The smoke has cleared a bit from the end of year sales. Now it is time to look forward to new "stuff". I have had my eye on this one for a while. And now I see a new version is on the horizon. This type of stuff is right up my ally. Maybe yours too?
"Plugin Boutique is finalising the release date for either February 14th or end of February 2020. Ed and the team are close to finalising the latest beta (Beta 4) which I am using confidently in my day to day composition and production. Were are getting mighty close and the final product is much more advanced than even we had hoped for - not to mention stable."
hi Dan I have 1.8.1 and I have the bete scaler 2 b4 love it just scatching the surface on the plugin its worth its money it works great on other dawns its not biab were it gives you a whole song layout but its good thanks eric
MusicStudent, Thank you for bringing up Scaler. It is a very cool plugin to explore and experiment with chords, scales, inversions you name it.
Trygve, the new beta does detect chords from files. Scaler should be released within next couple of weeks. You can grab a demo to try it out.
I recently started a "wishlist" topic for PG to either update existing chord builder to something similar as most of the theory is already in BIAB or take a more universal approach and integrate chording apps, such as this one into BIAB workflow. Please support that if you find it useful.
P.S. MusicStudent, are you using Scaler in BIAB or DAW? If BIAB, can you please share your setup/workflow?
The biggest downside for me is that this particular (great) program does not come as a standalone, only as VST.
I recently started a "wishlist" topic for PG to either update existing chord builder to something similar as most of the theory is already in BIAB or take a more universal approach and integrate chording apps, such as this one into BIAB workflow. Please support that if you find it useful.
Scaler 2 is still promise-ware, but weeks ago I purchased V1.8 and have been working with it. Not yet made any music with it, which is the goal, but it is deep and takes some enjoyable learning.
So the other day I was given a demo copy of Scaler 2 - Beta6. This new version has gone to a whole new level. While V1.8 was generally block and arpegiated midi chord chart generation, the new version 2.0 has added a world of added midi "expressions" and tempo editing.
The development team has proven to be responsive is discussing features and wishes and I do now believe V2 will eventually launch.
So I continue to recommend that you to keep an eye on this program. I am planning on a video to show how this may integrate with other tools including BIAB and EZKeys, but that is taking some time and I have been asked not to show Scaler 2 until it launches - maybe by summer.
"...OK guys, we have some news from Plugin Boutique. May 27th, 2020 is the official release date from them. We have a group marketing and software review skype set for this Friday the 17th so will be even clearer then but this looks like everything has aligned and Scaler 2 will be released on May 27th. Praise be :raised_hands: Will update with any further news."
Some of us are pretty excited. I am telling you, this program is a hidden gem.
Dan, I've gone through the videos, very interesting software but still unsure how it would be used in a workflow. Could you give us a heads up on how you might be thinking about using it?
Getting more of me into my music is the primary objective and I think this will help. But at the moment I have been in a learning and exploring phase with Scaler. I still have the day job so time is limited.
Hammering out a work-flow is a work-in-process. But it is coming together slowly. I envision the workflow will have Scaler integrated with Reaper, EZKeys and of course BIAB as well as my midi control keyboard. I had seen glimpses where I generated a quick chord progression in BIAB and then drag it over to Reaper where Scaler picks it up. Once in Scaler I can adjust, revise, manipulate and control (e.g., voicings, inversions... ) each chord or sections of chords to open up sounds and sequences which are currently beyond my ability to hear or create on my own. Once I have the chord sequences built I can play and hear the melodies and harmonies I create. They can be layered within Scaler or back in Reaper. Or they slip right into EZKeys which can do its thing.
First thing I have to tell you. This is not BIAB - nothing is! This music is not already made. Biggest thing for me, Scaler allows me to "hear and see" the music at its base (the chord progression). This allows me to make the music at a deeper level, not just play the music. This is a lot more effort then playing music in BIAB - but I am hoping the goals will be more satisfying and better help me reach my objective.
Oh and by the way, check out the price, this is really a no brainer for me at least.
Hey Dan, it looks amazing and beautifully designed. I'm still not completely clear on what all it does though. I watched part of a video where he showed how you can press one key on your MIDI keyboard and a variety of preset patterns will play. But your stated goal is to get more of you into your music. How is this achieving that goal?
Hey Dan, it looks amazing and beautifully designed. I'm still not completely clear on what all it does though. I watched part of a video where he showed how you can press one key on your MIDI keyboard and a variety of preset patterns will play. But your stated goal is to get more of you into your music. How is this achieving that goal?
J3, That is an excellent question. Thanks for asking. All I can say at this point is I am working on it. Stay tuned I am expecting a breakthrough in the weeks to come and I will get back to you on this. oh, the drama of it all!
Well, I'm tempted to just go ahead and buy it because 1) it looks like a cool tool, 2) it appears very well designed, 3) the price is right and 4) your recommendation and enthusiasm!
According to forum chatter, V2,0 will be a paid update. They have speculated $50 - $60 USD. I put V1.8 in my cart and just let it sit there. After a couple weeks they sent be a $10 off coupon and I bought it a month or two ago. The V1.8 currently has a 30 demo which has for evaluation. They have stated the upgrade price will possible be half of full price. Version 2.0 has been a long time in the coming.
Scaler 2 is a fun toy, but I do not see a direct way to incorporate in the workflow with BIAB, possibly an indirect one. I would say this. For intermediate or hobbyist user it can accomplish 2 main goals:
1) A chord progression / chord movement reference tool. Scale explorer. It has pretty cool layout for circle of fifth, Secondary scale, Modal interchange and Mediants, Chord inversions. You can hear them and see them graphically. Build chord blocks and hear how they would sound together! That is mainly what I am after. And for this usage, I would not even insert it as a plugin to BIAB, but have it opened in NanoHost as a stand alone program so when working on progression in BIAB it serves as a reference tool. It has onboard sounds of good quality, more than good enough for reference.
2)Chord pattern builder and arpeggio trigger (chords can be triggered from single key and bind to any keyboard sections) Has a whole load of various arpeggios in all genres (no specific to Electronic music) Fun feature for some experiments.
