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#68095 - 03/30/10 07:52 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Science can answer moral questions. ...Or can it? [Re: rubberball103]
Glenn Kolot Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/14/03
Posts: 2296
Loc: Victoria BC home of PG Music
If one needs to "get into it" with political/religious/moral/etc topics, I would suggest this:

http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forumdisplay.php?f=52

They sure know how to get into it.

Glenn

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#68096 - 03/31/10 08:54 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Science can answer moral questions. ...Or can it? [Re: Glenn Kolot]
Axegrinder01 Offline
Enthusiast

Registered: 08/15/08
Posts: 98
Loc: Texas
Glenn: I've been a registered Harmony Central forum member for quite some time now. Yes, they do 'get into it', but not in a very logical and rational way sometimes, and there is a lot of swearing and flaming, etc.

At least here we can discuss some things from our own viewpoints with a bit of self restraint and courtesy. I find the folks here to be a very talented and pretty well-informed group, so i almost always learn something new from these 'off topic' discussions, and that's why I read them. None of my opinions are carved into stone, so I can change them and have changed some of them. I especially like to hear from folks outside of North America to get a more global perspective.

In any event, I'd like to have a place here where some non-music related topics can be discussed civilly and rationally. I don't see this getting out of hand or becoming a flame war, and it would be very informative and educational in my opinion.
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#68097 - 03/31/10 11:12 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Science can answer moral questions. ...Or can it? [Re: Axegrinder01]
bobcflatpicker Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/27/07
Posts: 3350
Loc: WV, USA
Something that puzzled me about this thread is there's nothing contentious about the original link.

There's no side to take. It's simply thought provoking. I just wonder how many people actually watched the link.

Maybe I shouldn't have said it was 23 mins long! LOL.

Bob
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Bob
................................
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#68098 - 04/01/10 02:43 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Science can answer moral questions. ...Or can it? [Re: bobcflatpicker]
Wyndham Offline
Expert

Registered: 01/07/08
Posts: 1019
Bob I watched several minutes of the video and formed an opinion that was neither in favor or against his opening statements.
My thought was that again we have differences on language and the assumptions that are drawn as the basis for the discussion. There again this is neither pro or con, but the use of a subset of a language(science) to frame a context that for the speaker is valid but not to everyone in the extended group.
I wish to point out that even if every thing that he said was a valid argument the other video that I referred to about music and the communication with someone that the baseline of society disallows as a member shows that for mentally disabled, his language context can not be reconciled with the moral/science debate. My conclusion is that as most things like that it sounds interesting but is revelation's to a select group is like a tree falling in the forest, only if the tree hits me in the head does it matter.
Wyndham

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#68099 - 04/01/10 05:03 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Science can answer moral questions. ...Or can it? [Re: rubberball103]
RickeG Offline
Journeyman

Registered: 06/19/09
Posts: 484
Hey rubberball, we would have to ask Buddy Holly that question since he was the one Don had in mind when he wrote the day the music died.

BTW, did anyone ever see Nacho Libre when Jack Black's tag team partner would say when asked abuot his beliefs is "I believe in science." Then, Nacho fills a little basin and dunks his team mates head in it to baptize him. Too funny! You had to see it.

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#68100 - 04/01/10 05:46 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Science can answer moral questions. ...Or can it? [Re: RickeG]
rharv Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 18587
Loc: Marysville, Mi. USA
Just to throw some fuel on this topic,
at one end you have guys like this -

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2010/mar/29/james-lovelock-climate-change

Yeah, I know, look at the source... but then look at the actual source (the guy it is about).
This does nothing to help science. Quite the contrary. The article defeats its purpose.
This is not an April Fools joke, look at the date.
_________________________
Make your sound your own!

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#68101 - 04/02/10 07:59 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Science can answer moral questions. ...Or can it? [Re: RickeG]
rubberball103 Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 02/17/10
Posts: 297
Loc: NW corner of S. Nowhere
For sure. Actually Don McClean asked the question. Didn't exactly say it did.
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- Bud

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#68102 - 04/02/10 03:22 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Science can answer moral questions. ...Or can it? [Re: rharv]
Glenn Kolot Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/14/03
Posts: 2296
Loc: Victoria BC home of PG Music
Quote:

Just to throw some fuel on this topic,
at one end you have guys like this -

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2010/mar/29/james-lovelock-climate-change

Yeah, I know, look at the source... but then look at the actual source (the guy it is about).
This does nothing to help science. Quite the contrary. The article defeats its purpose.
This is not an April Fools joke, look at the date.




Bob:

I read the whole article, and the complete one that links to it.

Personally I think he's one of the few that actually has the balls to tell it like it is. To quote a few comments:

"Humans are too stupid to prevent climate change from radically impacting our lives over the coming decades".

