Remember Computer Shopper? It was basically a book of ads plus a few articles. It was as thick as a metropolitan phone book. In the 90s it was "the" way to find out what was happening in the new world of computers, peripherals and software.

Recently I was cleaning out an old file cabinet, and there was a folder labeled "future purchases"

One of the ads I had saved for future reference was from Computer shopper's April 1992 edition. As it turns out, I bought two of the items shown on this page: Cakewalk 4.0 and Band in a Box (not sure which version of BIAB I bought first. I'm pretty sure I bought Cakewalk first, then decided it wasn't easy to use. Later a friend at work introduced me to BIAB, and I remember thinking "THIS is how music creation should work!"

(see ads below)

Thanks for sharing Pat! That's awesome.... I totally remember perusing those books.

I remember Computer Shopper. I love seeing those old ads.

And that version of BIAB is three behind where I started (I started in version 8). I bought the ProPak and just as today, and then quickly realized that what I needed was the MegaPak (which at the time was the one with mostly everything - UltraPaks, UltraPlusPaks, and EverythingPaks came later), so when BIAB v9 came out, I upgraded to the MegaPak. Never looked back and have used BIAB for something on almost a daily basis since.

I also remember when other software first started incorporating audio loops. It was fascinating, but I thought that method of applying loops lacked the musical quality that BIAB achieved with its method of splicing snippets together into a cohesive song that followed the chords, and wasn't the same loop over and over.

At the time, people were getting frustrated by trying to play MIDI thru stock PC sound cards, and they couldn't get realistic sound. Even then the thought occurred to me that if PGMusic could ever figure out how to use audio loops the same way they were using MIDI snippets, they would have a game-changing product.

In 2008, they did!

To this day, nobody else has anything like it.

Hats off to Dr. Gannon and to everybody who has ever worked at PGMusic. Ideas are a dime a dozen. Making the idea work is much harder. And marketing the working idea into a product with a global user base is quite an accomplishment. Everybody reading this has benefited from your accomplishment. We thank you for making our lives a lot more fun than they would be without BIAB.

My first BIAB was version 4, and I had Cakewalk Pro also. Fun post, Pat.

Not long after, I noticed Notes Norton's ads in Recording Magazine or some such for a "better band in your box".

Check this out Pat, speaking of loops.... My first Sound Sampler for the Amiga, circa 1990.... I was also using Dr. T.'s KCS MIDI Sequencer and in years shortly after discovered Cool Edit Pro (now Adobe Audition). I was a late bloomer to BIAB but had my first experience with it in the mid '90s with a Music Theory class in college.

Sunrize Industries Perfect Sound - Some old advertisements on the link too.

I remember in the early days of computing, the Amiga was a superior product that never got the foothold in the USA that it had in Europe. It was an interesting time when different platforms fought for market share. Microsoft's alignment with IBM pushed it over the top, when people like me decided it made more sense to learn the operating system we'd probably end up using at work... and PCs surged ahead of Amiga and Apple in sales, even though both of those were superior products.

And your post about the Perfect Sound Board reminded me of the first product I bought in my search for better MIDI output. It was a Roland Sound Canvas daughter board, which attached to some of the early Sound Blaster cards that were mainly for games, not music production. The daughter board had great sounds, and I used it until the Sound Blaster croaked. After which, I bought a Roland XV-3080 rack unit, which I still have... along with a bunch of expansion boards

I find it interesting that so many early adopters of BIAB are still active users! How many products from the early days of computing still exist at all, let alone still have faithful users who have been on board from the beginning?

as a tie-in to another thread about market share: PGMusic's ability to stay relevant in a changing market probably has a lot to do with their longevity (and therefore cumulative global user base). They outlived a lot of their original competitors, and they've parlayed their unique approach to making music so that the survivors haven't made them irrelevant.

The ability to export tracks directly to other DAWS was a brilliant idea, because it eliminated the idea that you only need one piece of music making software. By positioning itself as one part of a multi-faceted system of music creation, I think PGMusic pretty much carved out a niche that has become unassailable.

Spot on Pat. I worked at a "Software ETC" computer store in 1989. That year most PC software sales was business/productivity software and they were getting a foothold on gaming software. We did sell lots of Sound Blaster 1.0 and Adlib sound cards. Amiga had the edge on games, art (Deluxe Paint), music followed by Apple. The original Macintoshes' were popular and Amiga had adopted their windows desktop look before M$ had got there. Of course M$/IBM would steal share from the others as you mentioned.

I also find it interesting that in 1992, Cakewalk Pro cost $175 while BIAB cost $59 (what would that be today, adjusted for inflation?)

