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#33863 - 09/08/09 09:27 AM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: silvertones]
rharv Offline
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Loc: Marysville, Mi. USA
By exporting the tracks as wav files you are consolidating them before importing into the other programs - not a fair comparison.

Try consolidating the original seq tracks, then save, then re-open.

RB is performing just as well as the others using the exact same data, according to your post!
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#33864 - 09/08/09 12:20 PM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: rharv]
silvertones Offline
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Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 7235
That's the answer my friend. I remember now this being an issue in the days when I used Cakewalk Pro Audio 8. Now here's hoping I can't highlight the whole song and consolidate all at once as I presently have 150 songs like this!!
_________________________
John
ESI Gigaport HD+
Lenovo Turion II /4 Gig Ram/ Win7x64 be
15.6" Monitor
"The only Band is a Real Band"
www.Wintertexaninfo.com/Bands/JohnnyD.php

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#33865 - 09/08/09 12:26 PM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: silvertones]
silvertones Offline
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Posts: 7235
It appears that you can so that won't be too bad.It is increasing the file size 10%
This is a message that needs to be made REAL CLEAR to everyone.
THANKS MUCH to everyone who offered help.
_________________________
John
ESI Gigaport HD+
Lenovo Turion II /4 Gig Ram/ Win7x64 be
15.6" Monitor
"The only Band is a Real Band"
www.Wintertexaninfo.com/Bands/JohnnyD.php

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#33866 - 09/08/09 01:09 PM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: silvertones]
rharv Offline
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Loc: Marysville, Mi. USA
File size is increasing because blank sections that were previously not part of the track are being made part of the track. But performance will improve. Hard disk space is cheap, performance matters.

Glad you got it whooped!
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#33867 - 09/08/09 01:17 PM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: rharv]
silvertones Offline
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Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 7235
rharv,
I did the diggin' but you did the whoopin'
Thanks much
_________________________
John
ESI Gigaport HD+
Lenovo Turion II /4 Gig Ram/ Win7x64 be
15.6" Monitor
"The only Band is a Real Band"
www.Wintertexaninfo.com/Bands/JohnnyD.php

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#33868 - 09/08/09 03:49 PM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: silvertones]
silvertones Offline
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Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 7235
By doing this it's truly flawless AND I'm running the output buffers at 250. The CPU usage is down to 3-4% for RB and disc load for RB 1% & less.
It's a different program. Meters react in time. Controls are immediate.No video stuttering. I'm a happy camper.
_________________________
John
ESI Gigaport HD+
Lenovo Turion II /4 Gig Ram/ Win7x64 be
15.6" Monitor
"The only Band is a Real Band"
www.Wintertexaninfo.com/Bands/JohnnyD.php

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#33869 - 09/08/09 04:24 PM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: silvertones]
Mac Offline
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Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 38502
Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia USA
RHARV!!!
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#33870 - 09/08/09 06:04 PM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: Mac]
rharv Offline
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Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 18953
Loc: Marysville, Mi. USA
Glad to help.
By using a few good practices, I always get great performance out of PT and RB.

I have said 'consolidate often' quite a few times, and others have complained that it eats disk space - I'll say it again; disk space is cheap, it's performance that counts. Wasting time dealing with issues to save a few meg of space seems silly to me.
Plus the wear on the poor drive thrashing around looking for sections of audio is more costly in wear and tear!

I'm still learning from others here, so I am thankful to contribute.
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Make your sound your own!

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#33871 - 09/09/09 05:40 AM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: rharv]
manning1 Offline
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Registered: 05/08/05
Posts: 1992
Loc: Canada
rharv.
re drives.
spot on mate.
hi performance drives with big caches like 32mb are dirt cheap these days.
heck people are throwing at me for free these days dual core systems
cos they are upgradeing to quads. the freebies just need some tlc n cleaning up
and they are good for 70 traks. just add a spanking new drive to record to for 80 buks.
why people do work now on old slow systems beats me when there are free or nearly free
dual core systems to be had beats me,.
ive got a bunch of old systems ive been given here , and i just take the old drives outta em ,
put em in a cheap usb enclosure n use em for backing up songs etc from the new pc.
like you i always consolidate.
rharv , if ya want a whizz bang time you sometimes see phenom quad motherboards with processor for 250 buks on special.
or something like a i7 processor will make you smile huge with a couple of raptor or veloci drives. lol.
the i7 is a lovely processor.
ive always been amd but the intel i7 i gotta say is superb.
give me an i7 system any day over a mac. or anything else.
_________________________
retired puter engr....powertracks on amd......NICE !
"what is the black art of audio engineering ?"
my silly songs...motagator.com/bmanning
see my tips in the tips section.

