I would hope, that in developing the product, that it is not just a case of adding new features and new RealTracks and RDs, but in overcoming some of the serious limitations of the product.
Something that has been requested repeatedly for many years, has been the ability to change chords more than one per beat.
Not only on an even two per beat (on eighth notes), but quarter note triplets (three chord changes divide equally over two beats), even eighth note triplets (three changes in one beat), etc. (The former, quarter note triplet chord changes, is actually pretty common in music. Of course, not for the bulk of a song, but in special places.) (Perhaps sixteenth note changes too, four to a beat, but I don't think that is very common.)
This has been a serious limitation of BIAB for many years. People have come up with all sorts of work-arounds to try to get around the problem (none working out too well), but the basic problem really should be fixed.
I certainly hope product development is not only focused on RealTracks and RealDrums, but on overcoming serious long-term limitations with the application, such as inability to change chords more than one per beat.
Has that problem been fixed in BIAB 2011? (I hope so! That would give a reason to upgrade!)
No, but have you read the list of new features? You can find it here:
http://www.pgmusic.com/bbwin.new.htm
I have the same broblem and all I want is to play two chords in a 4/4 measure.
And what BIAB does? Plays the first 2/4 with a chord and again the first 2/4 with the next chord. If this hapens in several measures one after an other the rhythm is gone.
Hi Panos,
Is it possible to give us a little more information about how you set the chords up to play, what style you use, tempo, etc. I don't think that I'm understanding your post properly because BIAB can certainly play two chords in 4/4.
Regards,
Noel
Quote:
I have the same broblem and all I want is to play two chords in a 4/4 measure.
And what BIAB does? Plays the first 2/4 with a chord and again the first 2/4 with the next chord. If this hapens in several measures one after an other the rhythm is gone.
If you right click on the measure you want more than 2 chords at, and choose chord settings then you can enter a different chord for every beat in the chord settings window and have 4 chords in a measure.
There is a shorcut way to do this without entering the chord settings window, but I have forgotten it, maybe someone can remind me how to do the shortcut way as well.
musiclover
Hi musiclover,
To put 4 chords (say, C F Dm G7) into a single bar. Click on the first half of the bar and type C,F and then hit enter. Notice that there is no space after the comma. now click on the second half bar and type Dm,G7 and hit enter.
This should do the job.
Regards,
Noel
Thanks Noel, I knew a comma had something to do with it, but wasn't doing things in the right sequence
thanks again
musiclover
Hi Noel,
I'll make an other try to discribe my problem. English is not my language.
I know how to enter chords in every beat of a bar and here is an axample.
I have 4 same bars, C on first beat and F on third beat. When I listen to these bars only drums are playing the rythm properly, all other instruments, they do follow the chords but they repeat the first half of the bar. This is not a problem with the most BIAB styles, but when I try to play Greek music using styles that I've made, rythm seems to be interrupted and reapeating the first half of the bars.
Thanks
Panos
With Norton Music EXPANDED styles, you can get 8 chords per measure. Two chords per beat.
I invented EXPANDED styles to "fix" this problem many years ago. They are not simple style that have been forced to expand, but styles that were developed to be played as EXPANDED styles, so they sound right when up to 8 chords per measure are used.
To check them out, go to
http://www.nortonmusic.com/styledemo.html and look for the EXPANDED styles.
Notes
Quote:
No, but have you read the list of new features? You can find it here: http://www.pgmusic.com/bbwin.new.htm
That doesn't answer the question.
No use adding on new features, 1001 more realtracks, etc., without fixing fundamental problems.
Why hasn't that problem been fixed after so much time, with a fix for it being requested by users many times?
I think more attention should be given to fixing fundamental problems, than only adding new features and RTs.
That doesn't answer the question? There were many statements, but only one question, and I answered it. Question: "Has that problem been fixed in BIAB 2011?". Answer: "No". Then I gave a reference where you could double-check the answer.
Hi Matt!
It seems you are really very active in helping people out with using BIAB.
Hats off!
In this case, the original post does two things:
1) it asks a factual question (will we be able to enter more than one chord per beat)
2) it start a discussion on whether its better to fix long time issues or add new features.
Answering "No but have you seen the new features" seems to be a response to both.
It seems to say: "your problem has not been fixed, but look at the nice new features, that should make you happy!"
In fact, if you read the page that you direct to, it confirms Maiki's issue: the bulk of development seems to have gone into realtracks and an iphone-app.
I'm really interested in the discussion part of the question: what issues should be solved in the next update? I myself would like to see a more mature user interface, implementation of some common chords (m7b9!), or a way to imput chords differently as is discussed elsewhere. Maybe we can discuss with Alan, as he seems to be the guy who actually does these changes?
Eddy
Quote:
That doesn't answer the question? There were many statements, but only one question, and I answered it. Question: "Has that problem been fixed in BIAB 2011?". Answer: "No". Then I gave a reference where you could double-check the answer.
OK Literally, you answered the question with one word: "No", then went on to tell about the great new features, as if all the new Realtracks, etc., should make up for a fundamental problem that has been discussed about here for years, but never fixed.
