Just released today - from our favorite Guitar VST maker!
The latest in the SESSION GUITARIST series brings the pure, warm tone of nylon strings to our acoustic guitar collection. Recorded from a one-of-a-kind, handcrafted original, and with a range of intuitive studio controls, PICKED NYLON gives you everything you need for a perfect, clean sound.
That is a way cool demo... Have you tried it yet? It makes me feel like I must have it... I'm a pretty good guitarist (should be after all these years), but I just can't make my guitar recordings sound this good... Recently, I've been playing around with NI's "Picked Acoustic", sounds so fine... I plan on trying to convert some of my recorded guitar performances to MIDI using Melodyne and then rendering thru NI's Gtr.Libraries have you tried this?
That is a way cool demo... Have you tried it yet? It makes me feel like I must have it... I'm a pretty good guitarist (should be after all these years), but I just can't make my guitar recordings sound this good... Recently, I've been playing around with NI's "Picked Acoustic", sounds so fine... I plan on trying to convert some of my recorded guitar performances to MIDI using Melodyne and then rendering thru NI's Gtr.Libraries have you tried this?
I am hearing for first time today as this was just released. I will likely get this since I own all the others. Each one gets better than the last as they continually include more and more. But while the $99 USD is a more than afair price, it will go down given time. Also, my strategy is to stick with Komplete Upgrades where you get the biggest bang for your buck. this will likely be in Komplete 14 next summer.
I am planning on picking this one up. I usually don't get guitar patches or VSTis but my nylon string guitar is lacking a lot of tone, i.e. it is a very cheap one. It looks like this one will fit the bill perfectly.
Ni sent me add as well... Pretty video. However, I am starting to feel that I should put a break on their "session guitar" series. While they sound fantastic, they are VERY limited to pretty much fixed patterns they recorded. Yes, there are variations and different root settings, tones, key switches, bridge positions and all that good stuff, still 200 patterns half of which are likely I will never use (comparing to other series of Session guitars I have used), I feel it is a bit too much considering that you can NOT expand library. Patterns are NOT editable beyond root note position. And I did not have a good experience with playing a guitar midi file through the plugin(s).
Having said that, Session Guitars are super easy to work with if you want a fast sketch and find useful styles in the given patterns
I am seriously considering Ilya Efimov VST guitar(s). Because you can create and import your own patterns / strums and it sounds in par with Kontakt stuff.
Pretty well said. I can't disagree with any of that. The demo's they provide are constructed by the same expects who designed the sounds. They know how to tweek these applications and it is not as easy as one might think.
There are some wonderful sounds which are available at the push of a key. I have used Session Guitars on multiple occasions but never with "guitar midi". It will trigger nicely from block chords to provide the patterns or you can play a chord and switch the notes on the fly to modify patterns. I have also played melodies on the keyboard when needed. I can't do what they do, but I have almost always had fun and have gotten some usable music into my recordings.
So I think Misha and I are pretty much on the same page with this.
Are you saying that I can't input a pattern that I play? The trailer says this nylon guitar can accept MIDI data so I should be able to play a strumming pattern on a MIDI controller then have it played back. Right? This would be a show stopper for me if it can't do that.
You can play a chord on the midi keyboard and it plays the pattern, and change chord to play live etc. This can also be used on one finger mode ..So play a c key on midi keyboard then a single f , then single g etc and it plays the pattern as and when you Change its a great song writing tool and a very respected guitar sound too !!.
However, I am not sure I entirely agree with him. There is an editor in some of the more advanced SG products for adjusting pattern to allow you to customize them. But you can't manually play in a pattern. Remember these are samples (which is why they sound so good) and not modeling which is what is used in other strum packages.
What you can do is change up the patterns on fly via your keyboard while they are playing. This can give a syncopated (G, G9, Gsus4...) feel which I like to use to customize the sound.
Are you saying that I can't input a pattern that I play? The trailer says this nylon guitar can accept MIDI data so I should be able to play a strumming pattern on a MIDI controller then have it played back. Right? This would be a show stopper for me if it can't do that.
Thanx in advance for your time.
They say this
"You can also record in your own parts using any MIDI controller, and then add in details like slides, fret noise, and harmonics to bring your compositions to life."
and this
"Create your own melodies, or choose from 201 picked and strummed patterns, recorded by a session pro"
This is very interesting and worth every penny of the $99 BUT I will wait for Black Friday to see if I can get it half off. If not I'll wait until the next sale. I WILL buy this but I WON'T pay full price! (They have trained me pretty well!)
Melody, yes... strums are nearly impossible to program unless you go surgical. Patterns are pretty much fixed. Evil Dragon is correct 100%.