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#33872 - 09/09/09 07:25 AM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: manning1]
Mac Offline
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Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 38502
Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia USA
manning -- Bear in mind that the "system" involved in this particular thread and problem (solved) -- is a laptop and not a desktop.

More and more people are turning to laptops for home recording/demo/music work these days and for many it is working quite well.

I've been using laptop plus E-MU 1616M pcmcia sound device, added 8 channels of A-D into the E-MU's ADAT input to yield a rather nice and portable 16-track input recording machine for onlocation work. Laptop plus 1616M w/ADC, one external Firewire hard drive for the Temp storage and the system flat works fine.


--Mac
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#33873 - 09/09/09 07:31 AM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: Mac]
silvertones Offline
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Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 7235
I'd like to see a check box in the audio prefs.
" Consolodate audio when saving"
_________________________
John
ESI Gigaport HD+
Lenovo Turion II /4 Gig Ram/ Win7x64 be
15.6" Monitor
"The only Band is a Real Band"
www.Wintertexaninfo.com/Bands/JohnnyD.php

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#33874 - 09/09/09 08:39 AM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: silvertones]
rharv Offline
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Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 18953
Loc: Marysville, Mi. USA
Good idea.

BTW, you'll probably need to run a defrag after consolidating all those files. You did a lot of them, and there will likely be a lot of small half-track size spaces leftover.
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#33875 - 09/09/09 04:00 PM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: rharv]
silvertones Offline
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Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 7235
Well I"m afraid the fat lady hasn't sung yet.
Yesterday a consolidated song 1 played it through 6 times perfectly.Saved , reopened played perfectly.
Did this for a couple more songs perfect.
Spent the rest of yesterday and this morning just going through all 150 songs. Then I defragged the drive and made copies to 2 other drives.
Went to town & when I got back thought I'd settle in and play a few songs.
STUTTERING GRAPHICS JUST LIKE BEFORE.
Checked the event list and no multiple audio parts.
Redid the consolidate on a song and it plays perfectly. Saved & reopen it plays fine. Open another song and then reopen the one I just consolidated and stutter.

What is going on here!!!!!!!!!1
_________________________
John
ESI Gigaport HD+
Lenovo Turion II /4 Gig Ram/ Win7x64 be
15.6" Monitor
"The only Band is a Real Band"
www.Wintertexaninfo.com/Bands/JohnnyD.php

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#33876 - 09/09/09 04:52 PM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: silvertones]
Wyndham Offline
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Registered: 01/07/08
Posts: 1019
Quote:

Redid the consolidate on a song and it plays perfectly. Saved & reopen it plays fine. Open another song and then reopen the one I just consolidated and stutter.

What is going on here!!!!!!!!!1



Well either BIAB takes the file and does something to it or it might be a bad stick of ram. There should be a free ram test you can find on the net. It is a possibility that as you are moving files in and out of ram that a bad section comes up. I don't know if this is it, just another guess in a long line of head scratching. Wyndham

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#33877 - 09/09/09 05:08 PM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: Wyndham]
silvertones Offline
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Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 7235
Done all the tests. HD, Ram, everything.
I've just deleted RB & BB. Ran CCleaner & Registry mechanic. Then I'm gonna try and run from the supplied external drive. The C disc is now only 30% full.
_________________________
John
ESI Gigaport HD+
Lenovo Turion II /4 Gig Ram/ Win7x64 be
15.6" Monitor
"The only Band is a Real Band"
www.Wintertexaninfo.com/Bands/JohnnyD.php

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#33878 - 09/09/09 05:38 PM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: silvertones]
manning1 Offline
Expert

