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#461035 - 03/07/18 03:43 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: Pipeline]
Mus Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 01/10/09
Posts: 99
Loc: London, UK
Originally Posted By: Pipeline


Type of shot
The type of shot needs to be either 0 or 1. If 0 is entered, the shot will be used when chords are entered with two periods (shot) or three periods (hold). If 1 is entered, the shot will be used when chords are entered with two or three carets before them (8th & 16th note pushes).



OK, that's some great info. I'll have to get used to editing and snappping to bars in RealBand to finish experimenting with this but I can see what is possible.

Bit of a disappointment that Shots and Holds can't be distinguished from one another.

Next step is what if you want a lead in fill to the next bar? Or is this getting too much to ask? :-)

Thanks
M

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#461043 - 03/07/18 05:36 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: Mus]
Pipeline Offline
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Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 2462
Put a part maker on the next bar then bring the drums in only on beat 3 of the previous bar C.d then put the next chord where you want the instruments to come back in C or bring the bass in next with the drums C.bd then all C

That's where a custom shot RealDrum comes in handy

SurfRockDoubleTwo^01-Ride,Splsh
SurfRockDoubleTwo^02-Ride,HiHat
SurfRockDoubleTwo^03-Splsh,HHat
SurfRockDoubleTwo^04-Custom Shot,1
SurfRockDoubleTwo^05-Custom Shot,2
SurfRockDoubleTwo^06-Custom Shot,3
SurfRockDoubleTwo^07-Custom Hold,1
SurfRockDoubleTwo^08-Custom Hold,2
SurfRockDoubleTwo^09-Custom Hold,3
SurfRockDoubleTwo^10-Custom Push,1
SurfRockDoubleTwo^11-Custom Push,2
SurfRockDoubleTwo^12-Custom Push,3

or you can make a generic one for all RealDrums

DrumShots^01-Custom Shot,1
DrumShots^02-Custom Shot,2
DrumShots^03-Custom Shot,3
DrumShots^04-Custom Hold,1
DrumShots^05-Custom Hold,2
DrumShots^06-Custom Hold,3
DrumShots^07-Custom Push,1
DrumShots^08-Custom Push,2
DrumShots^09-Custom Push,3
then use F5 to change to the RealDrum Shot you need


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#461204 - 03/08/18 03:49 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: Mus]
Pipeline Offline
Veteran

Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 2462
Originally Posted By: Mus
Originally Posted By: Pipeline


Type of shot
The type of shot needs to be either 0 or 1. If 0 is entered, the shot will be used when chords are entered with two periods (shot) or three periods (hold). If 1 is entered, the shot will be used when chords are entered with two or three carets before them (8th & 16th note pushes).



OK, that's some great info. I'll have to get used to editing and snappping to bars in RealBand to finish experimenting with this but I can see what is possible.

Bit of a disappointment that Shots and Holds can't be distinguished from one another.

Next step is what if you want a lead in fill to the next bar? Or is this getting too much to ask? :-)

Thanks
M


Let me know how that works for you, if it works good I'll put it in the Tips n Tracks section as Matt suggested.

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#461279 - 03/09/18 05:24 AM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: Mus]
jford Offline
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Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 10440
Loc: Pensacola, Florida
One minor correction is that pushes only use one or two carets (not two or three). One caret for an eighth note push and two carets for a sixteenth note push.
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#461292 - 03/09/18 06:48 AM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: Pipeline]
Mus Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 01/10/09
Posts: 99
Loc: London, UK
Originally Posted By: Pipeline

Let me know how that works for you, if it works good I'll put it in the Tips n Tracks section as Matt suggested.


Will do, might be a while until I get a chunk of time to do it as I'm quite busy at the moment. Thank you for the pointers :-)

Perhaps PG could be looking at making this automatically easier too?

Cheers
M

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#461313 - 03/09/18 09:08 AM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: jford]
Pipeline Offline
Veteran

Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 2462
Originally Posted By: jford
One minor correction is that pushes only use one or two carets (not two or three). One caret for an eighth note push and two carets for a sixteenth note push.


Yes I noticed that, PG will have to correct that on the webpage, it maybe in the manual also.

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#461315 - 03/09/18 09:28 AM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: Mus]
Pipeline Offline
Veteran

Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 2462
Originally Posted By: Mus
....
Perhaps PG could be looking at making this automatically easier too?

Cheers
M


Yes, but not sure how they would do it as each RealDrums has different shots at the end, some have just a few and some a lot of different ones, there's not a standard reference.
RealBand you can highlight the beat/bar/s and regenerate until you get what you need, but BB you have to regenerate the whole track.

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#461409 - 03/09/18 09:39 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: Mus]
Pipeline Offline
Veteran

Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 2462
Here's another option Custom RealDrum Solos\Hits Mac\Win you can also create an SFZ instrument from the same realdrums and use it in Sforzando VSTi on the midi track you can mute the realdrums on the bar/s with the shots/holds then add the midi notes you need in the piano roll on the bar/s that you need the custom shots/holds, then un-mute the realdrums after the shots/holds.

You can try it first with the PG Library in Sforzando > Drums > Rock Kit.

1. Use F5 to mute the drum track where the shots are.

2. Load Sforzando vst into a midi track.

3. In the Piano Roll view in the same midi track, hold the shift+ctrl and draw in a note, move the note up/down until you get the hit you want (make sure you have ASIO or MME Always On in the Driver Settings), draw in more notes if need be.

4. Use F5 to un-mute the drum track after the shots.

You never know the Rock Kit may be the same kit the surf drums were recorded on in the PG studio. You have some FX in the Sforzando GUI to adjust the sound to match the RealDrums or you can add some FX after Sforzando. You can copy and paste the midi shots if you need them again.


