Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread
Print Thread
Go To
Off-Topic
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,129
J
Joe V Offline OP
Expert
OP Offline
Expert
J
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,129
Hi all,

I don't run across them often in pop music, but when I do - I'm always amazed at how well they fit in the spot the composer gave them. I'm sure if overused, they would get boring quickly. I don't play a lot of older standards, where I think you find more of them. (lol - define "older" - say 40's and 50's big band jazz standard stuff - older than the old ones I'm using as examples )

Recently - while learning a few older pop songs, I came acroos these chords in :
1.) Billy Joel - Moving Out (...saving his pennies for some day...), The Stranger (during intro after modulation to E major before returning to Em)
2.) Elton John - The Border Song (during the words "Holy Moses")

Now these are the chords listed in the transcription books I'm using - but they sound pretty correct and true to the original to me.

Do any of you out there put these chords in your songs, or have some favorites that use these chords tastefully ?

Off-Topic
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,089
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,089
When I played in a cover band back in the 80s we used to play "Spooky" by the Atlanta Rhythm Section (originally done by the Classics IV), that had a diminished chord in it.

Off-Topic
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,169
Expert
Offline
Expert
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,169
I think often diminished and augmented chords are laid in there to embellish stuff. Not necessarily written as such in rock or country but often just put in there. One might go to a G7 at the end of a middle eight or chorus then go to a C to start the next verse or alternatively G7 , G+ then C. This rides up nice and rounds the end of the chorus. Sometimes works great even in rock but often it is not written.


HP i7-4770 16GB 1TB SSD, Win 10 Home,
Focusrite 2i2 3rd Gen, Launchkey 61, Maton CW80, Telecaster, Ovation Elite TX, Yamaha Pacifica 612
BB 2022(912) RB 2022(2), CakeWalk, Reaper 6, Audacity, Melodyne 5 Editor, Izotope Music Production Suite 4.1
Off-Topic
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,645
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 20,645
Yes Joe I do use both diminished and augmented chords in some of my songs.

My favorite and the song that got me into such chords is Because by The Dave Clark Five:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxbYxIggR_I


Me, it's not about how many times you fail, it's about how many times you get back up.
Cop, that's not how field sobriety tests work.

64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
Off-Topic
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 18,838
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 18,838
"The Greatest Love Of All" uses a number of augmented chords.



MY SONGS...
Audiophile BIAB 2024
Off-Topic
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 2,254
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 2,254
I don't know how recent you are looking for.

The Ariana Grande song "Break Free" has one before the chorus.

Ciara "Like A Boy"

"This Love" Maroon 5 (I like this song. Check out the Bdim7 Chord starting the verse)

"Friends in Low Places" Garth Brooks

ELO "Living Thing"..always loved that song.

Ironically my kids are watching "Mamma Mia" as I'm typing this! How I didn't start with that one, I don't know.

I remember friends of mine having a discussion along these lines. It turned into an argument...or maybe an augument (that was bad). Anyway, if I'm wrong on any of mine, totally cool. I'm wrong, you're right. I'm not Mr. Theory by a long shot! smile


Chad (Hope that makes it easier)

TEMPO TANTRUM: What a lead singer has when they can't stay in time.
Off-Topic
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,609
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,609
6 Wives of Henry the 8th by Rick Wakeman
I have a 'Complete Anthology' Yes book with the music written out for most of their songs. It includes a transcript of the medley that he did live with Yes for a while (I think it was from one of the live releases like Yes Songs).

Anyhow, that's how I learned to play/use diminished runs and sections; I learned that piece.
Interesting piece to learn if you are into that kind of thing like I am.



Last edited by rharv; 08/03/18 01:56 PM.

Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Off-Topic
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,913
R
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
R
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,913
These almost always will be used as passing note/chords. We just don’t like to hear measures full of them. But as a setup for a payoff chord they are great.

I think David Bowie banged away on augmented and diminished chords quite a bit and it’s one reason, besides the vibrato theatrics, that I could rarely listen all the way through one of his songs. I think he also used dominant 7 chords quite a bit and that added to the musical theatre sound of his songs. I can’t stand most musicals.

Both of these dislikes, I understand, are not shared by many.


Last edited by rockstar_not; 08/03/18 06:56 PM.
Off-Topic
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,913
R
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
R
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,913
This chordmap idea has been a blessing to me in the last 12 years when my songwriting output changed by an order of magnitude. Note how diminished chords always pass into a larger shape and they don’t lie on the main trunk. http://www.readmusicfree.com/images/chordprogressionmap.png

Note. No augmented chords on that major map!

Oh, btw, the way to use the map is to start a progression out away from the trunk and follow the branch in and down the trunk to the root.

Pretty slick!

Off-Topic
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 6,080
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 6,080
I always liked "Steal Away" by Robbie Dupree.

The verse goes:

| A | % | Aaug | % |
| A6 | % | A7 | % |

Note: % used above as a substitute for the repeat previous measure symbol.

It uses the A+ as more than a passing chord, and I hear a lot of pop songs using descending lines in the harmony very well ("Stairway" "This Masquerade", etc) but very few with ascending internal harmony done this well.

Insights and incites by Notes


Bob "Notes" Norton smile Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com

100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
Off-Topic
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,129
J
Joe V Offline OP
Expert
OP Offline
Expert
J
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,129
Great examples and comments. THanks for sharing : )

Off-Topic
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 2,945
PG Music Staff
Offline
PG Music Staff
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 2,945
Really enjoying the comments in this thread. grin Also it's giving me some song ideas which I always love.


