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Quote:
Scott, give us an idea what features you feel are missing that other DAW software has?
1. Flexible signal routing (not fixed to a hardware mixer mentality - many DAW let you use unlimited 'aux' type busses simply because you can use tracks as a bus)
2. Easy to use graphically based, node-enabled automation tools to control plugin and MIDI parameters.
3. Seamless integration of tempo locking (I use this with auto-filters and delay parameters all the time)
4. Sensible plugin use integration, without having to think of 'slots' and so forth.
5. Native audio edit tools that are non-destructive, built in cross-fading capability, etc. (actually, it took ProTools up to about 5 years ago to 'get' cross fading as a standard feature - so perhaps it's not fair to put this one in but I've been used to it since about 2005.)
6. Folder tracks
etc.
-Scott
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RealBand
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Good thanks, that helps me understand what you are talking about.
1. Flexible signal routing (not fixed to a hardware mixer mentality - many DAW let you use unlimited 'aux' type busses simply because you can use tracks as a bus)
Not many DAWs, just one, Reaper. Sonar, Studio one, Cubase, Protools, Etc. all use aux busses like a mixer, only Reaper uses any track you want as an aux buss. While that is real neat, it is not really necessary. Sure it is a cool feature, but as long as you can place effects in a aux busses and send and return is that not the point? RB does that.
2. Easy to use graphically based, node-enabled automation tools to control plugin and MIDI parameters.
This is a good one, and i agree completely. The automation in RB is okay, in a pinch, but really weak. i have tried to use it several times, and can, but it is not as precise, or has far less options.
3. Seamless integration of tempo locking (I use this with auto-filters and delay parameters all the time)
Another one that is good.
4. Sensible plugin use integration, without having to think of 'slots' and so forth.
Again this is a Reaper mentality issue. Sonar, Protools, Cubase, and all the others use synth rack, and effect slots. Reaper lets you route anyway you want, and place sends and returns everywhere, allows VSTi, and VST placement on any track. Really cool in theory, but also not needed. As long as you can route each track to a synth that is the purpose.
5. Native audio edit tools that are non-destructive, built in cross-fading capability, etc. (actually, it took ProTools up to about 5 years ago to 'get' cross fading as a standard feature - so perhaps it's not fair to put this one in but I've been used to it since about 2005.)
Again a good one, while there is the smooth audio thing, it is not a true crossfade feature.
6. Folder tracks
fancy feature that is cool, but you really do not need it often. Look if you are making music in a way that is not one of RB strengths, then using other software to polish is great. I have a ton of wood working tools, and so many are just for one specific purpose. I use what works. My process will work fine in RB, so i rarely jump over to anything else.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB/RB 2026, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 11 , Presonus Audiobox USB96
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RealBand
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Rob,
All of your comments about Reaper are unknown to me. I don't use Reaper.
Tracktion, Energy XT and others (any DAW that falls into the modular category) do allow use of tracks as busses.
I clearly stated in my first post in this thread that the comparisons between DAW software can only really be done in light of the way one composes.
My compositions start with the end sonic picture in mind. Many times; in fact I would say most times, I have the sound, and not the orchestration as my target.
The tools I mentioned - while you call them unnecessary, are to me necessary tools to do my compositions. It's a different mindset, not right or wrong - but the mindset and approach do beg for different types of tools.
To me, the auto accompaniment generation abilities of BIAB and RB are what are unnecessary and I've chosen to concentrate on a DAW that allows me to compose and mix the most naturally and efficiently for me.
My DAW is more like an electronics lab, where one of the goals is song composition, but some other goals are experimental sound design. I'll see if I can find the screenshot of the setup I did in Tracktion that allowed me to beat-box vocally into a mic, split the signal into 3 parallel paths, band pass filter each of the three paths - send those filter outputs to compressors, then into an audio-to-midi plugin, and finally trigger 3 different midi notes on a drum machine so that I had kick, snare and hi-hat samples triggering all from my vocal input 'boom-chuck-tssss' sounds that I performed live. Very fun.
Folder tracks - makes it very easy to comp tracks efficiently. Since I am almost required to comp tracks because I play everything but drums myself, this is a necessary tool.
Now, my approach is completely different than one that would gravitate to Ableton Live, or FL Studio. They would find use of the way I work as well as the PG approach, nearly impossible to accomplish their end goal.
So I'll reiterate my point, that composition mindset is the basis upon which to compare softwares that fall into the DAW category.
-Scott
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I see, that makes sense Scott. I can see where you are coming from. I guess, and no disrespect meant. If the very core function of BiaB, and Rb are unnecessary for you, why do you use the program? I mean that in a totally honest way. BiaB at it's very heart is for auto generation, and it's sound bed is aimed at jazz, rock, country, and other similar genres. It really is a very lacking product for the type of music you make. Is that not like trying to hammer Johns nail with a screw driver handle?
Would not using the modular DAW softwares, and other add on tools make more sense? I dabbled in electronis music for a while and found AcidPro far better. add a good drum VSTi, and a gazillion loops, add a good midi guitar synth, and a keyboard and it should be a killer setup.
I believe the OP was really getting at how other DAW software compares to BiaB/RB in the sense of getting things done from a stand point of what BiaB/RB excel at. So my comments were somewhat aimed sideways to yours. Sorry if I sounded badly. When i said unnecessary i mean from a basic point of construction of what most folks do here. I do agree that everything you mentioned is a cool feature, but in the general sense of things you can get by without them really. But maybe not in your world, since you create music completely different from the majority here would do.
Me personally if I were to go back to creating trance, electronica, soundscapes, and other similar types of music, BiaB would be the last program i would i attempt to use.
I would love to see that screenshot if you find it. Talk a bit more about how BiaB fits in if at all, that might be interesting.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB/RB 2026, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 11 , Presonus Audiobox USB96
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Rob here is the discussion thread at KVR from 2005 where I tried it out and a couple folks grabbed the idea and ran with it. There's a screenshot in one of Modulr's post that shows his signal routing about 1/2-way down the first page of the thread. http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=88341&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0he also has an .mp3 demo of his results which is really cool. Regarding the auto-arrangment capabilities of PG products, there really is no other comparable alternative. My link in that thread is long dead. Again, this was 2005 time frame.
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These types of conversations are great, i learn form others in how they make their music. So much to learn, and so much to remember.
HP Win 11 12 gig ram, Mac mini Sonoma with 16 gig of ram, BiaB/RB 2026, Reaper 7, Harrison Mixbus 11 , Presonus Audiobox USB96
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RealBand
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Quote:
These types of conversations are great, i learn form others in how they make their music. So much to learn, and so much to remember.
I don't know if you were able to find the .mp3 demo link that Modlur made in the thread, here it is:
http://nelson.textdrive.com/~modulr/temp/ModuLR-KTBeatBoxDemo.mp3
Even though it sounds like he is beat-boxing over top of an existing drum beat, that's not the case. The kick snare and hi-hat sounds are playing as a result of his beat boxing.
One of the things that I get tremendous satisfaction out of is helping others do something I really couldn't do skillfully, but that they couldn't do by themselves immediately. This is one such example
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