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#171568 - 08/31/12 09:42 AM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: jazzmammal]
rockstar_not Offline
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Quote:

That Kickstarter article is very interesting but did you read the blog posts below it? She quote "already had a massive following" before this project and is married to Neil Gaiman a successful author. She talks on her own blog about years of free gigs, sleeping on the floor at friends houses, online networking, "cloud crowds" to build up the fan base prior to using Kickstarter.




I did read some of them, and yes, to get THAT kind of support, is going to take some connections. But here's the difference, there are no record companies involved making the decision of success A PRIORI. Look at the graph of the support amounts and the distribution across pledge amounts. Over 9000 people pledged 25$. That was a couple hundred thousand of the support and some major change.

That's not rich friends, that's fans - concert attending, CD buying fans. Over 6,000 pledged 5$. That was 35,000$ of the support.

There were about 1600 backers that contributed $125 or more, for another cool $200,000+. Peel those off, they are the rich folks and the connected 'fans'. She still raised $353,884 from people pledging $50 or less.

That doesn't even count what she/band will make on self-publishing all of the media that they will have available from the project.

Crowd sourcing and having a real fan base is here with us now, and learning how to do it will likely be as or more important than knowing how to grease the skids with record companies in the past.

This guy, Tyler Ward, is a personal acquaintance. I won't call him a friend, because we've probably talked with each other less than an hour total, but I was one of the sound engineers at our church where we had Tyler as one of the band members and worship leaders. I am the one who converted Tyler to in-ear monitor use for his band. http://www.youtube.com/user/tylerwardmusic

He has almost 1,000,000 (that's a million) subscribers to his YouTube channel, with almost 300,000,000 (that's 300 million) views of his videos.

Two years ago, zilch. He did almost all of his social media on his own (with assistance from some local folks - but Tyler's a great stage presence, arranger, recordist, mix engineer, etc. - all on his own) Fan support fanned the flame over the past couple years. I think the last time I mentioned him here he had something like 300,000 subscribers. That was probably 6 months ago.

He is making MAJOR revenue now from YouTube advertisements. Major labels have courted him and he has to date turned them all away. Total control of his tour, who is in his band (all fine guys and girls - they all have been part of the worship team at same church), where he tours, what songs he records, what they will sound like, etc. etc. etc.

All done without one finger lifted of help from a record company. Oh boy they want in on the action, but he is trailblazing without them.

Yes, his story is unique, but no more unique than who record companies single out themselves to be popular, as an a priori decision. Then when they aren't, they drop them like a hot potato.

Many of Tyler's cover songs are more popular than the originals - and for the most part, they ARE better. Done in his home studio in suburban Denver.

Along the way he's brought all kinds of YouTube startups from Colorado and elsewhere along with him. None of them are as big as he is, but many are now getting the revenue from YouTube as they themselves are getting their own on-line fan base in the tens and hundreds of thousands.

Check out his videos, you'll see the links to these other artists that he's helped along.

One thing I can say, is that Tyler has real stage mojo. And if it's fake, he's really good at faking it. Watching him on stage just brings a smile. Sometimes it makes the sound engineer's job hard! I don't know of anyone that I know personally who seems to enjoy his/her job of bringing music to a crowd than Tyler. I think it's part of the success equation for him.

-Scott

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#171569 - 08/31/12 10:05 AM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: rockstar_not]
Don Gaynor Online   content
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An Irish cowboy enters stage left, taps mic then says: "Hey, Dude, zisthingon?"

Frankly, the song AND performance were ho hum. Something that I would never buy. That's the bottom line.

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#171570 - 08/31/12 11:50 AM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: Don Gaynor]
jcspro40 Offline
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I have to agree after watching both vids....average IMHO....

Skank? I see worse in the adds forced on me by yahoo!
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#171571 - 09/01/12 03:03 AM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: PRearden]
bobcflatpicker Offline
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PRearden,

I apologize for jumping your case last night. I reacted to you saying this about the girl in the video:

Quote:

Seemed she was trying to hard to be a hard country.., um.. skank.




Two wrongs don’t make a right. I’m sorry for my part in that.

FWIW, the vid is far less "racy" than a lot of commercials and TV shows we see on primetime.

One of the things I really like about the song is that I can envision great improvisational possibilities for acoustic guitar, electric guitar and mandolin in the song over the groove and chord changes.

