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#24559 - 06/07/09 02:09 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Danny C.]
Danny C. Offline
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Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 6464
Loc: South Louisiana
Just a thought but I wonder if the millions of babies we kill every year in the name of "Pro Choice" are factored into our longevity rate?

Just wondering,
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#24560 - 06/07/09 02:12 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Danny C.]
Sandra Sherman Offline
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Registered: 04/15/07
Posts: 770
Loc: Vienna, Austria
Of course there`s no restriction to what restaurants put on their menu. People just don`t like fast food here so much. Austrians (and some other European countries too) are big time bio-food consumers. Austria denied the gen-corn that is imported from the US, but the EU sewed us for that, now we have that damn gen-corn but it has to be declared as such.

Sandra
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#24561 - 06/07/09 02:41 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Sandra Sherman]
Danny C. Offline
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Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 6464
Loc: South Louisiana
Keep in mind a "Real" hamburger cooked properly is not considered fast food in the US either. I'd just love to have you visit my home where you can get a sample of a real tasty 1/2 pounder with that good old Cajun Seasoning, HMMMMMMM!

Take Care,
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#24562 - 06/07/09 02:44 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Sandra Sherman]
Mac Offline
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Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 38502
Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia USA
Quote:

I heard (dunno if it`s true) you can get burgers in almost every restaurant in the states.

just a thought...
Sandra




That one is not true, Sandra.



--Mac
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#24563 - 06/07/09 02:46 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Sandra Sherman]
Glenn Kolot Offline
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Registered: 07/14/03
Posts: 2296
Loc: Victoria BC home of PG Music
There are two charts here for what they are worth; the CIA and the UN charts:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expectancy

But I would caution anyone that it's difficult to relate life expectancy to state run health care because there are cultural factors to consider that affect what people eat, and this in turn affects health and lifespan.

For example, in Canada, our food choices are very close to those of the USA - both countries rely too much on the easy availability of fast food outlets like MacDonalds, Burger King, Wendy's, etc. It really shows up in the girth of our populations - both countries have an obesity problem. I am continually struck by the number of overweight teenage girls when I walk downtown - they're becoming the new "beautiful".

In Africa, starvation is one of the major factors affecting lifespan - in addition to genocide and AIDS.

Glenn

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#24564 - 06/07/09 02:47 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Glenn Kolot]
Mac Offline
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Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 38502
Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia USA
Don't overlook Genetics as yet another contributing factor.


--Mac
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#24565 - 06/07/09 03:04 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Mac]
swanman Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 11/13/07
Posts: 598
Loc: Detroit, MI.
Yes...I firmly aggree that "burgers" must be the culprit. We americans also eat far too much pork too. We're all damned and doomed.
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#24566 - 06/07/09 03:35 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: swanman]
John Conley Offline
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Registered: 09/28/03
Posts: 8333
Loc: London, Ontario, Canada
My uncles a doc. He's 72, still does emerg and surgery assists every couple of days unless he's travelling. Had a country practice, big purebread hereford farm, and a dairy farm. Often saw him come in from the barn in rubber boots and his suit to sew up some other farmer in the office on the side of his house. His daughter (my cousin and her husband wouldn't take his practice, they are both GP's too). They wanted no part of his regular 18 hour days, 7 days a week and 8,000 patients.

He told me no doc he ever knew got sued for malpractice. But my ex wife was a nurse and the gas passing doc got sued, but turned out the thing was bogus. They caught the woman who went to court in a wheelchair walking in the mall during the court case. Dismissed.

Any article I've read states that it's the accounting that's the big problem. Here no one cares if you use a qtip, or swab, or bottle of whatever. You need it you get it.

A local paper reported that some surgeries are being done in border towns in the US on a fixed price basis. A friend down the street went to Henry Ford Hospital for gastric by-pass paid for by the Ontario gov't. Cheaper than sending him to Toronto.

They buy 100 cases or something a year, at a flat rate. Cross border medicine.
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#24567 - 06/07/09 04:31 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: John Conley]
Sandra Sherman Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 04/15/07
Posts: 770
Loc: Vienna, Austria
@Danny,
thanx for the invitation
I don`t like meat very much, though - I only eat chicken. But if you make a chicken burger for me ... that cajun thing sounds great.

@Mac
thanks for clarifying.

@Swanman
Nobody damns you. But don`t you agree that nutrition might be at least one of more factors for a longer or shorter life?

Sandra
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#24568 - 06/07/09 05:31 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Sandra Sherman]
Mac Offline
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Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 38502
Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia USA
The assumption that the United States general population contains a majority of people who eat "wrong" is just that, an assumption.

