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#448047 - 12/30/17 09:43 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] My three wishes for BIAB 2019.
Cerio Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 790
Loc: Spain
1. Keep releasing new Realtracks! Realtracks are fantastic. They were introduced in 2009, and still there is no software in the world that can produce backing tracks with the quality BIAB can, thanks to the Realtracks. Realtracks are the single feature that makes BIAB such a wonderful and unique product for musicians, and I suspect the main reason why a lot of people upgrade BIAB year after year is to have new Realtracks. Just keep doing them!


2. No more "50 new features" each year! After more than 20 years adding 50 or more new features each year we have...well, just too many of them! I really don't want to sound offensive, but BIAB has a severe case of feature creep, and that's not good news:
https://www.techopedia.com/definition/4277/feature-creep
With so many features is really difficult to keep things simple. Most newcomers just find BIAB too difficult to use because of that, and even for experienced users, trying to find a feature that you haven't used for a long time is often a nightmare. New features add more complexity (and new bugs) each year, and still worst, with 50+ features being added every year, compatibility between old and new features is not easy to manage. Seriously, 99% of the users don't need 50 new features every year, they just need new Realtracks and...


3. Fix the bugs! Instead of adding new features, please, improve the ones that are already there. Fix the reported bugs, improve the program stability, make it solid rock. And make it simple: avoid windows / menus redundancy, hire a user interface designer who never used the program to get some fresh new ideas about what could be done with the GUI to improve the program's usability, etc, etc, etc.

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#448054 - 12/30/17 10:25 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Cerio]
JohnJohnJohn Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/25/12
Posts: 2163
+1,000,000 Excellent post!

The whole "50 new features" thing is an outdated marketing technique. Plus, lots/most of the "new features" are of little use to the majority of us. And the really cool new features like User Tracks and custom track names never seem to get fully implemented.

But the RealTracks are astounding...incredible...amazing...and every other positive word I can think of! This is where the product SHINES! This feature is better than anything on the market. Bar none. Hands down.

So yeah...keep the excellent work you do on RealTracks and fix the bugs and GUI.

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#448082 - 12/30/17 01:11 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Cerio]
Guitartist Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 03/04/03
Posts: 353
Loc: Maine
+1
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#448161 - 12/31/17 02:41 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Cerio]
WendyM Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 12/29/16
Posts: 161
Loc: UK
Im for all 3!!Especially the second. Im new last year to BB and the initial complexity (menus,submenus,subsubmenus) almost made me get a refund.and now weve got another 50 features!What! Will they ever get used.And nice easy features of 2017 like render to wav are now clunky and no longer user friendly.Defeats the object IMO.
If the programmers want something to do,get them working on away of being able to insert a midi instrument from a similar style into an otherwse RT style.And don't give me all that midi isnt RT guff.I know,I know.It seems daft to me that to maximise Style search you have to go midi first and then repopulate seleced tracks with RTs rather than finding a near perfect RT style that maybe just needs <M49 strings to be spot on.Current RTs like 1278 are so horribly wheezy that theyr unusable.Hence the sub.
Happy new year Biabers.
Wendy


Edited by WendyM (12/31/17 02:51 AM)
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#448170 - 12/31/17 04:59 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Cerio]
Islansoul Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 05/15/15
Posts: 762
Loc: St. Petersburg , FL
Sorry Cerio, I'm a Mac users so I can't agree on your wish for number two. I would love to see more features, for BIAB for Mac, but that is a different topic for a different time. I love my BIAB for Mac and it does what I need it to do.
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DAWs: Pro Tools, Logic, and Maschine
plays drums, percussion, bass, steel pan, keyboard,
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#448277 - 12/31/17 03:02 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Cerio]
Jim Fogle Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 3778
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
+1. Nice post Cerio.
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2018 BiaB (516) UltraPlusPak RB 2018 (Build 5)
Cakewalk by Bandlab - Sonar Home Studio - Cakewalk Music Creator 6 - Audacity
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#448327 - 12/31/17 07:53 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Cerio]
VideoTrack Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/05/12
Posts: 8104
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
All three suggestions are very worthy of consideration.

It would be great to see the Windows and Mac versions having identical functionality.

Program reliability is vital and better regression testing is definitely needed, so number 3 is particularly important in my view.

All excellent suggestions.

