Changing instrument of a RealStyle?

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It's a simple question and hopefully there's a simple answer to it.
I have a style that sounds quite decent: _J085_AS Night Jazz Ballad Quartet(85 RS)
I'd like to change the piano to a vibraphone.

How would I do this (in as much detail as possible)?
TIA

I'm not sure if you want the actual style changed or just one song to use the Vibes. Your question specifies the style so I'll answer that one. This assumes that there is no Vibes RealTrack and will use MIDI.

1. Make a copy of the original style before changing
2. While in BIAB, select the style or open a song containing the style
3. Edit the style (ALT F9)
4. Press the Misc button and then the More... button
5. Select Piano from the Instrument dropdown box
6. Select 0 <No Soloist> from the Soloist dropdown
7. Click OK and OK to exit from the Misc screens
8. From the Stylemaker screen, press the Pat. button
9. In the Piano Patch dropdown, select the 12 Vibes patch
10. Press OK
11. Press Save

Your style is now changed

Quote:

I'm not sure if you want the actual style changed or just one song to use the Vibes. Your question specifies the style so I'll answer that one. This assumes that there is no Vibes RealTrack and will use MIDI.

1. Make a copy of the original style before changing
...
Your style is now changed

Thanks very much Rachael.

It worked!
Now that was so intuitive. It would have taken me oh.... maybe a few months before I would have figured out all that!

Just one thing now.
The piano has been replaced with midi vibes, which is great.
But the rhythms it's playing are really hokey sounding.
I tried going in there and grabbing the only decent rhythm and changing its value to 9 and changing all the other values from 5 to 1 but when I regenerated the song nothing changed (I did save the new style changes before I re-generated the song).

I assume I'll need to re-weight the rhythms and/or write some new ones, but how do I make them stick?
Thanks again!

OK! I am now having some success with it!

Yippee.

I went into the style and copied the only good pattern there was over all the 1's (the 5's that were changed to 1's) and it really helped.
It's not perfect yet. I'll need to tinker with it some more, but it's almost there.

You can always find another style with a better sounding Vibes and add the desired RealTracks to it now that you know the procedure.

R

Quote:

You can always find another style with a better sounding Vibes and add the desired RealTracks to it now that you know the procedure.

R

Yes, thanks! Speaking of better sounding vibes...
Right now I'm using the VST/dxi synth settings in BIAB (I think).
The vibes sound pretty poor actually.
I have an old Roland Sound Canvas SC55-mkII that should have better synth sounds overall.
I haven't used it in ages and wonder how I would connect it to my computer now to try it out?
It has MIDI in, out, and thru jacks as well as what looks like a PS/2 connector to a computer.

Do you know how I could connect it to a new computer quickly?

TIA

SC55, you would need a MIDI converter to connect to a modern computer, typically either the soundcard with MIDI connects on it or alternatively, a USB-to-MIDI converter.

But don't count on the sounds in the long-in-the-tooth SC55 to sound better than what the VSC Roland Virtual Sound Canvas offers. VSC came along *after* the SC55, or maybe at the same time, and it has slightly better and richer samples in it to my ears.

On top of that, the Patch of interest here is the Vibraphone, a rather "easy" MIDI emulation as instruments go, do to the ADSR characteristics.

Very likely that the VSC sounds better than the '55 all the way around. If it doesn't, check your soundcard's Volume faders for both Master and Wav output, for if they are not turned all the way up, the software MIDI synth sounds suffer.

--Mac

Quote:

SC55, you would need a MIDI converter to connect to a modern computer, typically either the soundcard with MIDI connects on it or alternatively, a USB-to-MIDI converter.

But don't count on the sounds in the long-in-the-tooth SC55 to sound better than what the VSC Roland Virtual Sound Canvas offers. VSC came along *after* the SC55, or maybe at the same time, and it has slightly better and richer samples in it to my ears. -Mac

Thanks Mac.
My sound card got fried a while back during a lightning strike.
I went out and bought an Edirol USB Audio Capture UA-25EX unit to bring in audio recording to my computer.
I honestly don't know what my 'sound card' is now as a result. I only plug in the UA-25EX when I need to record my guitar or use a mic.
In BIAB, VSC shows up for midi.
That's all I know about my 'sound card'.

I call the thing a "soundcard" -- even if it no longer resides in a slot inside the computer. Whether it is USB, FireWire, or some connect to come along in the future, it is still doing the same job as the venerable old "soundcard" -- it is just that the card, or the printed circuit board, to be more precise, is now located outside the PC box.

The Edirol USB Audio Capture UA-25EX has MIDI connects built into it. You can use those to connect MIDI controller to Input and MIDI synth/sampler to output or standalone MIDi keyboard with both controller and built in synth to input and output.

