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#465081 - 04/01/18 02:20 AM [Styles and RealTracks Wishlist] Fix Kevin McKendree Piano Real Tracks
NigelSpiers Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 08/12/04
Posts: 68
Hi,
I really like Kevin's playing but all his real tracks are:
a. Out of time.
b. Have multiple flaws and glitches in the editing and looping of the 2 bar sections.
Please advise when these errors have been fixed.

Thanks & Best Regards
Nigel

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#466737 - 04/11/18 11:55 AM [Styles and RealTracks Wishlist] Re: Fix Kevin McKendree Piano Real Tracks [Re: NigelSpiers]
VideoTrack Offline
Veteran

Registered: 06/05/12
Posts: 8149
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
You mentioned: "But all his real tracks are Out of time."

I listened to a couple but I'm not sure I got that same result.

Could you offer an example?
_________________________

BIAB, RB 2018(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Izotope Prod. Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, KorgX3R, RodeNGT2, AM802mixer, NS40M Studio Monitors, Pioneer Active Mons, AKG K271 Studio H'phones

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#466818 - 04/11/18 06:31 PM [Styles and RealTracks Wishlist] Re: Fix Kevin McKendree Piano Real Tracks [Re: NigelSpiers]
Jim Fogle Offline
Veteran

Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 3853
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Hi Nigel,

One way to get RealTracks fixed is to freeze all the tracks in a song and send the song file to PG Support along with a note describing what bars play the errors and what the errors are.

By freezing the tracks and sending the song file to PG Music Support they can both hear what you're hearing and find where the mistake is located in the RealTracks.
_________________________
Jim Fogle
2018 BiaB (519) UltraPlusPak RB 2018 (Build 5)
Cakewalk by Bandlab - Sonar Home Studio - Cakewalk Music Creator 6 - Audacity
i3 laptop, 64bit Win 7, 8 GB ram, 480GB HDD
Music at: http://fogle622.wix.com/fogle622-audio-home

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#466819 - 04/11/18 06:49 PM [Styles and RealTracks Wishlist] Re: Fix Kevin McKendree Piano Real Tracks [Re: NigelSpiers]
Noel96 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 13326
Loc: Australia
Nigel,

Like Videotrack, I've just randomly tried a few of Kevin's Realtracks and they sound fine to me.

I'd also appreciate it if you could give an example of one that's not working well. Also, please give the tempo that you're running the Realtrack at.

Regards,
Noel


_________________________
LINKS TO MY BIAB/RB SONGS


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#466866 - 04/12/18 07:03 AM [Styles and RealTracks Wishlist] Re: Fix Kevin McKendree Piano Real Tracks [Re: NigelSpiers]
NigelSpiers Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 08/12/04
Posts: 68
Hi,

OK - here's an example of playing out of time:

Piano: 2498
Drums: JazzBrushesSticks by Craig Scott
Bass: 2426

At 165 BPM you can hear the piano out of time - sometimes lagging and sometimes ahead of the beat. When you then slow the song down to 85 BPM the Bass stays locked to the drums but the piano is all over the place.

The looping of this Piano is not too bad - sometimes the left hand goes missing and sometimes the right goes missing but mainly in this example the biggest problem is the Piano is just far too loose to be usable.

Best Regards
Nigel

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#466939 - 04/12/18 01:08 PM [Styles and RealTracks Wishlist] Re: Fix Kevin McKendree Piano Real Tracks [Re: NigelSpiers]
Noel96 Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 13326
Loc: Australia
Nigel,

Thanks for the added information. It helps understand your situation better.

My experience suggests that combining a bass Realtrack designed for use at 85 bpm and a piano Realtrack designed to be used at 165 bpm is fraught with difficulties because either the piano would need to be stretched too much to fit to 85 bpm or the bass would need to be compressed too much to fit to 165 bpm. I would anticipate that such stretching or compressing would lead to very noticeable audio artifacts in the generated tracks.

The above said, and you may already be doing this because I can see that you have a lot of experience with BIAB, it would be possible to set the piano to 'double time' in the Realtrack picker when loading it. This will then fit much better into 85 bpm. Similarly, if wanting to play at 165 bpm, the bass Realtrack could be set to 'half time'. Audio artifacts would then be reduced significantly.

Out of curiosity, I loaded the _RBILYSW.MGU. This songfile contains Piano #2498. I generated the song and transferred the piano and drums tracks to my DAW. I then set the grid on my DAW to 1/16th note triplets to accommodate the swing style.

As can be seen on the image below, the drums align really well with the grid. The piano notes, on the other hand, are often between the 1/16th note triplet beats (I've marked with a red line the part of the track that should reasonably align with the triplet; two 1/16th note lines = 1/8th note triplet). This seems to be true for much of the track and the amount of variation is reasonably consistent. As I see it, this supports what you say about the piano track being loose with timing.

I've reported it to the development team and given the URL of this thread for their reference.

Regards,
Noel


Attachments
Piano 2498 timing issue.JPG


_________________________
LINKS TO MY BIAB/RB SONGS


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#466982 - 04/12/18 04:59 PM [Styles and RealTracks Wishlist] Re: Fix Kevin McKendree Piano Real Tracks [Re: NigelSpiers]
Kent - PG Music Offline
PG Music Staff

Registered: 11/05/08
Posts: 939
Hi Nigel,

I've replicated the issue, and will make sure it's added to the bug list.

Thanks
Kent
PG Music

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#467011 - 04/12/18 09:31 PM [Styles and RealTracks Wishlist] Re: Fix Kevin McKendree Piano Real Tracks [Re: NigelSpiers]
NigelSpiers Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 08/12/04
Posts: 68
Hi Noel & Kent,

Thanks for your assistance - much appreciated.

Kent - please note that the other Kevin McKendree real tracks also suffer from similar problems.

I have also noticed similar timing problems with a number of the Acoustic and Electric guitar Jazz Rhythm tracks. I can be more specific if required.

I look forward to this year's set of new and revised Real Tracks.

Thanks Again & Best Regards
Nigel

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#467767 - 04/17/18 05:39 PM [Styles and RealTracks Wishlist] Re: Fix Kevin McKendree Piano Real Tracks [Re: NigelSpiers]
Kent - PG Music Offline
PG Music Staff

Registered: 11/05/08
Posts: 939
Hi Nigel,

No worries, I put a link to this forum thread in the bug report, so the dev team will see that comment. smile

If there are issues with other RealTracks, please let us know. You can send any song files that demonstrates the issues to support@pgmusic.com.

Thanks
Kent
PG Music

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PG Music News
Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows Build 520 Available!

Band-in-a-Box® Version 2018 for Windows users can download the latest free patch update, Build 250, here.

Summary of changes for Build 520 since 519 (July 17 2018):
Added: Save As style feature has support for MIDI velocity changes if volumes aren’t 90 on mixer when saved.
Added: Support for MIDI velocity changes in styles. Use the Misc-More dialog in StyleMaker to set velocity changes in MIDI styles.
Fixed: [Style Memos etc] button was not visible in the Style Editor -> Misc dialog.
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Updated: PDF Manual and Help.

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Did you know... Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Mac allows you to save the Notation Window as a video? What a great way to share your songs with users, and LEARN from the notation as you listen!

From the program manual:
[Save As] | Save as video
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Note: A special use of this feature is to combine a Video RealTracks (new with version 2018) with the corresponding notation in a single video. This creates an educational video, which shows the actual performance with notation/tab, playing over your chord progression! To do this, right-click on the Master button or one of the track buttons at the top of the main screen and select Render Video(s) from the menu.

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