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#278852 - 01/08/15 01:55 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: Joe V]
Pat Marr Offline
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I actually like that music and have a lot of respect for the really talented DJs who can work the crowd into a frenzy.

Different genre, different audience, different world (and it isn't mine)

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#278854 - 01/08/15 01:59 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: Joe V]
Robh Offline
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From here out all things that go wrong are Pat Marr's fault! Life abhors a vacuum.
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#278876 - 01/08/15 04:07 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: jazzmammal]
eddie1261 Online   content
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Registered: 04/08/11
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Originally Posted By: jazzmammal
Nope, strongly disagree. Did you read the bio and look at the course of the guy at Berklee? The name of the course is Using A Turntable As A Musical Instrument". Now I know just because a college professor says so doesn't make it so but still, this isn't the first time I've seen courses like this being offered. And this isn't something new, these courses have been around for years.


What do you think about the Blue Man Group? They play pieces of PVC tubing and other such things. If a musician is one who plays an instrument, by that definition they are not musicians. Again, goes to my point, they are entertainers rather than musicians.
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#278902 - 01/08/15 05:56 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: Robh]
Danny C. Offline
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Loc: South Louisiana
Robh,

This one has been on my playlist for a while, I love it.

Later,
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#278903 - 01/08/15 05:59 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: eddie1261]
bobcflatpicker Offline
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Registered: 10/27/07
Posts: 3350
Loc: WV, USA
Quote:
they are entertainers rather than musicians.


I agree with Eddie.

A turntable isn't a musical instrument. There's no shame in being an entertainer, so its not a put down to call them that. As far as the Dj's who do play musical instruments, when they're playing actual musical instruments, they're being musicians. When they're messing with their turntables, they're being entertainers.

Based on today's appetite, they'll probably get more bookings as DJ's.
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#278918 - 01/08/15 08:32 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: Joe V]
Pat Marr Offline
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Registered: 10/25/08
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I have no problem whatsoever thinking of myself as an entertainer...

until people start pointing out that clowns are entertainers wink

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#278975 - 01/09/15 06:43 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: Notes Norton]
chulaivet1966 Offline
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Registered: 01/10/13
Posts: 554
Loc: West coast
Originally Posted By: Notes Norton
DJs are not musicians, A musician is a person who plays a musical instrument. There are bad musicians and good musicians. You don't have to play first violin in the Cleveland Orchestra to be a musician.


That's how I see it....pretty simple to me.
DJ's are entertainers mixing up what others have written for a specific venue/crowd.
A turntable does not qualify as a musical instrument from my perspective.
I see it as a music medium....a method to convey what musicians have actually recorded.

EDIT: Based on some opinions that means radio DJ's are musicians too?....I don't think so.

Could it be said they're in a sort of derivative genre?
I don't know....it's early and I need more coffee.

Lots of various opinions without a doubt.

Feliz Viernes to all....


Edited by chulaivet1966 (01/09/15 07:45 AM)
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#278988 - 01/09/15 07:35 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: Joe V]
Notes Norton Offline
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Loc: Fort Pierce, Florida, U.S.A.
OK, I've taken your advice and watched some very creative DJs, but IMO the turntable is not a musical instrument and they are not musicians. They are entertainers though.

Rappers who don't sing are not singers either.

We have to be careful with our language. New things need new terms, or the language loses it's meaning.

Example: Awesome used to be reserved for things that were truly awe inspiring. Now I hear people saying, "Your new shoelaces are awesome."

Insights and incites by Notes
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#279049 - 01/09/15 11:26 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: Notes Norton]
eddie1261 Online   content
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Registered: 04/08/11
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Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
Originally Posted By: Notes Norton
"Your new shoelaces are awesome."


Not to mention cra-cra adorbs.....
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#279061 - 01/09/15 01:07 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: Notes Norton]
VideoTrack Offline
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Registered: 06/05/12
Posts: 7570
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Originally Posted By: Notes Norton
OK, I've taken your advice and watched some very creative DJs, but IMO the turntable is not a musical instrument and they are not musicians. They are entertainers though.

Rappers who don't sing are not singers either.