--Mac

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...
The Edirol USB Audio Capture UA-25EX has MIDI connects built into it. You can use those to connect MIDI controller to Input and MIDI synth/sampler to output or standalone MIDi keyboard with both controller and built in synth to input and output.

--Mac

Thanks Mac, I didn't even realize that I could connect my Sound Canvas SC55 to my computer with the Edirol UA-25EX.
I'll give it a shot and see what happens.

OK I just hooked up my Edirol USB Audio Capture UA-25EX to my SC-55 and I can't hear any Midi yet.
I just hooked up OUT of SC into 25EX In and IN of SC into OUT of 25EX.
I also told BIAB and my computer about the changes (25EX as midi device).
I also disabled VSC in BIAB.

Anything else obvious I'm missing?

TIA

OK I'm making some progress but I'm not quite there yet.
After twiddling with some settings inside BIAB I am at this stage:

When I play a midi file outside of BIAB and plug in headphones into the SC55 I can hear the midi file fine.

When I play a song inside BIAB I can hear the audio parts through my computer speaker but not the Midi part. When I plug in my headphone into the SC55 I can hear the Midi part that was missing.

I would like to know a simple way to get the audio + midi coming out of my computer speakers, the way it was yesterday, when I wasn't using the SC55 (just VSC software).

TIA

Ya gotta also hook up the stereo audio output of the device to the soundcard's line input...

Quote:

Ya gotta also hook up the stereo audio output of the device to the soundcard's line input...

Thanks Mac. I have a couple of questions about this.
If we don't get it straightened out in the next post or two I'll start a new thread because my original question has been answered.

First, about your reply, hooking up the output of the SC55.
Do I take the SC55 output and connect it to the UA-25EX's inputs on the front?
Wouldn't that create an endless loop?

The other thing I'd like to understand is about my 'sound card', audio and midi.
As I mentioned my internal sound card got fried during a lightning strike (the card that was built into my motherboard).
Despite this, I can still hear audio and midi WITHOUT my UA-25EX (external sound card) being powered up!
I don't understand how I can hear sound without a sound card?

Yes, I need my 25EX to record my guitar and my voice, but I don't understand how I can hear the audio without the sound card.

TIA

Trace back down the speaker wires to see where they are attached to the computer, that would probably be an "internal" sound card that is part of the motherboard.

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Trace back down the speaker wires to see where they are attached to the computer, that would probably be an "internal" sound card that is part of the motherboard.

Yes the speakers are plugged into the speaker outs on the MB.
But the main MB drivers with their software mixer etc. don't function 99% of the time.
Once in a blue moon the computer will start up with the drivers loaded.

The rest of the time the computer somehow manages to churn out sound, replacing the Realtek drivers with Windows' default sound drivers.

I just plugged in the outs of the SC55 into the ins of the 25EX and no midi sounds are happening through the speakers.

The SC55 shows midi activity on its screen.

If the speakers are plugged into the output of the motherboard's built in soundcard, then there is no way that any audio from the outrigger USB sound device can be heard.

You would need powered speakers, attached to the Line Out of the 25EX in order to do that.

I think you are in over your head, given what you've already told us (and what is likely left out) -- but you might try not using the audio of the 25EX and simply try plugging the audio outputs of the 55 into the Line inputs of the motherboard's soundcard, see if you can use that.

First things first.

--Mac

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If the speakers are plugged into the output of the motherboard's built in soundcard, then there is no way that any audio from the outrigger USB sound device can be heard.

You would need powered speakers, attached to the Line Out of the 25EX in order to do that.

Yes it seems this is the only way the SC55 will be heard, but I didn't know this before.
And what about recording the sounds from the SC55. Same hookup?

Quote:

I think you are in over your head, given what you've already told us (and what is likely left out) -- but you might try not using the audio of the 25EX and simply try plugging the audio outputs of the 55 into the Line inputs of the motherboard's soundcard, see if you can use that.

Hey, I'm the first one to admit I'm in over my head. I wouldn't be asking these questions if I wasn't.
I just tried plugging in direct from the 55 into the Line input of MB but still no Midi happening.

This triggered a memory from around the time shortly after the lightning strike.
The jacks (line direct/mic in/line out etc. from the MB are screwed up/not working).
This is the main reason I went out and bought the 25EX. To have a way to get sound into the MB/computer.

A few things were messed up by the lightning strike this was one of them. The other was a blown
MB ethernet adapter.

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But the main MB drivers with their software mixer etc. don't function 99% of the time.
Once in a blue moon the computer will start up with the drivers loaded.

Please think of the possibility that you're having hardware issues here and not necessarily software. Perhaps the issue isn't with configuration or setup or settings at all.

