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#451355 - 01/15/18 05:15 PM [Beginners Forum] Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file
Lesley55 Offline
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Registered: 12/14/17
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I tried doing this and only the melody was exported. Perhaps Real Styles can't be exported thus way?

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#451373 - 01/15/18 06:51 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
VideoTrack Offline
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RealTracks are Audio files, not MIDI, so generally cannot be exported as MIDI.

Some RealTracks have RealCharts which is the RealTrack that has been transcribed to MIDI

If a RealTrack has an associated RealChart, it will have an underline (short or long) with its name:


Attachments
2018-01-16_13-50-45.jpg


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#451383 - 01/15/18 07:32 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Lesley55 Offline
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So can the RealChart aid in exporting to MIDI file?

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#451385 - 01/15/18 07:45 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
VideoTrack Offline
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Originally Posted By: Lesley55
So can the RealChart aid in exporting to MIDI file?

Yes, if it has MIDI data, the simplest way is to use these two steps to get your MIDI file:


Attachments
2018-01-16_14-38-20.jpg


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#451386 - 01/15/18 07:45 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Matt Finley Online   content
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In a sense. If a RealTrack has notation (a RealChart), it is MIDI that can be saved to a file. RealCharts are sometimes exact performances, but other times they are just for educational purposes and lack any data for expression, volume etc.
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#451387 - 01/15/18 07:50 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: VideoTrack]
VideoTrack Offline
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Matt has made a very worthwhile point. Don't expect any expressiveness in the data. The MIDI file is likely to just be a manually created transcription.
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#451390 - 01/15/18 08:04 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Noel96 Offline
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Lesley,

In addition to the above advice, it's also possible to set BIAB to save Realcharts as midi by default.

To do that....

1. Enter "Options | Preferences | Realtracks" and select the option I've indicated on the upper image below.

Then....

2. When you save as midi first time, set the midi options to save Realcharts, too.

Once the above two settings are in place, they won't need setting again unless they are changed for some reason.

Regards,
Noel


Attachments
realchart to midi 1.JPG

Description: 1. Setting Realtrack preferences to save Realcharts as MIDI

realchart to midi 2.JPG

Description: 2. Setting MIDI options to save Realcharts


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#451398 - 01/15/18 09:40 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Lesley55 Offline
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If I save everything as midi, will the MGU file it lose expression when it is played on Band-in-a-Box? Or should I have two versions -- a midi and an MGU?


Another question -- I want to make the melody quite quiet (for a play along), except for an 8 bar fill in the middle of the song (I made the notes "invisible" in this section). What is the best way to do this?

I have tried playing around with "settings for current bar", but I'm not sure what the numbers mean, as in "louder per bar" it wants you to give it a number.


Edited by Lesley55 (01/15/18 09:41 PM)

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#451406 - 01/15/18 10:49 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Noel96 Offline
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Lesley,

The MGU and SGU files are BIAB's file types. These save ALL information relating to the backing track you create. MIDI files, on the other hand, only save MIDI information and by saving only in this file-type, you'll will lose some data that was present in the BIAB file.

In other words, if you want to keep the best possible file with the most information, MGU/SGU files are the way to go.

Regards,
Noel
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#451408 - 01/15/18 10:53 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Noel96 Offline
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Originally Posted By: Lesley55
Another question -- I want to make the melody quite quiet (for a play along), except for an 8 bar fill in the middle of the song (I made the notes "invisible" in this section). What is the best way to do this?


In Bar Settings (F5), set the "Melody | Change By" (Volume Changes button) to something like -20 for the first bar in the 8 bars you want the melody to be quieter. If -20 is still too loud, try -30, etc. Negative values reduce the volume and positive values increase it.

After the quieter 8 bars, you'll need to use F5 again to set the melody back to normal.

Regards,
Noel
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#451415 - 01/16/18 12:08 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
VideoTrack Offline
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Originally Posted By: Lesley55
Another question -- I want to make the melody quite quiet (for a play along), except for an 8 bar fill in the middle of the song (I made the notes "invisible" in this section). What is the best way to do this?

I have tried playing around with "settings for current bar", but I'm not sure what the numbers mean, as in "louder per bar" it wants you to give it a number.

