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Hi Folks

Brand new here (and to B-i-a-B). I am a MAC user and desperately trying to get to know the software so I can use it to more easily create tracks for myself.

I have created a simple song to start with and am using Realtracks:
_HANKPS1.STY Med Country Swing with Pedal Steel

The drums have a sidestick sound which is great through the verse. Now.. I get to the chorus and, at a specific spot, I need to do a little fill and then change to snare sound rather than the rim-shot.

Can anyone help me with this by telling me how to make the change and then, when I'm done with the chorus, to go back to the side stick sound?

Many thanks
Chris

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Chris,

Welcome to the forums.

Realdrums are not individual drum sounds that are assembled into a track, they are live performances of a drummer. As such, they do not have individual control over the different components of the drum kit.

For such control, it would be necessary to use something like EZ Drummer which uses midi to create drum tracks from sampled sounds.

In the meantime, some things that you might try that could help get something that works for you would be...

1. Enter into Realdrum picker and have a look at the variations that are available with the Nashville Sw8 Rhythm that _Hankps.sty uses. (See IMAGE 1 below.)

2. Experiment with part markers. The Blue and the Green Part Markers will activate a drum fill. They are obtained by clicking on the bar number. The fill will occur in the bar before the part marker. (See IMAGE 2 below.)

In the part marker image, the blue part marker at bar 3 will force a drum fill in bar 2.

Regards,
Noel

Attached Files (Click to download or enlarge) (Only available when you are logged in)
nashville sw8 variations.JPG (19.36 KB, 83 downloads)
IMAGE 1... Nashville sw8 variations (found in style _HANKPS.STY)
partmarker2.JPG (12.15 KB, 83 downloads)
IMAGE 2... Part marker at bar 3 forces fill in bar 2

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Hi there, Noel

Thanks for coming back to me on this one. I tried the change by right-clicking the beginning of the bar I want a drum fill and a change to snare. I changed one of the settings and got the little red underline. (See image)

Does this look like I'm in the right place? I wanted to change the style of play at that point.

Needless to say, it didn't work. frown

Looking forward to your reply.

Cheers
Chris

Attached Files (Click to download or enlarge) (Only available when you are logged in)
Change-Style-1.jpg (83.3 KB, 80 downloads)

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Hi Noel

I think I've managed to figure out how to get the effect I want. Steps I took:

1. Select bar where I want the drums to change
2. Right click until I get the box in the Step-2 image attached
3. Tell B-i-a-B that the bar is the start of a chorus
4. The drum sound changes to snare tap rather than side-stick (much more aggressive)
5. Right click where I want the chorus to end and change drum sound (Step-5 image)

It seems to work. I Generate the song again after each change.

Does this sound like I'm doing what I should be? Terribly confusing...

Cheers
Chris

Attached Files (Click to download or enlarge) (Only available when you are logged in)
Step-2.jpg (77.13 KB, 73 downloads)
Step-5.jpg (80.92 KB, 73 downloads)

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Noel this is what I'm meaning... I've tried to attach an audio file and hope the forum allows it - nope - it doesn't.

The audio file is here:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/h1fotgbx0q93h3j/BiaB-Change_Drum_Demo.mp3?dl=0

Note the change from the rim-shot to the snare proper.

Cheers
Chris


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Chris,

I'm glad you got it working. I had a listen to the audio and it sounds good! The blue part marker was what you needed to instruct BIAB to create a fill in bar before the chorus. And choosing the variation you did, gave the sound you were after. Your process looks fine.

While it's easy to create a simple backing track, there's definitely a bit of a learning curve associated with getting BIAB tamed and doing what you want. It's well worth the effort, though.

All the best,
Noel




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Originally Posted By: Noel96
Chris,

I'm glad you got it working. I had a listen to the audio and it sounds good! The blue part marker was what you needed to instruct BIAB to create a fill in bar before the chorus. And choosing the variation you did, gave the sound you were after. Your process looks fine.


Thanks very much for coming back to me, Noel. Really appreciate it.

Originally Posted By: Noel96
While it's easy to create a simple backing track, there's definitely a bit of a learning curve associated with getting BIAB tamed and doing what you want. It's well worth the effort, though.


Yes - this is one of the scary things I'm facing. I'm no lead guitarist but I need to try and create a lead solo (perhaps 8 bars of piano and then 8 bars of guitar) but have absolutely no idea how to get BiaB to do that. Any pointers would be so appreciated. I only installed the package today and still trying to get to grips with it.

Loved the chords in your song!

All the best
Chris


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Chris,

Have a play around with bar settings and muting instruments and then bringing their volumes back to normal. This is accessed by right-clicking on the chord sheet. (F5 is the shortcut key.)

Alternatively, because you are looking to create two solos, this would be easier to accomplish in Realband. Simply open your present song file in Realband. It will generate and then you can add extra Realtracks and use volume envelopes to take the sounds in and out of the mix.

What I normally do is...

1. Create my song in BIAB.

2. Use Realband to add extra material.

3. Save the Realband tracks and load the files into Reaper to arrange and mix, and to create a final overall wav file.

Regards,
Noel

P.S. Thanks for having a listen to my song smile Appreciate it.