Of course Scaler has about 100 other features, but I feel that two items above would be used most. Ideally I would like to see it integrated as a chord builder to be used instead of the one in BIAB. But you get what you get and you don't get upset... Maybe BIAB developers can figure out how to weld this thing into the workflow. I have tried several chord reference programs, this is the best one to my taste.
Overall fun plugin / tool. If you are looking to explore chord movement, inversions, all kinds of scales, to hear them side by side etc. This plugin is for you.
Scaler 2 is a fun toy, but I do not see a direct way to incorporate in the workflow with BIAB, possibly an indirect one. I would say this. For intermediate or hobbyist user it can accomplish 2 main goals:
1) A chord progression / chord movement reference tool. Scale explorer. It has pretty cool layout for circle of fifth, Secondary scale, Modal interchange and Mediants, Chord inversions. You can hear them and see them graphically. Build chord blocks and hear how they would sound together! That is mainly what I am after. And for this usage, I would not even insert it as a plugin to BIAB, but have it opened in NanoHost as a stand alone program so when working on progression in BIAB it serves as a reference tool. It has onboard sounds of good quality, more than good enough for reference.
2)Chord pattern builder and arpeggio trigger (chords can be triggered from single key and bind to any keyboard sections) Has a whole load of various arpeggios in all genres (no specific to Electronic music) Fun feature for some experiments.
Of course Scaler has about 100 other features, but I feel that two items above would be used most. Ideally I would like to see it integrated as a chord builder to be used instead of the one in BIAB. But you get what you get and you don't get upset... Maybe BIAB developers can figure out how to weld this thing into the workflow. I have tried several chord reference programs, this is the best one to my taste.
Overall fun plugin / tool. If you are looking to explore chord movement, inversions, all kinds of scales, to hear them side by side etc. This plugin is for you.
Could not have said it better. Exactly my findings on this hidden gem.
Will, It is a wonderful plugin. Price would be similar to Scaler 1.8 But it is a different, far more advanced beast. They will offer discount upgrade to all previous Scaler owners.
I think it would be a good idea for PG developers to look into this plugin if they can implement a path to use it within BIAB. And for people who do not want to spend money, maybe a similar path can be used to implement BIAB Chord Picker that pipeline is generously giving out for free.
I am using a beta version as a standalone (with VST shell), as chord reference tool with BIAB and it is great!
Just a brief update. Scaler 2 is scheduled for release on May 27. If you purchase Scaler 1.8 now for $49 USD you will receive a free updated when 2.0 comes out. If you already have V1.8 the price for Scaler 2.0 has not yet been published.
hi guys I pick it up for 15.71 plugin boutique I can get it to make some sound in biab with midi host but when I load it from biab I get scaler 2.2 but no sound. in the host midi setup only scaler 1.8.1 shows up the sound is limited you cant drag chords from scaler to biab that I have tried no luck anyone get this work in biab thanks eric
Eric, you are likely the only who has tried to bring Scaler into BIAB. Personally, my workflow is to get my music out of BIAB and not try to bring music into it. So I won't be trying that. I have found that Scaler and Reaper and EZKeys all trade chord charts effortlessly via drag and drop. So once I have BIAB tracks in Reaper I am good to go with using the necessary tools.
First, Scaler 2.0 was only released yesterday so much is still to be learned regarding its features and capabilities. But initial impressions suggest that there will be little synergy, at this moment, with BIAB and Scaler.
I know, this is likely coming as a surprise to some. Scaler is midi chord progressions at its core, which is exactly how BIAB started. Scaler will drag and drop midi content across EZkeys and Reaper - Sweet and powerful! These three apps (Scaler, EZKeys and Reaper) all permit midi in and out via drag and drop. So there are lots of options there.
However, BIAB does not play nice with other apps. Meaning BIAB does not permit moving midi content across applications in a simple manner. The "write chords to file" feature in BIAB is not automated and requires "clean up" before the output is usable. At the same time, Inputting midi files into BIAB is limited.
I am a big fan of all these tools. But until BIAB learns to play nice with the other kids by exchanging data in a simple workflow, I don't see the practicality of the pairing. For the time being I am using Reaper as the middle man to keep both apps working together to the best I can manage.
I don't have Scaler but you can drag n drop midi into Biab, I just set how many bars to go into the midi file 0 that is the start how many bars to import 8 that is the length how many blank bars to start including BB 2 bar count-in 10 (2+8 blank bars) to start on bar 9 It will import to the Melody by default but you can move or cut n paste to another track Have the Merge with Existing Data.. checked to keep adding:
Pipeline, First, there is a 30 day free version full functional demo of Scaler 2.0 available.
However transferring midi from Scaler to BIAB is not what we need at this time! What is needed is a script which takes the chord chart from Scaler and puts it into Reapers just like you did for transferring Chord names from BIAB to Reaper.
It was at my suggestion that they provide some way to output the chord names in a text file. So they did! They allowed a copy to clipboard of all chord titles. So can you do something with that to mimic what you did with your Reatracks chord transfer? If there is anything I can do to help let me know. The developers are also very cooperative. What do you think? Is this doable?
I'll have a look later, but you can use ReaTrak chords from midi item.lua to get the chords from progression.mid Ask them to write the chord names as midi markers in progression.mid
hi Musicstudent I to use bandlab, mixcraft ezkeys and scaler they do work well with the drag and drop and give great Music possibilities now I use biab as a tool and arranger and it does very well for me just thought it would be handy at times to drag in from scaler thanks eric
Yes, I bought the upgrade to show my support Beta worked fine with midi keyboard. I downloaded and installed official release. It does not crash Nanohost without midi board connected, will try with board next few days, maybe sooner. *There are couple of Nanohost versions... Mine is 1.0.2. Developers are very responsive with fixing things, I saw your message on the board. My guess, they are swamped with emails. Give them a few days to sort this out.
P.S. I think they took advice to make it a standalone seriously. I would not be surprised if they roll out their own version soon.
Also, I was very glad they implemented a few of my minor suggestions
*There are couple of Nanohost versions... Mine is 1.0.2.