+1
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BIAB, RB 2018(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Izotope Prod. Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, KorgX3R, RodeNGT2, AM802mixer, NS40M Studio Monitors, Pioneer Active Mons, AKG K271 Studio H'phones

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#448348 - 01/01/18 01:48 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Cerio]
Jon Thomas Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 12/18/15
Posts: 172
I also fully, wholeheartedly agree with all 3 suggestions.
_________________________
BIAB 2018 Audiophile edition
Win 7, 64 bit

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#448360 - 01/01/18 04:47 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Cerio]
DeaconBlues09 Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 03/21/17
Posts: 225
Loc: Merkaz, Israel
1. Re: Keep releasing new Realtracks!

RealTracks are great, no complaints here. BTW, what does everyone think about the Xtra Styles Paks being sold at extra cost? I wonder if PG has too much of an incentive to "hold back" with their best/freshest content so they can make some extra bucks.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for companies charging a premium for extra features that are truly supplemental--as in of a different character than the core program features, such as the instrumental studies, or the 101 jazz phrases or what-not.

By all means, PG, develop as much Realtracks as you like, and if you want to charge more for them, how about allowing the consumer to choose the core 202 new tracks they want for their $100 upgrades. I'd much rather have many of the styles I heard Demo'd in the YT vids than the Klezmer and Mariachi. Also the Americana tracks are not all that different from the excellent RTs released over that past decade. For instance, the Rock-Pop 4 styles are a lot more distinct (and more desirable from my perspective, than many of the other RTs which came with the std. 2017 to 2018 upgrade).

You know what I would shell out good money for? A well illustrated tutorial book with a CD and example files where you need to accomplish different things. Sell them as modules for all I care. There is no reason that I, and I'd wager a majority of other BiaB owners, should only be using less than 25 percent of the program's capabilities.

2. Re: No more "50 new features" each year!

I both agree and (respectfully) disagree. On the one hand, I LOVE the features. The ACW, the reharmonist, I could go on and on. Yes, a lot of them have a very steep learning curve, and I'll readily admit that I am barely proficient in 5 percent of all of them. However, suddenly you find a use for a given feature, and it suddenly becomes indispensable.

THAT SAID, the whole "50 new features each year thing" creates a tremendous disincentive for BiaB go 'hoard' fixes and updates that should really be released continuously throughout the year.

To throw out a few examples culled from the 2018 features--organizing the cluttered folders? Saving MP3 in a quality better than 64kbps? Skins? A floating mixer? Support for 12/8, 9/8, and 6/8 notation? These are issues that should be patched as a matter of course, not features!

Examples of genuinely new features (culled from updates over the years) would be the DAW plugin mode, the ACW, the ability to save mono audio as MIDI, the ability to open and save in ABC file format, usertracks, loops that transpose with the chordsheet, etc.

3. Fix the bugs!

+1,000,000,000 (and see regrading 2, above, as they are closely related). Can we drag Realband out of the 1980s please? Get an outside team and a technical writer or two if you must, say it costs you the amount of $ you would spend on developing, what 10, 25, 100 realtracks? Once done it's done, and can be updated relatively efficiently.

Would anyone here not sacrifice dozens or RealTracks for a decent GUI and coherent manual--a manual that isn't just the same one from the last decade with the upgraded feature text copy-pasted into relevant sections...

As a closing note, I would like to express my utmost respect and admiration for the folks at PG music and the incredible product they produce. You guys are cool af, but you need to listen, and respond to your consumer base more consistently (IMHO).

Peace to all, and happy new year!

Deacon








Edited by DeaconBlues09 (01/01/18 08:12 AM)
Edit Reason: A word
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#448399 - 01/01/18 07:51 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Cerio]
jazzi Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 10/06/08
Posts: 36
Loc: Inlet Beach, FL
What I would love to see is a clear, well-written, and concise guide to the most used features based on the 80/20 rule for usability.

Don't get me wrong, I like the program, and have been able to figure out most of what I need, but guides targeted to different types of users would be so useful. I'll wager that jazz musicians are the power users, but people like singer-songwriters might need a completely different entry point, especially with emphasis on simple accompaniment styles, etc.

The basic principle for software usability is that it should be based on making software easy to learn quickly by the average user. That way, not only the 20 percent will grasp it, but 80 percent will also understand. It might take a third-party product to do this, but so far I haven't found one.
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BIAB 2018 Win/Finale 2014/Audacity
Yamaha Tyros 4/Yamaha P-115/Pianodisc Player Piano

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#448422 - 01/01/18 09:20 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: DeaconBlues09]
JohnJohnJohn Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/25/12
Posts: 2163
Originally Posted By: DeaconBlues09
BTW, what does everyone think about the Xtra Styles Paks being sold at extra cost? I wonder if PG has too much of an incentive to "hold back" with their best/freshest content so they can make some extra bucks.

