Log in to post
|
Print Thread |
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,245
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,245 |
90db, In the near future, all music will be written, performed and recorded by machines. I beg to differ. Bluegrass and most other types of acoustic music WON’T be written, performed and recorded by machines in the foreseeable future because what matters most in this style of music is the performance by each individual in the band. If a bluegrass performer released a CD and it was later discovered they used backing tracks, AT or Melodyne on that CD, it would be shunned by the bluegrass community. Acoustic music as a whole is based on artistic integrity. Every note you hear on a CD is played by an actual human being. The vocal performance isn’t altered by AT or Melodyne. It’s real music played by real people. I do agree that most Pop or pseudo rock has already been or soon will be “written, performed and recorded by machines”.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,245
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,245 |
I am anti-auto tune for a few reasons, most importantly: - It sounds bad to my ears
- There are thousands of singers out there who have practiced, worked, and honed the ability to sing in tune - auto tune allows people who cannot sing to take their jobs away - I know there isn't any fairness in the world, but it's like letting only a few athletes use steroids to beat the ones that don't
- Music is expressive because of the nuances - the god is in the details so to speak. Many of those nuances involve toying with pitch - hitting a note a little flat to express angst, or a little sharp to be bright - slowly or rapidly sliding to pitch, falling off or rising the pitch up at the end of a note, varying both the intesity and speed of vibrato - and so forth - Auto Tune takes that expression out of the music - For a great example, listen to Otis Redding sing the line "You are tired, and you want to be free" on the song I've been loving you too long. He hits "Tired" flat, gradually pulls it up almost to pitch and it expresses his pain. If he hit it perfectly it wouldn't sound like pain. I manipulate pitch on my voice, sax, guitar, synths, and even my backing tracks.
Well said Notes.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139 |
90db, In the near future, all music will be written, performed and recorded by machines. I beg to differ. Bluegrass and most other types of acoustic music WON’T be written, performed and recorded by machines in the foreseeable future because what matters most in this style of music is the performance by each individual in the band. If a bluegrass performer released a CD and it was later discovered they used backing tracks, AT or Melodyne on that CD, it would be shunned by the bluegrass community. Acoustic music as a whole is based on artistic integrity. Every note you hear on a CD is played by an actual human being. The vocal performance isn’t altered by AT or Melodyne. It’s real music played by real people. I do agree that most Pop or pseudo rock has already been or soon will be “written, performed and recorded by machines”. Dear Bob, Please get a clue. It was a joke! I would have thought that was obvious, when I said this: "It will be technically perfect music, and with it, you will be absorbed into The Collective." Notice the Grin? Sheesh!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 6,080
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 6,080 |
My question is: If you can't sing, why should you become famous as a singer when there are others out there who can sing?
Insights and incites by Notes
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove & Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139 |
My question is: If you can't sing, why should you become famous as a singer when there are others out there who can sing?
Insights and incites by Notes Because the world isn't fair?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,638
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,638 |
My question is: If you can't sing, why should you become famous as a singer when there are others out there who can sing?
Insights and incites by Notes It does not take talent to become a famous pop/rock/today's country singer or musician these days. All it takes is showmanship and promotion. There are exceptions of course but I think that showmanship and promotion will top talent, at least to many people. Remember pro and semi-pro musicians, that does include many singers, listen with a critical ear. John Q. Public listens to the beat!
Me, it's not about how many times you fail, it's about how many times you get back up. Cop, that's not how field sobriety tests work.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,439
Expert
|
Expert
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,439 |
<snip> John Q. Public listens to the beat!
In the case of many female artists, John Q. Public listens with their EYES... Just sayin'...
--=-- My credo: If it's worth doing, it's worth overdoing - just ask my missus, she'll tell ya --=--You're only paranoid if you're wrong!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,558
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,558 |
My question is: If you can't sing, why should you become famous as a singer when there are others out there who can sing?
Insights and incites by Notes It does not take talent to become a famous pop/rock/today's country singer or musician these days. All it takes is showmanship and promotion. There are exceptions of course but I think that showmanship and promotion will top talent, at least to many people. Remember pro and semi-pro musicians, that does include many singers, listen with a critical ear. John Q. Public listens to the beat! "showmanship and promotion" are just another form of talent!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,558
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,558 |
Folks who think quality entertainment requires formal training or technical ability or some other magical ingredient are just missing the whole point of entertainment!