Yet, today, Cakewalk is free while a first-time purchase of BIAB can run as much as $669!

Prices adjusted for what the market will bear? You can't charge more for a product that nobody wants to buy!

And given a marketplace that is so glutted with similar products that a popular product like Sonar is abandoned, then resurrected for free... PGMusic's ability to continue charging relatively high prices for its flagship product tells us all we need to know about the demand for BIAB. People tend to vote with their wallets. They won't spend money for products they don't want.

yeah, and they also stole a lot of ideas from their more creative counterparts.. like the GUI

Also one of the Mac's early advantages was that they had a standardized SDK, so all of their software looked the same, making it easy to learn any program that was available. PC software, on the other hand, was all over the place, with everybody trying to create their own interface.

Visual Basic changed that. With a standard set of menus and dialog boxes etc, it wasn't long before a bunch of top-notch shareware emerged for the PC... all of which looked and worked the same way.

Sorry for saying stuff everybody already knows, but I'm on a roll down memory lane and I can't find the brakes. ;-)

Haha, totally agreed for me too!

Another BIG benefit of MAC/Amiga was that graphics/sound were integrated. You had to buy cards to put in your PC to do the same.

Pat, I don’t recall if I’ve told you this but I worked for Tandy in the 1970s. People know Tandy as Radio Shack. I used to take a computer in 1977, strap it into the passenger seat, and head to shows, schools, corporations and even TV appearances. I would often compete with the Apple dealer.

Working near the enormous IBM in Poughkeepsie NY, I sold tons of personal computers TO IBM and to IBMers years before they came out with their own personal computer in 1981.

Small world isn't it as I started with an Atari and Dr. T,s KCS! Dr T's software was way ahead of its time back then. I also used Cool Edit Pro. I then got a PC and later go Cakewalk's Pro Audio 9.

I tried BiaB back in my Atari days and I didn't like it. That is probably due to the fact I was using lousy sound sources and I didn't have the MIDI knowledge that I do today. I went back to using my external Korg DS-8 and doing everything myself.

I tried BiaB around 2000-2001 and I liked the improvements that they did. I've been using and updating every since.

It is extremely impressive that a software company has been in business for such a long time. Especially a small market software business, meaning the percentage of computer owners recording music. I understand that it is the lowest percent tile of all the specialized computer applications.

Mario, in a real way I'm STILL using Cool Edit Pro. I use Adobe Audition 1.5. Version 1 simply was Cool Edit Pro renamed, and version 1.5 fixed a few things. I also have version 3 which requires ASIO but rarely fire it up since 1.5 is so stable.

In the US, Radio Shack was the poor man's way to open the gateway to computer land. The one close by my house sold the Model 1 and model 3 but also sold the Commodore and Atari product lines. Later on they sold IBM and GoldStar (Korean IBM clone).

There really isn't anything quite like Radio Shack today (sigh).

Jim, your local Radio Shack was a franchise store as opposed to a company one. They were typically much older established stores that added the part of the Radio Shack line they wanted to carry.

My first computer was a Tandy 1000 SX... it had:

one 5.25" floppy drive. (I upgraded to 2 so I could copy stuff)

8088 CPU running at 7.16 MHz.

640 Kb (not megs, not gigs, not Tb) of ram

no hard drive. I bought a 500 gig HD card for $500...

Monitor was monochrome green.

GWBasic! I loved that!

In the days before the internet there was PCLink, and you paid by the minute to be online. I once ran up a $200 bill because I didn't realize I was being charged. Glad those days are long gone!

Here's my first one in 1983. Couldn't afford those big computers in high school.

Timex Sinclair 1000 Personal Computer

HA!

That is the version I started on!

I still have it...

That's really cool! This was before my time so it's neat to see. Thanks for sharing.

cool that you still have it, Floyd! and you got all 24 styles! (The latest version has a couple more than that, I hear)
If you started on version 5, that probably makes you one of the longest-standing users on the forum.
Did anybody besides Matt start at version 4 or earlier?

This has turned into a blast from the past

A guy I worked with for many years bought the convertor everybody used to convert the computer video output to video suitable for viewing on either television channel 3 or channel 4. (the little rectangular box thingy in the Timex computer box)

Looking on the back he noticed several of the patent numbers were patents he owned! Taking his patents and the convertor to a patent attorney he was easily able to persuade the attorney the matter was worth pursuing.

Seven years later the first electronic giant agreed to settle. It took another five years for the rest of the big players to settle. He died a rich and happy man. His children are still rich and happy.

By the way, the Timex computer was also known as the Sinclair ZX81. Sinclair designed the computer and it was manufactured in a Timex factory. It was meant to be the Arduino computer of it's day.