We have to be careful with our language. New things need new terms, or the language loses it's meaning.

Example: Awesome used to be reserved for things that were truly awe inspiring. Now I hear people saying, "Your new shoelaces are awesome."

Insights and incites by Notes


Extremely well articulated, Bob. 100%
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#279066 - 01/09/15 01:29 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: Joe V]
jazzmammal Offline
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Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 6371
Loc: Redondo Beach, Ca.
What really matters is what does the audience think. We've all said that for years, we play for the audience and if they want to hear Marguerittaville or the Chicken Dance I'll do it even though I hate it if that's what the gig calls for.

Well, all you have to do is listen to or watch some of the shows concerning modern music and they all refer to these people as musicians. It's definitely part of the language now, all these DJ's, EDM types, and other people doing these shows are referred to as musicians. To me that's the end of the story. For us as old timers discussing amongst ourselves oh no they're not, is nice but completely irrelevant.

That train has left the station, the people who count say they're musicians so they're musicians. Like you just said Notes, the language changes. We're going to be the Lone Stranger standing at the rim of the Grand Canyon screaming into the void all by ourselves "No they're not, dammit!!"

Bob
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#279077 - 01/09/15 02:38 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: Joe V]
Kemmrich Offline
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Registered: 02/27/07
Posts: 1814
I just watched a couple of avicii live videos and I can not believe how wild the crowd goes. It really is just a big event to drive the crowd to ecstasy.

I like the song/video "Wake Me Up" and I am trying to be "hip" (ha, ha), but I just don't get the crowds going that nuts over recorded music being mastered/DJ'd by one person. Now if I was trying to score drugs and pick up women, I can tell that is the place to be!
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#279078 - 01/09/15 03:00 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: Joe V]
90 dB Offline
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Registered: 04/20/10
Posts: 4508
Loc: Florida
“they all refer to these people as musicians...”

"They" could just as well refer to these people as ducks. It still wouldn't make them ducks.

“...It's definitely part of the language now ...”

No, actually it is colloquial, not really part of the language.

“the people who count say they're musicians so they're musicians...”

Just who are 'the people who count'? Some Millennial cretins writing blogs from their mom's basement? grin

You're free to define it any way you choose, Bob. I just disagree.


Regards,

Bob
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#279098 - 01/09/15 05:30 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: Joe V]
Danny C. Offline
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Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 6444
Loc: South Louisiana
I where the "entertainer" badge with honor when ever it is used to describe me or my shows/sets.

Later,
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#279172 - 01/10/15 06:40 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Here's how the restaurants and bars feel about musicians...even when they do pay them. [Re: Joe V]
Notes Norton Offline
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Registered: 07/06/00
Posts: 4222
Loc: Fort Pierce, Florida, U.S.A.
It's part of the language now? Not if you look in the dictionary.

And when you abuse the language like that, you hinder communication.

My previous example of "Awesome". If your new shoe laces are "awesome" what word will you use if you see something really awe inspiring?

If you do see something truly awesome and use that word, you are comparing the truly awesome to shoe laces.

Example: So if you see a guitarist play the entire 7th symphony from Shostakovitch on an acoustic guitar without missing or leaving out a note, and you say, "Man, that was awesome" you are saying that was just as good as a pair of shoe laces.

A DJ is a DJ, a musician is a musician. If we call the DJ a musician, pretty soon anyone who plays an mp3 file, or sticks a CD into a changer becomes a musician.

There is a difference between a DJ and a musician. An accomplished musician is someone who plays an instrument that can read sheet music. Stick the music for something as simple as "Twinkle Twinkle Little Star" in front of the DJ and the most accomplished DJ in the world can not play it unless he buys a recording that someone else has played.

So if we call DJs musicians, how do we differentiate between the person who cannot play "On Top Of Old Smokey" or "Fur Elise" or "Symphony #9: From The New World" or "Louie Louie"?????????

No, calling DJ's musicians is as wrong as calling a musician a DJ. There is a difference and it abuses the language to call the DJ a musician.

I know language evolves, and I'm certainly not opposed to new words and the growth of language. What I am against is the kind of abuse that hinders communication.