If you want Quiet, as in cannot hear it, just choose Mute
If you want quieter, just choose reduce by say a value of -80 and listen to the result (you can choose a value of -127 to +127). Feel free to experiment with values.
Remember to choose Back to Normal at the bar where you want the sound to resume/return to normal.
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#451417 - 01/16/18 12:50 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Lesley55 Offline
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Thanks so much for this information!

When I use F5 and make a change does it just change one bar, or all the bars from there on? I'm guessing the later? But the red outline only appears around the bar number of one bar.


Without this forum I would give up in despair. The manual seems to lack detail about some things. Or it is difficult to find the information, if it is in there. Sometimes I try googling a question, and usually this forum pops up. I found one post that Noel had made in 2010, I think.

I hope BiaB is paying you helpful BiaB veterans because you provide a very valuable service.

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#451431 - 01/16/18 02:16 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
VideoTrack Offline
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Originally Posted By: Lesley55
Thanks so much for this information!
When I use F5 and make a change does it just change one bar, or all the bars from there on? I'm guessing the later? But the red outline only appears around the bar number of one bar.

The change applies from that bar forward. Even though the red line appears at the location of the change, it continues until a different change is made elsewhere (further) in the song.

Quote:
I hope BiaB is paying you helpful BiaB veterans because you provide a very valuable service.

You comment about being helpful is greatly appreciated.

There are many dedicated forum members here. We're all just end-users, simply volunteers. Many have considerably more experience than me, and continue to unselfishly share their skills.

This really is a very great forum, because of the quality of all of the members.
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#451564 - 01/16/18 01:34 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Lesley55 Offline
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Ok, I have got the melody loud and soft where I want it. Thank you all!

As an aside, why is volume referred to as velocity sometimes?

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#451566 - 01/16/18 01:40 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Matt Finley Online   content
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Velocity as it applies to MIDI means how hard you strike. Think of how hard you might press a key on a piano, for example, on a scale of 0 to 127. For most purposes, it translates into volume.
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#451573 - 01/16/18 01:58 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
jford Offline
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Quote:
For most purposes, it translates into volume.


This is generally what happens; however, some synths respond differently depending upon the velocity (how hard you strike the note). Sometimes you get a harsh sound at higher velocities, or sometimes you get a different articulation. But yes, velocity and volume generally are related.

That being said, all MIDI notes have a specified velocity in a range from 0 to 127, but the track the MIDI data is on also has a specified volume setting. So velocity is sort of like volume within volume (or as I like to view it, the strength of the note at that volume setting).

So, if your volume settings went from, say, 1 to 10. Then, if you strike a note with velocity of 127 (the highest velocity), and your volume is set to 8, that's the loudest that instrument will play at volume 8. If you up the volume to 10, then velociy 127 is the loudest it will play at volume 10. You can kind of think of velocity as the strength of the note in relation to the volume setting.

But conversely, you can hit a note with velocity of 127 at volume 1 and it will be very quiet; however a note with velocity of say 50 at volume 10 would be louder than the note at volume 1, because it's all relative.

Hope that made sense, or maybe I made it worse.
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#451577 - 01/16/18 02:22 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: jford]
Ryszard Offline
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Some general, rather than technical, comments:

1. MIDI export defines my work style. I often create the framework for songs in BIAB, then port them into Propellerhead Reason, which is, among other things, a high-quality MIDI-based soft synth. From there I revoice, expand, and massage at will.

2. Jford’s remark about “different synths” responding differently to velocity is actually a patch-dependent effect called “zoning.” It is caused by mapping different samples (digitally recorded sounds) to velocity values. A simple patch might have a clean electric piano sound from 1-80 and a distorted sound from 81-128 to simulate overloading an instrument amplifier at higher volume.

Of course, it can be much more complicated; I have a book on the subject. It is not germane to the discussion, but it’s pretty interesting!

Richard
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#451580 - 01/16/18 02:46 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
jazzmammal Online   content
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Lesley, as you can see MIDI is very complex which is why people who are good with MIDI are sometimes referred to as "midiots".

