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Does anybody here use the services of a booking agent? (now or in the past)
If so, do you think it was a good deal? Did they take too big a cut?
Did they book you in places you didn't want to play?
Did they book you too often? Or not enough?
Was it an exclusive agreement that kept you from booking yourself without having to pay them a cut?
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If so, do you think it was a good deal? Did they take too big a cut?
15% - worth it.
Did they book you in places you didn't want to play?
Yup.
Did they book you too often? Or not enough?
Enough.
Was it an exclusive agreement that kept you from booking yourself without having to pay them a cut?
Nope.
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"Does anybody her use the services of a booking agent? (now or in the past)"
We used several back in the day....plus during the 60's a buddy and I formed an agency and booked a lot of garage bands -- mostly by getting exclusive deals with fraternities.
"If so, do you think it was a good deal? Did they take too big a cut?"
We paid 15% and that's also what our agency charged.
"Did they book you in places you didn't want to play?"
Nope 'cause they knew we wouldn't accept it. We all had day jobs and only wanted the fun gigs, i.e., those that had audiences who were there for the music.
"Did they book you too often? Or not enough?"
All we wanted.
"Was it an exclusive agreement that kept you from booking yourself without having to pay them a cut?"
We could book ourselves with the exception of festivals.
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based on these responses, I gather you both had a positive experience with booking agents.
Paying 15% Seems like a no-brainer to me. 85% of something is better than 100% of nothing any day.
The only way it wouldn't make sense is if they signed you to an exclusive agreement then didn't make any effort to book you, but demanded 15% of gigs you booked yourself.
It has always seemed to me that most musicians are not good businessmen. Those who are do OK, but the rest probably ought to have an agent.
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I've been on both sides. The Vegas show group was signed exclusively with MusArt Corp. One time there was a cancellation or something and we had an open week in the middle of a tour. The agent gave us permission to find something ourselves, otherwise no. Later I wound up in Calgary and was a sub-agent with one of the largest agencies in Western Canada. I brought a lot of groups up from the States for summer tours.
My experience was with the upper class agencies, one step below the big concert promoters. Both companies had lots of good exclusive class A rooms for bands to play and that's the key. So yes, it was worth it. If your agent has those kinds of accounts, they'll keep you busy but I don't know if that means nice clubs or hotel lounges like I played or if those rooms are gone and it's more corporate stuff and festivals now.
Bob
Biab/RB latest build, Win 11 Pro, Ryzen 5 5600 G, 512 Gig SSD, 16 Gigs Ram, Steinberg UR22 MkII, Roland Sonic Cell, Kurzweil PC3, Hammond SK1, Korg PA3XPro, Garritan JABB, Hypercanvas, Sampletank 3, more.
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Does anybody here use the services of a booking agent? (now or in the past)
Yes two, one of the best and one of the worst........
If so, do you think it was a good deal? Did they take too big a cut?
10 % definately worth it for the good one
Did they book you in places you didn't want to play?
Yes the bad one did
Did they book you too often? Or not enough?
not often enough
Was it an exclusive agreement that kept you from booking yourself without having to pay them a cut?
No
Most of the work I did 20 odd years ago was repeat bookings.
I did find that the decent agent who was well known all over Scotland tended to get much higher fees than I could get myself, and if there was any problem getting paid, he'd pay you himself and fight with the client
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The bands I played in were self booking bands. Initially, we approached an agent who didn't want to handle us because we were too country and we played a bunch of rock too so they didn't know how to represent us.... country or rock? It never occurred to them to book us as both. They said to be successful we had to be one or the other... not both.
So they refused to book us.
