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#445313 - 12/15/17 10:48 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's)
pchurchfield Offline
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Registered: 10/14/16
Posts: 21
Loc: Nashville, Tennessee
Hi I'm new here and I hope that this wish, or suggestion is going into the correct topic.

I wish that : You could describe your song to biab by familiar terms like : INTRO, VERSE, PRECHORUS, CHORUS, BRIDGE, OUTRO, SOLO, etc...

It's difficult for me to wrap my head around the idea that a SONG in biab is seen as just a bunch of choruses. I struggled with this from the getgo and I still do. I mean, with all of the amazing technology implemented in biab, how hard could it be?

I realize that you can add these things (after the fact). My wish is that it was the native mode of song entry, not an afterthought.

Thanks,
Paul

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#445319 - 12/15/17 11:25 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's) [Re: pchurchfield]
Matt Finley Offline
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Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 16526
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Welcome to the forum, Paul. You might enjoy a short discussion of this topic a few days ago in which I described why BIAB is this way. http://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Main=65857&Number=443764#Post443764 Scroll up to the top to read the whole thread.
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#445413 - 12/15/17 07:58 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's) [Re: pchurchfield]
JohnJohnJohn Offline
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Registered: 06/25/12
Posts: 2057
Originally Posted By: pchurchfield
Hi I'm new here and I hope that this wish, or suggestion is going into the correct topic.

I wish that : You could describe your song to biab by familiar terms like : INTRO, VERSE, PRECHORUS, CHORUS, BRIDGE, OUTRO, SOLO, etc...

It's difficult for me to wrap my head around the idea that a SONG in biab is seen as just a bunch of choruses. I struggled with this from the getgo and I still do. I mean, with all of the amazing technology implemented in biab, how hard could it be?

I realize that you can add these things (after the fact). My wish is that it was the native mode of song entry, not an afterthought.

Thanks,
Paul

It is that way because it is a convention used in jazz. The software was designed back when jazz was not the least popular genre in the U.S. and just never updated to something more common. smile

Once you get used to this wart you won't mind it too much. Just unfold your song and forget about the whole concept of jazz choruses.


Edited by JohnJohnJohn (12/15/17 07:58 PM)

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#445505 - 12/16/17 08:01 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's) [Re: pchurchfield]
Icelander Offline
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Registered: 11/11/12
Posts: 2261
There are actually a couple of ways in BBox how you can define the individual sections of your song beyond just a or b parts. But since these differ between the PC and Mac platform, and you haven't specified which one you are using (see my tip in the Beginners forum!), I cannot presume which one to outline for you.


Edited by Icelander (12/16/17 08:02 AM)
Edit Reason: correcting mistakes.
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#445731 - 12/17/17 04:40 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's) [Re: pchurchfield]
pchurchfield Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 10/14/16
Posts: 21
Loc: Nashville, Tennessee
Thank you for clarifying that for me.
I appreciate the feedback.
Still a nice item for the wishlist, nevertheless.

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#445903 - 12/18/17 03:25 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's) [Re: pchurchfield]
Icelander Offline
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Registered: 11/11/12
Posts: 2261
Originally Posted By: pchurchfield
Still a nice item for the wishlist, nevertheless.
Absolutely, I was just checking if perhaps you could already do this and just didn't know about it smile
Happens more often around here than you might think. I'd even say I've yet to find anyone on here who knows absolutely 100% of all the things you can do with this program.
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#445994 - 12/19/17 04:09 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's) [Re: Icelander]
Darrow Offline
Newbie

Registered: 04/08/05
Posts: 2
Loc: UK
I'm not new to BIAB but I have been away for a while and recently upgraded. I was hoping to find an alternative to the old chorus and tag structure so I also add this to my wish list.
I use ONSONG on an iPAD for gigging which uses INTRO/VERSE/CHORUS/BRIDGE etc. It's chords and lyrics only, no accompaniment, but I find that it is much easier to build new songs that way.

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#446013 - 12/19/17 06:34 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's) [Re: pchurchfield]
Cerio Offline
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Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 771
Loc: Spain
+1

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#446026 - 12/19/17 07:34 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's) [Re: pchurchfield]
Icelander Offline
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Registered: 11/11/12
Posts: 2261
+1 for more options to define this as suits you best
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#446047 - 12/19/17 09:56 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's) [Re: pchurchfield]
raymb1 Online   content
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Registered: 05/24/05
Posts: 2464
Loc: Sterling, Va
It also depends on what you call a verse, bridge or chorus. In a large majority of the old standards and jazz songs the choruses were 32 bars long. A verse was something in front of the 32 bars and usually not played in the solos. The scheme was A-A-B-A, with B being the bridge. A lot of songs were also written 16 bars-16 bars with no verse or bridge. Many of today's song are written with parts called verse and bridge that have no relevance to the old standards. What today's song writers might call a verse, bridge or chorus is very subjective.
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#446052 - 12/19/17 10:08 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's) [Re: pchurchfield]
Icelander Offline
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Registered: 11/11/12
Posts: 2261
You just beat me to the punch with that elaboration there, Ray cool

I think this whole thread just underlines a need I've seen in other threads, for an overhaul/update to these definitions. To give the user more varied set of choices, a bit like they're already offering with the various ways for us to define chords. Perhaps a sort of "Define terminology in Jazz or Pop" kind of settings for the user might be just the thing here.

