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#451032 - 01/14/18 03:36 AM [Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)] Re: Amp power: 2 prong to 3 prong [Re: VideoTrack]
Teunis Offline
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Registered: 12/20/16
Posts: 213
Loc: Gold Coast, Queensland, Austra...
I see a lot of advice to take it to a pro which is certainly advice I would heed. Steve wrote about an incident where two guys on stage touched guitars and sparks flew. This tells me it is important that all the gear goes back to one common point. This is particularly true of earth or ground points. Some usually older buildings may have electrical circuits going back to different earths this can create issues such as earth loops, tingling and/or sparks and also increased buzz or we would say 50 cycle hum. For you 60 cycle hum.

Just a thought

Tony
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#451180 - 01/14/18 06:23 PM [Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)] Re: Amp power: 2 prong to 3 prong [Re: Teunis]
flatfoot Offline
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Loc: Sacramento CA

~Wow!~

Thanks for all these great replies!

A few days ago, I remembered that I have a local friend who is my age, plus. I found out he made a living working on tube circuits before moving on to computers in the 80s. He says the thing to do is test and replace all the capacitors. Upgrading to 3-prong is a no-brainer when doing a caps job.

It will be fun, since he will talk to me while he works. I am sure to learn some important stuff.

Thanks for all your help.
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#451286 - 01/15/18 10:42 AM [Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)] Re: Amp power: 2 prong to 3 prong [Re: flatfoot]
Guitarhacker Offline
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#451434 - 01/16/18 02:37 AM [Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)] Re: Amp power: 2 prong to 3 prong [Re: flatfoot]
VideoTrack Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/05/12
Posts: 8049
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Quote:
He says the thing to do is test and replace all the capacitors.

Yes, that nailed it. Let him replace the required capacitors. Their values drift with age, more than any other components.

Your mate will do you a big favor to get that amp humming again. Oh my, what did I just say? crazy
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#452304 - 01/19/18 07:29 PM [Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)] Re: Amp power: 2 prong to 3 prong [Re: Teunis]
Larry Kehl Offline
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Registered: 06/04/00
Posts: 2049
Loc: New Mexico
Not to beat this horse to death ("the horse is never so dead it can't be beat some more") since you are taking it to a pro but consider this a "Oh by the way:"

Here is another Gibson amp and note this vid was posted AFTER we discussed what to do with a “death cap”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TeWF6nHSH08

Go to about 8:37 and he talks about changing it to a three prong and the “death cap” – he doesn’t SAY he will remove the cap BUT you can see it there BEFORE he mods and it’s GONE after he mods.

You can plainly see it in circuit on the left (big black one) connected to ground next to transformer (go to around 8:57) and goes to power switch and by time 10:23 it has been REMOVED completely.

Larry

PS I had a Gibson GA-5 (I was first original owner, along with a original first owner of a ES-125) the model that preceded the Crestlines. They were physically smaller and covered in an almost white tolex I TRULY MISS that thing.




Edited by Larry Kehl (01/19/18 07:32 PM)
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#452307 - 01/19/18 07:43 PM [Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)] Re: Amp power: 2 prong to 3 prong [Re: flatfoot]
eddie1261 Offline
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Registered: 04/08/11
Posts: 4274
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
Would they produce and amp that wasn't safe for you as it is?
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#452351 - 01/20/18 03:59 AM [Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)] Re: Amp power: 2 prong to 3 prong [Re: flatfoot]
duncanwhyte Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 11/19/17
Posts: 31
Loc: uk
More study and its a basic early line filter. Intended to clean up the power supply. Something which now is done at the point of generation, but back then wasn't detected until sound equipment came into being.

Perhaps you might remember some amps which gave out a radio signal? Because they picked it up in their circuitry. Such things are rare as rocking horse doodoo now.

Its unlikely now to find a noisy line in the grid. But quite possible in something like a generator if the line filter on that is poor or faulty.
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#452356 - 01/20/18 04:33 AM [Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)] Re: Amp power: 2 prong to 3 prong [Re: duncanwhyte]
BlueAttitude Offline
Expert

Registered: 11/30/07
Posts: 1328
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Originally Posted By: duncanwhyte
More study and its a basic early line filter. Intended to clean up the power supply. Something which now is done at the point of generation, but back then wasn't detected until sound equipment came into being.



I agree, no longer needed and you will never see it in a modern tube amplifier.
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#452480 - 01/20/18 02:45 PM [Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)] Re: Amp power: 2 prong to 3 prong [Re: eddie1261]
Larry Kehl Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/04/00
Posts: 2049
Loc: New Mexico
Eddie

No reputable designer or company would do it KNOWINGLY but yes they did unwittingly make unsafe amps. And it was almost EVERY amp manufacturer of that era especially when based on 40'5 & 50's designs and before the general use of the "hot, neutral, and grounded" power cord (aka the 3 prong) - with a properly grounded amp folks no longer had to "lift ground" to reduce/eliminate 60 (50) cycle hum .

These early design's were simply done "in a vacuum,", that is they never considered a cascade of failures:

1) a shorted CAP and

2) touching STRINGS, while

3) TOUCHING an ACTUAL ground source or touching a "grounded" Mic or other guitar player whose OWN ground source was at a completely different electrical potential

But these designs were not done with malice and the designers were not not lazy or stupid.

Even today a clean and great sounding amp can probably trace their actual design (maybe even the entirety of it, except for some of the power supply) directly back to these OLDER designs, with very little if ANY modification to signal flow path, power supply rectification, or components.

Larry


Edited by Larry Kehl (01/20/18 02:46 PM)

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#457367 - 02/13/18 11:57 AM [Help! Tech S.O.S (Off topic)] Re: Amp power: 2 prong to 3 prong [Re: flatfoot]
Larry Kehl Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/04/00
Posts: 2049
Loc: New Mexico
how did your mod go?

and while here

This is just an UPDATE (and more "dead horse beating") with a video on HOW to do it (while this is a Fender not Gibson it has similar design with a death cap and ground/polarity switch)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3cX-DwRWIMU

(on this first vid he leaves death cap in and polarity switch in but entire thing has been electrically removed from circuit - he does it for 1) external cosmetics - no gaping hole where switch was and 2) if some idiot wants to revert to original DANGEROUS condition)

and to add emphasis on how to

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEyScfv1Mgc&t=141s

Larry


Edited by Larry Kehl (02/13/18 12:06 PM)
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PG Music News
Video - 202 NEW RealTracks for Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Mac!

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Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Mac is here, and there's more than 80 new features! We've answered some user requests with this release, including:

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