NanoHost 1.0.2 does not crash with Scaler V2.0.4 (newest release) it just does not accept input from the keyboard. Totally silent from keyboard but does have sound when using the mouse. So I hooked up Scaler v1.8 which works nice with the keyboard. BTW, All the beta versions have gone dead.
Understood. Scaler’s “copy to clipboard” copies the chords from each “box” separated by a comma. And therefore no indication of how many boxes will be in a single bar.
For this purpose can we assume one chord per bar with the bar marker indicated by a comma in the text file. It would be easy for the user to adjust the text file prior to sending to Reaper if more chords appear in a single bar by moving commas as needed. We can go back to the developers at a later time with a better idea involving “writing the chord names as midi marker in the exported chord track” as you suggest. But for now, could this work as a proof of concept?
Ok here is my first initial efforts at a path forward… I move the Scaler “copy to clipboard” chord names from the clipboard and paste into a .csv file template. There I have to do a little editing to get the names in the right cells and save for import into Reaper. Hey, it is a start! drive.google.com
I should be able to script it to do 1 chord per bar, but you can set chord duration in beats in settings. I could maybe create a small GUI that you paste the clipboard chords into and set beats per chord. I will have to play around with it more and watch some videos. But if they just add chord name midi markers it would solve the issue but then again I have been asking PG to do that for years.
Dan, I briefly tested Nanohost+Scaler 2, it accepts my midi keyboard...and works with chord "binding" option too. Sorry, swamped with other things to do deeper testing at this time. But it worked for me from first try.
Did you check / selected controller in your congfig in Nanohost, under MIDI? I uninstalled the Beta first, then installed official release, maybe that has something to do with it.
Another thing that came to mind if your interface (if your MIDI is through interface, not direct USB connection) has "exclusive" control and some other audio program is opened at the same time?
Try running Nanohost+Scaler and nothing else, choose proper MIDI port in upper left config (of Nanohost!). See if that works. Good luck.
Personally I think the "Drop chord" feature is not very useful with Scaler. It is more of a chord tool, not so much of arranger. My main usage is exploring scales, Modal interchange, secondary scales etc... Very fun and educational reference tool.
I believe one of the primal usages of Scaler is chord binding. You can bind custom chords or arpeggios to single key or section of keyboard and trigger them live.
Dan, I briefly tested Nanohost+Scaler 2, it accepts my midi keyboard...and works with chord "binding" option too.
Wow, both excited and disappointed at the same time. I tied everything to get this to work and no deal! OK, obviously not everything. Seems like I have more work to do. Thanks so much for your followup on this. It will be nice to have the V2 working as standalone again.
But if they just add chord name midi markers it would solve the issue but then again I have been asking PG to do that for years.
Understand completely. But these guys appear to be young and hungry and receptive to suggestions. I may have been the one who sent them down this "text" trail ( my bad ). If you can carefully articulate exactly what they need to do I am betting they will do it once the dust has settled on the V2 launch is causing quite a stir in the forum over there.
Personally I think the "Drop chord" feature is not very useful with Scaler. It is more of a chord tool, not so much of arranger. My main usage is exploring scales, Modal interchange, secondary scales etc... Very fun and educational reference tool.
I believe one of the primal usages of Scaler is chord binding. You can bind custom chords or arpeggios to single key or section of keyboard and trigger them live.
Exactly, a very exciting tool.
But the need for chord names in Reaper is more a "documentation" tool than anything else. Since they are giving us the Chord names we should not have to relay on an algorithm to interpret the notes. Complex Chords can take on multiple names. Speaking for myself, I read chord charts not Staff notes (remember I am primarily a guitarist). So I am hoping for a way to simply move the chord names over.
Pipeline has used the phrase "..write the chord names as midi markers in the exported chord track". When I google that I find it is actually a "thing". And I think this is exactly what we need here.
Pipey - I have passed this to the development team lets see what they do now. Thanks so much for pointing us in this direction. I actually think some good will come from this effort.
Got some feedback from Davide of the Scaler Development team
"...There are quite a few things to consider here from an implementation perspective vs priority but I like all the thinking and absolutely can see a use. When the dust settles from this first wave I will be sitting down with the team and discussing priorities in terms of features. It is logged and will be discussed. Thank you."
So on that note I am hoping to put this tread to rest. Time now to focus on making music instead of talking about it. We did give this tread a good run, didn't we!
Try Impro-Visor you can paste the chords with commas in the Textual Entry box at the top, for more chords on a bar use " / " for beat spacing between chords ,C / G /, your slash chords will be ,C/G, with no space. You can also add in Utilities > Leadsheet Textual Editor Any chord name it don't recognize you can go to Utilities > Voicing Editor. You can then export to musicxml that is dragged into Reaper then "MusicXML Chords" button. It can also be imported into Biab File > Open Special > Open MusicXML File... and import the Impor-Visor or Scaler midi also. ReaTrak musicxml chords notation events to regions.lua
Scaler 2 has been updated to 2.0.8. It seems to load correctly now and is no longer blacklisted in to Cubase. But they should change the name as it not seem to scale the right way on a 4k monitor.
A lot of plugins suck there, like waves (older versions?). I get really fed-up with all this updating all the time. A thing that works all of a sudden doesn't anymore after an update. AND TH WINNER IS: WINDOWS !
So i am still curious if anyone found a way to use Scaler 2 with BIAB or RB. The chording sequences coming out of it sound quite good.
Pipeline, I believe we are still in the que with our wish. 2.0.8 was released several weeks ago in the flurry of bug fixes. I am confident they will get to our wish as they promised. Patience, I am watching this closely and will be quick to report when something happens on this front.
Scaler 2.1 is a few weeks away, we are all working really hard on it Thanks for your patience and support :slight_smile: Ed
Ed (one of the developers) has been promising some new surprises in 2.1. If you are an owner, Best to check into the Scaler forum on occasions so you don't miss it.