I have read some studies that put the blame of shortened lifespan on stress...

There are very likely to be *many* factors involved.

Those who have an agenda will, of course, use whatever they can find to push the agenda forward.

Someone once said, "You are what you eat."

Someone else, perhaps much wiser, said, "All things in moderation."

--Mac
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#24569 - 06/07/09 05:58 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Mac]
Curmudgeon Offline
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Registered: 01/06/06
Posts: 2689
Loc: Henderson, NV
A friend was telling us about his grandfather who came from Russia. He said that he lived to be 113 and smoked everything he could get his hands on.

I wisecracked, "Just think how how he would have lived if he hadn't smoked."

Don S.


Edited by Curmudgeon (06/07/09 05:59 PM)

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#24570 - 06/07/09 06:40 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Curmudgeon]
Mac Offline
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Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 38502
Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia USA
He couldn't have lived for 113 years in Russia without a lotta WODKA to go along with them cigarettes...
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#24571 - 06/07/09 07:28 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Mac]
John Conley Offline
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Registered: 09/28/03
Posts: 8333
Loc: London, Ontario, Canada
Actually I never thought that cigs caused all the problems, the filters did. I smoked for 26 years, because I started work early in logging camps you had to roll your own. Tailor mades caused fires.

But, I quit due to economics. We pay huge taxes on cigs, and I was spending the same amount of cash as a new van cost me every month, so I got a van for the 5 kids.

And I don't think booze in even minor excess is a problem. But again that's my take on it. As I have a rye and water.

I do think all you can eat $10 buffets that you see in the US are a bad idea.

So far today I had an omega 3 egg on rye with caraway, 1 cup of coffee and 3 glasses of tap water for breakfast.

Then a piece of bacon, 2 slices of tomatoe and lettuce with a small dollop of mayo and a piece of black rye for lunch.

Then a beer.

Then skinless boneless chcken thighs in a curry sauce with peas for supper.

And a rye and water.

And a rye and water.

It's whiskey on a Sunday.

Monday it's Italian red wine!

Fergetaboutit. Go to the matresses.

Mac is right, there are restaurants that don't serve burgers in the US. But the BBQ is mean in most of those places.

Or the seafood if you are in the south or south east.

Can't talk about California, or Oregon. 2 states I've missed.
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#24572 - 06/08/09 07:22 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: John Conley]
Keith from Oz Offline
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Registered: 12/05/07
Posts: 2185
Loc: NSW Australia
There was a lady who was celebrating her 100th birthday, and the local television station came round to interview her.
They rolled the camera and asked "To what do you owe your longevity?"
She replied "I have never drunk alcohol, I have never smoked, and I have never been with a man, and today I am celebrating my 100th birthday.
The TV reporter replied "How?......."
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#24573 - 06/08/09 07:39 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Mac]
Ryszard Offline
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Registered: 09/28/07
Posts: 3899
Loc: Kennesaw (Atlanta) GA
Quote:

Someone else, perhaps much wiser, said, "All things in moderation."

--Mac




INCLUDING MODERATION!!!

lol,
R.
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#24574 - 06/08/09 08:56 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Glenn Kolot]
Shackman Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 09/01/05
Posts: 199
Actually re the comment above about socialised medicine, and yes, I'm going right off topic here. But please bear with me. I've just made 100 posts and am celebrating becoming an Enthusiast!

While travelling in the States in '97 I remember chatting with a taxi driver in Indianapolis. His mood was good until we happened to talk around the subject of medical care and its cost in your country. Seems his nephew had leukaemia and needed a bone marrow transplant. I was shocked to hear that it was going to cost
$100,000 US and one of his immediate family would have to sell their house to fund this (I presume because the family had no medical insurance). No guarantee that it alone would do the trick, mind you. I'm sure there was a heap more expensive treatment besides.

Although here in Australia we don't have socialism as such, a federal government of a mildly leftish persuasion (think Democrats or European labour parties) had actually instituted universal health insurance back in the mid 1970's and it persists in a largely unchanged form, despite many changes of government since. You can still buy additional health coverage if you wish which entitles you to choice of doc and maybe choice of hospital. But if you go public, as I do, (and I might add I've worked in public hospitals for 28 years), you will almost certainly get world standard health care for no more than your regular income taxes. If you make the average full time adult income of about $50-60,000 dollars a year, those taxes will be about 15-17% of that gross. Not a huge impost, I would have thought.