It is entertaining...because it is entertaining! Not because the singer sang perfectly or the band was real instead of BIAB backing tracks!
If it was not entertaining for you then...it was not entertaining for you. Plain and simple. No other reason required!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,638
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,638 |
"showmanship and promotion" are just another form of talent!
Yes but NOT musical talent!
Me, it's not about how many times you fail, it's about how many times you get back up. Cop, that's not how field sobriety tests work.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 6,576
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 6,576 |
I can play a number of instruments competently, but I'll create my tracks using BiaB instead because I can get to where I need a lot faster, and get better results.
Given the option to re-tune a vocal that's flat or re-take the vocal, I'll tune the vocal.
Heck, I'll even use Vocaloids, if I think it's "good enough".
That won't stop me from practicing and performing - both my instruments and vocals.
If a non-singer can become more famous than an excellent singer, then singing clearly isn't the key to being a famous singer.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074 |
"showmanship and promotion" are just another form of talent!
Yes but NOT musical talent! I've noticed that most successful people have multiple talents. On the other hand, the highly talented yet unsuccessful person is practically a cultural cliché.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139 |
"showmanship and promotion" are just another form of talent!
Yes but NOT musical talent! I've noticed that most successful people have multiple talents. On the other hand, the highly talented yet unsuccessful person is practically a cultural cliché. Everybody is talented these days. Just ask them.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 8,074 |
Everybody is talented these days. Just ask them. LOL! I'd have to agree! But in the context of the discussion, all the evidence suggests that talent alone isn't enough to guarantee success. And by success, I mean earning reasonable amounts of money from performing or marketing one's music. There are millions of people chasing the same dollar, and competition is high... very little room for accidental success. Those who beat the odds and make money do so because they have something on the ball that the rest do not have. Sometimes it's a sponsor, influential connections, a rich daddy, overwhelming undeniable talent or multiple talents, better than average song writing ability, a face or body that demands attention, a savvy marketing plan, access to some new technology ... or all of the above. And these days, my guess is that it's usually "all of the above" Case in point: the people in this forum are all pretty talented, but we're short on rich daddies.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139 |
"...sponsor, influential connections, a rich daddy, overwhelming undeniable talent or multiple talents, better than average song writing ability, a face or body that demands attention, a savvy marketing plan, access to some new technology..." Now that explains why I'm still flogging covers in dive bars! Thanks Pat!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 6,080
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 6,080 |
<...> Those who beat the odds and make money do so because they have something on the ball that the rest do not have. Sometimes it's a sponsor, influential connections, a rich daddy, overwhelming undeniable talent or multiple talents, better than average song writing ability, a face or body that demands attention, a savvy marketing plan, access to some new technology ... or all of the above. And these days, my guess is that it's usually "all of the above"<...> True, especially about influential connections. But I still maintain that using auto-tune is equivalent to an Olympic or Pro Athlete using steroids. And I know that throughout history we had had bad singers become stars, Fred Astaire, Bob Dylan, and so many more, but at least they were honest about their singing ability. They became famous being a performer or songwriter or whatever. But to become a famous singer with the help of auto-tune just seems wrong to me. But it seems that I am in the minority. Insights and incites by Notes
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove & Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 8,056
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 8,056 |
I agree with Mr. Norton regarding auto tune with the exception of slight use in a place or two to fix a vocal track I'm trying to sing when another vocalist is the better choice but none is available. Being flat or sharp sometimes helps show the emotion of lyrics but there are times when it doesn't fit and the 'right' note may be just beyond my range. Tuning helps in those situations for me.
I have pondered in the past where folks who think an athlete who excels with the assistance of steroids or other drug compares with a musician who writes a hit song while under the influence of alcohol or drugs?
BIAB Ultra Pak+ 2024:RB 2024, Latest builds: Dell Optiplex 7040 Desktop; Windows-10-64 bit, Intel Core i7-6700 3.4GHz CPU and 16 GB Ram Memory.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,638
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,638 |
But to become a famous singer with the help of auto-tune just seems wrong to me.
But it seems that I am in the minority.
Insights and incites by Notes
As am I my friend!
