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#177590 - 10/31/12 06:27 AM [Off-Topic] Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard
wildetudor Offline
Newbie

Registered: 10/31/12
Posts: 5
Hello everyone,

I want to transfer some MIDI files from my PC to the internal memory of my Yamaha EZ-200 keyboard, in order to learn to play those pieces using the keyboard's Learning Mode. I connected the keyboard to my PC using a USB-MIDI cable, following the in-to-out out-to-in convention for the MIDI ports. The settings of Yamaha "MusicSoft Downloader" (the software used to copy files from a PC to a Yamaha keyboard) displays the connection as a "USB Audio Device", however I cannot browse the keyboard's internal memory in order to copy MIDI files over. This is without having installed any drivers yet, and without Windows prompting me to install anything upon connecting the keyboard to the PC.

I then downloaded and installed the Yamaha USB-MIDI driver (http://download.yamaha.com/usb_midi/index.html), however it says that no keyboard is connected. This driver is, however, meant to be used with a different cable than mine (http://www.yamahamusicsoft.com/en/instru...03?currency=USD), although the two cables seem to be essentially the same (1 USB port to 2 MIDI ports).

Was anyone able to make such a connection to an older keyboard? I am wondering whether getting this Yamaha "UX16 USB-MIDI Interface" cable would enable the software to access my keyboard's internal memory. I know the EZ200 *is* capable of having files copied to it, because it appears in MusicSoft Downloader's list of models! On the other hand, though, the keyboard appears to not have an internal memory, as there is no Record feature on it...

Any help with this would be tremendously appreciated!

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#177591 - 10/31/12 06:59 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: wildetudor]
Ryszard Offline
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Registered: 09/28/07
Posts: 3900
Loc: Kennesaw (Atlanta) GA
Wildetudor,

I see that this is your first post. Welcome to the BIAB community. It's a little early yet for most users, so be patient. Someone will probably be along to address your issue. Good luck, and have fun!

Richard
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#177592 - 10/31/12 09:26 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: Ryszard]
eddie1261 Offline
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Registered: 04/08/11
Posts: 4376
Someone may be able to help you but does this have anything at all to do with PG Software? I am not seeing even a mention of BIAB or RB. It sounds like an issue for the people who made your interface or Yamaha.
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#177593 - 10/31/12 10:05 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: eddie1261]
furry Offline
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Registered: 06/28/06
Posts: 5615
Loc: Scottish Highlands
Have a look at yahoo groups, yamaha users. I know there's some good yamaha forums out there. Google yamaha forums and you should come up with some pointers.
From experience I'm pretty sure that you can transfer midi files into your keyboard but only yamaha ez200 files will work with the learning mode. You can download these from yamaha but they can be pricey
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#177594 - 10/31/12 10:05 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: eddie1261]
Notes Norton Offline
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Registered: 07/06/00
Posts: 4430
Loc: Fort Pierce, Florida, U.S.A.
Will your Yamaha read files from a USB flash drive?

Years ago when I had a Yamaha keyboard, it could read floppy disks. I would create my song on Band-in-a-Box, save as a type 1 MIDI file, do some editing with a software sequencer, save as a type 0 MIDI file (that was the only kind the stone-age Yamaha could read) and use Windows Explorer to drag the type 0 MIDI file to a floppy disk. Then I'd use the floppy to load into the Yamaha.

If your keyboard can read files on a USB flash drive, this could work for you. (And a newer keyboard might even be able to read type 1 MIDI files)

Notes
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#177595 - 10/31/12 10:07 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: eddie1261]
wildetudor Offline
Newbie

Registered: 10/31/12
Posts: 5
Hi Eddie and Richard,

Thanks for your replies! You are right in that my question does not at all relate to any PG software products. However, when searching for a solution to this problem, I found a similar post on this forum by a user who had a slightly different problem, and who advised me to post here, since there might be keyboard players who have experienced a similar dillema and who might be able to help. I thought the "off-topic" section of the forum would be .. off-topic enough for a random question like that

I hope that's ok...

Best wishes,
Tudor

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#177596 - 10/31/12 10:39 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: wildetudor]
eddie1261 Offline
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Registered: 04/08/11
Posts: 4376
MIDI is MIDI, so it should be cross platform. When I did this in the past it was with my Ensoniq boards, and I used an intermediate software written for the Ensoniq ESQ-1. It was a drag and drop just like moving files in windows explorer. The trick was in the software, knowing how to make native MIDI fit the format of the sequencer inside the ESQ-1. All I had to do was assign it to a sequence name inside the synth. Sounds like you have something similar to that in your near future.
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I will continue to post in the songwriters forum but will be keeping my opinions to myself as far as the off topic forum goes.