New Chord Editor Control individual notes and velocities in each chord Use the circle of fifths to easily create chord progressions Search for any chord in Scaler More than 100 new expressions in triplet feel and across several time signatures Add bass/inversion display in chord name
- Audio-Detection Improved accuracy of detection Reduce the number of duplicate chords in results Filter-out unlikely chord types to reduce noise Add ability to detect from a file in the source dropdown New Modulation Preset - Neo-Riemannian Create harmonic transformations from any chord Support custom sounds folder location Support custom chordsets folder location Multi-Select Pattern and Pattern Chaining improvements Add ability to apply extracted voicing to a multi-selection of chords Ability to export chord names to MIDI markers when dragging to DAW New Arpeggio Octave Range option Add ability to select the output MIDI channel Keys-Lock - Chord Mute function now works properly when used with DAW-Sync Ability to select and remove multiple notes with lasso in Detect panel Add ability to synchronise the selected scale across instances
-Bug fixes:
Fix “Right-Click -> Select All” in Pad View Fix erratic behaviour when deleting from a multi-selection in Pad View Fix bind to suggested pathways refresh issue in Modulation Fix UI not redrawing correctly after Clear State Fix lowercase display for minor chords in Modulation panels Fix empty large clip when dragging from MIDI Capture Other fixes and overall stability improvements
"Ability to export chord names to MIDI markers when dragging to DAW"
NO, that couldn't be right, we only just asked for that recently, that should take at least ten+ years if at all to do, shouldn't it ??? 2008 Export Chord Notation with .mid Files
Originally Posted By: MusicStudent
..."Add ability to select the output MIDI channel"...
Can't believe I am back, but this program has had a big impact on my music. A little of this app appears in everything I do. It is now back on sale for the low price of $49. It reminds me a lot of BIAB in the way you can never really master the total content of what this program can do. It literally can hurt my head (in a good way ) thinking about what it is doing. Every use is a discovery. But if you have followed this thread, you already know that...
Riddle me this Batman, where were these genius insightful "Carnac the Great" like developers 30 years ago? OK fair is fair, how about even 10 years ago?
Well someone has to do it, so it might has well be me. We all have our roles to play and apparently mine is to keep everyone up to date on Scaler.
Quote:
New update released over night.
2.3.0 (available 8th February 2020)
Playback Add new Riffs to Melody mode New 70’s Funk & Soul chordsets Prevent notes from hanging when triggered from multiple sources at once. Prevent overlapping notes from hanging in performance/phrases/rhythms/melody/bass modes. Fix hung notes due to keyswitch not resetting properly after being pressed. Fix a playback issue when using alt-click to preview chords. Keys-Lock: Improve chord extension handling of altered chords. UI “Undo/Redo” is now accessible from the Scaler Logo - Right-Click menu. "Import/Export State” is now accessible from the Scaler Logo - Right-Click menu. EDIT panel: labels now refresh properly when changing chord parameters. Add bigger “Bind” buttons on all screens. Fix highlight of chords in Pad-View when using multi-pattern selection. Add ability to search by style in the Scales panel. Other improvements Audio detection from a file can now be run multiple times in a row Sync between instances now maintains multi-selection of patterns. Prevent a crash when changing parameters on a chord in the EDIT Panel after removing/reordering patterns. Prevent unexpected behaviors caused by the UI Keyboard creating notes with no velocity. Fix a calculation error creating notes with a velocity higher than the maximum allowed. The installer will now automatically move the sound library when using a custom location. Improve stability of the audio detection for sample rates up to 96KHz. Prevent a crash when resetting the playback. Prevent a crash when changing a chord voicing after deleting the parent pattern. Prevent a crash when removing Scaler from a track during playback. Fix a voicing calculation error when extracting/applying a voicing to a chord. “Right-Click > Detect” now refreshes the panel properly every time.
Sorry for Delay Jeff, I never saw this question till now
So I don't use RealBand so I can't give you a quick answer. Ir does work well in a standalone mode or with Reaper. If you need this info, get back to me and I will check it out for you.
Ya, I have appointed myself the forum notification board for Scaler 2. While the first track in my DAW template is reserved for BIAB-VST, the second track is reserved for Scaler 2.
New version to be released on May 27. Who doesn't like to hear a nice modulation in there tunes.
Version 2.4.0 free update released today (available 26th of May 2021)
CONTENT New “Common Progressions” Chord Sets New Performances, Bass & Sequences New genre Chord Sets: EDM & Metal 2 new Pluck sounds
MODULATION Progression - Add “Maintain Voicing” option to adapt the suggested chords to your progression’s voicing. Neo-Riemannian - Add “Minimise Movement” option. Mediants - Add “Group Voicing” option to prevent jumps in octave between distant chords.
COMMANDS Add new mappable commands to control Scaler with MIDI CC or keyboard shortcuts.
BIND Add the ability to bind chords to “All” keys instead of “Only White” keys. Add the ability to start the “Bind” area from any note of the keyboard. Add the ability to switch between OCT/ST steps when defining the “Bind” area from the side menu. Add new binding mode “True Scale” to map chords on notes belonging to the selected scale.
PLAYBACK Prevents hanging notes when playing a chord while navigating to another panel. Playback in Section A now follows global settings for “Perform Mode”. Internal playback now cancels previously latched notes to prevent overlap. Fix keyboard display showing keyswitch keys while in Chord Edit mode. Fix an issue in the Detect source selector causing the source to appear empty. Fix an issue in the Sound selector causing the selected value to change back to “Felt Piano” after turning it off. Properly navigate to the “Detect” panel after detecting a chord selection. Prevent latched notes from clashing with internal section playback. Fix an issue preventing the last latched chord from starting playback. Fix an issue in the Voice-Grouping causing the extracted voicing to reapply incorrectly when voiced across multiple octaves. Fix an issue preventing latched chords from playing when triggered from the UI. Avoid stopping playback on UI Close/Reopen.
AUDIO DETECTION Prevent the first chord from being ignored after clearing the detection. Fix an issue causing the result of a file analysis to not display properly.
