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#192514 - 01/29/13 06:04 PM [Off-Topic] PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice?
Paul Haynes Offline
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Registered: 12/30/12
Posts: 362
Loc: United Kingdom
I've been asked to play my acoustic guitar with a friend who sings gospels songs at some nursing homes. I'm guessing the amount of people we would sing to would be between 12-20 people? I always like to bring a good sound to the mix and from that have bought BIAB of which I am very pleased. However, I've started to consider what speaker system I would need to be able to plug in my guiar, mic and iPod [BIAB backing tracks]? I don't have a big budget and dont want to get sucked into buying a full on PA which is overkill. I own an AER Acousticube which is a very good acoustic guitar and mic but not so good reproducing smooth low end bass notes from BIAB. Thing is I've been spoiled with my computer speaker system 2x B&W speakers + Rel Sub. The sound really rocks with the sub so I'm looking for a portable speaker system that can reproduce the nice low end bass notes that I've come to enjoy from my computer. Good bass makes all the difference I believe.

I've seen these Web Page but I'm not so sure they would do the bass any justice?

This option looks more plausible YouTube especially from 3min onward in the video.

Maybe I'm looking for the impossible but does this speaker system exist?


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#192515 - 01/29/13 06:15 PM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: Paul Haynes]
Mac Offline
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Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 38502
Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia USA
BOSE L1

http://www.bose.com/controller?event=VIE...stems/index.jsp

Great sound, fullrange, no monitors needed and nice and portable to boot. Matching Subwoofer available.

I love it.


--Mac
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#192516 - 01/29/13 06:18 PM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: Mac]
Mac Offline
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Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 38502
Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia USA
My Bose L1 also has the added advantage of the tiny footprint, I have found that too many speakers does not bode well at the retirement home. The support personnel will be telling you to turn it down before you turn it on if you go in there with boxes on stands, power amps and subwoofers. And it just isn't needed there.

The L1 will handle the venue you describe just fine.


--Mac
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#192517 - 01/29/13 06:52 PM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: Mac]
JohnJohnJohn Offline
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Registered: 06/25/12
Posts: 2234
I bought a very inexpensive ($150) system from Behringer that I absolutely love for small venues like local dive bars with a small crowd. It is the EUROLIVE B205D Active 150-Watt PA/Monitor Speaker System and it mounts on your mic stand. Has two inputs that each accept XLR or 1/4" plug. It has input for your mp3 player, phantom power and a basic EQ.

It certainly won't compare with Mac's Bose L1 but it sounds pretty sweet for small venues and you can't beat the price!

And I just noticed they are replacing the 205 with a 207 which has a bit larger speaker, an additional mic input and a built-in mp3 player so you can play your recordings from a USB stick.

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#192518 - 01/29/13 06:52 PM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: Mac]
Paul Haynes Offline
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Registered: 12/30/12
Posts: 362
Loc: United Kingdom
Mac, which Bose L1 do you mean? There are three.
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BIAB 2017
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#192519 - 01/29/13 07:40 PM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: JohnJohnJohn]
Pat Marr Offline
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Registered: 10/25/08
Posts: 7576
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC
Quote:

I bought a very inexpensive ($150) system from Behringer that I absolutely love for small venues like local dive bars with a small crowd. It is the EUROLIVE B205D Active 150-Watt PA/Monitor Speaker System and it mounts on your mic stand. Has two inputs that each accept XLR or 1/4" plug. It has input for your mp3 player, phantom power and a basic EQ.

It certainly won't compare with Mac's Bose L1 but it sounds pretty sweet for small venues and you can't beat the price!

And I just noticed they are replacing the 205 with a 207 which has a bit larger speaker, an additional mic input and a built-in mp3 player so you can play your recordings from a USB stick.




I saw a bluegrass band last night and they used this cool little PA. The venue was very small, about the size of a McDonalds. They stayed 4 feet away from the mic, and you could still hear each performer singing. The instruments were acoustic, not amplified, so they just used it for vocals. They might not have needed a PA at all for this gig, but it was clearly capable of a lot more volume than they were requiring of it.

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#192520 - 01/29/13 08:11 PM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: Paul Haynes]
Mac Offline
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Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 38502
Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia USA
Quote:

Mac, which Bose L1 do you mean? There are three.




Well, you said you wanted a subwoofer, so that rules out choice number 1. BUT -- you very likely won't need the subwoofer. My suggestion is to see if you can audition one locally before purchase, take your laptop and BB with you, ask to plug it in. I don't use a subwoofer, didn't buy one, don't need it IMO. If, perhaps, you wanted to rock out, perhaps it would be apropos, but you mentioned retirement homes...

Numbers two and three come with the addon subwoofer.

For your stated purposes, and even much larger halls than that, you might consider choice 2, the one in the middle.