I think these should be included as a free bonus for loyal customers who upgrade every year. I remain unconvinced they are worth what they charge for them.

Quote:
I'd much rather have many of the styles I heard Demo'd in the YT vids than the Klezmer and Mariachi.

I am puzzled as to why so many of the new RealTracks are Klezmer. I cannot see this being a much sought after style!

Quote:
the whole "50 new features each year thing" creates a tremendous disincentive for BiaB go 'hoard' fixes and updates that should really be released continuously throughout the year.

To throw out a few examples culled from the 2018 features--organizing the cluttered folders? Saving MP3 in a quality better than 64kbps? Skins? A floating mixer? Support for 12/8, 9/8, and 6/8 notation? These are issues that should be patched as a matter of course, not features!

I agree 100%!

Quote:
Can we drag Realband out of the 1980s please? Get an outside team and a technical writer or two if you must, say it costs you the amount of $ you would spend on developing, what 10, 25, 100 realtracks? Once done it's done, and can be updated relatively efficiently.

Would anyone here not sacrifice dozens or RealTracks for a decent GUI and coherent manual--a manual that isn't just the same one from the last decade with the upgraded feature text copy-pasted into relevant sections...

I have completely given up on the manuals and mostly given up on Realband. I only use it to generate a few bars if I cannot get something to sound decent in BIAB. It has the potential to be so much better.

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#448424 - 01/01/18 09:26 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Cerio]
J. Larry Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 01/09/07
Posts: 486
Good suggestions all, even tho’ much of it I don’t use or understand. I use BIAB for live gigs only. Love the real styles. No midi here. I’ve learned to freeze all the tracks, so the tunes load faster. No problem, except for loops. Any particular reason why songs with added loops take so long to load and play---even when frozen? Wish that could be speeded up.

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#448433 - 01/01/18 11:25 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Cerio]
Jon Thomas Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 12/18/15
Posts: 172
Here's my take.
I think we should consider that people use BIAB in ways that are radically different from each other. If you are a pro composer, an amateur songwriter, a musician that uses BIAB for live gigs, a music teacher etc. I am sure that these people use BIAB in very, very, very different ways.
I also have the feeling that, for that reasons, many users use just a small minority of the MANY features that BIAB has to offer - but for each person, THOSE features are absolutely essential. I am an example of that. I think I probably use 5% of BIAB features, no kidding. But I am the happiest user in the world (thank you PG !!!!!!)
And yes, in my "ideal world", BIAB should develop only the features I use smile
But saying that would be quite silly of me, wouldn't it?
So, this is to say that we should be very careful in suggesting what is important and what is not, because what is important, or even crucial for you, may be irrelevant for many others - and vice versa. For example, I don't use at all RealBand. As far as I am concerned, if RB was abandoned tomorrow by PG Music I couldn't care less. But I understand that for other users RB may be crucial. I could go on with other similar examples.
So, what's my point, you ask?
My point is that I don't want to tell PG Music what specific features should be developed, which specific ones should be abandoned, which specific new ones should be introduced. I think only the folks at PG Music know this, better than anybody else.
However, there are some GENERAL issues that, I presume, affect most if not all BIAB users. And these are the ones mentioned in the first post of this thread:

1. RealTracks.
This is the "core" of BIAB. I cannot immagine any BIAB user who doesn't benefit greatly from having more / better realtracks. So, my feeling is that if PG Music develops more, better, higher quality, wider variety of Realtracks, all users will be happy.

2. Features: improve / fine tune / develop the features that are already there, rather than implementing new ones.
Now this could be debatable. However, BIAB is SO RICH already in features, that honestly I think that most if not all users would greatly benefit from a fine tuning of existing features (esepcially the ones that don't work so well - UserTracks comes to mind ...) rather than having a gazillion new features every year.

3. Bugs and Interface
Again, this is something that everyone would benefit. Who wouldn't want a better interface and a more stable program?

So basically, I'm repeating what the first poster said smile
As I said before, I totally agree with that first post.

And thak you again PG for this incredible product.
_________________________
BIAB 2018 Audiophile edition
Win 7, 64 bit

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#448493 - 01/01/18 04:51 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Jon Thomas]
raymb1 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/24/05
Posts: 2529
Loc: Sterling, Va
+1 for your post. I too use only a small part of BIAB for what I need to do. My number one request would be the ability to enter 8 chords to the bar instead of just the present 4.
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Asus Q500A i7 Win 10 64 bit 8GB ram 750 HD 15.5" touch screen, BIAB 2017, Casio PX 5s, Xw P1, Center Point Stereo SS V3 and EWI 4000s.