Me, it's not about how many times you fail, it's about how many times you get back up. Cop, that's not how field sobriety tests work.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,815
Expert
|
Expert
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,815 |
...But to become a famous singer with the help of auto-tune just seems wrong to me.... I can't think of anyone who has become a famous singer using autotune. Maybe T-Pain, but the auto-tune is the gimmick. All major label studio albums use auto-tune nowadays (from what I have heard). Most studio singers (including the one everyone wants to bash, Taylor Swift) sing close enough to pitch to begin with -- and most are probably pretty good. So I think you are extrapolating the fact that a) everyone uses autotune to the erroneous conclusion that b) they are "making it" or only sound good because of autotune.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Off-Topic
|
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139
Veteran
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 5,139 |
"I have pondered in the past where folks who think an athlete who excels with the assistance of steroids or other drug compares with a musician who writes a hit song while under the influence of alcohol or drugs?" You think they are comparable? Curious.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Convenient Ways to Listen to Band-in-a-Box® Songs Created by Program Users!
The User Showcase Forum is an excellent place to share your Band-in-a-Box® songs and listen to songs other program users are creating!
There are other places you can listen to these songs too! Visit our User Showcase page to sort by genre, artist (forum name), song title, and date - each listing will direct you to the forum post for that song.
If you'd rather listen to these songs in one place, head to our Band-in-a-Box® Radio, where you'll have the option to select the genre playlist for your listening pleasure. This page has SoundCloud built in, so it won't redirect you. We've also added the link to the Artists SoundCloud page here, and a link to their forum post.
We hope you find some inspiration from this amazing collection of User Showcase Songs!
Congratulations to the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!
We've just announced the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!
There are 45 winners, each receiving a Band-in-a-Box 2024 UltraPAK! Read the official announcement to see if you've won.
Our User Showcase Forum receives more than 50 posts per day, with people sharing their Band-in-a-Box songs and providing feedback for other songs posted.
Thank you to everyone who has contributed!
Video: Volume Automation in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®
Video: Audio Input Monitoring with Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®
Video: Enhanced Melodists in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®!
We've enhanced the Melodists feature included in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows!
Access the Melodist feature by pressing F7 in the program to open the new MultiPicker Library and locate the [Melodist] tab.
You can now generate a melody on any track in the program - very handy! Plus, you select how much of the melody you want generated - specify a range, or apply it to the whole track.
See the Melodist in action with our video, Band-in-a-Box® 2024: The Melodist Window.
Learn even more about the enhancements to the Melodist feature in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows at www.pgmusic.com/manuals/bbw2024upgrade/chapter3.htm#enhanced-melodist
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 DAW Plugin Version 6: New Features Specifically for Reaper®
New with the DAW Plugin Version 6.0, released with Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows: the Reaper® Panel!
This new panel offers built-in specific support for the Reaper® DAW API allowing direct transfer of Band-in-a-Box® files to/from Reaper® tracks!
When you run the Plugin from Reaper®, there is a panel to set the following options:
-BB Track(s) to send: This allows you to select the Plugin tracks that will be sent Reaper.
-Destination Reaper Track: This lets you select the destination Reaper track to receive media content from the Plugin.
-At Bar: You can select a bar in Reaper where the Plugin tracks should be placed.
-Start Below Selected Track: This allows you to place the Plugin tracks below the destination Reaper track.
-Overwrite Reaper Track: You can overwrite previous content on the destination Reaper track.
-Move to Project Folder: With this option, you can move the Plugin tracks to the Reaper project folder.
-Send Reaper Instructions Enable this option to send the Reaper Instructions instead of rendering audio tracks, which is faster.
-Render Audio & Instructions: Enable this option to generate audio files and the Reaper instructions.
-Send Tracks After Generating: This allows the Plugin to automatically send tracks to Reaper after generating.
-Send Audio for MIDI Track: Enable this option to send rendered audio for MIDI tracks.
-Send RealCharts with Audio: If this option is enabled, Enable this option to send RealCharts with audio.
Check out this video highlighting the new Reaper®-specific features: Band-in-a-Box® DAW Plugin Version 6: New Features Specifically for Reaper®
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 DAW Plugin Version 6: New Features Video
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Forums66
Topics81,390
Posts732,461
Members38,441
|
Most Online2,537 Jan 19th, 2020
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|