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#465185 04/02/18 12:44 AM
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Could some of you check this out for me, please.
Is it an issue with my system or the RealTracks?

Using BIAB 2018 Build 513, I entered the chords for Jim Croce's Time in a Bottle and selected _CACTUS.STY as a suitable style. Then, when auditioning each instrument via the Solo button, I noticed dropouts in RT 2055; Guitar, Acoustic, Fingerpicking CountryWaltzBrent Sw 140.

To check this I opened another BIAB window and entered a I, iim, IV, V7 progression over several keys and found that RT 2055 only played the V7 chords.
I went back to Time in a Bottle which has some 6ths, min6ths, 7ths, etc. and realized that only the "numbered" chords were playing. To confirm this I randomly altered the other progression to include 6ths, 7ths, 9ths etc. and again only the "numbered" chords played.

This also occurs with;
RT 2054; Guitar, Acoustic, Fingerpicking CountryWaltzBrent Sw 110.
RT 2053; Guitar, Acoustic, Fingerpicking CountryWaltzBrent Sw 85.

I checked out the other Fingerpicking Waltz RTs (very few) and they seem OK.

Best regards
Vintage

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Just a thought - do you have it set for "Natural Arrangements"?

As far as I can tell, "changing" an SGU from what I have inputted to their suggested Natural Arrangement because I have a certain percentage of, by definition therefore, UN-NATURAL chords, like your min6ths etc, robs it of its required complexity.

Perhaps the recorded guitar player didnt record them at PG, which I would have thought a tad odd a) considering that Mr Brent knows more chords than I ever will ;-) and b) these kind of styles REQUIRE subtlety of chording, not just wham-bam.

What happens if you input the chords in English? lol. Do they come out right or are they still not there?

Cheers
ian

Last edited by sixchannel; 04/02/18 02:38 AM.

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Ian, Thanks for the speedy response.

To clarify my previous post;

The RTs are playing over the "numbered" chords, e.g. DMaj7, Gm6 etc. but dropping out on the "plain" chords, e.g. D, Gm etc.

I used the Roman numerals to indicate that on my test progression I had entered 4 bars, C,Am,F,G7, i.e. I, iim, IV, V7 then repeated several times changing key each time, so the next line entered was D,Bm,G,A7 and so on. Standard chord lettering was used on all tests.

Sorry for any confusion.

Regards
Vintage

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Originally Posted By: VintageGibson
Ian, Thanks for the speedy response.

To clarify my previous post;

The RTs are playing over the "numbered" chords, e.g. DMaj7, Gm6 etc. but dropping out on the "plain" chords, e.g. D, Gm etc.

I used the Roman numerals to indicate that on my test progression I had entered 4 bars, C,Am,F,G7, i.e. I, iim, IV, V7 then repeated several times changing key each time, so the next line entered was D,Bm,G,A7 and so on. Standard chord lettering was used on all tests.

Sorry for any confusion.

Regards
Vintage


My understanding is that IF you have it set on Natural Arrangement it will ignore your Dmaj7 and just give you D, ignore your Gm6 and give you Gm and so on.

I really dont get the point of NA - IF I wanted a plain D, I would type in a plain D. If I wanted the maj7 I would type it in and expect it to play it.

I hope someone with more in depth knowledge can contribute here and correct me if I've got it wrong.

Cheers
Ian


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Sorry Ian, you've got it the wrong way round.

The RTs I quoted are playing over the Dm7, G6 etc. but over the "plain" chords there is silence. All other RTs in that style perform as expected as do other Fingerpicked Acoutic Guitars that I tried.

I also tried with and without Natural Arrangement as you suggested, no difference.

I suspect the three RTs are at fault as others I tried are OK.

If someone can replicate this using the same RTs I will pass it on to support.

Regards
Vintage

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Hi Vintage,

I haven't been able to replicate the problem so far, RT 2055 is playing every chord I throw at it.

If you freeze the tracks in that song and send it to support@pgmusic.com, we'll be happy to check it out.

Thanks
Kent
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Vintage,

Before you email the song MGU or SGU file to PG Music Support, freeze all the tracks so PG Music will be able to load and hear the same thing you do.


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Well, i posted this with PG; frozen and all, Kent probably saw it, and no reply yet:

i have some issues with RT 591, Scott Vestals soloist banjo, a very useful one for me in creating backing tracks for (bluegrass) fiddle students.

At times it misses a half bar, often at the beginning of a chorus, re-generating some times fixes that.
Yesterday i was messing with a BIAB MGU exchanging these two styles within the arrangement for a few bars between 590 and 591.

Then when i imported the MGU in to REALBAND (v5), at the style change bars, there where simply gaps at these bar numbers, across all (realband) tracks.

