job you want.

There's also higher level material available, but it comes at a price.

The choice is yours, but it's perhaps wrong to not take into account that there is a cost already involved in producing a professional product when someone suggests that they cannot provide it to you for free. They are generally justifying that they cannot provide it as a freebie, together with reasons.

Also, please don't be too offended because one person used the term 'freeloaders'. Many have tried to assist and explain their unique situations in detail, and additionally others have offered possible no cost solutions in an effort to help you.

Good luck with your music.

This just popped up also. I haven't explored it myself:

https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=796262#Post796262

I'm sorry but that makes absolutely no sense to me. BMI, like ASCAP, only collects for the performances of music. They had to sell Shazam! because it was violating the terms of their Consent Decree (per the 2012 BMI annual report) — they bought it to listen to the internet and didn't shut down the other parts of it (oops!).

My last day gig was working for ASCAP's legal department. Feel free to back channel me on this. I'm quite curious as to how it happened and what they were trying to get from you.

Back on topic:

The Real Book is published by Hal Leonard, now part of Muse Group (MG).

There are ways to obtain access it so that everyone gets paid. MG has systems in place that satisfy the courts and sub publishers — almost nobody knows about them, however. Here's a brief overview and it mentions The Real Book: Muse Group Acquires Hal Leonard . "Brief" is quite subjective—plan to take some time to absorb it all but it's well worth it.

Oh, "free" is not an option. Somehow, some way, at some point somebody must get paid. At the moment, it's through their MuseScore PRO+ subscription plan (I pay $39.99 annually)

Muse Group is bent on world domination of the music industry and they have the Dough for the Do-Re-Mi (BMI slogan from the '70s) to make a run at it. One benefit is that MuseScore, by their own admission, will have to become good. Version 4 is a step in the right direction but they have a long way to go. I expect that AI will feature prominently in version 5. They are hiring AI engineers and I don't think you have to move to Cypress to work for them (I could be wrong on this, BTW).

I know little about US copyright-related stuff ... this is a UK-related aside.

A few years back I received a 'phone call from PRS (Performing Rights Society) here in the UK. They were immediately very aggressive, telling me that my company was in breach of performance copyright on multiple counts and demanding that I agree to pay thousands of pounds a year in royalties for the future and in retrospect. The reason for that, as I eventually dragged out of them, was that playing music or a radio in the workplace, whereby other people can hear it, is considered here to be "public performance". I repeated to them five or six times that I was a consultant and that I worked alone ... there was nobody else here to hear anything I might play. They eventually and rather grumpily went away. At no point did they actually ask whether anything was played in the workplace, they just presumed.

They were trying to alarm me into paying for a licence that I did not need.
In a way, it didn't really matter whether or not it made sense, they were just after some money.

I never understood how playing public-broadcast radio in the workplace could count as an additional public performance of that radio broadcast and justify an additional licence.

Slightly O/T I know, but this is a good point about the aggressive nature they will go to in an attempt to increase their capital.

Some years ago my company received a totally unsolicited call from an unknown firm who stated their job was to "test the quality" of our 'telephone on hold music system' and asked us to put them 'On Hold'. Clearly they were just trying to find if we were using a radio station or public broadcaster for our 'on hold' music (we weren't). Not even knowing who they might have been, we refused to assist them in any form and they went away, never heard from them again.

For others who helped them out this might have been a very different result.

I think someone was trying to scam you, brother. I'm pretty sure that the radio station has already paid

Bob has not responded to this, but my guess is they were looking to see if Bob was putting stuff up that they needed to collect for. Just a guess.

I agree, sounds like a scam. You own no money if you are playing a legal radio station that is playing copyrighted music as they have paid any fees required. No matter how many people can hear it.

You can find plenty of free stuff, and it is worth about what you are paying for it. There is really no such thing as free music of the kind you are talking about as you have seen here already. Sharing files is fine as long as they are not copyrighted songs. Otherwise it is theft plain and simple. Just do a simple google search and you will find plenty to steal.

I really appreciate all the comments.

Moderator - please delete this thread.

I don't think it works that way around here. A lot of information has been posted that others might find useful.

Not a good idea to give a legal opinion when a) you aren't a lawyer and b) you are wrong.

I'm neither an attorney nor am I practicing law: everything below is easily looked up. I did work in this field a long time.

If anyone is curious, the US Congress passed the Fairness in Music Licensing Act of 1997/1998). It lays out the rules regarding when the a radio or TV broadcast is considered a public performance and when it is not. I know them cold but it isn't germaine to this subject. Everyone thought that the PROs would howl because there were now rules while the PROs were rejoicing because now there were rules.

Great Britain and the EU have their own laws about this, too, and they are far more restrictive than the US. Again, this is easily looked up if you're curious.

Anyone remember MUZAK? They went bankrupt telling their customers that those rules would not hold up in court (oh boy were they wrong!). As a result, MUZAK was absorbed by the companies that own Sirius/XM who pay the required licensing fees and pass the cost to their customers.

Music on hold is considered a public performance. Again, there are laws and plenty of companies that can keep their customers in compliance with them.

Sadly not, Byron.
In the UK, that is genuinely the situation.

I don't know about the UK, but I do know about the US.

There was a time, in the late 20th century, when restaurants needed an ASCAP license to play the radio.

I had a friend who owned a small, pizza restaurant. He played an easy listening radio station, at low volume, over the ceiling speakers. The ASCAP rep told him he needed to get a license and pay the subscription fees. Instead, he quit playing the radio station. The previous volume was so low, during the lunch hour, you couldn't hear it anyway.

Eventually that law was overturned, and as far as I know, now it's OK to play the radio without considering it to be a public performance. But I'm not a lawyer, so I could be mistaken about that.

Insights and incites by Notes ♫

I am not trying to give a legal opinion here. The Fairness in Music act has exceptions which are pretty lenient in some cases concerning size of an establishment, number of speakers etc. I have no idea how we got on to this. The main thrust is file sharing of copyrighted material is a no no unless you own the copyright and retained the rights to do so. And, it has been determined that a chord progression is not included in copyright. Melody, lyrics sure. Most recently upheld in the case against Ed Sheeran (I think this is the most recent).