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#448536 - 01/01/18 10:35 PM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: WendyM]
BBB Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 07/17/11
Posts: 113
Hi Wendy,

Let's get rid of the attitude......... Or I may have to tell Pepe about this!! LOL

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#448629 - 01/02/18 11:07 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Cerio]
J. Larry Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 01/09/07
Posts: 486
The Jon Thomas post is spot on, in my view. I can think that, but not articulate it like that. Is it crazy to suppose, that as BIAB continues to develop, that different levels of the product might become available----such as versions/features appropriate for song writers, hobbyists, live play, etc.? Or, might that just create more confusion among consumers? Some DAWs offer entry levels, up to more advanced. Heck, I’d spring for a hardware version of BIAB, if such were possible, designed and built by PG Music specifically for live play-----that was rock solid, with high quality audio, and stereo outputs.

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#448773 - 01/03/18 06:13 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: raymb1]
BlueAttitude Offline
Expert

Registered: 11/30/07
Posts: 1389
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted By: raymb1
+1 for your post. I too use only a small part of BIAB for what I need to do. My number one request would be the ability to enter 8 chords to the bar instead of just the present 4.


Yes, that to me is something that should have been done YEARS ago.

I suspect the reason it hasn't is because that 4 chords per bar limitation must be hard-coded deep within the bowels of BIAB and would require a major rewrite to fix.
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Blue Attitude: Homepage, Latest song: Time Flies

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#448784 - 01/03/18 06:47 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Cerio]
Jon Thomas Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 12/18/15
Posts: 172
Yes, also i think that all or most realtracks would have to be re-recorded. ... unimaginable ...
Anyway, just to confirm how much each user is different,having 8 chords per bar would not be something that I would need, hardly at all ... users' needs are very, veruy different ...


Edited by Jon Thomas (01/03/18 06:47 AM)
_________________________
BIAB 2018 Audiophile edition
Win 7, 64 bit

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#448789 - 01/03/18 06:58 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: Jon Thomas]
BlueAttitude Offline
Expert

Registered: 11/30/07
Posts: 1389
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted By: Jon Thomas
Yes, also i think that all or most realtracks would have to be re-recorded. ... unimaginable ...
Anyway, just to confirm how much each user is different,having 8 chords per bar would not be something that I would need, hardly at all ... users' needs are very, veruy different ...


It's not so much that you need 8 chords per bar, not for me anyway. It is being able to place a chord on an offbeat, i.e. the 'and' of the beat.

Currently the hack workaround is to use the 'push' function so you can drop a chord on the 'and' (push by 1/8), but pretty much useless most of the time because you can't follow it with a chord on the next beat.
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Blue Attitude: Homepage, Latest song: Time Flies

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#448795 - 01/03/18 07:19 AM [Band-in-a-Box Wishlist] Re: My three wishes for BIAB 2019. [Re: BlueAttitude]
raymb1 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/24/05
Posts: 2529
Loc: Sterling, Va
Originally Posted By: BlueAttitude
Originally Posted By: Jon Thomas
Yes, also i think that all or most realtracks would have to be re-recorded. ... unimaginable ...
Anyway, just to confirm how much each user is different,having 8 chords per bar would not be something that I would need, hardly at all ... users' needs are very, veruy different ...


It's not so much that you need 8 chords per bar, not for me anyway. It is being able to place a chord on an offbeat, i.e. the 'and' of the beat.

Currently the hack workaround is to use the 'push' function so you can drop a chord on the 'and' (push by 1/8), but pretty much useless most of the time because you can't follow it with a chord on the next beat.


+1 I can think of only a couple of songs where I would need 6-8 chords in a bar. Your post, BlueAttitude, is spot on.
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PG Music News
Thoughts on Band-in-a-Box® 2017 - Mac Power Users Discussion

David Sparks and Katie Floyd discuss a variety of topics in their recent episide of Mac Power Users: https://www.relay.fm/mpu/432 - listen all the way through (and laugh along with them - it was a very entertaining episode!), or jump to 1:37:40 where David shares his thoughts on Band-in-a-Box® 2017 for Mac!

Thank you David and Katie!

Polish New Features Video for Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows

Our Polish Distributor, Sound Station, has finished their Band-in-a-Box 2018 New Features summary video (in Polish!) - click here to watch.

We hope all our Polish Band-in-a-Box users find this video helpful - thank you Sound Station!

YouTube Find - Love it (with Band-in-a-Box 2018)

YouTube channel EmtpyHallToones uploaded a video of their guitar performance using Band-in-a-Box backing tracks!