EDIT: And needless to say, this should be song based, not ruined by a crude Global implementation (which happens too often!)


Edited by Icelander (12/19/17 10:12 AM)
Edit Reason: Afterthought
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#446056 - 12/19/17 10:33 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's) [Re: pchurchfield]
Matt Finley Offline
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Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 16526
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Before everyone continues, you should take a look at the Song Form Maker in the Tools toolbar. It gives you a basic way to define A,A,B,A,C,A,B sections by defining measure ranges.
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#446058 - 12/19/17 10:35 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's) [Re: raymb1]
raymb1 Online   content
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Registered: 05/24/05
Posts: 2464
Loc: Sterling, Va
For those who may not know what a verse, bridge or chorus is, you can always label the parts from A to Z with repeats, if desired, in each section.


Edited by raymb1 (12/19/17 10:39 AM)
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#446072 - 12/19/17 12:06 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's) [Re: Matt Finley]
Icelander Offline
Veteran

Registered: 11/11/12
Posts: 2261
Originally Posted By: Matt Finley
Before everyone continues, you should take a look at the Song Form Maker
Ahemm...
Originally Posted By: Icelander
There are actually a couple of ways in BBox how you can define the individual sections of your song beyond just a or b parts.
wink
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Never finish what you can't start!
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#446074 - 12/19/17 12:12 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: Better Song Structure Entry (not just # of CHORUS's) [Re: raymb1]
VideoTrack Online   content
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Registered: 06/05/12
Posts: 7554
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Originally Posted By: raymb1
What today's song writers might call a verse, bridge or chorus is very subjective.
Ain't that ever an understatement! cry
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PG Music News
Band-in-a-Box® 2018 For Windows Build 509 Update Available!

Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows customers can download this free patch update at http://www.pgmusic.com/support_windowsupdates.htm#509

Summary of changes:
Added: The drop station has MP3 and WMAL (lossless WMA) quadrants added.
Fixed: "Drag Audio as MP3" setting in the Plugin settings did not work when dragging a file to Windows Explorer.
Fixed: "Pause Play until MIDI or key received" setting did not work if using WAS audio drivers.
Fixed: Band-in-a-Box Server was unable to communicate with BB2018.
Fixed: Choosing a drum kit file in the MIDI/Audio Driver Setup dialog would fail with error "Unable to install patch/drum map for...".
Fixed: Disabling "Include 2 bar lead-in" setting in the Render Song to Audio File dialog would cause videos to be out of sync.
Fixed: It was not possible to type the # sharp character into the chord sheet if using a French keyboard.
Fixed: Some Amplitube TGS files and styles were missing in certain installations.
Fixed: Song would stop playing at bar 8 after rendering to an audio file.
Fixed: The Practice Window songs would not load with error "This directory does not exist...".
Fixed: The Tip of the Day dialog was not displaying any tips.
Fixed: The Tuner, MIDI Monitor, and Drum Kit window were always displaying in English instead of the user's language.

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It's the LAST WEEKEND of our Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows Special!

Our Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows special ends on January 15th... it's your last weekend to order with some amazing upgrade pricing, Bonus PAKs, discounted Xtra Styles PAKs, and Video RealTracks bundles!

Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows purchase options: http://www.pgmusic.com/bbwin.packages.htm
(learn more about the new features: http://www.pgmusic.com/bbwin.new.htm)

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*The $49 Pro Upgrade does not include the Free Bonus PAK, any RealTracks, MIDI SuperTracks or other Add-ons.

Autumn Leaves Video Tutorial - Band-in-a-Box Backing Tracks!

Forum user Lot2Learn recently shared their Autumn Leaves - Jazz Piano Tutorial video to our I just heard Band-in-a-Box on YouTube forum, it's approaching 1.7 million views!

Make sure you watch this incredible tutorial video! http://www.pgmusic.com/?vid=stsBqdo9Svc

Songwriting Feedback - "Why This Forum Matters"

Our Forum is a great resource when you're wanting to discuss Band-in-a-Box (or other PG Music Inc. programs), but it's so much more!

In addition to the different sections we have for our products (Band-in-a-Box, RealBand, PowerTracks, and Other PG Music Programs), there are also places on our Forum to share your songs, YouTube videos, ask for tech help for problems not related to our software, "off topic" discussions, and more!

Forum user David Snyder shared his thoughts on Why This Forum Matters in his recent Songwriting post, which has some great feedback, including:

It occurred to me this morning that it is the group effort that counts. That is, one kind word about another member's song, one piece of encouragement or generous suggestion, might cause that person to write the greatest song ever written, which might then go on to have a massive impact on some stranger's life, cause someone to fall in love, or turn their life around, and literally change the course of history. Because songs do that.

OR, one kind word given to YOU might cause you to write the greatest song ever written in the coming year, and that song could go on to have an impact on untold thousands. Who knows! It happens all the time.

But the point is, it is not about any one of us, it is about all of us, the group.

Read through the whole conversation (and join in!): http://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=447431

...and a big THANK YOU to David for sharing his thoughts!

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