I can see adding at least a minute to the song to allow for instrumental breaks. I still don’t think that Lisa Angelle is getting her due for her vocal chops, … but that’s JMHO and we’ve all got those.

Take care.
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#171572 - 09/01/12 03:37 AM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: jazzmammal]
bobcflatpicker Offline
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Bob,

I've watched the Law & Order Criminal Intent episode you mentioned a couple of times and was surprised at Jeff Goldblum's chops on the piano.

They also work him playing piano into another episode about ballet dancers.

I don't know if the statistics cited on the show are spot on, ... but they sound accurate, or at least reasonable.

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#171573 - 09/01/12 06:22 PM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: bobcflatpicker]
jazzmammal Offline
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Yeah, Hugh Lauri of House is another one. His character has a grand in his living room and he plays it fairly often. Solid player. Around here it seems like everybody's a player. A very good player.

And Scott, I'm not saying having the ability to control your own destiny using the internet isn't cool. All I'm saying is this new stuff doesn't make it any easier to make it in the biz. The odds are much worse now than they were 30 years ago imho, and we all know how easy it was then. Once you've created a large following then these websites like Kickstarter are great. I'm not discounting that but getting over that first hump is just as hard as it's ever been if not worse.

Tyler is very good, starting in a large church is a time honored traditional way to break into the music biz. Look at all the motown folks who grew up playing gospel in the church. Churches have been hotbeds of networking for centuries. I'm not a churchgoer and I've been told my whole life I should do that but I have too much respect for those folks and to go in there under false pretenses just to network doesn't sit well with me even though people have been using churches for that purpose for a very long time.

Bob
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#171574 - 09/01/12 07:18 PM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: jazzmammal]
rockstar_not Offline
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To clarify a couple points: our church was not 'large'. We averaged 250-300 over 2 services.

Regarding 'making it' it is actually just different, not better or worse than 30 years ago. You don't have to have a big following to successfully use kickstarter. Most don't. Most projects are very small. You match your projects to your size with some stretch. Your highlighted text has it all wrong. Getting over the first hump is different, and I would say it's way more accessible than in the past. What has changed is venue based versus home based. Venue based is harder, home based is way easier. Want to get 1000 CDs pressed but don't have the $2000 to get it done decent at Discmakers? Well, if you really NEED 1000 CDs, you should have a mailing list going already and should be able to get 150 or so folks to pledge you $15 and you end up giving them a CD after it's done at Discmakers. That's the kind of projects that are mostly done at Kickstarters. Sell the other 850 CDs for 10$ and you have $850 to go towards your next project. That's how most people are using these type of sites. (there are a few others, but Kickstarter is the one I have supported folks on.)

Tyler didn't 'start' in our church to make it in the music biz. He didn't use our church, as far as I can tell. His outside of church following in the local area was well along the way before our church as he played in a local band. In fact, our church really had not contributed at all to the firestorm success - it was never even discussed publicly. He only led worship a couple of times. Most of the time he was a supporting guitarist.

Anyways, I think we disagree. I just happen to know many folks that are successful using kickstarter and the like to do a reasonable amount of income without having to involve or worry about record companies or agents or the like. They are in control of their own destinies and sharing their art. I consider that 'making it'.

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#171575 - 09/16/12 04:50 PM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: rockstar_not]
jazzmammal Offline
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Hey Scott, just thought I would come back to post this link:

http://www.artsjournal.com/slippeddisc/2012/09/the-kickstart-singer-who-wont-pay-her-musicians.html

This is our friend Amanda Palmer the Kickstarter millionaire we talked about above. Now she wants musicians to play for free. There's a big discussion about this over on the Keyboard Corner forum.

This reminds me of an old story when I was in a show band at the Holiday Inn Waikiki in the 70's. Don Ho was the big deal then and he moved from his long time gig at the Outrigger to the new Hilton with about a 3 time increase in salary. The Iliki family who had backed him up for over 20 years asked for a small raise and he refused so they quit. It took Mr. Ho like hours to replace all of them for the same money. Lots of loyalty there.