Now, Australia is a prosperous and well off country by most economic indicies. But the U.S.A. is more prosperous. Last I saw the stats it remained the richest country in the world most any way you analyse it.
I'm not a red ragger, that is, a leftist sympathiser or activist. Not at all. In fact I detest the Godless humanism
I see sweeping into Western societies all over the world. But I sincerely reccommend to you that if universal health coverage is achievable and affordable in my country it surely is in yours.

The above has been brought home to me all the more, with thanks to God that I live here, by the illness of my cousin's son this last 12 months- an acute myeloid leukaemia of a particularly nasty type (Philadelphia chromosomes). This in a strapping 22 year old extremely athletic basketballer. He has needed every far out and funky medical treatment and procedure I know of in Oncology and then some. BMT's, spinal taps aplenty, stem cell transplant(s), induced graft versus host disease, chemo after chemo after etc etc.

So- socialism- no. But Medicare (as UHC is known here)- absoloutely. And thank God for it. Try it. I guarantee that after you adjust to the idea you'll like it.

In any case, stay well.

John

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#24575 - 06/08/09 10:25 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Shackman]
Danny C. Offline
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Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 6464
Loc: South Louisiana
Said to say but many people in making choices choose the likes of the latest cell phones (some even for their grade school children) autos/trucks with the latest wheels and sound systems (of which many are financed not only the vehicles but the wheels and sound systems) and trips to casinos that they also cannot afford instead of spending that money health insurance. Just watch a judge show or Maury Povich on American TV every now and then and it will hit you square in the face. With this said the cell phone companies, auto accessory and casinos are doing very well and I’d never fault them for their success.

Back when I worked for Jack Daniel's there was a saying the tour guides at the distillery would use when asked by a tourist, "how many people work here"? Their answer was always, "oh, about half of them". It was funny then but not anymore as that is just about the number of citizens currently working and paying taxes in the US. My point is that many more people could indeed afford healthcare, especially if they got on a plan in their younger years, but they choose to spend their and the tax payer's money elsewhere. Or God forbid even “worked” for a company who offered healthcare.

Keep in mind the US government does not produce, manufacture or sell anything; they get their money for these programs from the 50% of people still working and paying taxes. So as much as I'd like to give additional help to fund Government Healthcare I simply can't afford to do so.

Remember some of the scariest words ever heard in America, “we are with the government and we are here to help you”.

PS: John, it is not only universal healthcare in the US, it is the ever growing "cradle to grave" taxpayer funded programs that keep generations owing their loyalties to certain politicians that worry me, and socialized medicine is just another one of those programs.

God Bless America!
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#24576 - 06/08/09 01:35 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Danny C.]
Notes Norton Offline
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Registered: 07/06/00
Posts: 4349
Loc: Fort Pierce, Florida, U.S.A.
Quote:

Just a thought but I wonder if the millions of babies we kill every year in the name of "Pro Choice" are factored into our longevity rate?

Just wondering,



Of course not. If they don't have a birth certificate, they aren't in the statistics.

And millions of babies and pro choice are religious labels. I was brought up not to impose my religious beliefs on other people.

My religion says abortion is wrong, so I don't do it (of course, I can't, I'm male) but if somebody else's belief says it's OK, they should have the right. I am in charge of my moral obligations, NOT big brother.

Notes
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#24577 - 06/08/09 01:38 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Danny C.]
Glenn Kolot Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/14/03
Posts: 2296
Loc: Victoria BC home of PG Music
Quote:

Keep in mind the US government does not produce, manufacture or sell anything; they get their money for these programs from the 50% of people still working and paying taxes. So as much as I'd like to give additional help to fund Government Healthcare I simply can't afford to do so.

Remember some of the scariest words ever heard in America, “we are with the government and we are here to help you”.




Here's something else for the 50% to pay for:

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/U...EMPLATE=DEFAULT


And I can hardly wait to be a part owner of some vehicle companies.

Glenn


Edited by Glenn Kolot (06/08/09 01:40 PM)

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#24578 - 06/08/09 01:59 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Patriotic retirement bail-out plan [Re: Danny C.]
Curmudgeon Offline
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Registered: 01/06/06
Posts: 2689
Loc: Henderson, NV
Quote:

Keep in mind the US government does not produce, manufacture or sell anything; they get their money for these programs from the 50% of people still working and paying taxes. So as much as I'd like to give additional help to fund Government Healthcare I simply can't afford to do so.




Printing presses really come in handy in a money crunch, eh?

Don S.
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