It is often a problem with software companies, that they think in order to sell upgrades, etc., they have to advertise a lot of "new features", but don't end up fixing fundamental problems with the application.
As I know that PG Music is more open to user input than most, with participation by the software developers on this board, where they have seen the problem discussed for years, that it should be fixed by now.
At least I hope in the future, the tendency is not just to see how many hundreds of country-pop-rock real tracks can be added, but to fix some fundamental long term problems the app has had for many years.
Yes, there are various work-arounds for the problem I mentioned, they are a lot of hassle and don't work too good. Yes, as Bob Norton said, one can buy his styles that allow that (requiring an extra 3rd party purchase, for something that should be available in the product itself, and his styles do not use RT (not criticizing your styles, Bob, just that the app itself should be able to handle more than one chord change per beat)So yes, the one chord per beat limitation should be worked on and fixed, not primarily adding barrelfulls of RealTracks.
Hi Eddy. Thanks for the kind words.
I generally try to answer questions as directly as possible, to the best of my ability and experience. If someone wants more info or wants more discussion, they can request it, but I try not to overwhelm anyone the first time with an answer, if for no other reason than I do not have the time. Also for this reason, I generally skim speeches about known facts and go straight to the question asked.
The rest of the original poster's comments, in my opinion, belong more properly in the Wishlist. Your ideas in your final paragraph might be more effective there, too. m7b9 = interesting!
ps I have never heard of anyone named Alan at PG Music. Is he someone who helped you?
Hello, maiki. I did not say "great" new features.
Please accept my apology for attempting to answer your question. It will not happen again.
I think the new features are great anyway.
Everything has limitations. I used to wish the wife looked more like the women in Playboy but cooked like Julia Child. Neither happened. But it's been ok.
I love Take Five. I've resigned myself to not practice it with Band in a Box.
Anyone know of an arranger keyboard that can do 5/4? Nope. I think I'll rail at Korg, Yamaha, and Roland. I'm sure they are going to listen.
Wishlist is all I can say.
Oh, and it is possible. Just use twice as many bars and you have chords on the eighth not quarters. It just looks funny. And anyone can manipulate the styles file for midi to work around things to get to eighth notes.
Every release I take what is given and work with it. Except Banjo, I don't need it, nor really want it. Uke, maybe not. 6/8 timing, bring it on!
That's a great attitude, John: take every release for what it is, and work with it.
The irony here is that I agree with the example cited by the original poster.
Before RealTracks, when some of us thought the program had matured, I was among many who posted that it seemed like it was time to address some of the core functions in BIAB, such as chords per bar, measures per song, chords supported, etc. I had my list of the twenty things I recommended, and other posters had their lists.
Then, BIAB introduced RealDrums followed by RealTracks, and many of us realized they had solved a problem we did not even know we had. The way I look at it now, RealTracks need to run their course until there are sufficient numbers of them in requested styles to meet the basic needs of a wide group of users, and then perhaps we will see some new direction. The way to influence what that direction will be, is to post respectfully in the Wishlist. Many times, I have received my wish. Other times, I have been blown away by the innovations introduced by PG Music. At all times, I trust that they know what the issues are and will come out with something great.
You can also approximate quarter note triplets by inputting: eighth note-16th note push on the 2nd beat-eighth note push on the 3rd beat. Later, Ray
John, Matt,
I agree with both of you that there is no use in stopping what you want to do because there are obstacles in the way. You need to move over, under, around or through them, or you won't get anywhere.
Having said that, it is rather strange that some of the basic issues with BIAB haven't been dealt with yet, while the solving of other "problems" is communicated with fireworks and marching bands.
Surely pgmusic must realize that it is strange to have their users buy another program to play take 5? Are they not worried that the user finds out that this other program can also do a m7b9 chord? That they may in the end conclude that this other program has a better idea of what users need?
Personally I believe that the BIAB people are monitoring this stuff closely. But in the end they make commercial decisions, not user friendliness-decisions. What would you guys think of a poll to be held after each release, where users can vote on what they want to see in the next release? If PGMusic could make a committment to implement or solve the most-wanted issues, that would go a long way.
Regards,
Eddy
I doubt it. This discussion goes around. It's one things for users to debate and flail about, another are the realities of writing the code. I don't pretend to understand the underlying code behind the concept, however there must be some serious math going on.
That said I am sure the use base is listened to. So if I scrap Band in a Box because I have to play Take Five and it won't do it, (it will I have it done by someone sort of someplace lol), then what do I use? If using backing tracks I can render several hundred songs quickly to .wav then .mp3 and buy one commercial backing track for Take 5? Then I lose control over the process a bit, unless it is a midi file and it can be 'tweaked'.
Alt +F5 shortcut to Chord Options
Alt +F5 shortcut to Chord Options
ckane
Welcome.
You revived an eight year old thread. Possibly you could have created a new thread for your post, but that's for another day.
Your post was a bit ambiguous. You could enter the chord as F+ which would be F Augmented, the same as an F chord with a sharpened 5th. Is that what you were seeking to achieve?