I'm not using the extra subwoofer with mine and it sounds just great with BiaB. People are always remarking on how good we sound. And the sound seems to come from everywhere, there are no hotspots and no dropout spots either. No separate monitor system, even in large venues, we hear exactly what they hear. And running it yourself onstage is easy peasy, literally a set and forget system.

In the retirement homes, I often elect not to put up the entire stack, as well. It isn't needed, is more unobtrusive in looks, but still fills the typical large drawing room or cafeterias found in those places.


--Mac
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#192521 - 01/29/13 08:16 PM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: Paul Haynes]
GDaddy Offline
Expert

Registered: 11/06/08
Posts: 897
Loc: Homosassa , Florida
Behringer K3000FX Ultratone Keyboard Amplifier (300 Watts, 1x15")

I use this to amplify my keyboards, synths, guitars, Bass guitars, Roland 5080 and even a JAM MAN! looper.
The bass is gut wrenching on the drums and Bass guitar, and the vocals are crystal clear...

With 300 Watts of power, you'll never run out of horse power. The K3000FX 4-channel PA/keyboard amplifier enclosed in a bass reflex cabinet has a special, beefed up 15" Bugera woofer and a custom-made 1" tweeter, delivering clear, clean sound that's ideal for gigs, large or small... included in this great amp,an internal 24-bit digital FX processor with 100 awesome presets including reverb, chorus, flanger, delay, pitch shifter and various multi-effects. Our revolutionary FBQ Feedback Detection Enjoy full 4-channel stereo operation with separate volume and FX Send controls per channel, plus there is an additional XLR mic input on channel 1 for direct connection of dynamic microphones. Use the dedicated 7-band graphic EQ to give your sound your very own edge. I also have a Behringer Bass Amp which is plenty powerful. My Fender
KXR keyboard/PA is also a performer to reflect the quality of the BIAB/RB Programs PERFECTO!!

http://www.zzounds.com/item--BEHK3000FX

4 payments of $100....Have it payed off in no-time!!


It's delicious...it's delightful...its... POTATO SOLID!! ...

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#192522 - 01/29/13 08:23 PM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: GDaddy]
Mac Offline
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Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 38502
Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia USA
Here's the reason why this old achin' back loves his Bose L-1:

One trip. Even with guitar bag over the other shoulder.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ia-vbM4lwp0

And it fits in the trunk or on the backseat of my little Ford Taurus.

I've got a Roland stereo keyboard amp. Nice to have on the loud R&B/Bluesband gig, but a real backbreaker at the end of the night.

And to think that I used to lug a B3 around.

Maybe that's what's wrong with the back now?


--Mac
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#192523 - 01/29/13 08:54 PM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: Mac]
Danny C. Offline
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Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 6494
Loc: South Louisiana
The B3 wears you down, than BAM the Leslie's throws the knockout punch!

Later,
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#192524 - 01/29/13 09:30 PM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: Paul Haynes]
John Conley Offline
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Registered: 09/28/03
Posts: 8333
Loc: London, Ontario, Canada
I have the l1 model 2 with a bass speaker and the little Mixer. I don't know about guitar pickups but an audix mic is suggested by many and I love mine. None of it is heavy, but I got 2 trolley dollies 2 wheel jobs that I pull in. The Bose has some magic inside and if Mac says its good it is. I think we ended up getting them close to the same time, he's always telling me what to do. I'm pretty deaf.
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#192525 - 01/29/13 10:52 PM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: Paul Haynes]
J. Larry Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 01/09/07
Posts: 496
I've played many nursing homes and retirement centers with the Behringer 205D monitor speakers (with BIAB and outboard mixer), and they work great. Small, light-weight and they get the job done. Even used them with a 4-piece group in a restaurant setting. No problem.

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#192526 - 01/29/13 11:29 PM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: J. Larry]
JoanneCooper Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/12/12
Posts: 2380
Loc: South Africa
I use a Yamaha stage pass for smaller venues. Very neat design. Two passive speakers with 6 channel mixer which fits onto the back of one of the speakers and the cables go in the back of the other. So all you carrying is two small speakers

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#192527 - 01/30/13 12:26 AM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: JoanneCooper]
flatfoot Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/15/00
Posts: 2185
Loc: Sacramento CA
.
For the small venues like nursing homes I use Logitechs similar to these:

http://www.amazon.com/Logitech-980-00040...rs+for+computer

Remember that in a nursing home you will not need great volume to compete with chatting, knife-and-fork noises and other audio interference. These have plenty of power for something the size of a large living room. They do something very nice with vocals, and handle the full range of Biab instruments cleanly and in stereo. The tweeters are small enough that I can usually place them in a way that makes them nearly invisible. The whole thing fits in one milk crate, including a mixer like this one:

http://www.amazon.com/Pyle-PYD6070-6-Cha...6+channel+mixer

(...many companies make mixers on this scale.)