Aspirin reduces muscle pain. So does ibuprofen. If you call them both aspirin, and someone has a fatal allergy to ibuprofen, how does that person choose the product that will save his/her life from the product that will get rid of his/her aching biceps?

No, a DJ is not a musician. A DJ is someone who plays recordings and may accompany them with sounds from his/her equipment.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

Insights and incites by Notes
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Page 6 of 8 < 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 >


PG Music News
Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows Features a Cleaned-up BB Folder

If you've used previous versions of Band-in-a-Box®, you may have noticed a lot of different files and folders within the "BB" folder for the program - after years and years of development there are up to 10,000 files for an UltraPAK! With Version 2018, we've cleaned it up - but you're not losing anything - the cleanup normally happens automatically during installation, but you can run it manually if you'd like - just select the main menu Help | Utilities | Run Cleanup routine...

Review all the new features in Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows at http://www.pgmusic.com/bbwin.new.htm

Introducing... RealTracks Artist Kirk "Jelly Roll" Johnson

One of our just-released RealTracks Sets features the award winning harmonica player Kirk "Jelly Roll" Johnson!
RealTracks Set 283: Jelly-Roll Country Harmonica

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Beginners Forum - Exporting from Band-in-a-Box® to a .MID File

Our Forum is amazing - an online community full of helpful program users, BETA testers, endorsers, and staff!

We include a Beginners Forum, which is a great place for Band-in-a-Box beginners to visit for discussions & resources!

This week included a very active post, Exporting from Band-in-a-Box to a .MID file. Visit this post to learn more about exporting RealTracks as .MID files, and see our friendly forum users at work!

Introducing... RealTracks Artist Colin Linden!

Have you heard the newest Guitar RealTracks from Colin Linden? You can find his RealTracks with:
RealTracks Set 279: Americana: Slow Groovin' 12-8 & 16ths
RealTracks Set 280: Americana: Gritty Blues & Rockabilly Swing
RealTracks Set 287: Pop Songwriter: Acoustic Guitar
RealTracks Set 299: Rootsy Blues Guitar & Piano

Learn more about Colin and listen to demos of his RealTracks when you visit his RealTracks Artist Bio.

The Band-in-a-Box® 2018 49-PAK with 40 Unreleased RealTracks!

Our Band-in-a-Box® 2018 49-PAK is still available, and includes 40 UNRELEASED RealTracks, Video RealTracks Set 1: Pop Ballad Band, Video RealTracks Set 2: Country TrainBeat Band, 32 MIDI SuperTracks, 108 Instrumental Studies, Artist Performance Set 8: Traditional Songs Sung by Béatrix Méthé, 40 AmpliTube Presets & 37 Associated Styles, and 52 Loops!

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Band-in-a-Box® 2018 For Windows Build 509 Update Available!

Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows customers can download this free patch update at http://www.pgmusic.com/support_windowsupdates.htm#509

Summary of changes:
Added: The drop station has MP3 and WMAL (lossless WMA) quadrants added.
Fixed: "Drag Audio as MP3" setting in the Plugin settings did not work when dragging a file to Windows Explorer.
Fixed: "Pause Play until MIDI or key received" setting did not work if using WAS audio drivers.
Fixed: Band-in-a-Box Server was unable to communicate with BB2018.
Fixed: Choosing a drum kit file in the MIDI/Audio Driver Setup dialog would fail with error "Unable to install patch/drum map for...".
Fixed: Disabling "Include 2 bar lead-in" setting in the Render Song to Audio File dialog would cause videos to be out of sync.
Fixed: It was not possible to type the # sharp character into the chord sheet if using a French keyboard.
Fixed: Some Amplitube TGS files and styles were missing in certain installations.
Fixed: Song would stop playing at bar 8 after rendering to an audio file.
Fixed: The Practice Window songs would not load with error "This directory does not exist...".
Fixed: The Tip of the Day dialog was not displaying any tips.
Fixed: The Tuner, MIDI Monitor, and Drum Kit window were always displaying in English instead of the user's language.

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Xtra Styles PAKs special pricing: http://www.pgmusic.com/xtrastyles.php?os=win

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