We started booking ourselves and before long had a good following and numerous clubs that were booking us at decent rates. Out of nowhere the agent called and wanted to represent us now because he had heard good things about us. We declined the offer this time. I think we did eventually play one gig that the agent had booked as a favor to him. We knew him as a friend and a fellow musician and he needed to fill a booking when a band he had booked there was unable to make the gig..... We had the date open and played it. His band, and the bands he represented were the ones that had the 8x10 glossy photos in matching suits and tuxes..... we were a bluejeans and T-shirts and cowboy hats type of band..... so we continued to do our own booking throughout. I handled the band's booking and got us into some of the biggest regional band venues in the state.
I called one place and the drummer said "man, that club is where the big bands play.... they won't even talk to us".... but I called anyway. The owner answered the phone and after a few minutes said "I've never even heard of your band"... to which I replied... "I never heard of your club either until tonight".....to which he said..."I'll give you this son, you got guts and spunk...tell you what... you can play a one hour audition for free on a Wed night.... If I like you I book you at my standard rates and if I don't, you don't call me again"... to which I replied.... "Deal!"... the rest, as they say, was history. We rocked that place numerous times until it closed. BTW: he did pay us for that audition because the place was kinda full and he asked us if we would mind playing a second set.... so we did and he paid us plus gave us several weekends of bookings to start.
I stayed on the phone with clubs and managed to keep our band booked. In addition to the weekend jobs, we played week day gigs as well. We averaged 20 to 25 gigs a month so we essentially were a full time band. I recall one time where we played 21 days in a row and had a few days off before we were back into a 10 day stint..... no booking agent would have been able to keep our band working like I did. Having a military base near the town, which, at the time used live bands on week nights really helped too, but hard work, lots of phone calls and a "go get it" attitude was what we used to keep our band working.
Last edited by Guitarhacker; 01/02/15 03:50 AM.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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I've had good and bad experiences with agents. Most of them are good, but like anything, you have to watch out for the bad ones. When I was on the road, we had an exclusive with an agency who charged 15%. They kept us booked for a couple of years as much as we wanted (50 weeks/year) but that was a long time ago. Since then I've worked with a few good and bad agencies, but not an exclusive with any one of them. I would sign an exclusive if they had enough work to keep me booked 48 consecutive weeks a year (I like a little longer vacation now). Around here, for small groups, there is no agency that can offer us even 30 weeks per year so we self-book and use the agents when they have something for us. They now take 20%. The thing to note is that in the case of small acts and night clubs, the agency will collect the fee from you, but they work for the club. They want to please the club owner so that he/she always comes back to the same agency for entertainment. Decisions will be made in favor of the club. That means they don't want to mis-book you into a room that isn't appropriate for your group. It could mean the loss of the room. I've had it happen though, and when I was in a disco band they booked us into a redneck bar because the bar was stuck for new-year's eve entertainment. It wasn't pleasant but not as bad as the Blues Brothers movie  We had another were we were booked for the season at a Hyatt playing pop music for the 40 and up crowd. The bar receipts were good, and the bartenders said business was much better than usual. A new F&B manager came in and wanted jazz instead of pop and canned us with 5 weeks to go on the contract so he could have a jazz band. The agency didn't fight it, and put a jazz band in. He scrounged up a couple of one-nighters for us, but we were out a lot of money, and since our contract was with the agency and not the Hyatt, we were just stuck. But those are the exceptions to the rule. All and all our relationship with agencies has been good. We do our best to be cooperative with the club managers, we show up a little early, don't take long breaks, and play to the audience unless the manager asks for something different. If he/she does we tactfully let him know our position but also say we are happy to play what he/she wants. We know we are hired sub-contractors. But we would do that whether an agency booked us or we put ourselves in. My best advice would be not to sign an exclusive unless there was a minimum amount of bookings guaranteed to you in the contract (whatever you are comfortable with). When you go to the gig, do not solicit other gigs bypassing the agency. Ask for agency business cards, write your band's name on the back, and have them go through the agency. The agent that put you in the club has the right for all the other gigs that you generate while representing that agency. This will work out with more bookings for you in the long run. Insights and incites by Notes
Bob "Notes" Norton  Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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Hi Pat.
