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#98693 - 12/22/10 01:06 AM [RealBand] Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock
raintalk Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 134
Hi Experts,

I've loaded Jamstix as a vst and RB for some reason constantly send the first measure with clock to the plugin.

It never stops even if RB is stopped. And it never sends any real measure info to Jamstix, when I hit play only the first measure is sent over and over.

Anybody get this working?

Demo of Jamstix here:
http://www.rayzoon.com/jamstix3_demo.html

thanks in advance for any pointers,

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#98694 - 12/22/10 07:45 AM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: raintalk]
silvertones Offline
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Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 7211
This is one of the type of VSTi that are not totally supported by RB.
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ESI Gigaport HD+
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#98695 - 12/22/10 01:12 PM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: silvertones]
Robh Offline
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Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 4166
Loc: California
Any VSTi that requires timing lock does not work properly in RB or PT. I have used JS from the beginning and in PG product it will only work as a "dumb" drum machine and follow midi data. You can't use it as a intelligent drummer.

Hopefully PG will solve this mystery soon.
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#98696 - 12/22/10 02:21 PM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: Robh]
multitracker Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 03/22/09
Posts: 272
Loc: Hibbing, MN
I second that - hopefully soon. Jamstix is a great program, and similar to PG Music in that the owner provides excellent support for his product.

Terry
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#98697 - 12/22/10 03:08 PM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: Robh]
jazzmammal Offline
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Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 6486
Loc: Redondo Beach, Ca.
Quote:

Any VSTi that requires timing lock does not work properly in RB or PT. I have used JS from the beginning and in PG product it will only work as a "dumb" drum machine and follow midi data. You can't use it as a intelligent drummer.

Hopefully PG will solve this mystery soon.




I've finally become convinced it ain't happenin. I was the first to report this 3-4 years ago, went into great detail about it, went back and forth with support, posted Ralph's (Rayzoon) replies to my emails and Peter said a couple of times he was aware of the problem and was working on it. During one of the Beta's maybe two years ago Jeff also said he was working on it but not a peep since. I'm not dumping on them, they're wizards at fixing things like this. I think it simply can't be fixed in RB for whatever reason.
All you can do is use JS in another host to create your drum grooves and then import the drum track back into RB. I've been using Sonar Home Studio for that. Then, when you have the whole song done except for fine tuning the drums do a preliminary stereo mix with no drums and put that back into the other host and use JS to finalize the drum track. Now at least you have a choice as to which host to use for your final mix and master. Yes, clunky I know but whatever it takes to get the job done.
If you don't know already, Musicians Friend is selling the Tracktion 3 Ultimate Bundle for $19.95. Regular price is like $250. An absolute steal, Scott (rockstar_not) says Tracktion is a great program and works well with all these plugins. It just arrived by UPS and I'm looking forward to playing with it.

Bob
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#98698 - 12/22/10 05:09 PM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: jazzmammal]
raintalk Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 134
Thanks Everyone

I've been able to bring up Jamstix in Ableton lite and use Midi Clock to get them to somewhat sync. I'll have to play with buffer sizes, or get midi-ox in the loop to get the sync rock solid.

This is too bad, I also tried to pull in a synth into real band and have the arpegiator sync. I'll try the second daw trick with that also.

Thanks for the Traction bundle info. It looks like a cool daw.

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#98699 - 12/22/10 07:50 PM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: raintalk]
MusicStudent Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 5500
Loc: Chicago
I'll just add that JS works sweet in Reaper! Nuff said.

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#98700 - 12/22/10 08:57 PM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: multitracker]
rharv Offline
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Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 18799
Loc: Marysville, Mi. USA
Quote:

I ...and similar to PG Music in that the owner provides excellent support for his product.

Terry




I once knew of a plugin that had a weird issue with PTW. I let PGMusic know about it, and then I let the developer know about it too. Pretty soon the two of them had found a solution. Maybe the plugin needs an easy update, and for PGMusic it would be a major endeavor. I do believe PGMusic would be willing to find a solution to plugins like Jamstix, and if the developer was interested too (lots of additional sales from users) it may be worth a shot.

It's a possible opportunity (for both sides)
Just an idea (I like proactive approaches)
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#98701 - 12/22/10 11:48 PM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: rharv]
Robh Offline
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Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 4166
Loc: California
The developer has worked with several other programs like Sonar, Reaper, Multitrackstudios and found solutions. I hope that PG would be willing to work out the problem, but JS is not the only Plug that does not work well in PG stuff.

There were three threads back in 06 and 07 where the JS developer Ralph discussed this and PG was contacted by forum members, Jazzmammal was one i believe and while PG wanted to resolve it, they decided that it was for a later revision. If you have ever gone to JS website and watched the videos you will see just how powerful this program could be with RB, and PTPA. between the abilities of RDs and Jamstix track there is virtually no drum track that could not be made to sound very live and real. I know I and others have mentioned this many times here, but I really hope Peter and Jeff can maybe take a little time to contact Ralph and see if this can't be resolved. I think while it might drive some sales to JS, also the ability to use that program in PG product might make some over there think about adding BiaB and RB to the arsenal.