Click here to watch.

Get to Know the 202 NEW RealTracks Released with Band-in-a-Box® 2018!

We released 202 NEW RealTracks with Band-in-a-Box® 2018! Learn more about these new RealTracks when you watch our video, Band-in-a-Box® 2018 - 202 NEW RealTracks.

These new RealTracks (in Sets 278-300) are included in every Band-in-a-Box® 2018 UltraPAK, Audiophile Edition, or the PlusPAK upgrade - the Mac packages are on sale until June 30th!

Learn even more about the new RealTracks and listen to demos here.

Vocal "Oohs" and "Aahs" RealTracks Tutorial Video for Mac

With Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Mac®, we've introduced Vocal "Oohs" and "Aahs" RealTracks. This video shows you the different ways you can use these versatile new RealTracks.

Video link: www.pgmusic.com/?vid=zkO-AtAPv4g

You can also listen to demos of RealTracks Set 278: Shiny Vocal Oohs & Aahs here.

This RealTracks Set is available for just $29, and is also included in RealPAK 14: Country, and the Band-in-a-Box® UltraPAK, Audiophile, or 2018 PlusPAK Upgrade.

Video RealTracks for Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Mac - Special Pricing Until June 30th!

With the recent Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Mac release, we also released Video RealTracks Sets!

Video RealTracks allow you to see the RealTracks artist playing that track - you can use them just like any other RealTrack, and you can generate a video which will display the musician playing your song exactly as you hear it. You can also include a chord sheet or notation in the video.

We've added Video RealTracks Set 1: Pop Ballad Band to our Free Bonus PAK included in Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Mac packages during our release special (which ends June 30th!).
Video RealTracks Set 2: Country TrainBeat Band is included in the 2018 49-PAK, along with 40 Bonus UNRELEASED RealTracks, 22 MIDI SuperTracks, 101 Instrumental Studies, and Artist Performance Set 8: Traditional Songs Sung by Béatrix Méthé.

SPECIAL OFFER: During our Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Mac release special, purchase our "Video RealTracks Set 3-6 Special Bundle Offer" to complete your purchase with the remaining Video RealTracks Sets for the low price of just $49! Learn more.

Learn more about the new Video RealTracks and see them in action: http://www.pgmusic.com/?vid=fzkX6jO_hW4

Band-in-a-Box® Version 2018 is a HIT!

Since the release Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Mac, we've received some great feedback!

"The added Piano Roll Window is... WONDERFUL!"
"Adding the Piano Roll Window is a BIG DEAL - thanks PG Music!"
"This significantly changes how I will use Band-in-a-Box in the future."
"And yet again you manage to come up with styles and instruments that we absolutely must have!"
"Great to have the Oohs and Ahhs RealTracks!"
"The RealTracks are worth their weight in gold to me. They really are an amazing invention for music creators."
"Just tonight popped together a quick video using one of the new video styles. Must say the whole process worked without a hitch so this really does look like a great new feature. And what a great teaching aid! "
"Such a comprehensive source for music making!"
"THIS IS EXCITING!"
"The new Audio Chord Wizard is my favorite new feature!"
"This should be great for creating backing tracks for covers."
"Oh wow. This has got to be the coolest enhancement in Band-in-a-Box 2018. This is so-o-o powerful. Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!"
"A brilliant piece of software!"
"What a release!!!"
"THEY DO NO PAY ME BUT if you don't own this you are crazy."
"Been using Band in a Box for years!! Great product for composing. I absolutely love the background vocals in Band-in-a-Box 2018."
"My compliments to the PG Music team who have once again have delivered an incredible collection of new styles and RealTracks to Band-in-a-Box this year!"
"There is still so much to explore and work with!"
"Love the new Video RealTracks!"
"The mixer included into the StylePicker is a great addition."
"Recent retirement and the 2018 version of BIAB is a perfect combination!!"
"The XTRA Styles are fantastic... any future idle music-related minutes I may have had are now totally gone... gonna find that perfect background rhythm on just about every one of my favorites!!!"
"I bought this Band-in-a-Box 2018 and I love it , it is amazing to work with!!!!!"
"...it's educational utility and the potential is awesome!!!"
"I must say, the new harmony options in particular have me chomping at the bit!"
"This will give my students a great overview of what's going on in an arrangement with the different instruments.!!!"
"A musician must have."
"Lovin' the new RealTracks!!!"
"This is amazing software!"
"Thank you for a wonderful tool for both musicians and singers - I can never say enough about this amazingly versatile product!"

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