INTERFACE Improve “lasso” selection on Windows (clicking away from selected content now clears the selection properly). Fix double drag of MIDI content in affected DAWs. Improve “Save” function in Section C (saving individual patterns is now optional). Improve “Save/Override” function in Section C (add ability to select the session to replace from a dropdown menu). Add the ability to “Sync” new parameters between instances (DAW-Sync, Section C Looping, Chord Duration). Add the ability to “Sync” the entire state between instances. The “Add Chord(s) to" option in the Right-Click menu is now accessible from chords in the Section C. Add “Replace Current Pattern” option in the Right-Click menu for chord selection. Fix keyboard display showing wrong marker/icons on keyswitch keys. Fix an issue causing the Section B chords to be hidden on navigation. Fix a navigation issue when detecting chords from Right-Click > Detect. Disable unavailable “Chord Mute” option in some Keys-Lock mode.
I could have put this video in a number of places, but I chose here. I have always realized the significant overlap between BIAB and Scaler but this video is the best I have seen of someone attempting to build a song, ala BIAB, using Scaler. In reality a workflow which combines both BIAB and Scaler takes advantage of the best of both.
It is that time again. The folks over in Scaler forum are buzzin this morning with release of Scaler 2.4.1
WARNING: If this is your first introduction to Scaler 2, you may want to start viewing from the beginning of this thread. Scaler 2.4.1 is for extreme musical nerds only!
Just for those who need to know. Scaler 2.4.1 Change Log
Content & Playback o New Common Phrases (Chordal & Progression) o New Basic Performances o Improve timing precision - Fix timing offset in recorded performance, prevent short notes from being added to recorded MIDI at looping points and prevent hung notes. o Add the ability to Quantise and Latch chords with Perform mode OFF o Fix “Chord+Melody” playback to avoid creating overlapping MIDI notes.
MIDI Mapping o Add the ability to manually select the MIDI CC to map from a dropdown when creating an action. o Add the ability to map "MIDI Panic" to a command binding o Add the ability to bind dropdown menus' "Previous" / "Next" command to a MIDI CC o Add new assignable commands for keyswitch actions (toggle chord/scale mode, toggle chord mute, switch melody patterns) o Add the ability to disable keyswitch (green keys) from the side menu. o Add the ability to override an existing command mapping.
Other Improvements o Fix - Extracted Voicing - Avoid creating an extra gap in octave when re-voicing extended chords o Include inversions when exporting MIDI markers (slash chords) o Fix multi-selection not applying changes when modifying multiple chords in EDIT matrix o Keys-Lock - “Scale Notes Mapped” profile now prioritise the natural position of each mapped note correctly. o Forcing a chord set into a scale now refreshes the chord colours and Section B properly. o Multi-selection of chords are now moved properly when dragged from a Section C pattern into an empty pattern. o Fix an issue causing the Keys-Lock settings to be lost when entering/exiting the Chord-Edit view. o Dragging a single chord with an expression ON now exports the duration of a single chord instead of the duration of the whole pattern. o Fix a bug in the generation of modulation pathways creating duplicate suggestions in Modulation Popup. o Fix an issue preventing the transposition of "Community" chord sets. o Fix an issue causing the "..." button to appear in the wrong location
It is that time again. The folks over in Scaler forum are buzzin this morning with release of Scaler 2.4.1
WARNING: If this is your first introduction to Scaler 2, you may want to start viewing from the beginning of this thread. Scaler 2.4.1 is for extreme musical nerds only!
Thanks a lot Dan... My day was all planned out, until I came across this thread... I'm in trouble now.
Thanks a lot Dan... My day was all planned out, until I came across this thread... I'm in trouble now.
Don't blame the messenger!
But that aside, do you all believe 20,000+ views on this topic? I'm wondering where that ranks in the records for the # of views in the "off topic forum"?
But that aside, do you all believe 20,000+ views on this topic? I'm wondering where that ranks in the records for the # of views in the "off topic forum"?
must be a record, or close to it... Just looking at the Scaler 2+ Bundle... Would anyone recommend the "Producer's Guide to Scaler 2 ? Or is most of this information covered on youtube..?
Nanohost is free and will permit you to load Scaler2 as a standalone version. A standalone version makes Scaler 2 quick and easy to work off line and allows you to focus on its full feature set. Scaler 2 standalone has all the sounds and ability to save your work so when you do need to bring it all into your DAW it is there.
Nanohost is free and will permit you to load Scaler2 as a standalone version. A standalone version makes Scaler 2 quick and easy to work off line and allows you to focus on its full feature set. Scaler 2 standalone has all the sounds and ability to save your work so when you do need to bring it all into your DAW it is there.
Thanks for the link to nanohost... I'll give it a try.
this nanohost program looks very interesting compared to enormous DAWs ; I will give a try too thanks for the link
I have a directory of shortcuts I set up for the multiple VSTs I wrap in Nanohost to play as standalones. Credits to @Rustyspoon for recommending this app a good year ago.
Unfortunately, that cannot be utilized with the program on this site. Very big minus. Second, isn’t you who needs complex chords other than jazz music? Rock and pop is simple if you want to do it. As for the melody so Scaler what makes the melody so I don't think it's a song melody. The program on this page may well create a melody that can be sung.
Unfortunately, that cannot be utilized with the program on this site. Very big minus.
A long time effort has gone into attempting to remedying this point. And some limited progress has been made. Particularly using Reaper to share chord charts between Scaler and BIAB-VST via the midi markers which both utilize. But, yes, much more needs to be done.
Here is the Manual Method for moving chord charts from Scaler to BIAB.
Thanks Dan, very good explaination, but to what end? I'm not sure why anyone would want to do this... Scaler2.5 and BIAB are both excellent tools for generating MIDI and Audio files, which are part of a balanced diet for my hungry DAW... edit; BTW thanks again for link to the excellent wrapper, https://www.tone2.com/nanohost.html another excellent tool.
I want to share chord charts across the two programs. Why? Because, simply put, Scaler is a better tool for creating interesting chord charts and BIAB is a better tool for creating accompaniments to play the chord charts.
What I showed above is the current best "manual" workflow, short of just retyping them over again. Granted, it is not an attractive workflow either way.
There is another workflow which moves the chord chart from Scaler to Reaper to BIAB-VST. But that is not perfect either.
Unfortunately, that cannot be utilized with the program on this site. Very big minus.