"One of the main obstructions is modern democracy".

"Even the best democracies agree that when a major war approaches, democracy must be put on hold for the time being".

His comments will rile feathers, no doubt, but I'd have to agree that he's right.

We humans are so self-aggrandizing that we cant see what we're doing to the Earth.

Glenn

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#68103 - 04/02/10 04:19 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Science can answer moral questions. ...Or can it? [Re: Glenn Kolot]
jcspro40 Offline
Expert

Registered: 04/16/03
Posts: 817
Loc: Ohio-USA
To answer the OP....no, it can not...and yes I watched the clip....
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#68104 - 04/02/10 04:30 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Science can answer moral questions. ...Or can it? [Re: bobcflatpicker]
D. Tuna Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 06/01/05
Posts: 235
Yes it can and is starting to do so right now....

The Moral Brain


I watched the whole vid too!
_________________________
DTuna

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#68105 - 04/02/10 04:56 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Science can answer moral questions. ...Or can it? [Re: D. Tuna]
rharv Offline
Veteran

Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 18587
Loc: Marysville, Mi. USA
Glen,

No argument that we are not making the earth any better. However, one of the main complaints on the other side is that the AGW movement is a grab for control, and outright saying what he said plays directly into their hand.

I personally think the incentive to cleaner energy has a great monetary reward, and in our history that has always been enough to get some great inventions. Giving up freedom for reassurance from the gubmint just doesn't sit well with a lot of folks..

Then there is the little problem of the non-democratic countires and their surging growth. So if we tax and restrict oil, etc, here - it will just make it cheaper for them. Their concern for the environment has not shown itself to be reliable, so I really question whether it would make an iota of difference, other than our surrendering the problems and associated freedoms.

Oh, and I found it a little condescending and insulting personally.
_________________________
Make your sound your own!

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#68106 - 04/02/10 05:58 PM [Off-Topic] Re: Science can answer moral questions. ...Or can it? [Re: rharv]
bobcflatpicker Offline
Veteran

Registered: 10/27/07
Posts: 3350
Loc: WV, USA
rharv,

Quote:

Oh, and I found it a little condescending and insulting personally.




I read variations of the article on a couple of sources and I couldn't agree with you more.

It amazes me that so many refuse to acknowledge that the earth has always undergone "climate change". It always will.

Does this mean we shouldn't be good stewards of the earth? No. Does this mean we should devastate our economies to try control something that's beyond our control?

No.

Bob
_________________________
Bob
................................
http://soundcloud.com/bobcflatpicke/music-in-the-mountains

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#68107 - 06/15/10 01:35 AM [Off-Topic] Re: Science can answer moral questions. ...Or can it? [Re: bobcflatpicker]
Glenn Kolot Offline
Veteran

Registered: 07/14/03
Posts: 2296
Loc: Victoria BC home of PG Music
Quote:

Oh, and I found it a little condescending and insulting personally.

I read variations of the article on a couple of sources and I couldn't agree with you more.

Does this mean we shouldn't be good stewards of the earth? No. Does this mean we should devastate our economies to try control something that's beyond our control?

No.





I would re-word the last statement thus: "Should we devastate the environment (and our economy) trying to do something that's beyond our control?"

Oops, we just did.

I've been following the Deepwater Horizon "issue", and it's extremely bothersome. And for some reason, I thought of this thread and the following:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2010/mar/29/james-lovelock-climate-change

I'm wondering if James Lovelock was all that wrong. Which reminds me of something George Carlin said:

"think how stupid the average person is, and realize that half of them are stupider".

Sadly this may provide an insight into how this disaster came about.

If during the course of applying science and technology, we can't prevent disasters, how can science/technology answer the original question?

I have a friend (a banker) that thinks that technology will come up with an alternative to fossil fuels (oil) for powering our vehicles (airplanes, cars, trucks, busses). I suggested that his faith in technology is misplaced. The only country that has ships that aren't powered by oil is the USA. One of them was here in our harbour the past few days - quite a sight - USS Ronald Reagan - an aircraft carrier.

Glenn

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PG Music News
Band-in-a-Box® 2018 For Windows Build 509 Update Available!

Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows customers can download this free patch update at http://www.pgmusic.com/support_windowsupdates.htm#509

Summary of changes:
Added: The drop station has MP3 and WMAL (lossless WMA) quadrants added.
Fixed: "Drag Audio as MP3" setting in the Plugin settings did not work when dragging a file to Windows Explorer.
Fixed: "Pause Play until MIDI or key received" setting did not work if using WAS audio drivers.
Fixed: Band-in-a-Box Server was unable to communicate with BB2018.
Fixed: Choosing a drum kit file in the MIDI/Audio Driver Setup dialog would fail with error "Unable to install patch/drum map for...".
Fixed: Disabling "Include 2 bar lead-in" setting in the Render Song to Audio File dialog would cause videos to be out of sync.
Fixed: It was not possible to type the # sharp character into the chord sheet if using a French keyboard.
Fixed: Some Amplitube TGS files and styles were missing in certain installations.
Fixed: Song would stop playing at bar 8 after rendering to an audio file.
Fixed: The Practice Window songs would not load with error "This directory does not exist...".
Fixed: The Tip of the Day dialog was not displaying any tips.
Fixed: The Tuner, MIDI Monitor, and Drum Kit window were always displaying in English instead of the user's language.

Today is the LAST DAY of our Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows Special!

Our Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows special ends at 11:59 PST TONIGHT!
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Video RealTracks offers: http://www.pgmusic.com/bbwin.videorealtracks.htm

Xtra Styles PAKs special pricing: http://www.pgmusic.com/xtrastyles.php?os=win

Xtra Styles PAKs - Order Now... Sale Ends January 15th!

Hurry... all of our Xtra Styles PAKs on SALE, but only until January 15th! Purchase any Xtra Styles PAK (1 - 4) for just $29 each! (reg. $49) http://www.pgmusic.com/xtrastyles.php?os=mac

The recently released Xtra Styles PAK 4 has over 150 new RealStyles for Rock-Pop, Jazz, Country, and 'Folk and Beyond' styles, which work with the RealTracks included in any Band-in-a-Box® version 2017 or higher UltraPAK/UltraPlusPAK, EverythingPAK, or Audiophile Edition!

Listen to all the demos of these new Xtra Styles here, or check out this video: www.pgmusic.com/?vid=Zl_wr47d2V0

It's the LAST WEEKEND of our Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows Special!

Our Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows special ends on January 15th... it's your last weekend to order with some amazing upgrade pricing, Bonus PAKs, discounted Xtra Styles PAKs, and Video RealTracks bundles!

Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows purchase options: http://www.pgmusic.com/bbwin.packages.htm
(learn more about the new features: http://www.pgmusic.com/bbwin.new.htm)

Bonus PAKs information: http://www.pgmusic.com/bbwin.bonuspaks_2018.htm

Video RealTracks offers: http://www.pgmusic.com/bbwin.videorealtracks.htm

Xtra Styles PAKs special pricing: http://www.pgmusic.com/xtrastyles.php?os=win

Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows Bonus PAKs are Almost Gone!

Purchase your copy of Band-in-a-Box® 2018 for Windows during our special, which ends on January 15th, and it will include a FREE BONUS PAK!* Time is running out...

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The Free Bonus PAK includes Video RealTracks Set 1: Pop Ballad Band, 10 MIDI SuperTracks, 7 Instrumental Studies, 40 AmpliTube Presets & 37 Associated Styles bonus and 52 Loops - learn more at http://www.pgmusic.com/bbwin.bonuspaks_2018.htm.

*The $49 Pro Upgrade does not include the Free Bonus PAK, any RealTracks, MIDI SuperTracks or other Add-ons.

Autumn Leaves Video Tutorial - Band-in-a-Box Backing Tracks!

Forum user Lot2Learn recently shared their Autumn Leaves - Jazz Piano Tutorial video to our I just heard Band-in-a-Box on YouTube forum, it's approaching 1.7 million views!

Make sure you watch this incredible tutorial video! http://www.pgmusic.com/?vid=stsBqdo9Svc

Songwriting Feedback - "Why This Forum Matters"

Our Forum is a great resource when you're wanting to discuss Band-in-a-Box (or other PG Music Inc. programs), but it's so much more!

In addition to the different sections we have for our products (Band-in-a-Box, RealBand, PowerTracks, and Other PG Music Programs), there are also places on our Forum to share your songs, YouTube videos, ask for tech help for problems not related to our software, "off topic" discussions, and more!

Forum user David Snyder shared his thoughts on Why This Forum Matters in his recent Songwriting post, which has some great feedback, including:

It occurred to me this morning that it is the group effort that counts. That is, one kind word about another member's song, one piece of encouragement or generous suggestion, might cause that person to write the greatest song ever written, which might then go on to have a massive impact on some stranger's life, cause someone to fall in love, or turn their life around, and literally change the course of history. Because songs do that.

OR, one kind word given to YOU might cause you to write the greatest song ever written in the coming year, and that song could go on to have an impact on untold thousands. Who knows! It happens all the time.

But the point is, it is not about any one of us, it is about all of us, the group.

Read through the whole conversation (and join in!): http://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=447431

...and a big THANK YOU to David for sharing his thoughts!

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