Cheers,
Ember
Off-Topic
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 2,732
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 2,732
Originally Posted By: rockstar_not
This chordmap idea has been a blessing to me in the last 12 years when my songwriting output changed by an order of magnitude. Note how diminished chords always pass into a larger shape and they don’t lie on the main trunk. http://www.readmusicfree.com/images/chordprogressionmap.png

Thanks for the share sir..... I've used a much simpler one too:




Steve

BIAB/RB 2022, Pro Tools 2020, Korg N5, JBL LSR 4328 Powered Monitors, AKG/Shure Mics.
PC: Win11 PRO, 4 TB M2 SSD, 2 TB HD, 128 GB Memory
Off-Topic
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 8,021
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 8,021
Poetry in Motion - Johnny Tillotson.
The intro


John
ESI Gigaport HD+
Lenovo Turion II /4 Gig Ram/ Win7x64 be
15.6" Monitor
"The only Band is a Real Band"
www.wintertexaninfo.com/BANDS/JohnnyD.php
Off-Topic
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 3,414
PG Music Staff
Offline
PG Music Staff
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 3,414
While not a top 40 song, a good modern example of a song that uses diminished chords well is "Icky Thump" by The White Stripes. And while far from being modern anymore, Led Zeppelin used tons of them.

Great topic - excited to hear other mentions smile


Cheers,
Deryk
Off-Topic
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,301
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,301
Right from the start



You can find my music at:
www.herbhartley.com
Add nothing that adds nothing to the music.
You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both.

The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Go To

Link Copied to Clipboard
ChatPG

Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.

ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.

PG Music News
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 Review: 4.75 out of 5 Stars!

If you're looking for a in-depth review of the newest Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows version, you'll definitely find it with Sound-Guy's latest review, Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows Review: Incredible new capabilities to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs.

A few excerpts:
"The Tracks view is possibly the single most powerful addition in 2024 and opens up a new way to edit and generate accompaniments. Combined with the new MultiPicker Library Window, it makes BIAB nearly perfect as an 'intelligent' composer/arranger program."

"MIDI SuperTracks partial generation showing six variations – each time the section is generated it can be instantly auditioned, re-generated or backed out to a previous generation – and you can do this with any track type. This is MAJOR! This takes musical experimentation and honing an arrangement to a new level, and faster than ever."

"Band in a Box continues to be an expansive musical tool-set for both novice and experienced musicians to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs, as well as an extensive educational resource. It is huge, with hundreds of functions, more than any one person is likely to ever use. Yet, so is any DAW that I have used. BIAB can do some things that no DAW does, and this year BIAB has more DAW-like functions than ever."

Happy Easter! Holiday Hours...

2024 is well underway - it's already Easter Weekend!

Our Customer Service hours this weekend are:

Friday, March 29: 8-4
Saturday, March 30: 8-4
Sunday, March 31: closed

Regular hours resume Monday, April 1st - no joke!

Convenient Ways to Listen to Band-in-a-Box® Songs Created by Program Users!

The User Showcase Forum is an excellent place to share your Band-in-a-Box® songs and listen to songs other program users are creating!

There are other places you can listen to these songs too! Visit our User Showcase page to sort by genre, artist (forum name), song title, and date - each listing will direct you to the forum post for that song.

If you'd rather listen to these songs in one place, head to our Band-in-a-Box® Radio, where you'll have the option to select the genre playlist for your listening pleasure. This page has SoundCloud built in, so it won't redirect you. We've also added the link to the Artists SoundCloud page here, and a link to their forum post.

We hope you find some inspiration from this amazing collection of User Showcase Songs!

Congratulations to the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!

We've just announced the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!

There are 45 winners, each receiving a Band-in-a-Box 2024 UltraPAK! Read the official announcement to see if you've won.

Our User Showcase Forum receives more than 50 posts per day, with people sharing their Band-in-a-Box songs and providing feedback for other songs posted.

Thank you to everyone who has contributed!

Video: Volume Automation in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®

We've created a video to help you learn more about the Volume Automation options in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows.

Band-in-a-Box® 2024: Volume Automation

www.pgmusic.com/manuals/bbw2024full/chapter11.htm#volume-automation

Video: Audio Input Monitoring with Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®

We've created this short video to explain Audio Input Monitoring within Band-in-a-Box® 2024, and included some tips & troubleshooting details too!

Band-in-a-Box® 2024: Audio Input Monitoring

3:17: Tips
5:10: Troubleshooting

www.pgmusic.com/manuals/bbw2024full/chapter11.htm#audio-input-monitoring

Video: Enhanced Melodists in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®!

We've enhanced the Melodists feature included in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows!

Access the Melodist feature by pressing F7 in the program to open the new MultiPicker Library and locate the [Melodist] tab.

You can now generate a melody on any track in the program - very handy! Plus, you select how much of the melody you want generated - specify a range, or apply it to the whole track.

See the Melodist in action with our video, Band-in-a-Box® 2024: The Melodist Window.

Learn even more about the enhancements to the Melodist feature in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows at www.pgmusic.com/manuals/bbw2024upgrade/chapter3.htm#enhanced-melodist

Forum Statistics
Forums66
Topics81,400
Posts732,555
Members38,443
Most Online2,537
Jan 19th, 2020
Newest Members
danielsk, Mark Morgan, zagrajbarke, Ernest J, Izzy
38,442 Registered Users
Top Posters(30 Days)
MarioD 199
Al-David 132
DC Ron 116
rsdean 84
dcuny 83
Today's Birthdays
(charlie), WobblyGstring
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5