Cool stuff Jim! Thanks!

I first started with BIAB around 2003/2004, but don't remember the version number. I got the basic package plus the additional blues styles disk, for some reason I recall it was disk #16 but might be wrong about that.

First DOS PC I had was a Tandy 1000, although I had a CP/M machine before that.

My first buy was in 1992 for Atari, after I read an advertisement in Keyboard Magazine.

I've still got the disks (but not the Atari )

Very interesting thread, for the early adapters to biab, some of you guys must have stayed off the forums for years though as I used to lurk a lot on this and the older forums. and never seen you around.

Maybe some used different user names.

There used to be a very active BIAB yahoo group, I used to hang out there long before I created a forum account here. Forget what my username was over there.
And even though I created an account here back in '07, I wasn't really active here until a few years ago.

Wow - talk about a blast to the past! I'd never seen this before. Thanks for sharing

Here's what *I* think is cool: Even though BIAB has been around for years and has survived the operating system wars, and the battles to see which DAWS are useful enough to keep their customers and continue finding new ones... now it's a "next generation" company. When PGMusic posts pictures of its employees, I am always a little surprised to see how young most of you are. The upshot is that the company is well-positioned to continue into the future

Musiclover, the forum as it is now dates from summer 2000. Some of us were active on the previous forum for many years before that, but those threads and post counts were not carried over.

Only somebody who has been here for more than 18 years would know that.

Matt, now that Mac has stopped participating, you Rharv and Notes Norton are probably the forum members who have remained active for the longest time. Your names should appear in gold letters or something.

Well, I haven't been here as long as Mac or Matt or Notes, but I did register on the forum on December 20, 2000, a few months after the new forum was instituted. Previously, I participated in the multiple Yahoo groups.

I think you could also include Russell in that list of long times users & contributors.

true.. once you start naming names, where do you stop? A lot of people on this forum have been here for a long time.

Pat, do you mean on the forums or on the planet?

PS - the devil made me say this.

My first version was on the Atari/ST and then the PC in DOS. I don't know what version number it was, but it only had 4 instruments (Bass, Drums, Piano and Guitar) 24 built in styles, zero additional or user styles, no shots, no holds and no endings.

It's come a long way since then.

And I bought a few Computer Shopper mags myself.

Insights and incites by Notes

Ha! Mario, you made me laugh!

Notes, while we're on the topic of companies that have vision and staying power:
I noticed that the ad for version 5 said that the DOS version allowed users to make their own styles. I find it interesting that even today, that isn't a huge topic on the forum.

You were an early adopter of user styles, one who saw the potential of that feature. Not many people have the perception or the intellect or the drive to pursue an idea until it becomes a product... but you did.

I remember along the way there were others who tried to market their styles, but to my knowledge you are the one survivor. Good job!

+1 Pat... Kudos to Notes!

There is still an UK Computer Shopper mag.

I used to take all up all the special print offers of computer mags usually were three for a £1, but found a better way.

Think I have mentioned this before on the forum, the Readly app gives you tonnes of mags for a set fee each month, usually £7.99.

With them I only take up the special offers like £7.99 for there months, last 3 months I got for 99p.

I find that with poor eyesight its a lot better to read on tablet than print, because its easy to enlarge the text.

Load of mags here, including Guitarist, computer music, and lots more.

Might be a few offers around for the US, if paying with paypal once you get the offer, and don't want to continue with the normal price after offer runs out, just go into recurring payments in paypal and cancel it.

Thanks Pat and Steve.

I enjoy making the styles. I took music arranging in school and I play sax, guitar, bass, drums, flute, wind synth and keyboard synth so I have a good idea as to how the instruments interact with each other.

But I have to thank the people who like my work, purchase my efforts and tell me what kind of styles they would like me to make.

I started this back in the early 1990s, and never had any idea it would last this long. It was mail order at first with classified ads in Electronics Musician, Keyboard and a couple of other magazines. I mailed them in DOS 5.25" floppies and Windows, Atari, and Mac 3.5" floppies.

The Internet has made delivery easier and instant. When e-delivery became possible, I dropped the price of my 'disks' because I don't have to buy the disk, the cardboard mailer, and drive to the post office.

So they aren't physical disks anymore, but I've been calling them that since the early 1990s, so I don't know what else to call them.

And I also carry products for Band-in-a-Box by Roy Hawkesford, Sherry Mayrent, Jim Wedd, and David Bailey.

Notes

Pat... do you remember Compuserve? They were another internet service that charged by the minute. I too got lambasted one month for forgetting about the "by the minute" charging.