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#177597 - 10/31/12 10:41 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: wildetudor]
Curmudgeon Offline
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Registered: 01/06/06
Posts: 2689
Loc: Henderson, NV
Quote:

I hope that's ok...





Welcome Tudor,

I hope that you feel free to return to our group for whatever question you may have!

Don S.
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#177598 - 10/31/12 10:41 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: wildetudor]
wildetudor Offline
Newbie

Registered: 10/31/12
Posts: 5
I should also mention that I asked this question on more relevant forums (e.g. the Yamaha forum, and keyboardforums.com), and received no helpful replies. The EZ200 doesn't, unfortunately, have any other connections aside from those 2 MIDI ports, so transfering MIDI files that way would be the only option.

I was suggested to use a different cable (this one: http://www.amazon.com/EMU-XMIDI-1X1-MIDI...s=emu+midi+usb) , however at this point I am really doubtful the keyboard knows how to handle external MIDI files, much less store them inside its internal memory!

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#177599 - 10/31/12 10:45 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: wildetudor]
wildetudor Offline
Newbie

Registered: 10/31/12
Posts: 5
Eddie: in my case, the software that allows drag&dropping MIDIs from the PC to the keyboard would be Yamaha Software, called MusicSoft Downloader, however it does not recognise the USB-MIDI connection, and cannot access the keyboard's internal memory.

If this turn out not to work in the end, I'll probably sell the Yamaha EZ200 and get a Casio LK-280, which *is* meant to take in files, as it has an USB connection, and also has the lighted keys that allow easy visual learning of the piano pieces.

Thanks again for your help.

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#177600 - 10/31/12 10:46 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: wildetudor]
eddie1261 Offline
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Registered: 04/08/11
Posts: 4376
I really doubt the cable is the issue. If you can communicate events to play notes, you should be able to communicate sysex data transfers. 5 pins is 5 pins.

I can tell you all about Ensoniq, including company history, but I don't know Yamaha keyboards at all. Does your synth even have a sequencer?

Once again, MIDI is MIDI. Internal, external, extraterrestrial... MIDI is MIDI. If the board is capable, there is a way to move stuff from A to B, and that "way" is called sysex (system exclusive). If your board can send and receive sysex data, you are home free. Your manual will address that.
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I will continue to post in the songwriters forum but will be keeping my opinions to myself as far as the off topic forum goes.

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#177601 - 10/31/12 11:06 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: wildetudor]
KeithS Offline
Expert

Registered: 06/09/03
Posts: 896
Loc: Mobile, Alabama
I looked at the online manual for your keyboard and it just wasn't designed to do what you want to do. Your MIDI IN and OUT is going to allow an external program to record MIDI from a performance on your keyboard, and also let an external MIDI sequencer play back a performance using the sound module on the Yamaha. You have no capabilies that I could find to record MIDI files on the EZ 200.
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#177602 - 10/31/12 11:13 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: KeithS]
Mac Offline
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Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 38502
Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia USA
Quote:

I looked at the online manual for your keyboard and it just wasn't designed to do what you want to do. Your MIDI IN and OUT is going to allow an external program to record MIDI from a performance on your keyboard, and also let an external MIDI sequencer play back a performance using the sound module on the Yamaha. You have no capabilies that I could find to record MIDI files on the EZ 200.




This is the correct information.


--Mac
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#177603 - 10/31/12 11:13 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: wildetudor]
flatfoot Offline
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Registered: 06/15/00
Posts: 2185
Loc: Sacramento CA
.
>>>...I want to transfer some MIDI files from my PC to the internal memory of my Yamaha EZ-200 keyboard...>>>

I googled the EZ 200 quickly and it seems this model does not have internal memory. On my Yamaha DGX, the songs that come installed are completely inaccessible. They cannot be moved or copied.


>>>...The settings of Yamaha "MusicSoft Downloader" (the software used to copy files from a PC to a Yamaha keyboard) displays the connection as a "USB Audio Device", however I cannot browse the keyboard's internal memory...>>>>

I beleive that's the way Yamaha intend it to work. On my keyboard the Yam software enabled copying between a PC and an SD memory card. Very difficult to use.

>>>...This driver is, however, meant to be used with a different cable than mine...>>>

I would not be at all surprised if Yam made it so that only their won cable will work.

Are you able to have the keyboard play songs from a program on your PC? I can play a song in Band in a Box and have the Yam produce the sounds. Are you able to do that? From what I can see this should be allowed, but you may need the Yam cable to do it.

