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Having decided to let the uprade offer pass me by, I changed my mind and decided that, although I could see problems with the 64 bit plugin, the standalone should work.
IMK procedures are certainly better than I remember and the program download was accomplished speedily. I haven't yet started to download the sounds.
Users of SampleTank 2.5, who have ruined their eyesight squinting at minuscule text, will be delighted with the new main window in which you can read the names of instruments/multi easily in white on a black background. Many improvements have been made which I have yet to savour.
The actual setup for the standalone version is similar to all such programs excpt the options are reduced. ASIO drivers are recommended but you are offered one only, and in my case, the one was a corrupted driver left over from a previously uninstalled soundcard. Usually, a dropdown menu of ASIO options has been offered so that the above problem could be ignored. The DirectSound audio drivers were offered instead.
Next, the Midi Drivers were offered as "ANY" or selected from a dropdown list. I was suprised to see that the old faithful MIDIYOKE drivers were not listed. My Oxygen 49 Midi Controller and the Ketron SD2 were.
I found that, with minimal experimentation, that the Ketron did work passing the Midi data through to the ST3 and just required the Volumn slider to be set to Zero. No changes to settings in RealBand were required.
Instruments from previous SampleTank, Sonik Synth and Miroslav Philharmonik programs can be imported into SampleTank 3 being resampled by the engine. A "Lucky Dip" selection of imported instruments does seem to suggest that the new sampling engine has improved the existing sounds.
I was fortunate to be able to use the Ketron SB2 as the Midi Driver and I expect that any external synth should be able to achieve similar results. There is a need to locate a bridge like MIDIYOKE which will work. Again, some resolution to the 64 bit plugin in a 32bit program needs to be found.
Lyn
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RealBand
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I used to use MIDIYoke for many years, but MIDIYoke only works with 32-bit applications. I switched to LoopBE30 instead (I went ahead and purchased the LoopBE 30, since the free version only gives you one port). It works with XP, Vista, Windows 7, and Windows 8. LoopBE works as a virtual MIDI cable for both 32-bit and 64-bit applications, so it replaced old-faithful MIDIYoke on my system.
John Laptop-HP Omen I7 Win11Pro 32GB 2x2TB, 1x4TB SSD Desktop-ASUS-I7 Win10Pro 32GB 2x1.5TB, 2x2TB, 1x4TB SATA BB2024/UMC404HD/Casios/Cakewalk/Reaper/Studio One/MixBus/Notion/Finale/Dorico/Noteworthy/NI/Halion/IK http://www.sus4chord.com
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RealBand
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Thanks jford for the information. I will purchase item as soon as possible.
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RealBand
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RealBand
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"Using inter-process communication mechanisms, it aims to make it possible to run 32bit plugins in 64bit hosts, 64bit plugins in 32bit hosts, or even bridging 32bit plugins to 32bit hosts, allowing to overcome the memory limitations of a single 32bit process, in this last case." Has anyone tested this? If it adapts 64 bit plugins to 32 bit hosts, maybe something like this is the answer for many. http://jstuff.wordpress.com/jbridge/
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
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RealBand
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I downloaded Jbridge earlier but have yet to experiment with it.
Currently, my concern is with downloaded the sounds. IKM gave me 180 days to complete the downloading process - I wondered why. After 5 days I have failed to download one of the eight groups. The question is - do I need more time???
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RealBand
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1. + 1 on the LoopBE30 (been using it a lot lately)
2. I got all 8 to download at 7mbps took a few hours. If only one part is giving you trouble then a) keep trying AND b) contact IK Multimedia. I'm pretty sure the time limits on ALL IK sound add-on libs, not just Sampletank 3, are because IK doesn't want to commit that much server space indefinitely for ever customer for ever app (Plus, they can then later charge you to make it re-available for another period of time)
3. I SWORE I wasn't going to to this, but I just run jBridge with PT, RB, BIAB and ST3 (after creating a bridging file for the Sampletank3 DLL) - it works as expected. Don't forget you must make BIAB, PT or RB point to the new location of "jBridge'ed" version of the dll.
I WILL reiterate what jBridge instructions state or imply: DO NOT MIX locations where your 32 bit, 64 bit and "bridged" VST/VSTi .dlls are!)
Larry
Last edited by Larry Kehl; 07/29/14 03:46 PM.