BTW i couldn't edit-access these changes as with BIAB's bar Settings menu. Is there a trick for that in Realband? - F

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Thanks for all replies, will freeze and send.

regards
Vintage

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Hi Vintage,

I did get the drop-outs in your frozen song, but not when I unfroze and regenerated, so I'd say you just need to reinstall RealTracks set 187. I've added a link to your online account.

Thanks
Kent
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Hello Kent,

I downloaded and installed RealTracks set 187, then checked the BIAB directory, all the relevant folders have today's date and update time.

Unfortunately the three RTs are still behaving as before.

What now?

Regards
Vintage

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Originally Posted By: VintageGibson
Hello Kent,

I downloaded and installed RealTracks set 187, then checked the BIAB directory, all the relevant folders have today's date and update time.

Unfortunately the three RTs are still behaving as before.

What now? Regards Vintage


In the RT selector, pressing rebuild and fix, does it show this:

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Biab RT selector.jpg (118.27 KB, 94 downloads)
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Fiddler,

Yes, I did this before opening the .SGU files, same message as you displayed but no joy with the RTs.

Thanks,
Vintage

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VintageGibson,

It would help if you can make your test SGU file available as a Dropbox link here in the thread so that we can download it and try it.

Maybe one of us on the forum might discover something useful for you.

Regards,
Noel


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Good idea Noel,

Have just signed up to Dropbox so I hope this works.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/uisac1hmtcft94h/AADoGDLPBrsJMirvxAGJ_Z0Ba?dl=0

Regards
Vintage

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Thanks!

I downloaded them fine.

When I loaded the files into BIAB, the image below shows what I got. All the files were the same.

Apart from the strange chords, notice that the song starts and ends on bar 115 (#1), the number of choruses is 40 (#2), and the tempo is 30511 (#3).

The same happens with the 'Time In A Bottle' file.

It looks like your file is corrupted. It's rare that this happens but it does occur sometimes.

One way that you might try to strip the potential issues away is...

1. Open the songfile in Realband (if you have Windows BIAB).

2. Save it with a slightly different name still using the SGU/MGU format.

3. Try opening this newly saved Realband file in BIAB and see what happens.

It would also be worthwhile using "File | New" to create a brand new starting file and one that should be devoid of any form of compromise.

I'm not sure why XML is mentioned in the 'Title' box (in the image). Did you save the songfile as XML and then reload it into BIAB and save as SGU?

Hope this helps,
Noel

P.S. The text file read fine in Notepad.

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Noel,
That looks pretty horrible and can only suggest that, since Kent didn't pick this up from the same files that I emailed yesterday, it may be caused by Dropbox.

re New file; I made several new files using these RTs with the BLANK34.STY and others, all with the same dropouts.

re XML; I have never used this.

Have just opened this song in RB using the right click menu, something definitely strange.

I have RB set not to generate tracks when opening .SGU or .MGU but this generated RT's and MIDI, complete with dropouts in RT2055 and its MIDI.
Also, instead of naming the tracks as normal, they are named BB RealBass 0: J_SWING, BB RealPiano 0 etc.

On a new track I generated another instance of RT2055, guess what, no drop outs.

Closed all this by selecting New file and not saving then re-opened from File, recently used. Generated as before except this time tracks are named
BB RealBass 2055: Guitar Acou, BB RealPiano 2055: etc. and only two MIDI tracks were generated.

Files made using BLANK34.STY and RT2053, 2054, 2055 behaved as above when opened in RB.

Tried a few recent .SGU or .MGU files that do not contain RTs 2053, 2054, or 2055; opened as expected with no tracks generated.

Tried your suggestion of opening in RB and saving as Newname.SGU, same dropouts when opened in BIAB.

In a new BIAB file re-entered the same chord progression using BLANK34.STY, then generated the same RTs as _CACTUS.STY substituted RT2055 with RT823.
The resulting .SGU has no issues in BIAB or RB.

This points me towards RT2053, 2054, 2055 as the problem.

I have a couple of work around that will let me move on with this song, but I really would like this to be resolved.

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Originally Posted By: VintageGibson
Good idea Noel,

Have just signed up to Dropbox so I hope this works.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/uisac1hmtcft94h/AADoGDLPBrsJMirvxAGJ_Z0Ba?dl=0

Regards
Vintage


I just DLd your Time In A Bottle SGU and it plays exactly as it should. All those neat chords are present like Dmmaj7 etc.
Ian


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Ian,

Thanks for your help, the file apparently didn't behave with you as it did when Noel96 opened it,(see his post above).

Since it plays OK for you that confirms the problem to be at my end, I'll need to throw this back to Support and hope they come up with something.

Regards
Vintage

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Hi Vintage,

Where is Band-in-a-Box installed to, and where are your RealTracks installed to?

I'm wondering if you have two RealTracks folders, and updated one folder but have BIAB pointing to the other.

If you go to Options - Preferences - RealTracks, is "Use a custom folder location" checked?

Thanks
Kent
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