these might be true in RB too, but right now I'm using PT x64, preparing a show for streaming, and I've noticed two things I've never seen before in all the years of using PT and RB in exactly the same way:
Before I describe the problem, I should describe my setup, and how I use it. My gear is rack mounted, and it all goes to a mixer, which then goes to an audio interface for streaming. The only thing that connects the gear together is serial MIDI cables used for sending embedded patch changes and continuous controller messages in each sequence to set up the patches and FX for each song so I can move through my set hands free.
I go to a lot of trouble to make sure that the volume of each device and each track and each song is consistent, much like mastering an album... through many iterations I play and record the set, making tweaks at each pass.
I noticed today that two things are causing unexpected variations:
1) if I move the master volume slider in PT, somehow it is changing the master volume on my vocal processor. Which blows my mind, since the only thing that slider should affect is the backing tracks. CC7 is the controller I use to change the output volume for the TC Helicon vocal processor. Maybe a change was made in the program so that a CC7 controller is executed across all MIDI channels when the master volume slider is moved? But it's messing me up.
2) The other new problem is that MIDI controllers embedded throughout each song to turn FX on and off have started randomly changing locations in the song.
When I enter a location for an event to occur, PT (sometimes) changes the number to something wayyyy outside the range of the song, so the change never executes at all because the song ends before that bar is reached. I click on the event to edit it, and as soon as I click on it, the event editor shows the correct number... but as soon as I start the song again, it reverts back to some crazy large bar number. Even when I find it, I can't fix it because PT changes it back to the incorrect value for some reason.
I have actually seen this in the past, but not very often. Maybe because I've had PT open all day every day for practicing it's more likely to happen?
This usually happens near the end of the song, when I'm turning reverb off so I can talk to the audience. It might have something to do with running chord wizard, because that creates a section of bars (the song) that are mapped to a different tempo than the rest of the bars in a song? Since I'm picking a bar near where the tempo might be dramatically different, is there any way the algorithm could get it wrong? (grasping at straws here)
Anyway, my workaround is to close the program, reopen and make changes. but.... potential is high to make last minute edits to the CC events, and fail to catch it before a show.
I just checked RB 2021, and the master volume slider does the same thing. Maybe somebody asked for this feature so they could raise or lower the volume of everything in their signal chain without changing the mix. I can actually see the value in that. But if I haven't got the mix nailed yet, and hoped to use the master slider to reduce just the backing trax, I need a plan B.
Fortunately, I'm a plan B kind of guy, and this won't stop me. I'll just make sure the master volume is maxed out for every song, then use the track sliders to get the song mix where I need it. I just thought I'd mention this, since I never noticed it before. If its a feature, then great. But if its a bug, you should know its happening.
Speaking as somebody who uses continuous controllers in every song, changing a slider to send a global CC across all channels seems like a disaster waiting to undermine years of work I've put into my sequences. If this is in fact a design.. are there any other buttons or sliders that send global MIDI commands? It would be useful to know about them in advance, and not learn about them in the middle of a song when a parameter changes unexpectedly.
Question 1. - Is your vocal processor set to receive on a given MIDI channel? Or is it receiving all channels? If a given channel, which one?
Chasing down MIDI and which device is listening to what channel, and what 'Thrus' are enabled along the way can get complicated if you have a bunch of stuff hooked up.
Question 2. - I have no idea. Haven't ever experienced it, and can't imagine what would possibly cause that.
Make your sound your own! .. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
Question 1. - Is your vocal processor set to receive on a given MIDI channel? Or is it receiving all channels? If a given channel, which one?
All devices are set to receive CC data on a unique channel. This one receives on channel 4
Originally Posted By: rharv
Chasing down MIDI and which device is listening to what channel, and what 'Thrus' are enabled along the way can get complicated if you have a bunch of stuff hooked up.
Question 2. - I have no idea. Haven't ever experienced it, and can't imagine what would possibly cause that.
I think CC7 is a common controller for master volume command. I'll do a test on all of my devices to see if any other devices are being affected by the volume slider. At the moment the VoiceLive is the only device I have turned on that uses CC data to control volume.
update: my TC Helicon voiceworks uses CC87 to control master volume. It was not affected by the slider in Power tracks/Real Band
My Behringer VAMP PRO does use CC7 as master volume, and it was indeed affected in the same way by the volume slider. The VAMP is set to Midi channel 1, So it looks like the slider is sending a CC7 across all channels every time it's moved.
I have to believe this was added recently by request, as I would have encountered this before if it had been true in previous versions. If so, just knowing this is the new normal is enough for me. I know how to work around it now that I know its there. I have to admit , the ability to reduce other devices in synch with the backing tracks is potentially useful and pretty clever.
I tested the volume slider back to version 12, and they all output Midi CC 7 volume changes from that volume slider, so it seems like it's something that's always been there. As for problem # 2, could you record a screen capture video of the problem and send it to us at support@pgmusic.com?
I tested the volume slider back to version 12, and they all output Midi CC 7 volume changes from that volume slider, so it seems like it's something that's always been there. As for problem # 2, could you record a screen capture video of the problem and send it to us at support@pgmusic.com?
Interesting to note that its been there for years, but it explains another of my unexplained mysteries that drove me nuts for years. The other device that uses CC7 is my old guitar processor, and I had a long-standing problem of not being able to come back to the same volume settings in my guitar patches. It was obvious that SOMETHING was globally changing the volume of all patches from one performance to the next, and I couldn't figure out what was doing it. Now I know.
More interesting is that my solution was to embed an initializing CC7 at the start of every song, which overrode any temporary volume change that was being introduced by the mystery problem.
I discovered it this time because my new vocal processor uses CC7, and it was obvious just from having the mic and headphones on while changing settings that the mic volume changed dramatically when I moved that slider.
The good news is that I can use the same solution that worked for the guitar processor: embed initializing CC7s that override any accidental changes made by moving the slider. As long as I know what the rules are, I'm willing to jump through any hoops as long as they yield predictable and controllable results.
Thanks to all of you who work so hard at keeping the customers questions answered. We appreciate it.
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