A long time effort has gone into attempting to remedying this point. And some limited progress has been made. Particularly using Reaper to share chord charts between Scaler and BIAB-VST via the midi markers which both utilize. But, yes, much more needs to be done.
Here is the Manual Method for moving chord charts from Scaler to BIAB.
Thanks for the tip. I still can’t use Scaler so much that I would play those midi keyboards like one in a video on youtube. So I can't save it. Help would be appreciated.
I just bought Scaler 2.5 and am trying to figure out what to do with it. This is far from obvious! I would just like to ask:
Has anyone here actually used Scaler together with BIAB to create a song? If so, is it posted somewhere with an explanation of the connection? I'm thinking of something like, "The first verse is how I originally wrote it, the second verse uses a progression Scaler generated based on the first."
(Cool, a thread for me to use for this...) Has anyone here actually used Scaler together with BIAB to create a song?
OMG, fresh meat! This thread will be 2 years old next month. With 28,000 views it is the second most viewed thread on this site. Which is a testimony to my personal (nagging) persistance , the forums interest and the synergy between Scaler and BIAB.
I have also made a number of videos using Scaler and BIAB, however, I don't leave these on the web. But there are lots and lots of pro videos of Scaler and even some specifically for Scaler and BIAB. Look in this tread for some links.
I might suggest you start a separate thread for what peaks you specific interests with using Scaler and BIAB. Keep in mind there is an excellent user forum for Scaler where you will recognize a number of the folks from here. Actually, this is where our little chinese friend hangs his hat.
Thanks! Can you tell me something about where Scaler came in? Did it make suggestions to spiff up a simple progression, did you use those "performance" things where you play somebody's chords by playing a scale, did it generate "modulation pathways" for you?
Oh, and did you still have a human soul after collaborating with Scaler? =8^)
Scaler comes in at the mark shown. Yes, this is one of those "performance " things which play over my chords.
Scaler, like BIAB, creates midi. What scaler does different is it permits chord voicings to be explicitly set and adjusted based on how you want to hear or play the chords. Second, Scaler identifies the harmonic series of chords for any specific scale or mode. With this you can hear and select the next chord in your sequence from within the selected scale.
Scale permits me to visually identify, examine and hear my chord progressions as I compose "on the fly". It has permitted me to voice the chord on the keyboard as I play and capture the exact midi notes I want to hear. This was a game changer for me and has become an integral part of my music making. Fact is, Scaler has allowed me to get more of me into my music.
Yes, Scaler does make suggestions for chord sequences and does generate modulation pathways, and it does construct performance sets and much more. So I do understand your point about losing one's soul to software which writes the music for you. Heck, we are in a BIAB forum so we all understand that reality. I can only say, we all do the best we can with the tools and talent at our disposal.
Visit the Scaler forum. Join in the chats and review the videos. You say you already bought the software, so you should see what others are doing.
Scaler comes in at the mark shown. Yes, this is one of those "performance " things which play over my chords.
Thanks, that's what I was looking for. There are many, many words and videos explaining what Scaler can do, I'm wondering what I can do with it.
Originally Posted By: MusicStudent
I do understand your point about losing one's soul to software which writes the music for you.
OK, I was just kidding about losing your soul.
There are certainly concerns to be had about the effects of this stuff on creativity, but I don't go in for the idea that there's some mystical force inside us that we must protect and nurture by only getting ideas from organic sources.
I'm actually a big fan of automation and algorithmic composition as sources of musical material, and have no qualms about that. I even use pitch recognition on raw noise to generate MIDI output that you may or may not want to call music; I generate some output, delete all the obvious crap, then work what's left into something that sounds good to me.
Here's one "workflow" that might horrify some:
1) Pick an algorithm, set some parameters, and let it generate an hour of music with 8 parts. 2) Listen for parts that sound good and discard the rest, yielding, say, 5 minutes of music in 4 parts. 3) Voice, arrange, edit.
(Of course, an hour of 8 monkeys jumping around on a rectangle of 4 pianos would probably also provide interesting material, and now I'm wondering if anyone has ever made music out of animals "playing" instruments like that. I absolutely guarantee if you take that hour-long recording, you will find interesting sections, structured by the physical ratios of their bodies and behaviors. Anyway!)
Originally Posted By: MusicStudent
Visit the Scaler forum. Join in the chats and review the videos. You say you already bought the software, so you should see what others are doing.
Already there, thanks. The occasional comments about BIAB are interesting and strangely familiar.
Aural gave me a pure, abstract MIDI, generated using algorithms I know nothing about, and I messed with it in Logic. It's a little long (10 minutes), but I tried to keep it interesting.
It’s a mammoth update with some really nice new features.
Scaler 2.7 is set for release with the following changes:
Changelog 2.7.0
• New features
Add Live Sync ability to keep other Scaler instances synchronised in realtime. Add new modes for Parallel Harmony to generate progressions by thirds, fourths, and fifths. Add Auto Play in browser (Section A) to enable quick preview of chord sets. Add Multi Voice Output (Multi Midi Out) option to split each note of chords onto separate channels. Add Global UI Velocity controls to change the strength of MIDI notes played through the interface. Add ability to consolidate chords from multiple patterns into a single chord set file. • New Content
Sequence ‘Moods’. 80s, Classical, HipHop, LoFi Chord Sets. Fixed Bass Chord Sets (Triad and Extended). Orchestral Divisi Chord Sets (Intended to work with Multi Midi Out). Experimental Phrases Experimental Performances Internal Orchestral Bass Instrument Internal LoFi Instrument • Improvements
Make undo/redo buttons always visible in Section C. Clear Undo/Redo history when clearing state or when importing a state file. Fix Daw-Sync timing causing playback to start early in Cubase. Fix Play-Quantize offset calculation. Remember the last selected scale on circle of fifths in the Voicing Editor.
I may end this tread with this new features video. Scaler has now advanced to such a high level that for those of you who have not jumped on board, it may just be too late.
The new vid is mostly impressive but the low fi crackle is pretty crappy. Not a tool I'd delve into but impressive stuff....oh, Avant Gard as a preset must be an oxymoron. Perhaps avant gare?