From my own experience, whenever I've had PC's that were obviously 'hit' after voltage spikes (or lightning strikes), your PC is bound to do some pretty strange things either right away or in the near future -- assuming it survived the electrical 'jolt' in the first place. As your electronics were never designed to survive such a thing, you just never know to what extent your net damage is going to be. You may have some electronics (IC's, etc) overheating at some point, you may have some parts of your system working intermittently, you may have some that appear to work (on the surface of things) but then are actually CAUSING problems with other parts of your system, etc.

It's a crap-shoot whether you should even continue to use the system or not. If you weren't 110% certain and you are 'relying' on this machine, I'd recommend that you take your PC to a shop and have them perform a few detailed diagnostics on it and then give you their opinion on whether it's safe to use or not and whether you should continue investing in it (just how reliable or unreliable it will likely be). Only you yourself can decide whether it's a good idea to continue to invest your time and money into it -- Myself, I doubt I'd even plug a new peripheral device into it. I'd be overly concerned for the welfare of any new box I plugged into it! And as you may or may not know, electrical 'hits' take their toll on your electronics (all over your house, not just your PC). You can count on it reducing the lifespan of all your equipment.

I've built, configured and repaired PC's and peripherals for many years (for 1000's of business users) and quite frankly, depending on the necessity or application of that particular PC, I wouldn't do anything with that machine that was in a critical application or where you aren't prepared to endure some weird things happening from time to time (not to mention you should consider that it will crap out on you altogether sooner than you think). I use those 'questionable' PC's for printer servers or the like. Remember too that it's likely to be okay maybe if by 'weird stuff' we're saying that we'll need to endure the inconvenience of an occasional reboot. But what about those things you can't predict? What about if your PC starts to take a toll on the new technology you're likely to be adding to it in the future? Right now, you don't know the percentage of the problems you're having can be traced back to software or hardware.

I know it's not an easy proposition but why do you think that those companies selling 'spike' protection equipment can offer you thousands (even hundreds of thousands) of dollars to insure you against something like this? And even then I can tell you that it still happens -- Spikes will get past the protection equipment from time to time. I've seen this happen and my company has filed a few claims like this before. Not before months of pulling-your-hair-out troubleshooting. There's really no way to protect against mother nature's power -- With the technology we currently have, we cannot even generate the power that Ma' Nature creates in one single lightning strike!

Similar to your situation ... I had a PC (on $50,000 dollar-insured, surge suppression) one time that the morning after a bad storm, wouldn't power up -- black screen. We went through that machine with a fine-tooth comb and eventually the solution was to physically pull out the fried modem and sound card -- the mobo survived but evidently the peripherals sustained the bulk of the hit. Once replaced with new peripherals it was fine -- or so we thought, until six months later with the mobo finally died. Lesson learned I guess.

On another note, if I were you and I was fighting the gremlins that you are, I'd yank that original sound card right out. There's even a good chance that the old card is or will cause you additional future problems. Secondly, if the sound card is built in (integrated into the mobo), then you should have a switch on the mobo to turn off external peripherals (read your documentation). And apart from that, if you have a more advanced mobo, then you might find the on/off switch for your integrated devices to be in your system setup / BIOS (usually accessible during hot boot). Finally (assuming you're still in fight-my-gremlins-mode than you are ready buy a new system), Tiger Direct (at tigerdirect.com) can get you a replacement board (probably with more features than your old one). If you're not comfortable with that (or like me, you get tired of it nickel and diming you and wearing out your troubleshooting patience), start over with a new machine -- It could cost you a lot less money and time.

thanks, Russell.

I agree with what Russell says here.

You should replace that computer or resign yourself to many things going bump in the night and not having any place to stand on as to whether or not it can be fixed with a tweak or is a user problem or is just the lightning-struck motherboard acting up.

Not a good thing.

--Mac

Yah ... what Mac said, only MUCH shorter version!

Thanks Mac!

Quote:

Similar to your situation ... I had a PC (on $50,000 dollar-insured, surge suppression) one time that the morning after a bad storm, wouldn't power up -- black screen. We went through that machine with a fine-tooth comb and eventually the solution was to physically pull out the fried modem and sound card -- the mobo survived but evidently the peripherals sustained the bulk of the hit. Once replaced with new peripherals it was fine -- or so we thought, until six months later with the mobo finally died. Lesson learned I guess...

Thanks for your help!
The lightning hit was a long time ago (more than a year) and the system is VERY stable now.
The items hit were:
-cable modem (replaced)
-ethernet adapter (built-in, has been replaced)
-sound card (built-in)

I was VERY concerned at the time needless to say and distraught. The strike was so powerful that I jolted right out of bed in the basement!
But after the above items were replaced I was satisfied and still am satisfied with the stability of the system. It's just that from time to time I forget that the sound card plugins (mic in/out, line in) don't work properly.

I'm using a very special MB by AOpen that would be almost impossible to replace now.
Think parallel port adapter, 9-pin Serial port, PS/2 mouse and keyboard etc.