Back in the day, we used three different agents at the same time. We paid 15% rather than go with a single agent which would have been 12%, but we never stopped working.
Many of the venues would have an arrangement with a particular agent who supplied all their acts, but by using multiple agents we never found a club we couldn't play at.
In my experience, a good agent is invaluable - it takes away a lot of work and stress and lets you concentrate on the music.
ROG.
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there is a series of books that helps creative people get published...
THE ARTIST'S MARKET
THE WRITER'S MARKET
THE CARTOONISTS MARKET
THE MUSICIAN'S MARKET
etc
they consist of nothing but contact information for publishers who pay for creative content. Typically they also include hints on how to present work to the different places, since the New Yorker prefers a different type of cartoon than Penthouse for example.
It would be awesome if there were regional versions of information with contact info for venues that hire live music. Those of you who book your own bands, put that idea in the back of your thinking. When you get to the point where you don't want to perform anymore, you may be able to sell such contact lists to up & coming bands who have talent but no gigs.
Around here there are free weekly newspapers that are typically in racks outside supermarkets and restaurants. They advertise the arts, including the local live music scene. I've been going through them every week laboriously creating call lists of places that offer live music, but I wish there was an easier way.
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As I read through the comments, a couple of things stand out.
1) those who have used booking agents did so at a time when live music was in its heyday
2) they were asking the agent to book a full band at established venues
<REALITY CHECK>
___Solo act. Backing tracks. 2015. Restaurants.
</REALITY CHECK>
Given the recurring complaint among musicians that they can't get work, you'd think the agent concept would have evolved with the market. And they probably have, but more along the lines of booking bands who used to be famous, but who now have niche appeal outside the mainstream.
Its looking like there isn't going to be an easy way to get gigs without having to wear yet another hat and get out there knocking on doors. ;-(
But A man's gotta do what a man's gotta do...
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There was an agency in the VA Beach area.... Southern Orchestras ...I think was their name.... we wanted to have them represent us but they wanted the band to be established and working for a certain period of time before they would touch the act.
By the time we met that requirement, we had established ourselves into a lucrative market where as we played a gig, we would simply schedule additional gigs at the same venue.
One cool gig that SO offered was a 30 day gig at Club Gitmo in Cuba.... on the military base there. Several local bands had done it and claimed it was a vacation more than anything..... laying in the sun all day, free food at the various officer & enlisted dining halls.....playing a few nightly gigs a week.... being there for 30 days and ...well... the pay was kinda slim, but hey....what a tan!!!!
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Here are 10 places that can help an act get on-line gigging info: http://www.hypebot.com/hypebot/2010/09/10-resources-that-help-musicans-book-gigs-online.htmlProbably the best way is to start going out to all the places that have live music in your general area (or used to) and check it out and then talk to the manager. It seems you still have time getting the whole act together, so build some relationships now. Are you going to do any on-line sets (like at streetjelly) to get ready?
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I absolutely hate knocking on doors and doing cold calls. I did it in the beginning, because that's what it took. But it's so time consuming.
When you do a cold call and everything in the club is OK, you are just another pesky salesman that the manager doesn't have time for. After all, a waitress called in sick, the beer distributor screwed up the invoice, the ice machine is on the fritz and a zillion other things are going wrong.
So you knock on 100 or so doors.
Then you knock on the door just after the manager had a band catastrophe. They broke up, got sick, or drove away customers. Then you are the hero - and you get the gig.
That's how we started back in 1985. Was lucky enough to book slow summer seasons on cruise ships (we lasted 3 years on a 3 week contract and quit when we got tired of living on board). This helped us build up a client base in South Florida during our 3 month vacation (that was typical on cruise ships back then).
I haven't done a cold call in well over 15 years now. It's all repeat business, referrals, and the occasional agency gig.
Agents are having just as hard a time getting gigs as we musicians are. More and more clubs are going DJ, TV-Land (sports bars), Karaoke, Open Mic Night, and so on.