I'll mention General Midi or GM because Biab is based on GM. GM is the simple brain dead way to work with midi. The Coyote Wavetable synth that is included with Biab along with the Sfzorando synth are both GM. They have a limited soundset and have limited control over the individual patches (instruments). This could be good enough for you and if so stop here, you're happy don't mess with it.

BUT if you want to have much better sounds, more control which means much more realistic sounds then you have to move up to more expensive softsynths like the aforementioned Reason, Sampletank, Kontakt etc. Those are NOT GM meaning you have to manually set each instrument for each part inside Biab, they will not simply play automatically. Well, they might play SOMETHING, but not what you expect. The piano track for example may be sounding a completely different instrument, even drums. Hearing that will cause you to post here in a panic if you don't understand what's happening.

The complete explanation of this is long and complex, I'm just giving you a heads up about it.

Bob
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#451585 - 01/16/18 03:04 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Lesley55 Offline
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Thank you for all this additional information, though some of has gone right over my head!

I am an absolute beginner with regards to midi. I asked about it because someone at the chromatic harmonica forum (where I have been posting links to my play-along videos) asked me if I could supply midi files, so he could adjust the tempo. So I think i just need basic, simple midi for that--a simple midi accompaniment.


I'm going to sneak in a non-midi question: How do you handle a "pause" , that is, an upper semi-circle with a dot inside it, above the staff line. Is there a way to make Band-in-a-Box pause?

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#451600 - 01/16/18 03:46 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Matt Finley Online   content
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That's called a fermata.

One way to do it in BIAB is to slow down the tempo for that measure. Press F5 on the measure and there are two types of tempo adjustment. Then go to the next measure, do F5, and set the tempo back to normal.


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#451607 - 01/16/18 04:00 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Matt Finley]
Noel96 Offline
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Originally Posted By: Matt Finley
One way to do it in BIAB is to slow down the tempo for that measure. Press F5 on the measure and there are two types of tempo adjustment. Then go to the next measure, do F5, and set the tempo back to normal.


That's how I do it, too. If you have a look at the below thread, it might help you understand how to do it a bit better.

http://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=451427
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#451652 - 01/16/18 10:18 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Lesley55 Offline
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Thanks for this information about tempo.
I notice that when you press f5 to change tempo it doesn't have a "return to normal" option (the way it has for volume).

And if you decrease it by -10, then later increase it by plus 10, it doesn't return to the original volume. I suppose you would have to increase it by 10/9 , or 11.111... to get it back to the original volume.

So does this mean I am better to put in values for the tempo instead of percent changed? I have entered "Old Man River", and it seems slow down and then resume speed repeatedly. I'd rather use the percentages so I could change the overall tempo more easily.

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#451663 - 01/16/18 10:53 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Noel96 Offline
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Lesley,

If you are using the % decrease and then increase, your mathematics looks to be correct. This is because the % value uses the current tempo to calculate the new tempo.

That's why I use absolute tempo values in the "Tempo change to" box.

Regards,
Noel
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#451670 - 01/16/18 11:16 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Noel96]
Lesley55 Offline
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Ok, thanks Noel. I guess absolute is the way to go.
My song seems to have got it's brain scrambled and the melody gets out of sync with the RealStyle part way through the song. I hope I can fix it by taking the percent changes out.

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#451673 - 01/16/18 11:37 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Noel96 Offline
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Lesley,

I wonder if this strange behaviour arises from one or more tracks being frozen. (I thought that tempo stood outside of freezing but I might be wrong. It's also possible that absolute tempo stands outside of freezing but percentage tempo does not.)

To test these possibilitie....

1. Make bar setting changes using %.

2. Unfreeze any frozen tracks.

3. Regenerate song.

Now repeat the above except instead of using %, use absolute values.

Was the behaviour the same?

Regards,
Noel
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#451721 - 01/17/18 05:58 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Matt Finley Online   content
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Right; the percentage of change formula is the amount of change over the starting amount. After you change tempo, the starting amount differs.
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#451863 - 01/17/18 04:05 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Lesley55 Offline
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Is there a way to tell which RealStyles have RealCharts? Maybe a way to filter the list of RealStyles?