The new vid is mostly impressive but the low fi crackle is pretty crappy. Not a tool I'd delve into but impressive stuff....oh, Avant Gard as a preset must be an oxymoron. Perhaps avant gare?
L'avant gare? Before the train station? Interesting name for a preset. No idea what it would sound like, other than crowd noises.
v2.7 just showed up as an update in my Plugin Boutique account. Downloaded. Installation next. Just wondering what it's going to take for them to create a major version upgrade that I'll have to pay for. Many other software developers would have it on v4, at least. Ca-ching. Ca-ching. Ca-ching. Points to the devs!
It’s a mammoth update with some really nice new features.
Scaler 2.7 is set for release with the following changes:
Changelog 2.7.0
• New features
Add Live Sync ability to keep other Scaler instances synchronised in realtime. Add new modes for Parallel Harmony to generate progressions by thirds, fourths, and fifths. Add Auto Play in browser (Section A) to enable quick preview of chord sets. Add Multi Voice Output (Multi Midi Out) option to split each note of chords onto separate channels. Add Global UI Velocity controls to change the strength of MIDI notes played through the interface. Add ability to consolidate chords from multiple patterns into a single chord set file. • New Content
Sequence ‘Moods’. 80s, Classical, HipHop, LoFi Chord Sets. Fixed Bass Chord Sets (Triad and Extended). Orchestral Divisi Chord Sets (Intended to work with Multi Midi Out). Experimental Phrases Experimental Performances Internal Orchestral Bass Instrument Internal LoFi Instrument • Improvements
Make undo/redo buttons always visible in Section C. Clear Undo/Redo history when clearing state or when importing a state file. Fix Daw-Sync timing causing playback to start early in Cubase. Fix Play-Quantize offset calculation. Remember the last selected scale on circle of fifths in the Voicing Editor.
Thanks... I just downloaded the Scaler 2.7 update file, (6439_Scaler-2.7.0.pkg) and have not figured out how to open it to view the file's contents... MS Word & Notepad say it's too large to open... Any Help Please. How do I install this update?
Thanks... I just downloaded the Scaler 2.7 update file, (6439_Scaler-2.7.0.pkg) and have not figured out how to open it to view the file's contents... MS Word & Notepad say it's too large to open... Any Help Please. How do I install this update?
Common problem for me in the past. The update comes in two versions MAC and PC. It is more than likely you downloaded the wrong one for your system. The PC version is named 6440_Scaler-2.7.0.zip. You have the Mac version Is this the problem?? If so, go back and get the right one.
Thanks... I just downloaded the Scaler 2.7 update file, (6439_Scaler-2.7.0.pkg) and have not figured out how to open it to view the file's contents... MS Word & Notepad say it's too large to open... Any Help Please. How do I install this update?
Common problem for me in the past. The update comes in two versions MAC and PC. It is more than likely you downloaded the wrong one for your system. The PC version is named 6440_Scaler-2.7.0.zip. You have the Mac version Is this the problem?? If so, go back and get the right one.
Thanks... I just downloaded the Scaler 2.7 update file, (6439_Scaler-2.7.0.pkg) and have not figured out how to open it to view the file's contents... MS Word & Notepad say it's too large to open... Any Help Please. How do I install this update?
Common problem for me in the past. The update comes in two versions MAC and PC. It is more than likely you downloaded the wrong one for your system. The PC version is named 6440_Scaler-2.7.0.zip. You have the Mac version Is this the problem?? If so, go back and get the right one.
I'll double check, and let you know asap.
That was it... Successful update... Thanks so much.
What can I say, I can't stop now, I feel a bit responsible.
2.7.2 (available January 5th, 2022)
Changelog 2.7.2
Filter SysEx messages from ScalerControl on M1 (improves Logic Pro X MIDI FX on Apple Silicon). Handle bind velocity based on default or custom chord velocity. Prevent a crash with the next user set selector when the folder is empty. Fix a crash when sending too many change scale commands to multiple instances simultaneously. Fix an issue causing the auto-play to jump to the scale playback when browsing chord sets.
Mario, since I know you know music theory cold, and have superb experience with MIDI music production, could you take a moment and tell me what Scaler does FOR YOU?
Mario, since I know you know music theory cold, and have superb experience with MIDI music production, could you take a moment and tell me what Scaler does FOR YOU?
Hi Matt,
The main thing it does for me is to give me different chords and chord progressions that I might not of thought of using BiaB. Being able to select chords from a different points of view does help, i.e. scales, modes, artist, genre, etc.
I have tried the melody function and it is on par with BiaB's Melodist. That is it will not give me a complete melody line that I find usable, just like the Melodist. I doubt no program will do that for me.
To be truthful I rarely use Scaler. I bought it when it was on sale and hoped it would do a lot more for me. I have worked with it and watched the videos but I keep going back to BiaB.
It might be beneficial to both of us if you asked the same question to a power user.
Thanks. No, you answered it to my satisfaction. I hadn’t even considered the melody line, only the chord progression, and you said it can help give you ideas you might not have considered. Very good.
Mario, how do I get those chord progressions into BIAB without typing them?
I also bought Scaler when it was on sale mostly because Dan likes it and I like Dan so...
Most of the time I type them in. On occasion I will bring the chord progression into my DAW Studio One Pro 6, lets say a chord a measure. Then In BiaB I will quickly put in a chord a measure, usually the same chord in each measure. My DAW I will convert the BiaB tracks to the correct chords via the chord track. Note that I do this in MIDI. It should work with RTs but you may get some artifacts doing it this way.
One of these days I'm gonna bring the chord progression into my DAW as block chords, extract the MIDI track from the DAW, then insert it into BiaB and have BiaB figure out the chords.
So I ask other Scaler users how do you get your chords into BiaB?
So I ask other Scaler users how do you get your chords into BiaB?
Unfortuantely, there are issues with this.
Scaler will write any chord progession or sequence to a .mid file. BIAB will Import a .mid file and interpret the chords to the chord chart. It should be that easy, but...
BIAB just struggles in assigning the chord names correctly. Even simple triads get messed up and key signatures. Don't even try chord extensions or slash chords.