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Originally Posted By: Noel96
Chris,

2. Use Realband to add extra material.


OK - here's a real newbie question... is Realband included somewhere in BiaB or is it s separate package?

OK OK - I'll go have a look at the PG Music site. <whoosh> laugh

Best wishes
Chris


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Chris,

I apologise. I forgot that I was in the Macintosh forum and made a mistake. Realband is part of the Windows suite but it is not available with the Mac version of the program. Sorry for the confusion.

Regards,
Noel


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Chris, there is no Real Band in the Mac version - only in the Windoze version. Also on the Mac, you've got to use "fn" plus "F5" to access the bar settings. Hope that helps a little.

Oops - posted the same thing at the same time!

Last edited by babarton; 06/18/17 01:42 AM.

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Hi there, babarton and Noel

Thanks to you both for the ongoing help.

Quote:
Chris, there is no Real Band in the Mac version - only in the Windoze version.


OUCH! I feel like I've been ripped a little. I could have purchased the Windows version of the software but chose the MAC version because my daily driver is a 27" iMAC and my Windows is running as a virtual machine using Parallels.

So... without RealBand I guess I have to revert to calling on live musicians to help with the various solos. That would be such a shame - I was really hoping to be able to construct the entire song within BiaB.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Do I try and get PG Music to give me the Windows version rather than or as well as the MAC version of the package?

All the best
Chris


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Chris,

I always put my solos together in a DAW. To do this, I generate the instruments that I need and I always do multiple generations. I then load the audio files into my DAW and cut/copy/paste sections of the solo instruments until I get what I like.

Generating solos in BIAB and then saving is straightforward.

When I'm creating my songs in BIAB, I always generate a new solo every time I generate the song. If one generation appeals to me, I always save it immediately! I do this because I will generate a song a couple of hundred times (at least) during the writing process. By regenerating over and over, I get to hear around 200 versions of the solo and some of them definitely sound better than others.

If you have a listen to "Tomorrow I'll Be Fine", you'll hear an 8-bar guitar solo followed by an 8-bar violin solo (which are similar back-to-back solos to the ones you mention you'd like to achieve with guitar and piano). I did this in a DAW.

Regards,
Noel


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Hi Noel

Originally Posted By: Noel96

I always put my solos together in a DAW. To do this, I generate the instruments that I need and I always do multiple generations. I then load the audio files into my DAW and cut/copy/paste sections of the solo instruments until I get what I like.

Generating solos in BIAB and then saving is straightforward.

How you actually play the solo. For example the guitar sounds very real but was this actually played on a guitar or did you use the keyboard in BiaB and then "turn it into" a guitar sound thereafter, before importing into your DAW?

Originally Posted By: Noel96
When I'm creating my songs in BIAB, I always generate a new solo every time I generate the song. If one generation appeals to me, I always save it immediately! I do this because I will generate a song a couple of hundred times (at least) during the writing process. By regenerating over and over, I get to hear around 200 versions of the solo and some of them definitely sound better than others.

You've definitely lost me now. laugh How do you set BiaB to regen the solo as well and the whole song each time?

LOVE what you did in the song. That's exactly what I would like to be able to recreate. I see a long and large learning curve ahead! heh heh

Best wishes
Chris


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Hi Chris Kenward ,

Excuse me for chiming in on your question/topic.

I use Mac Band-in-a-Box 2017 Audiophile version to initially capture my musical ideas and then a DAW ( such as Mac Digital Performer or Logic Pro X ) to manipulate those audio tracks, especially the drum tracks.

Those drum tracks are live performances by for real drummers and therefore it is a huge undertaking to record nearly every possible drum play a user would want.

Now since those two DAW's i mentioned cost big bucks you may not want to buy them.

In your situation if you very recently purchased the Mac version you may ask PG for an refund or exchange by stating your dissatisfaction.

On the other hand you could also ask PG to help you thru your problem.

In both matters I know from personal experience that PG is excellent in customer service and satisfaction.



Yours truly, w/MisterMagoo

Last edited by w; 06/18/17 10:12 AM. Reason: additional comments
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Chris,

Adding to what w has said above, if you wanted to get BIAB Windows and you purchased BIAB Mac less than 30 days ago, PG Music do have a 30-day money back guarantee option that would allow you change over. It may be worth following that up with sales staff if it applies to you.

Regards,
Noel


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Hi there, MisterMagoo

I have been using Logix X Pro for a long time and also have Adobe Audition CS6 which I swear by - love it.

My problem is that I need to have some way to create the solo tracks I need for my backing tracks. Being a total BiaB newbie, I'm still playing with the chord screen and I have the Pro version, which doesn't have that many Real Tracks compared to some of the others.

I've dropped PG Music a support Email asking what I should do about the fact that Real Band is not included with the MAC version of the software. Waiting for a response and then we'll take it from there.

Thanks for your input - much appreciated.

Regards
Chris


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Hi Noel

Thanks - yes - will have the discussion. Don't really want to change away from MAC as I use it for all my music mixing etc. but really quite desperate to ensure that I can make the solo tracks I need if I'm to try to be self contained.