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#451874 - 01/17/18 04:49 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
VideoTrack Offline
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Originally Posted By: Lesley55
Is there a way to tell which RealStyles have RealCharts? Maybe a way to filter the list of RealStyles?


RealTracks with Charts are indicated in the RealTracks Picker. You can also sort by column.

Also, if a RealTrack has an associated RealChart, it will have an underline (short or long) with its name at the top of the BiaB form (see my first answer to your original question in this thread).


Attachments
2018-01-18_11-48-10.jpg


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#451893 - 01/17/18 06:11 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: VideoTrack]
Lesley55 Offline
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Thanks, Video Track.

I don't seem to have a column labelled "Chart" in my table. But I notice one labelled "type".

The type is either R, RM or M. I guess the M's are midi. I selected a midi style (Country Piano - Country Ballad - S). I dragged the tracks over to the "MID" corner of the box in the upper left. then clicked on it to audition the file. Only the melody plays in the file.


Edited by Lesley55 (01/17/18 06:48 PM)

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#451902 - 01/17/18 07:53 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
VideoTrack Offline
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This is in the RealTracks picker, not the StylePicker:


Attachments
2018-01-18_14-53-08.jpg


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#452395 - 01/20/18 08:35 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: jazzmammal]
Icelander Offline
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Originally Posted By: jazzmammal
The Coyote Wavetable synth that is included with Biab along with the Sfzorando synth are both GM.
Just a minor nitpick, the Sforzando is absolutely not a GM based synth - unless the way you spelled it isn't a typo like I've presumed here and you are in fact talking about a different synth entirely, in which case you might be right.
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#459404 - 02/27/18 12:31 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
jazzmammal Online   content
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I missed this post. To clarify, the Sforzando that PG is including is preset with the HiQ sounds which use the GM convention so it plays with Biab seamlessly as if it is a GM synth.

I know there are several GM soundfonts around that load into the player and if you're using one of those then it's a GM synth. I think what you're saying is it's not locked in to being a GM synth, it depends on what type of soundbank you're loading into it.

Bob
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#459421 - 02/27/18 05:42 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: Exporting from band-in-a-box to a MID file [Re: Lesley55]
Icelander Offline
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I'm not going to argue semantics with you (I refuse to play this game of always being right!), but I'd appreciate if you would at least refrain from telling others what they are 'trying to say'.
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Tutorials - How to Install Band-in-a-Box® for Mac

Here are some tutorial videos we've created to help you install your Band-in-a-Box® purchase.

Our Band-in-a-Box® Pro, MegaPAK, and PlusPAK are delivered as a download, on DVD, or on a 32GB USB flash drive.

Installing Band-in-a-Box® from DVD: click here to watch.

Installing Band-in-a-Box® from the 32GB flash drive: click here to watch.
Your flash drive shipment also includes a Band-in-a-Box® keychain!

The Band-in-a-Box® UltraPAK is available as a download or shipped on a portable hard drive. When you receive the hard drive version, there are a few different installation options:

Option #1 - Run Band-in-a-Box® directly from the USB drive only: click here to watch.

Option #2 - Install Band-in-a-Box® on your computer hard drive, but leave the RealTracks and RealDrums on the USB hard drive: click here to watch.

Option #3 - Install Band-in-a-Box® AND RealTracks on your computer hard drive: click here to watch.

All of these videos are available on our YouTube Channel or Videos support page.

Video - Making A Song in Band-in-a-Box® 2018

Ever wonder how to create a song in Band-in-a-Box®? We start off with the basics in our latest video for Band-in-a-Box® 2018!

Windows users: click here | Mac users: click here

RealTracks Patch Update for Windows Users

Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows users can download the latest RealTracks update patch (519) here.

This patch includes some RealTracks audio updates we have made since the release of Band-in-a-Box 2018. 2018 users should be sure to download the latest Band-in-a-Box 2018 update patch (519), as that patch includes the bulk of the fixes for RealTracks released with 2018. This is a larger download than typical because it updates the Vocal Oohs and Aahs RealTracks audio files. There is more information and Audiophile patches available here.