Win10Pro,i9,64GB,2TBSSD+20TBHDDs,1080TI,BIAB'24,Scarlett18i8,Montage7,Fusion 8HD,QS8,Integra7,XV5080,QSR,SC-8850,SPLAT,FL21&others,Komp.14,IK suite&others, just a guitar player-AXE FX III &FM9T, FishmanTP, MIDIGuitar2, GK2/3'sw/GI20
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RealBand
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Thanks Larry,
I have contacted IMK and the reply is of some help but I already use one of their recommended browers. My son recommended GETRIGHT to control fractured downloads - yet to try.
Thanks for the information on LOOPB30 and JBRIDGE which I have downloaded.
I now have all the previous sounds from Sonic Synth, Miroslav and SampleTank2.5 all organised and in the SampleTank 3 data base. This needed a lot cleaning up to remove duplicates and none responding Multies. For example, while playing about with the BIAB introduction of ST a couple of years ago during Beta Testing I managed to get three versions of the sounds loaded in various locations and the Legacy Import function found them all.
Lyn
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RealBand
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Lyn
You may know this but others may not. ST3 has and installs the entirety of ST2 XL - so "re-importing" as legacy within ST3 could waste ~6.5 GB of space.
I've moved and renamed all my IK "stuff" to another drive and did some renaming, I no longer use original default directories or parent directory names so can't swear the parent directory would be C:\...\IK Multimedia Instruments\...
However, having said that, when importing legacy sounds into ST3 there is no need to import the "..\Sampletank XL sounds" subdirectory of wherever/whatever you call(ed) the IK Multimedia instrument libs.
The "...\Sampletank" "..\Sample Tank L sounds," or "...\Sampletank XL sounds" subdirectory contains the ST2 free, L, or XL sounds which are now 100% included in the downloaded and installed ST3 parts under the various ST 3 Instrument groups called "ST2 XL."
So within ST3, under "Brass" in the ST3 interface list there is:
"Classical Brass,"
" Jazz-Pop Brass," and
"ST2 XL."
And under Drums there are:
"Alt Rock Kit,"
"Brush Kit,"
…
"ST2 XL"
I would suggest if you plan to use ONLY the ST3 app that you should import all the OTHER ST2 instrument subdirectories like
"…\ Miroslav Philharmonik Sounds," or
" …\Sampletron,"
…
"…\Vintage Keys,"
or any other add-ons like OmniSynth 2 that you may own. Since I will still be using ST2 for sometime to come I see no need, yet, to import and duplicate all those .sti's and samples in ST3.
Win10Pro,i9,64GB,2TBSSD+20TBHDDs,1080TI,BIAB'24,Scarlett18i8,Montage7,Fusion 8HD,QS8,Integra7,XV5080,QSR,SC-8850,SPLAT,FL21&others,Komp.14,IK suite&others, just a guitar player-AXE FX III &FM9T, FishmanTP, MIDIGuitar2, GK2/3'sw/GI20
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RealBand
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I just run jBridge with PT, RB, BIAB and ST3 (after creating a bridging file for the Sampletank3 DLL) - it works as expected This is good news!
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
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RealBand
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Great Information - thanks to you all.
I have spent some time rationalising the folder structure and various duplications have been removed. The GETRIGHT download program worked perfectly, although I used the basic mode only and ignored, for now, the more complex features which I have left for another time.
I am still using the standalone version and find that the volumn control in RB does not vary the track sounds which are taken over by the ST3 Mixer. I find that the Midi Learn feature has been altered from a fairly simple system to now where you need a Midi Controller to make it work. Essentially, you need to use the Midi Learn feature to select a parameter in ST3 say Volumn and then move the slider in your Midi Controller to pass control for the Midi Code CC7 events to it. I have yet to find a way of getting this to work in RB.
Interestingly, when control of the Volume function is passed to ST3 no CC7 or cc85(Nodes) events work. Probably, this will apply to CC" Breath, CC11 Expression and maybe CC10 Pan but this is yet to be checked.
I eventually found that I could use my Midi Keyboard to enter a Modulation CC1 code using the Mod Wheel and then Edit the Control Setup in ST3 to change CC1 to CC7. This works and with RB taking back control of the volumn sliders Node, entries can be made. This performance is required for each track.
I hope that I find a better method than the above.
Lyn
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At last I am back from the brink of dispair. I have suffered two viruses in the last ten days, one laid me on my back for four days and the other rendered my computer unusable on the Net. Both are now recovered.