All the best
Chris


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Please note my additional comments in my first post.

Also
Quote:
I have been using Logix X Pro for a long time and also have Adobe Audition CS6 which I swear by - love it.

My problem is that I need to have some way to create the solo tracks I need for my backing tracks.


There you go, I use my DAW's to create drum backing tracks and many other audio tracks because DAW's have far more built in and third party software such as AU/VST's whereby the my song project is a blend of Band in a Box and what ever DAW i need to use.

Mac Band have come a long way but to some extent limited and perhaps good enough for the average musician.

Although, it is fun to play the same song using the 5 thousand plus styles. ( just kidding about playing 5 thousand styles )

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Chris,

A number of people use Mac BIAB over in Users Showcase and their songs are amongst the best on the forum. A couple of Mac users who spring to mind are below.

1. Janice and Bud Merritt
https://soundcloud.com/mootsman

2. Steve Young
https://soundcloud.com/stephenwyoung/

Regards,
Noel


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Noel those sounds are amazingly good. If they are all produced using BiaB and without resorting to multi-track recordings using "real" guitarists or pianists, then that's exactly what I'm attempting to do.

I'm completely blown away at the intricacies of some of those tunes and riffs.

Thanks for sharing them!

All the best
Chris


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A DAW will give you the greatest control over your sound, but you can still do an awful lot in BIAB.

However, since you only have the BIAB Pro Pak, which is really an entry-level version that has very limited RealDrums and RealTracks content. The Pro Pak is really designed to give you a taste of what you can do with BIAB; however, most folks pretty quickly upgrade to one of the other paks to have much more musical content at your fingertips. Even the MegaPak gives you a lot more content to work with, but the UltraPlusPak or EverythingPak gives you all the RealDrums and RealTracks.

The higher level packs give you much more "real" content to work with (pianist, guitarist, bassists, horn players, etc), so you don't need to resort to "live" players, unless you are looking for a specific riff or melody (remember, RTs are pre-recorded phrases and don't follow MIDI note data - they are instead designed to work within your chord progression).

Since you can create in BIAB, you can easily export (or drag and drop) out of BIAB and bring your content into the DAW of your choice. That may require a lot of back and forth, but still very doable.

Or work within the track limitations of BIAB and do everything there.


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Chris, if you've got Logic, you're good to go. You can generate a track in BIAB and just drag and drop the single track (rather than the whole arrangement) into Logic. If you aren't happy with it, regenerate it in BIAB and drag and drop it into Logic again... and again... and again... until you are happy with it. As a former Windoze user, what I can tell you is that Real Band IS a DAW, but with the ability to regenerate a specific part (or section of a part) just like BIAB does. However, you can regenerate these within BIAB and drag/drop them to Logic. This is not terribly cumbersome, and (at least to me) well worth avoiding the Windoze environment. Of course, YMMV...

I also have to agree with jford, you're going to want ALL the real tracks to play around and experiment with, if you can afford them.


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Hi there, jford
Originally Posted By: jford
Even the MegaPak gives you a lot more content to work with, but the UltraPlusPak or EverythingPak gives you all the RealDrums and RealTracks.

The higher level packs give you much more "real" content to work with (pianist, guitarist, bassists, horn players, etc), so you don't need to resort to "live" players, unless you are looking for a specific riff or melody (remember, RTs are pre-recorded phrases and don't follow MIDI note data - they are instead designed to work within your chord progression).


THIS is what I wanted to hear. I'm very happy to upgrade to the ultraPlusPAK and have just had a response from PG Support (Woah! A long time to respond - I asked the question on 18/6/2017) saying that they will refund me for the additional PAK I just bought as it's included in the UltraPlusPAK. I'm going to buy it and see where it takes me. Thank you so much for this response.

All the best
Chris


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Originally Posted By: babarton

I also have to agree with jford, you're going to want ALL the real tracks to play around and experiment with, if you can afford them.


Thanks so much for the additional recommendation. I've dropped the folks at PG Music an Email asking how I go about getting the "top" pack so I can delve further into creating my new song.

Thanks all for being so helpful. Appreciate it!

Cheers
Chris


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Chris,

The "top" pack is the Audiophile edition of the software. That will give you exactly the same that you presently have except that Realtracks and Realdrums will be in higher quality WAV/AIFF files rather than the compressed files that the UltraplusPak has.

From the perspective of Realtracks, Realdrums, Styles, etc., there is no difference between the UltraplusPak and the EverythingPak. The EverythingPak contains additional video tutorials, lessons and extra MIDI songs.

Regards,
Noel


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Originally Posted By: Noel96

The "top" pack is the Audiophile edition of the software. That will give you exactly the same that you presently have except that Realtracks and Realdrums will be in higher quality WAV/AIFF files rather than the compressed files that the UltraplusPak has.

From the perspective of Realtracks, Realdrums, Styles, etc., there is no difference between the UltraplusPak and the EverythingPak. The EverythingPak contains additional video tutorials, lessons and extra MIDI songs.


Thanks, Noel - I have placed the order and paid for the 'Everything' pack and have downloaded the files. Now to install them and make sure not to lose anything I've already created.

Cheers
Chris


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