Bob
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#171576 - 09/16/12 05:42 PM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: jazzmammal]
rockstar_not Offline
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Yeah she seems like a real class act. (dripping with sarcasm emoticon needed here)

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#171577 - 09/16/12 06:49 PM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: rockstar_not]
Pat Marr Offline
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regarding Amanda Palmer:
I just got back from reading all the threads about her decision not to pay her band. I could even ALMOST buy her reasoning if only she hadn't been a militant OCCUPY supporter.
If the same logic she applies to herself were applied to the 1% she despises, she would have to say that it's up to the individual to make their own choices about how they earn their living. Then she would have to acknowledge that she is disingenuous on one front or the other.

regarding Lisa Angelle:
If she were in my band, I probably wouldn't kick her out

Just sayin'

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#171578 - 09/16/12 07:07 PM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: rockstar_not]
bobcflatpicker Offline
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I can't help but wonder how her supporters who all contributed to the "One F******g Million" dollars feel after giving her all that money, then seeing her flash her boobs with a gloating body paint message and then hearing that she expects her musicians to play for free! Hmmmmm.....

I vote for the capitalist approach. Record a CD, pay your musicians, offer it for sale and hope that people buy it.

Don't beg for money, gloat that people gave it and then screw over the musicians who make it possible.

As Scott said, ... she's a real class act!
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#171579 - 09/16/12 07:59 PM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: Pat Marr]
bobcflatpicker Offline
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Pat,

It’s interesting that you mentioned that she is an OCCUPY protester who hates the 1%.

I wonder how she would react if a major record company approached her and said “We can make you PART of that 1%!, …?”

There’s no doubt in my mind that she would jump on that bandwagon and become what is known as a hypocrite, … and then immediately start shunning the OCCUPY protesters outside the arena where she was performing! LOL.
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#171580 - 09/19/12 01:47 PM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: bobcflatpicker]
jazzmammal Offline
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I briefly looked her up and man, what a fox. She grew up in the business, her father is/was a producer, it sounds like the whole family is well connected, she's written a lot of stuff that's been produced and it just shows how hard it is to make it even with everything she has going for her. Trust me though, somebody like that has no problem marrying very well, I'm sure she's fine even if she's not an individual star.

Bob
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#171581 - 09/19/12 02:37 PM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: jazzmammal]
filkertom Offline
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Amanda is definitely a strange contradiction walking. I have loved the work of her husband for years, but I don't like her stuff -- or her way of promoting herself -- much at all.

I find no contradiction in her being an Occupy supporter... but I've got a huge problem with someone at her level trying to get musicians to work for free for her.

Shrug.
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#171582 - 09/19/12 02:47 PM [Off-Topic] Re: You’ve gotta wonder just how hard it is to make it in the music business after watching this video. [Re: jazzmammal]
rockstar_not Offline
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I regret making the reference to the kickstarter millionaire.

Here are examples of projects that I've actually helped fund with donations:

1. Pikes Peak Guy's coffee table book - I pledged and paid $75 to help this guy get his coffee table book published. His initial attempt failed. With a little social media help, he reached his goal. Now he is on I believe his 3rd printing and selling through local bookstores, Amazon, etc. http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/thepikespeakguy/365-days-of-pikes-peak-the-journey-0?ref=live note that if you search 'Pikes peak guy' on kickstarter, you'll see his failed first attempt.

2. Amy Winkles' album. They are in mastering right now. I forget what I pledged - I think it was $25. http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/amywinkles/amy-winkles-new-album-in-2012?ref=live

In both cases, these very different artists, one a photographer, one a firebrand rock/worship singer/leader, had financial goals in their artistic endeavors that were out of their personal reach financially - but were needed to get to the 'next level' of getting their art into the public's hands. They had a quite small, but established fan-base (of which I am a fan of both) that were willing to forward them a fairly small bit of cash, for a valuable product in return - should enough people join the pledge.

I have a great, signed, sleeved hardcopy of the Pikes Peak Guy's 365 days of Pikes Peak proudly on display on my coffee table - and it's glorious. It retails for $99 on Amazon for an unsleeved version. More importantly, it is sold at all of the major gift shops in Colorado Springs - the most appropriate place for them to be printed. It is a very high quality book - that was one of the artist's requirements - he went into some detail about how he selected the printer and his criteria for selection. He involved us backers in his process - which is worth some of the backing fee, IMO.

