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musiclover #222405 11/24/13 03:08 PM
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Hey MusicLove, I am curious to find out about what program people are using to compliment BiaB. I am going to buy BiaB so by mentioning a program that can help in the production somehow I wouldn't think would be against the rules. That would be very strict rules if you can't express that. If you can send me a message to let me know I would appreciate it. If you came on here beating down BiaB in favor of something else I can understand. Thanks

Sly Ruby #222407 11/24/13 03:19 PM
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Hey SlyRuby,

Band in a Box ships with RealBand program, which is a DAW program complete with audio plugins and RealBand is designed to work with Band in a Box style files as well as a host of other features. Multitracking, recording Audio and/or MIDI, Mixing, even Mastering can all be done inside RealBand.

While there are certainly plenty of users who use and endorse other DAW programs, Sonar comes to mind readily, there are also a lot of users who use RealBand as well.

You might wait until you purchase your Band in a Box package to see what that is all about, for it is possible certainly to use just these two programs to produce the entire shebang.


--Mac

Pat Marr #222412 11/24/13 03:32 PM
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Speaking of the audio being the weakest link, I was looking through reviews on inexpensive reference speakers the other week, and someone mentioned that they hooked up their M-Audio speakers to a Berhringer UCA202 instead of going directly to their audio card.

I occurred to my that I had a UCA202, and tried it out. There wasn't a huge difference, but the UCA202 was noticeably better.

The audio chain is only as good as the weakest link.

And as Mac said, if you can't hear it, you can't fix it.


-- David Cuny
My virtual singer development blog

Vocal control, you say. Never heard of it. Is that some kind of ProTools thing?
Sly Ruby #222444 11/24/13 07:26 PM
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Sly, don't even think about buying another DAW until you're completely familiar with Real Band. It works very well and it is fully capable of doing everything you need an audio/midi recording program to do at this time. Real Band IS a fully functional DAW and it's included with all but the most basic Biab purchase. I have advised folks for years that they should learn RB at the same time they're learning Biab. Spend an hour with one then have some coffee and spend another hour with the other. Keep on doing that until you can start answering other noobies questions here. Hang out on the RB forum and start reading all about it.

For you to talk about spending several hundred bucks for another DAW right now is like some rich guy letting his 16 year old kid take his 300K Ferrari to the DMV to take his first driving test. Kinda overkill, ya know?

Baby steps, baby steps. Learn how this stuff works first then when you can explain to another noobie on this forum exactly why you need another DAW, go ahead and spend your money.

Bob


Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
jazzmammal #222452 11/24/13 07:56 PM
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Sly,
Bob (Jazzmammal) has given some very good advice. I think that Band in a Box and RealBand will take you a long way...
Enjoy!


BIAB & RB2024 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
Mac #222456 11/24/13 09:25 PM
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Sounds like a good idea. Band in a Box and RealBand is probably all I want. I was thinking about Cubase since I know it could be the best. But I am sure it is so high tech I would be at a loss. And RealBand will likely be all I need. And who knows 2014 might have more improvements. So I will just go for BiaB and use RealBand. Thanks

Pat Marr #222544 11/25/13 05:20 PM
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The thing about Realband is that it supports BiaB features way beyond any other DAW.
Regeneration alone makes it worth learning.
No other DAW does that.

So if you are paying for BiaB features, you may as well learn a DAW that uses BiaB features, because you move on to a DAW to improve your final project, but sometimes you may want that DAW to be able to regenerate sections. That happens a LOT here.

In all other DAWs, if you decide to re-arrange the song, or add a verse, you have to go back to BiaB and regenerate everything, then import it into the DAW.

With RB you can continue to generate (even small sections) right on through the DAW stage.
Other DAWs DO have certain features and aspects that may make you eventually need to use them, but until then I agree with the above posts; learn RB as a DAW. Most of what you learn will 'translate' to other DAWs, so there is little time wasted on learning it.

You'll also learn what it can do that the others can't, and thus know when to switch to which DAW. Saves time in the long run.


Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
rharv #222556 11/25/13 06:24 PM
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After all that was said here about Real Band I am looking forward to that program also now instead of just thinking about BiaB. Sounds like the best DAW for BiaB you can have. Then possibly for some reason someone could use another program like Cubase to import your production into it. Or parts of it. Who knows why. I will probably always use Real Band once I get comfortable with it. Maybe I will go to YouTube and see a couple demos on it to see what I am in store for.

Sly Ruby #222601 11/26/13 02:04 AM
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Originally Posted By: SlyRuby
After all that was said here about Real Band I am looking forward to that program also now instead of just thinking about BiaB. Sounds like the best DAW for BiaB you can have. Then possibly for some reason someone could use another program like Cubase to import your production into it. Or parts of it. Who knows why. I will probably always use Real Band once I get comfortable with it. Maybe I will go to YouTube and see a couple demos on it to see what I am in store for.


Hi Sly

Here's a good place to start!
There's plenty more though!


BIAB & RB2024 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
Pat Marr #223178 11/27/13 03:56 AM
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Yes Real Band will be treated like it is part of BiaB for me. I will learn both. I am sure I will just fall in love with Real Band and never even think about Cubase. Once you familiarize yourself with this one and it works wonderfully with BiaB why use anything else right? These two programs together will really be interesting to learn. I will take my time with it all. I won't expect any productions from this for a month. I think just enjoy learning about it. Take it slow. It is kind of an adventure I think to learn all of this. It is almost December now. What if on December 1st it is up for sale? WOW!! The day I do see it will be amazing since I have been waiting for maybe 4 months or so for this to come out.

Sly Ruby #223219 11/27/13 07:37 AM
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Well, my advice is to START with RealBand.

*It is already included in the purchase of Band in a Box.

*RealBand will give you a much better idea of perhaps which features and how to implement them are desirable for you and your workflow, etc. which will put you in a much better place to be able to make intelligent decisions regarding the choice of a different DAW software - or not.

*It is entirely possible to publish world class musics using RealBand and the plugins which come with it.

*Having the RealBand DAW along with the Band in a Box program shipping together as they are, gives you the chance to find out more about what it is that you may not know now concerning these issues. And these forums will prove very helpful as well along those lines.


--Mac

Pat Marr #223276 11/27/13 10:11 AM
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i find Cubase to be very complicated, and a big learning curve. I have a version and have never tracked with it.

I usae RB for 95% of DAW work i do It actually does almost everything i need. However it is lacking in a few areas. Most of those you will not need at first. Learn RB and learn it well. Then add a good DAW later for things like Detailed automation, and such. Hopefully over the next years Rb will add those features as well. and there will be no need.

I recently bought Studio one only cause there artist version came with my interface free, and i grabbed the producer version for $49 black friday upgrade. I also own Sonar X-1, and Multitrackstudio, as well as reaper 4.5 truth is i never open Sonar anymore, and i never open Reaper either, really i hardly ever open MTS. I work for the most part in RB. If i want to really polish up a project with fancy automation and a few more plugs, some lane comping, Studio one will do all that.

It is my deep hope that RB adds those feature soon so I can just stay there 100% I love what the guys said about starting a project in BiaB and moving natively to RB and there you can generate tracks and part seemlessly.


Lenovo Win 10 16 gig ram, Mac mini with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2022, Realband, Harrison Mixbus 32c version 9.1324, Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app, Komplete 49 key controller.
JohnJohnJohn #223466 11/28/13 01:43 AM
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Originally Posted By: JohnJohnJohn
one problem with expensive gear is the law of diminishing returns kicks in very quickly. is a $10,000 Neumann mic really 100 times better than a $100 Shure? Nope. Probably not even twice as good. So you can easily end up spending a ton for very minor improvements in your gear.


Actually, Nuemann doesn't make a $10,000 mic. As someone who owns quite a few microphones, going from a Shure to an AKG C414 is a HUGE difference. The sound on a recording opens up. Much richer. Is it twice as good. Absolutely. The signal biggest thing you can invest in is a good microphone. Consider it an instrument, something that will last a lifetime.