I just spent an hour trying to illustrate something positive in a video. BIAB was just not in the mood to cooperate today. Even with a RTFS, it was an effort in frustration.
Bottom line BIAB and Scaler do not play well together in regards to exchanging specific detailed chord designations and voicings via copy/paste or export/import. In Scaler you can specify the exact notes and order of notes you want to play. Meanwhile, BIAB will play what "it" composes based on the Chord names you enter. I am afraid the fundamental premise of the two programs differ in this regard. That is why you need both.
Yes, we've had forms of this discussion in various environments. The problem is the lack of chord info support in MIDI (even in the new MIDI 2).
BIAB cannot be expected to interpret the notes into exactly the same chords as were sent, yet alone get voicings right. Now, if Scaler could export in Music XML format, then we might have something. Has anyone asked Scaler if they could do that?
I am not sure what the consensous is, or if XML it is coming or not. But based on my morings exercise, BIAB could do a better job in importing and naming the chords in a .MID file even if it is not able to play them as named.
(ChatGPT:) I'm sorry, but I'm not familiar with a software called Scaler 2.0. Could you provide more information about what this software does and what you are trying to do with it?
(ChatGPT:) Scaler is a music composition software that helps users find and play chord progressions. It does not support MusicXML, which is a file format for representing music notation and other music-related data. Instead, Scaler can import and export MIDI files, which can be used to exchange data between digital audio workstations and other music software. If you have a MusicXML file that you would like to use with Scaler, you may be able to convert it to a MIDI file using a separate software tool or online service.
Thanks, Dan. I read that. It looks like you are correct, they haven't reached consensus on HOW MUCH of Music XML to support, but it does seem as if the chord progression and MIDI should be supported for both export and import. Once that's done, you can reassess the accuracy of importing it into BIAB.
I remember you asked me some time back to help you out and ask them to put chord markers in the exported midi so I joined their forum and posted all the info and they implemented the markers, so you have the markers now. I'm just glade to be helpful and help out when users ask for help.
I remember you asked me some time back to help you out and ask them to put chord markers in the exported midi so I joined their forum and posted all the info and they implemented the markers, so you have the markers now.
• New Content 66 Song Chordsets: Ambient, Anime, Synth Divisi 4 Part, Latin Jazz, Movie Theme, Reggae, J-Pop, K-Pop 14 Artists Chordsets: Lloyd Brown, Pablo Sanchez Expressions Patterns: EDM Bass, Melodic Bass, Sidechain Bass, Common Progression Phrases, Common Rhythms, 7/4 Rhythms, 9/4 Rhythms 10 Japanese scales New Slap Bass sound. New guitar chord positions.
• Improvements Prevent CPU spikes when starting recording or using MIDI Panic Improve stability on M1 systems. Add compatibility with M1 Native plugins in Pro Tools. Prevent OpenGL crash when saving a session from the Save popup. Ensure performance parameters are reset properly when switching bind OFF Fix playback timings being reset when moving chords to empty slots or reordering slots in Section C. Prevent NoteOff messages from sharing the same sample number as the next NoteOn event of the sequence.
I just drafted Dan The Man to do a Q&A on Scaler at 8:00 pm Eastern tomorrow evening, Monday, 6/26/2023. I will post a Zoom link here and on Off-Topic. BYOB
Topic: Billy's Zoom Meeting Time: Jun 26, 2023 07:00 PM Central Time (US and Canada)
I remember you asked me some time back to help you out and ask them to put chord markers in the exported midi so I joined their forum and posted all the info and they implemented the markers, so you have the markers now.
You are absolutely correct!
That's great I was glad I could help you, I don't mind helping out with Scaler for you so that's why I downloaded it and tried it all out, I was just worried that others would say "unfortunately we have no control over all that nonsense".
Scaler 2.9.0 Final Build (Releases April 25, 2024)
Content & Playback 8 new Arpeggio Patterns (Converge, Diverge, Converge/Diverge, Thumbs Up, Thumbs Up/Down, Pinky Up, Pinky Up/Down, Spanish Tremolo) 22 New Song Chordsets (Celtic, Chill, Country, Alternative, Progressive Rock) 13 new Bass Expressions in the new Triplet Bass category “Progressive” Chordsets category renamed to “Progressive House” New Live Suggest mode Generate chords compatible with your progression based on your currently played chord. Suggestions update in realtime per chord. New ‘Passages’ Articulation 7 New ‘Passages’’ that add movements to chord progressions. Key-switches allow switching passages whilst performing. New Guitar Features Left-handed representation for Fretboard and Chord Chart display Other Improvements Improved automatic chord detection General bug fixes and DAW compatibility Re-introduced ‘Slap bass’ Internal sound missing in Scaler 2.8
I'm sure the program is incredible, but I tried it and never could figure out how to integrate it into my workflow.
I've worked with all kind of software my entire life, and I'm a fast learner, but this must be one of the most confusing and counterintuitive programs I've ever found. The GUI is, to me, a perfect example of good looks, but very poor usability, and unfortunately the documentation and official "tutorial" videos don't help at all.
I've worked with all kind of software my entire life, and I'm a fast learner, but this must be one of the most confusing and counterintuitive programs I've ever found. The GUI is, to me, a perfect example of good looks, but very poor usability, and unfortunately the documentation and official "tutorial" videos don't help at all.
I don't disagree with you guys. Scaler can be perceived as odd and therefore not for everyone. But I would say that what it does, is truely unique. And at $39 it can be entertaining, educational and a great value for the buck. I actually spend more time in the standalone version (which is only coming in Scaler 3, but there is a free addon which works well now). So no need to even open the DAW. And by the way I have never read the manual. There is nothing better to experiment with chord progessions, chord voicings, scales, modes, modulations, key changes, and piano patterns not to mention a wide selection of sounds. Pure ear candy to provide inspiration.
I am not trying to change anyones mind here. Just enjoying the conversation and trying to add a perspective. Carry on.
I also remain somewhat confused and generally puzzled by Scaler. But, with that said, I am quite glad to have it! It is fun to mess around with and it cost me less than dinner at Fridays! Dan has never steered me wrong!
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