To continue with the SampleTank review:
I find that the rebuilt GUI and functions much improved at the expense of using up more screen space. The MIDI LEARN function is easy to use and does work, contrary to my previous experience, provided you are more robust in moving sliders in the RB Windows to assign the parameters.
For new and proposed users remember that at the start up, the ST3 recognises only velocity data from RealBand. It is necessary to use Midi Learn to assign, at least, CC7 Volume and CC10 Pan in ST3 to similar parameters in RB on a channel by channel basis. It is useful to set up the Midi file with Track and Channel numbers to agree. Position Channel 10 Drums on track 10 and use the Edit > Rechannel command.
Other CC parameters which are useful are:
CC1............... ST3 parameter "LFO1Depth" to control Modulation
CC64.............. ST3 parameter "LFO1 Rate" to control Sustain.
If you look in the Control Panel then all the Midi Learn assignments will be listed as well as the permanently assignments to CC12 to CC19, which are used to add continuous midi data to control the eight parameters in the MACRO display working from left to right. These are intended to be the most frequently used paramters for a specific instrument.
One is "Swell" which acts to change the Velocity of the last note varying the level of sound much like CC2 Breath or CC11 Expression, does in a Standard MIdi Synth, without affecting the CC7 Volume overall level.
You need to set up the appropriate data using the Piano Roll Window, unless you have software to emulate the instruments' playing styles. If you have this data already in a track, then go into the Control Panel and change the CC number from 12 to either 2 or 11 as appropriate.
Experienced users must have used favorite assignments in previous SampleTank versions and it would be useful to list their experiences. Please advise.
It is worth your while to create a Proforma Multi which you can load each time you have a new setup to do. Use an existing Multi which you have created fill any blank channels with instruments and set up each channel with the Midi Learn entries you want regularly.
Save As a Multi with a name such as Proforma Base File then delete all the instruments from the loaded Multi and Save As Proforma. This latter file will load very quickly and contain all the Midi Learn assigments ready for instruments to be loaded.
I uaed the Standalone version to do much of my testing but did try out the jBridge program to create a 32 bit VSTi from the original 64 bit SampTank3.dll. This has worked without a problem so far although I am still using the Test Version. The main differences are the GUI, in the pluging mode, takes up even more real estate occupying 50% of the screen.
There is a plugin problem, in my system, whereby the scroll wheel works differently to the way in the standalone mode in which the scroll wheel moves the pointer up and down in a window. In the plugin mode using the scroll wheel removes the ST3 display and you need to use the DXi/VSTi icon to restore it. A couple of times the ST3 had to be reloaded. If you look to the right of the panels in PLAY showing the lists of instruments etc, there is a light coloured column - place your pointer in the slot and this will work properly. Could be my local problem.
I think that I will use the Standalone model as lockups are less frequent and easier to clear. The screen behaviour can be improved by using a DeskPins type program to keep ST3 on top all the time. The display is smaller than the plugin model because there is no RB panel on top.
I had an impression that the sounds were better via the Standalone version, but this needs to be checked with Audio recordings.
Lyn
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A few last comments from my testing of SampleTank 3 on a live project.
LoopB30 was installed to allow the ST3 to operate in a Standalone mode. Initially I was confused by the way in which operational and muted drivers were displayed - see other post.
Jbridge was installed to provide the 32 bit version of the ST3 64bit plugin. This works OK but takes up even more real estate in display. However, I played around with the JBridge Settings and found that you can get the plugin to open in two parts. One part contains the PGMusic headings for adding effects plus the Jbridge Settings. When this part is minimised, the ST3 GUI is displayed on it's own thereby reducing the overall display area required by one third.
I have found that the ST3 Midi Learn function works in the Standalone version only. If you use the Proforma idea with the frequently used Midi Learn entries incorporated then this should not cause a large problem. All other editing parameters can be reset in the Plugin verson. Of course this could be a local problem for me only.
I see that there are a number of training videos available from IMK
Have fun,
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LynB,
Thank you for sharing your findings, insights and observations. There is a lot of interest in Sampletank 3 since there was a long delay between it's introduction and release. It's really nice to know it can be adapted for use with Biab and RealBand.
Jim Fogle - 2024 BiaB (1111) RB (5) Ultra+ PAK DAWs: Cakewalk by BandLab (CbB) - Standalone: Zoom MRS-8 Laptop: i3 Win 10, 8GB ram 500GB HDD Desktop: i7 Win 11, 12GB ram 256GB SSD, 4 TB HDD Music at: https://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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