Plus people don't go out as much as they used to. With wide screen TVs, 7.1 surround sound, and a Cable bill that can easily run $300, they get entertained at home.
Thanks to the fact that we are lucky enough to have enough talent and professionalism to get repeat business, we've been doing some gigs for over 20 years now (they may only book a few parties per year, but there are a lot of them).
Once you get the commercial gig, think like the club owner/manager. Pretend you get a piece of every dollar that goes in the cash register. Make all your decisions that way, whether it means skipping breaks, being nice to a nasty customer, or playing the favorite song of the regular customer as soon as they are settled in.
If doing a private party gig, think like you are the host or hostess, and do everything you can to make sure the guests have a good time. They will complement the host/hostess on the entertainment choice, and you will get the repeat gig.
And of course, send your resume to the local agencies. Create an agent-only website (with no contact information) so they can show you off to prospective customers without giving away your personal contact (some people will try to side-step the agency for a better deal). Do your best job, don't cause trouble for the agency (be nice even if the manager is not), and pay their commission promptly. They are trying to make a living too.
There is a little work to go around, the other acts your size are your competition, you have to simply do a better job than the rest to get repeat business.
Insights and incites by Notes
Bob "Notes" Norton Norton Music
https://www.nortonmusic.com
100% MIDI Super-Styles recorded by live, pro, studio musicians for a live groove
& Fake Disks for MIDI and/or RealTracks
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Agents I worked with are slimy vermin that crawl in the mud at the bottom of a dirty river. Some were okay, but a few tried to make acts sign that they will book only through them. NEVER sign that deal. Demand that they book you on a job by job basis, where you have right of first refusal. That keeps you out of Bob's Country Bunker.
As far as concerns about recorded backing tracks, agents will book you to go play spoons with your dirty feet on the sidewalk in front of a homeless shelter as long as they get 15% of what you get paid. The downside is that they will try to coerce you into taking such an awful gig. (see: "vermin" above)
Just make sure you are not bound solely to them, demand a contract for every job they get you with numbers clearly stated. No percentages. Numbers. "Artist will be paid $350. Agent commission will be $52.50." That protects you if the client offers to tip you $100. That is over and above your fee and the vermin, er, agent is not entitled to 15 of those dollars.
I am using the new 1040XTRAEZ form this year. It has just 2 lines.
1. How much did you make in 2023?
2. Send it to us.
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Its looking like there isn't going to be an easy way to get gigs.
Also make sure you have an absolutely flawless and pristine demo DVD. I suggest you record the music in your home studio, then make a deal with a local bar or some kind of hall (VFW, Eagles....) to set up for a video and lip sync to that perfectly recorded demo as you record the video. I only suggest lip sync for the demo video so you can do it in as few takes as possible. If you play live and you screw it up you have to start over every time. If the sound is mixed correctly to the video nobody will know you are not playing live.
I am using the new 1040XTRAEZ form this year. It has just 2 lines.
1. How much did you make in 2023?
2. Send it to us.
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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Update Your PowerTracks Pro Audio 2024 Today!
The Newest RealBand 2024 Update is Here!
The newest RealBand 2024 Build 5 update is now available!
Download and install this to your RealBand 2024 for updated print options, streamlined loading and saving of .SGU & MGU (BB) files, and to add a number of program adjustments that address user-reported bugs and concerns.
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Did you know... not only can you download your Band-in-a-Box® Pro, MegaPAK, or PlusPAK purchase - you can also choose to add a flash drive backup copy with the installation files for only $15? It even comes with a Band-in-a-Box® keychain!
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Handy flash drive tip: Always try plugging in a USB device the wrong way first? If your flash drive (or other USB plug) doesn't have a symbol to indicate which way is up, look for the side with a seam on the metal connector (it only has a line across one side) - that's the side that either faces down or to the left, depending on your port placement.
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows® Today!
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows for free with build 1111!
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