I will be getting a signed copy of Amy's CD. If it's anything as good as hearing her live, my money will be well spent. Amy's vocals remind me of the best of Pat Benatar and Melissa Etheridge combined into one. I wish there was a popular female rock singer right now, but there isn't. So, I bought into Amy's project knowing that at least the folks involved in her project will likely do right by her voice. On stage energy; hard to capture in a CD; but I was willing to take the risk that they'll get some of it done.

Perhaps more valuable to me in both of these endeavors is that I played a small part in allowing these two artists to pursue their dreams. Paying it forward, shall we say. I know one thing that the coffee table project allowed was to allow the artist to 'stair-step' their investment, for wider exposure, with very little out of pocket expenses except in the original creation of the photographs.

I think they are 'making it', using their own terms, and at their own pace - without any outside influence of publishers or corporations. This is what I mean when the world is a better place for this now, than it was even 20 years ago.

-Scott

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PG Music News
RealBand® 2018 for Windows Build 3 Update Available!

RealBand 2018 users can update their version with the latest patch, Build 3. Download this patch here

Summary of Changes since 2018 Build 3:

Added: Section Numbers supported. All section letter menus now include numbers 1 through 9 in addition to letters A through Z.
Fixed: Section letters in Notation Window were not being resized if the notation was zoomed in/out
Fixed: RealBand might freeze when generating audio harmonies
Fixed: Loading in a BB song (MGU/SGU) or generating realtracks could freeze up the program.
Fixed: Chords in Notation/LeadSheet on 1st beat of a bar were being drawn too close to bar lines.
Fixed: Support for XP and Vista.

http://www.pgmusic.com/support.realband.htm#2018_3

Band-in-a-Box® 2018 Build 505 Update Available!

Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows users can update their version with the latest patch - Build 505.

This patch can be downloaded here.

Summary of changes for Build 505:

Added: You can now put Section Numbers in your song. Previously you could only use letters A-Z, but now you can use 1-9 as well.
Added:You can now filter styles in the StylePicker for styles that contain Video RealTracks.
Fixed: Band-in-a-Box would crash with error "Procedure entry point MFTEnumEx could not be found in the Dynamic Link Library Mfplat.DLL" while starting up if using Windows Vista.
Fixed: Band-in-a-Box would crash with error message "dwmapi.dll cannot be found" while starting up if using Windows XP.
Fixed: The Transcribe feature in the Audio Edit window was not always working.
Fixed: The Windows Audio Devices dialog might show garbage text for names of devices if not running Band-in-a-Box in English.
Fixed: There was no Quality selector in the Render to Audio File dialog if rendering MP3 on Windows 7 or earlier.
Fixed: There were visual artifacts in the leadsheet & notation windows when moving the cursor.
Fixed: Using the Transpose or stretching features in the Audio Edit window might cause an access violation if the audio track is mono.
Improved: Band-in-a-Box will start up faster.
Improved: Importing ABC Notation files has been improved.
Updated: Help file and manuals.
Updated: RealTracks Artist bio's.

http://www.pgmusic.com/support_windowsupdates.htm#505

New! Video RealTracks for Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows!

NEW with Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows... Video RealTracks Sets!

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Video - 202 NEW RealTracks for Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows!

With the release of Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows we also released 202 NEW RealTracks (in Sets 278-300)! Listen to all the individual demos here: www.pgmusic.com/bbwin.202newrealtracks.htm, or watch our Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows - 202 New RealTracks Overview Video: www.pgmusic.com/?vid=qDFYZMjrzAI

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Video - The Audio Chord Wizard in Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows

Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows boasts over 50 new features and enhancements... including the Build-in Audio Chord Wizard!

The Audio Chord Wizard has been redesigned with Band-in-a-Box® 2018, and is now built in to the program! Previously, the Audio Chord Wizard was a separate app that was not tightly integrated into Band-in-a-Box®. This app is still available from the [Audio Chord Wizard] toolbar button, but now the improved built-in Audio Chord Wizard can be accessed from the Audio Edit Window!

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RealBand® 2018 for Windows Build 2 Update Available!

RealBand 2018 users can download a small (free) patch update for their purchase!

Summary of patch update:
Access violation if clicking on Guitar Window or Big Piano when there isn't any notation window currently open.

http://www.pgmusic.com/support.realband.htm#2018_2

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