Quote:
and anyway, even if you buy the best pair of near-fields out there, you still have to test/listen on a variety of other systems cause people listening to your music almost certainly will not have the monitors you have and every pair sounds a little different.


While this is sort of true, what you do when you mix is to make it sound good on anything, be it iPod headphones or $10,000 Martin Logans. Why people spend thousands of dollars on a good mixing studio is to save time. Sure, you can come up with a good mix with just whatever you have, but it will take a lot of time. Like if you don't have a good subwoofer in your mix studio, then you perhaps won't hear that you have low frequencies that are mudding the mix....



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ericdano #223515 11/28/13 07:45 AM
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Originally Posted By: ericdano
Originally Posted By: JohnJohnJohn
one problem with expensive gear is the law of diminishing returns kicks in very quickly. is a $10,000 Neumann mic really 100 times better than a $100 Shure? Nope. Probably not even twice as good. So you can easily end up spending a ton for very minor improvements in your gear.


Actually, Nuemann doesn't make a $10,000 mic. As someone who owns quite a few microphones, going from a Shure to an AKG C414 is a HUGE difference. The sound on a recording opens up. Much richer. Is it twice as good. Absolutely. The signal biggest thing you can invest in is a good microphone. Consider it an instrument, something that will last a lifetime.



I will respectfully disagree as I think you overlooked your mic preamp. I would invest in a good mic preamp before I bought a good mic. That Shure mic plugged into a good preamp will sound better than the AKG C414 plugged into a cheap consumer soundcard preamp.

Just my thoughts and I’m not trying to start a war.


Me, it's not about how many times you fail, it's about how many times you get back up.
Cop, that's not how field sobriety tests work.

64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
Pat Marr #223545 11/28/13 09:12 AM
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I've not been using BIAB 2013 much this year. started out well, did a few songs but as the weather changed my attention shifted to other things. Now the nights are darker and it's "stay in doors" weather my attention is turning back to BIAB. However, I've noticed there is no 2013.5 and I don't have time to read through 14 pages of posts on this subject. Can anyone tell me what the latest info on this is please? Looks to me that BIAB are doing something big for 2014 because no 2013.5 is released or am I wrong?

Thanks.

Pat Marr #223554 11/28/13 09:22 AM
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Hi Paul. You are correct, there was no 2013.5 release. If past is a guide, the next version could come out in early December but again, the past is no guarantee.


BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
Pat Marr #223558 11/28/13 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted By: Pat Marr
Originally Posted By: CountryTrash
So maybe they are doing the 64 bit which would be MAJOR and maybe need more development and testing than usual...even an interface redevlopment?


64 bit would definitely be worth waiting until December


What would be the benefit of a 64bit BIAB? Faster processing?

Pat Marr #223564 11/28/13 09:48 AM
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In other discussions on this, we've identified the ability to support more RAM as perhaps the major benefit, especially when using VSTs.

Faster processing is also theoretically possible, if the programmers take advantage of it.


BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
ericdano #223674 11/28/13 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted By: ericdano
Actually, Nuemann doesn't make a $10,000 mic.

Oh really? Here is one discounted to $8,000! http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/SolutionDM/

Quote:
Why people spend thousands of dollars on a good mixing studio is to save time.

And also because they buy into the marketing hype that implies a $10,000 Neumann is 100 times better than a Shure!

The law of diminishing returns is a very real concept. Where someone draws their line as to "good enough" will differ greatly from person to person. If you are wealthy then purchasing the very best of the best for only a small improvement may make sense. If you are on a more limited budget (like most of us forum users) there are lots of places where spending the extra cash to buy high-end gear may not make any sense at all!

Of course, each person has to decide for themselves as this is a very subjective process.

Last edited by JohnJohnJohn; 11/28/13 04:53 PM.
JohnJohnJohn #223739 11/29/13 03:37 AM
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Well, it would be great if they have spent the time making the holds, shots and endings sound more natural across all styles and maybe fixing the midi file output.

Already a great product for the most part but I find these 'little' things spoil it sometimes. Very fiddly to get them all right I daresay but essential for the finished article.

I would rather they did that than release more and more Gigabytes of real instruments that only work 90%.

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