Actually I use one of these for roll-in and roll-out:

http://www.amazon.com/Portable-Extendabl...=rolling+crate.

If you can afford the Bose, go get 'em. If not, try these. Try Craigslist while you are at it
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Got some tunes on You Tube:
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#192528 - 01/30/13 01:14 AM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: Paul Haynes]
tomshannon2 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 07/17/06
Posts: 39
Loc: Naperville, IL
I'm with Mac on this one...I've owned Bose L1 since 2005 (at that time there was only one option).

For nursing home/assisted living situations, the L1 compact is more than sufficient. The bass module is built into the unit and would suffice for your application. The other models have an option bass module which are a more powerful bass modules than the built in module in in the compact. But again, the L1 Compact would suffice for your application.

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#192529 - 01/30/13 03:04 AM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: tomshannon2]
Paul Haynes Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 12/30/12
Posts: 362
Loc: United Kingdom
I'm looking for a sound system that when played through, the bass sounds live and deep rather than just OK if you know what I mean. To the best of my knowledge and experience this can only be achieved with a sub in the mix?
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BIAB 2017
Custom PC: Intel I7, 960Gb SSD, 16Gb RAM, 3x 4Tb internal HDD, 2x 4Tb External backup drives. Asus Xonar Essence Sound Card.
Recording: Studio One 4 Pro, Rode K2 + Beyerdynamic TGX80 Mics, Audiobox 22VSL, KRK VXT6 speakers, Sennheiser HD280

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#192530 - 01/30/13 08:48 AM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: Paul Haynes]
Mac Offline
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Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 38502
Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia USA
Quote:

I'm looking for a sound system that when played through, the bass sounds live and deep rather than just OK if you know what I mean. To the best of my knowledge and experience this can only be achieved with a sub in the mix?




You must audition the L-1, the standard model, which has a subwoofer in the bottom, just not as big as the other two offerings.

My bass sounds like a bass should, whether using Realtracks or even MIDI styles.

The L-1 is a totally different design concept from any of the others mentioned here. Trying to compare the L-1 to the standard PA configs that are everywhere without first auditioning the L-1 system is like trying to compare a prop place to a jet.


--Mac
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#192531 - 01/30/13 11:44 AM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: Mac]
Paul Haynes Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 12/30/12
Posts: 362
Loc: United Kingdom
Quote:



And to think that I used to lug a B3 around.


--Mac




Whats a B3? Is that the Bose L1 Model 3? The largest of all of them?

So from your posts I take it you have the L1 Compact?

I will audition as soon as funds permit and where I can find a place who sell them. I do live in UK after all!

But here's my take on it, my AER Acousticube 2 cost me around £1500 when bought back in 1998. Now they are over £2000. So if an expensive brand like Bose sell their bottom range system for £899 cheapest, me thinks it isnt going to meet my needs. The L1 v2 or L1 v3 or L1 v2 x2 subs etc might do? Or am I wrong?
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Custom PC: Intel I7, 960Gb SSD, 16Gb RAM, 3x 4Tb internal HDD, 2x 4Tb External backup drives. Asus Xonar Essence Sound Card.
Recording: Studio One 4 Pro, Rode K2 + Beyerdynamic TGX80 Mics, Audiobox 22VSL, KRK VXT6 speakers, Sennheiser HD280

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#192532 - 01/30/13 11:52 AM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: Paul Haynes]
Robh Offline
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Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 4166
Loc: California
If i had the cash right now rather than the upper end Bose i would get 2 compacts. Two bass modules and 2 speaker arrays stereo, cool.
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#192533 - 01/30/13 01:08 PM [Off-Topic] Re: PA Suggestions That Do BIAB Justice? [Re: Paul Haynes]
John Conley Offline
Veteran

Registered: 09/28/03
Posts: 8333
Loc: London, Ontario, Canada
A b3 is an organ. It also used special Leslie speakers, which have a spinning horn.

It needs a special rig to move it, or 2 strong people.

I never moved one, but mostly played the 'floor' model b4.

I have played a b3 where the band bought one and a leslie, but I , that's I with a capital I, never helped to move it. I did set it up though. And that's another whole story.

I'm with Mac on this one, mine is the L1 Model 2, with 2 pieces of pole, the bass module, and the 'mixer'. That was to be our touring rig. I should find someone in my area who wants to gig with it, I use it 2 or 3 times a week, preferring to play the actual piano on the upper level of the house.

Bose is pricey, but look up the website, or find a dealer who has one setup. I think it's worth the cash if you are looking to invest in something well engineered that should last you 10 years. If you think that way. I don't even by green bananas anymore.
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