Attachments
BB-SFZ-Shots.png



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#461564 - 03/11/18 03:58 AM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: Pipeline]
Mus Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 01/10/09
Posts: 99
Loc: London, UK
Originally Posted By: Pipeline
Here's another option...


OK thanks, I'll investigate when I have time :-)

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#461566 - 03/11/18 04:10 AM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: Pipeline]
Mus Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 01/10/09
Posts: 99
Loc: London, UK
Originally Posted By: Pipeline
Originally Posted By: Mus
....
Perhaps PG could be looking at making this automatically easier too?

Cheers
M


Yes, but not sure how they would do it as each RealDrums has different shots at the end, some have just a few and some a lot of different ones, there's not a standard reference.
RealBand you can highlight the beat/bar/s and regenerate until you get what you need, but BB you have to regenerate the whole track.


I think that PG should do the work you have suggested, instead of us, by merging the various kit sounds in some extra shots and holds at the end of the RealDrums files so that the shots and holds generate sounding like, um, 'real drums'... ;-)

BIAB would use these and the single hits would still be useful for those that have the time, inclination and technical nous to customise.

I think this is a bug that has been around since the beginning of RealDrums and I would class as a definite design fault.

I think you have generously and expertly provided them with some most excellent technical re-design suggestions, Pipeline :-)

M

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#461572 - 03/11/18 04:51 AM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: Mus]
Pipeline Offline
Veteran

Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 2462
I have suggested fixes and improvements to give more control of realdrums for years n years n years but there is usually a ten year delay until PG catches on to things.
That's why I'm always having to find work arounds for so many things.

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#461664 - 03/11/18 04:28 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: Pipeline]
Mus Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 01/10/09
Posts: 99
Loc: London, UK
Originally Posted By: Pipeline
I have suggested fixes and improvements to give more control of realdrums for years n years n years but there is usually a ten year delay until PG catches on to things.
That's why I'm always having to find work arounds for so many things.


Every year I always ask how many GB of extra RealTracks will be sold in the yearly update without the basics being fixed.

Grateful that you at least provide these detailed workarounds, so well documented :-)

M

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#461728 - 03/11/18 10:30 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: Mus]
Pipeline Offline
Veteran

Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 2462
This will give you just a few of the possible options.
Put these folders in your X:\bb\Drums\SurfRockDoubleTwo^

https://www.dropbox.com/s/yb7ficwz8nj1wj9/SurfRockDoubleTwo%5E01-Extra.zip?dl=1

Create a backup 1st then paste this over all the C:\bb\Drums\SurfRockDoubleTwo^ text
in X:\bb\Data\PGALLDrumFolderNames.txt (2018)
X:\bb\PGALLDrumFolderNames.txt (2017)
Code:
C:\bb\Drums\SurfRockDoubleTwo^\SurfRockDoubleTwo^01-Ride,Splsh
C:\bb\Drums\SurfRockDoubleTwo^\SurfRockDoubleTwo^01-Ride-SK,Splsh-SK
C:\bb\Drums\SurfRockDoubleTwo^\SurfRockDoubleTwo^01-Ride-SS,Splsh-SS
C:\bb\Drums\SurfRockDoubleTwo^\SurfRockDoubleTwo^01-Ride-ST1,Splsh-ST1
C:\bb\Drums\SurfRockDoubleTwo^\SurfRockDoubleTwo^02-Ride,HiHat
C:\bb\Drums\SurfRockDoubleTwo^\SurfRockDoubleTwo^03-Splsh,HHat


In the RealDrum Picker > Rebuild > then choose Shot=Kick or Shot=Snare or Shot=Tom1
you can create many different ones with one type for a shot/hold and another for a push. The above demos just uses the same for push/shot/hold.
More can be added to 01 02 03
But to have combined hits the wav file will need to be edited.

Memos can be added to RDPGMemos.txt and info to DrumGrooveNames.txt






Attachments
BB-SurfRockD2.png

BB-SurfRockD2-Picker.png




Edited by Pipeline (03/11/18 10:37 PM)

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#461738 - 03/12/18 01:08 AM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: Mus]
fiddler2007 Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 12/22/07
Posts: 713
Originally Posted By: Matt Finley
Dead fish slap?
Must be a half rotten octopus then ..

For PipeLine: Done, Mr PipeLine, hats off & thanks, it works; behold, you're my man!
But to find time to get a grip on this editing work's hows and wheres is a bit beyond my capabilities.

General PS: This is maybe why PG's BIAB is such a success, just like Windows; they leave a lot of client addressable open ends & unfinished business to fix. So every one jumps in to help out, and IMO with PG stuff quite acceptable, as their pricing is really fair. Maybe here's some business for f.i. you or Bob Norton? - F

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#461740 - 03/12/18 01:42 AM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: 2017 fixes - Drum Shots and Holds [Re: fiddler2007]
Pipeline Offline
Veteran

Registered: 02/05/15
Posts: 2462
Just open up the text file inside the different shot folders then scroll to the bottom and you will see all shots are removed but the one being used.
The first one still has all the shots at the end of the text file so using that drum you will get random shots.
The one with 0 in front is used for shots n holds C.. C...
the one with 1 in front is used for the pushes ^C ^^C

So you can just make a copy of the first folder and rename it to the name of the shot and also rename the text file inside to the same name prefix.
Then just go down to the bottom of the text file and delete the shots you don't want, if the shot has a ; in front remove it to use it.
You can have the same shot for shots/holds and pushes or different just choose the 2 you want to use, one with 0 in front(shot/hold) and one with 1 in front(push).

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