Edited by Robh (12/23/10 01:10 AM)
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#98702 - 12/23/10 01:44 AM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: Robh]
rockstar_not Offline
Veteran

Registered: 01/14/02
Posts: 7381
Loc: Colorado Springs, CO, USA
It isn't just Jamstix. As pointed out already, any VST or VSTi that uses tempo clock from the host simply doesn't work as far as I can tell with an older version of PTPA.

I like to use tempo-synced delay effects. The one I like to use in particular is a freebie called Bionic Delay. Instead of messing with calculating delays in mS, you just use the note value that makes sense - 1/8th, 1/16th, etc. If you change the tempo of the song just a bit, no big deal, the VST comes right along with.

That Tracktion deal also comes with a fairly complete install of Drumcore - which I'll be trying out probably first thing once I decide to install T3.

So, whatever it is in the coding of how PG products handle plugins with a midi tempo send, it just doesn't work. Jamstix is just one VSTi that needs that midi info to properly do it's 'Jamming'.

-Scott

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#98703 - 12/23/10 11:55 AM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: rockstar_not]
Robh Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 4166
Loc: California
The new JS 3 is absolutly incredible. It also works flawlessly in MTS and MC5 with is a cheap work around too a midi in MC5 and open JS and build a drum track. I do not use JS as much since i love some of the RD tracks, and think they are very good especially for live work. For recording original tunes, i use either RDs or JS tracks where i can output 8 drum tracks and mix them.
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#98704 - 12/23/10 02:00 PM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: Robh]
MusicStudent Offline
Veteran

Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 5500
Loc: Chicago
Quote:

The new JS 3 is absolutly incredible.




US$79 until end of year, but do I need to pay extra for a XL version? I could ask over in their forum, but I trust you guys and this is off topic - music related - and will be used with BIAB and RB in some form or another.

I'll duck now being a little sensitive to asking questions about other vendors product here!

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#98705 - 12/23/10 02:56 PM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: MusicStudent]
Robh Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 4166
Loc: California
I own 2.5 so it is a $39 upgrade to 3 weeeeee
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#98706 - 12/24/10 10:12 AM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: Robh]
Wyndham Offline
Expert

Registered: 01/07/08
Posts: 1019
A quick off topic question on JS. I am looking to do backing track similar to Loreena Mc Kennett's Mummers Dance or one of the others that have a Irish Bodhran sound or other hand drum sound. Will JS work for this in the basic package or an add on, if anyone knows.
Mighrt be a nice Christmas treat, thanks Wyndham

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#98707 - 12/24/10 11:26 AM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: Wyndham]
Robh Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 4166
Loc: California
JS comes with typical kits, i doubt the irish Bodhran sound is there, there is the new Jamcussion addon, but still that would be a reach. The RDs are your best bet, or download some loops
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#98708 - 12/24/10 01:25 PM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: Wyndham]
Andrew - PG Music Offline
PG Music Staff

Registered: 05/16/02
Posts: 3771
Loc: Victoria, BC
Hello Wyndham,

Quote:

A quick off topic question on JS. I am looking to do backing track similar to Loreena Mc Kennett's Mummers Dance or one of the others that have a Irish Bodhran sound or other hand drum sound. Will JS work for this in the basic package or an add on, if anyone knows.




There are Bodhran Realdrums styles... included in RealTracks Set 104.
_________________________
Andrew
PG Music Inc.

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#98709 - 12/28/10 10:13 AM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: Andrew - PG Music]
Wyndham Offline
Expert

Registered: 01/07/08
Posts: 1019
Thanks,I'll dig into it tonight. Just received 2011 and sounds like a lot of great new RT's to play with as well. Wyndham

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#98710 - 12/04/11 09:33 PM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: raintalk]
raintalk Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 134
Quote:

Hi Experts,

I've loaded Jamstix as a vst and RB for some reason constantly send the first measure with clock to the plugin.

It never stops even if RB is stopped. And it never sends any real measure info to Jamstix, when I hit play only the first measure is sent over and over.

Anybody get this working?

Demo of Jamstix here:
http://www.rayzoon.com/jamstix3_demo.html

thanks in advance for any pointers,




Does this work in 2012 with all the VSTi that has been done?

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#98711 - 12/04/11 09:43 PM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: raintalk]
Robh Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/08/06
Posts: 4166
Loc: California
No they have not addressed the VSTi issue as far as I know.
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#98712 - 12/04/11 10:57 PM [RealBand] Re: Jamstix - RB is constantly sending midi clock [Re: Robh]
jazzmammal Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/08/05
Posts: 6486
Loc: Redondo Beach, Ca.
Nope. Rob and I are two California boys who stay on top of this issue. If there were any changes we would know about it. I stand by what I said last year. It seems like it just can't be done. Something in the core programming code I guess. It's too bad, it's the one thing holding RB back. That and automation.

Look at how responsive PG has been in this latest 2012 version. They added virtually everything that a lot of folks have been asking for since forever. Except the VST timing thing. I doubt they just forgot or thought it wasn't important, it simply can't be done imho.

Bob
_________________________
Biab/RB latest build, Win 10 64 bit, Intel 4770, 256 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA1XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.

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