Registered: 05/08/05
Posts: 1992
Loc: Canada
silvertones
as your aware the net is littered with problems with laptops.
yes some folks luck out and get one that works well, but lots dont.
if you havent run this yet..
please do so and report back.
cos i'm finding the vast majority of lappies fail this test,
and that includes over 6 i tried this week.
http://www.thesycon.de/deu/latency_check.shtml

please report back if you get red spikes etc etc.
when you get the stuttering probs...
how many audio traks does it start at ??
are you useing 44.1/16 ?? or higher rates ??
another question....
do you get probs at low trak counts ??


ps..is this your lappie with the slow internal drive ??
http://uk.shopping.com/xPF-TOSHIBA-P25-S5262-P25S5262-Factory-Serviced
please confirm.
_________________________
retired puter engr....powertracks on amd......NICE !
"what is the black art of audio engineering ?"
my silly songs...motagator.com/bmanning
see my tips in the tips section.

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#33879 - 09/09/09 05:55 PM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: manning1]
silvertones Offline
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Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 7235
Manning1
I'm reinstalling the program now so will have to wait until tomorrow to run the test.
Yes that is the lappy. I've upped the Ram to 2G & HD to 160.
Most recent test results.
Running the program from the external drive and songs on C stutters.
Moving songs to External, I say this carefully for now, seems fine.
Lawrie originally questioned the drive now I'm starting to wonder but if you've read the whole post It's confusing.
_________________________
John
ESI Gigaport HD+
Lenovo Turion II /4 Gig Ram/ Win7x64 be
15.6" Monitor
"The only Band is a Real Band"
www.Wintertexaninfo.com/Bands/JohnnyD.php

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#33880 - 09/09/09 07:31 PM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: silvertones]
manning1 Offline
Expert

Registered: 05/08/05
Posts: 1992
Loc: Canada
silvertones
please run that dpc utility i linked to at the earliest.
cos it will report usefull info.
and post back what it says.
the fact that you report no probs with an external drive leads me to suspect that
win is cutting in to do its thing if useing internal drive for daw work.
a common problem with lappies.

when you get the stuttering run a process/task monitor at the same time..
to see which tasks are useing resources.
what many folks do is replace the slow internal drive with a 7200 rpm ,
and use an external hi performance drive as i said in an enclosure
to record to.
that internal you upgraded to , whats the rpm ??

it would be nice to know what audio trak counts are when you experience problems.
typically lots of internal drives cant keep up if useing
high sample rates n bit depths with high trak counts.
_________________________
retired puter engr....powertracks on amd......NICE !
"what is the black art of audio engineering ?"
my silly songs...motagator.com/bmanning
see my tips in the tips section.

Top
#33881 - 09/09/09 08:09 PM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: manning1]
Mac Offline
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Registered: 05/29/00
Posts: 38502
Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia USA
What went on is simple enough, you did the defrag. '

However, multiple tracks of audio may not like being in contiguous data.

They like to be *interleaved* such that the head does not have to go as far a distance to find a buffer full of track 1, then a buffer full of track 2, then track 3, etc. before playing back that buffer. And then go through it all over again to fill the second buffer. etc.

Just let the program do the consolidation and leave it that way.


--Mac
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You must be Audiominds.
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#33882 - 09/10/09 07:31 AM [RealBand] Re: Small Annoyance [Re: Mac]
silvertones Offline
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Registered: 05/13/03
Posts: 7235
Mac,
Are you saying to not defrag once I've consolidated the files?
Manning1,
No sure if you read the whole post but this is strictly a video stutter. Audio is fine.
Ran the test and there are some red spikes. Disabled 1 item at a time with no change. Didn't disable the video card though.
I refuse to believe it's totally the fault of the lappy. If I load the same 10 tracks into Sonar or Adobe Audition the play 110% perfect. I can open the task MGR. I can open other screens and there's never an audio or video stutter. The meters react perfectly in time with the music and so on.


Edited by silvertones (09/10/09 08:16 AM)
_________________________
John
ESI Gigaport HD+
Lenovo Turion II /4 Gig Ram/ Win7x64 be
15.6" Monitor
"The only Band is a Real Band"
www.Wintertexaninfo.com/Bands/JohnnyD.php

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