Summary of RealTracks Audio updates:
Improved: There were small issues with the tuning of several Bass styles. This has been fixed for both the original mix and the direct input mix. This affects the following RealTracks:
- Bass, Acoustic, AmericanaSlow16thsByron Ev16 060
- Bass, Acoustic, AmericanaSlow128Byron Sw 040
- Bass, Acoustic, RockabillySwingByron Sw 190
- Bass, Acoustic, BluesyPopByron Ev 100
Improved: Audio glitches have been removed from the ends of phrases in the Vocal Oohs and Aahs RealTracks.

Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows Patch Update Available!

Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows users can download the latest (free) update patch (519) here.

Summary of changes:
Added: Additional dialog available for detailed information in the StyleMaker (fields for memo, examples, and other parameters). These are set in the StyleMaker (more dialog, a button called "Style Memos etc").
Added: Help Video button Added to the Audio Harmony dialog.
Improved: ABC opening improvements with some accidentals, and leadin bars that occur in middle of song.
Improved: Audio harmonies now used Improved algorithms, and can be easily set using N voices above, M voices below (and have additional functions like duplicate melody, and dup. melody octave below).
Improved: Lyrics will be now read from .mid files that used to be karaoke files (.kar) and got renamed somewhere along the line.
Improved: Support for RealTracks that should be transposed only lower (ie heavy metal guitars) and for future Improved metal guitar comping.
Improved: The Audio Harmony Dialog has been rearranged to be more intuitive when using Band-in-a-Box Intelligent Mode.
Fixed: Audio harmonies might be missing some notes.
Fixed: Audio harmonies would be generated with the wrong notes if selecting a range of audio in the middle of the track.
Fixed: Band-in-a-Box might crash on bootup with error "Read Beyond end of file".
Fixed: Band-in-a-Box should show message if the latest VJT application is not installed when the user tries to render videos.
Fixed: File > Open Special > Open Audio was importing audio instead of opening it in a new song.
Fixed: In the Bar Settings window, "Chordsheet and Notation - Start a New Line" should say "Notation - Start a New Line".
Fixed: It was not possible to record audio using WAS audio drivers if "Output always on" was disabled.
Fixed: Misc. RealTracks updates.
Fixed: Quicklist drums picker sometimes showing too many drums in the list.
Fixed: Redundant flash messages were showing.
Fixed: Removing a custom drums from a track would still display Drums as the name of the loop in the track.
Fixed: Rendering audio while there is a region of bars highlighted in the chord sheet might cause a crash.
Fixed: Saving a MIDI file would fail unless saving as type 1.
Fixed: Some 12-key RealTracks were incorrectly set to allow transposition.
Fixed: The Audio Harmony dialog needed some hints.
Fixed: The Audio Harmony dialog was missing the new Band-in-a-Box Intelligent Mode.
Fixed: The VJT application should print out its version number in log files.

Tutorials - How to Install Your Band-in-a-Box® for Mac Hard Drive

When you have your Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Mac UltraPAK shipped to you on a portable hard drive, there are a few different options for installation. We go over these 3 options with our latest video series:

Option 1: Run Band-in-a-Box® directly from the USB drive only: click here to view.

Option 2: Install Band-in-a-Box® on your computer hard drive, but leave the RealTracks & RealDrums on the USB hard drive: click here to view.

Option 3: Install Band-in-a-Box® and the RealTracks & RealDrums on your computer hard drive: click here to view.

Check out all our Band-in-a-Box for Mac videos here.

Video - Downloading and Installing RealTracks Sets for Band-in-a-Box® for Mac

Have you purchased your Band-in-a-Box® package, and want to make sure you're downloading and installing the RealTracks Sets correctly?

Well, we've created just the tutorial video you're looking for! Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Mac® - Downloading and Installing RealTracks Sets.

Video link:
www.pgmusic.com/?vid=QndXu8H_IwM

Thoughts on Band-in-a-Box® 2017 - Mac Power Users Discussion

David Sparks and Katie Floyd discuss a variety of topics in their recent episide of Mac Power Users: https://www.relay.fm/mpu/432 - listen all the way through (and laugh along with them - it was a very entertaining episode!), or jump to 1:37:40 where David shares his thoughts on Band-in-a-Box® 2017 for Mac!

Thank you David and Katie!

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