>>>...I know the EZ200 *is* capable of having files copied to it, because it appears in MusicSoft Downloader's list of models!...>>>

Try downloading a manual for this instrument and see what it says.
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#177604 - 10/31/12 11:48 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: flatfoot]
eddie1261 Offline
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Registered: 04/08/11
Posts: 4376
Okay, you may need to define "files". "Files" as in banks of presets that replace the factory presets, or "files" as in sequences? Huge difference there. I still have a Yamaha FB-01 module from the 80s that would accept custom designed sounds via sysex, but it had no sequencer. The banks of sounds are "files" too. I suspect you have something similar going on here.

Nothing says that you can't PLAY those sequences from another storage and playback device. That would come down to the capability of your synthesizer, i.e. how many voices is it. If it's an 8 voice, you are splitting those 8 voices between different instruments playing back on your tracks.

Again deferring to those more schooled on Yamaha, is his model higher end or lower end? If it has no sequencer, I assume it's the latter, particularly knowing how long ago onboard sequencers became the standard issue.
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I will continue to post in the songwriters forum but will be keeping my opinions to myself as far as the off topic forum goes.

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#177605 - 10/31/12 12:45 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: eddie1261]
wildetudor Offline
Newbie

Registered: 10/31/12
Posts: 5
The EZ200 definitely does not have a sequencer, as it is clearly a low end model - I just bought it because of the lihted keys feature. I am currently waiting for a response to an enquiry sent to Yamaha as to whether their USB-MIDI cable (http://www.yamahamusicsoft.com/en/instrument/Keyboard/EZ-200/category/Accessories/product/1013803?currency=USD) is able to transfer MIDI files from a PC to the EZ200. I am not putting my hopes up though, and have started shopping around for a Casio LK-280...

Once again, I really appreciate everyone's input, I'm pleasantly surprised at how this helpful the forum is.

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#177606 - 10/31/12 01:04 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: wildetudor]
eddie1261 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 04/08/11
Posts: 4376
I can tell you their answer, as you have provided it yourself. The board won't do what you want to do no matter what kind of cable you have. It is just not built to store sequences. It may be able to PLAY them, but again, it depends on the synth. My old Ensoniq was made that I could play different tracks back on different patch numbers. Yours may be that it will play piano, or strings, or organ, or brass, but only one of those at a time. On teh ESQ-1, I could play piano on one track, organ on another, strings on another....
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I will continue to post in the songwriters forum but will be keeping my opinions to myself as far as the off topic forum goes.

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#177607 - 11/01/12 08:45 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: eddie1261]
Notes Norton Offline
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Registered: 07/06/00
Posts: 4430
Loc: Fort Pierce, Florida, U.S.A.
My old Yamaha had limited MIDI capabilities, but that was back in the early days of MIDI. Channel 1 only went in and out the MIDI port, but the floppy would get things in. I didn't keep it long as the MIDI resolution was 96ppq and the sequences I was making on the Atari computer at the time were 240ppq and I could hear the difference. (Remember Atari Computers anyone).

My suggestion would be to get a different keyboard or make mp3s of your BiaB or RB files and use a computer or iPod to play them back.

Here's how I do it: http://www.nortonmusic.com/backing_tracks.html

Notes
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100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
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#177608 - 11/01/12 09:25 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: Notes Norton]
MarioD Offline
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Registered: 12/27/03
Posts: 11209
Loc: Hamlin NY
Quote:

....the sequences I was making on the Atari computer at the time were 240ppq and I could hear the difference. (Remember Atari Computers anyone).

Notes




Oh yea, with my Atari 1040 ST, Dr. T’s software, my Korg DS-8 and a Casio MG510 midi guitar controller I was in seventh heaven! The only thing I have left from those days is my Casio MG510.
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#177609 - 11/02/12 11:17 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Transferring MIDI files from the PC to a Yamaha keyboard [Re: MarioD]
Notes Norton Offline
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Registered: 07/06/00
Posts: 4430
Loc: Fort Pierce, Florida, U.S.A.
I still have two Atari computers. The one I used and another that a friend of mine gave me when he decided to go Mac. I don't even know if they work. I thought about selling them, but I don't know of anyone who would want them.

I have an old Mac too. I used to have two, but while cleaning out some storage space, I plugged in the old Classic (Motorola CPU) and it displayed nothing by gibberish on the screen. To the recycling center it went. I still have a giant IBM CPU eMac that I haven't turned on in years. Another orphaned dinosaur.

But I no longer have my DOS5/Win3.1 through my Win95 computers. I sold them for not much money, but just enough so that somebody wanted them. I figure it kept them out of the landfill for a while.

But the Atari and eMac went ignored on Craigslist. Windows has always had a good bit of backwards compatibility (like BiaB) so most old software still works on Win7 - I wonder if Win8 will change that? I hope not.

I've read some good and bad about Win8 in the PC magazines. I won't get it right away (the cutting edge is the bleeding edge) and time will tell if it becomes another Vista or not.

Notes
_________________________
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& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks

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