They do sound good, but when you look at number of patterns - "200" they are advertising, they are actually variation sets. Specifically about 5 per style. So you have something like "Country Rock" which will have 5 variations for that style. So in "real life" scenario you get 40 styles with corresponding variations. What sucks, is they want you to buy whole session instrument again, when new comes out there is no "upgrade" path or purchasing patterns separately. Series sound good, but they are limited of what you can do with them.
Just a word of caution.
$40-$60 would be a fair price to pay in my opinion to have them in arsenal.
Then I should be able to play my electric guitar, convert it to MIDI, and have it play in this software. I also should be able to play directly into it with my MIDI guitar controller.
I'm really not that interested in the strumming patterns per say, I'm just looking for a good sounding nylon string guitar VSTi. This one sounds good but so does this one:
Mario, don't you own any of the SG guitar products? Many of these are two separate nki instruments 1)Performance based Strumming/Picking patterns and 2) Instrument Samples for Melody. So you get two different instrument. (See Picture)
The Samples for Melody (#2) are very similar to the package you have shown above. You play a midi note or input a midi file and you get a audio sound from a sample. This will have articulations associated with each sound.
While #1 is a performance based where you hit a note and you get a loop performance. These are patterns which we have been discussing up until this point.
As best I understand this is exactly what is provided in the Picked Nylon.
Perhaps what you want is actually the Melody samples only. But it is important to know the difference. Or you might miss out.
By the way SG Picked Nylon is 6.43 GB while your alternative is 1.5 GB if that helps you in your decision.
No, I have been schooled much like JJJ. I may, but only when it drops to half price (which is historically probable) or when they include it in the Komplete bundle upgrade.
Do they discount new products within a year of release to 1/2 price... at "summer sale event" or it is something like 20% off?
This time around, Komplete upgrade was a bit of disappointment for me. The only item I really wanted was "Cuba", but it is much less than what I expected. No crying, just opinion. Ohh that fancy piano, that I think you posted earlier this year does have a very decent felt piano synth...probably the best "felt" piano I have heard "out of computer". Luckily it came packaged with the update.
I decided to upgrade at the last couple of days of sale... In event they decide to go "subscription" (since NI sold themselves out to big Francisco in January) at least I will have the last non-subscription version
Do they discount new products within a year of release to 1/2 price... at "summer sale event" or it is something like 20% off?
To the best of my recollection I got two of the older Session Guitar packages for $49. But not within a year of launch. But I have also paid the full $99 price. I have all the packages in the picture above. The biggest contribution was Komplete 13 from several months ago which were dirt cheap. I think this will be in Komplete 14.
Not sure how I disappointed? You have to remember I am a recent retiree so I am going through a bit of a transition.
I found that playing a polyphonic midi guitar file into the NI Picked Acoustic vst in (Melody Instrument Mode) works great... Very impressive results. I believe the "Picked Nylon" vst works the same way...
"You have to remember I am a recent retiree so I am going through a bit of a transition."
Dan, that was a joke. I know how much you like Session guitars, that is why I asked.
My grandma told me a story once... How she and her her "big" (~10yo) brother hunted chipmunks to sell to a local tannery to get money to buy my great grandma a scarf for her birthday. I am wondering if NI will accept squirrel hides for trade? 20 squirrels - 1 Picked Nylon w free shipping. Who knows, maybe new owner wants to diversify payment methods.
---------- Bloc-head, can you possibly share an example of what you came up with playing guitar midi file through picked acoustic (melody)?
I do not know what I am doing wrong, but a playback just sounds lousy to me.
Here is a midi chop using picked acoustic (melody mode / open string) Picked acoustic
Here is same midi ran through SF2, changing nothing: SF2
Admitting, I am not very savvy with midi. Perhaps there is little "something" I forgot to press in Picked A to make it sound amazing. So far, to my ears SF2 wins.
Rustyspoon#, I had the same issue before transposing... Try transposing your midi file up 12 simi-tones... made a huge difference. I'm out of town, and away from my studio, but I'll try to provide an example in a few days when I return and get settled in.
bloc-head, Thanks! That worked. No need to share file. I used a midi filter to transpose, maybe it will work better if I actually shift notes? But I think it should make no difference.
Ok first impression: While it made a "huge difference" from how it plays out of the box, still there is something unnatural. I tried tweaking "humanize" section, fret noise knob etc. Transitions and slides are a bit mechanical. I am talking about "open string" picking option, does better job in flageolet section, but that is only to be used in certain nuances. Muted was not horrible too, but again that only for certain things.
I guess my biggest issue is that patterns are not programmable and there is no strum option. My consensus, it is good for "certain" picked melodies, but far not for random/average. ---
I tried Sunburst, got a much better result. That is because electric is far more forgiving than acoustic
P.S. I do not want to sound like a fan boy (I actually am) but that is what I love in BIAB, transitions are very natural for the most part, as a human would play. I know I am comparing apples to oranges, I just wish NI would done a more universal guitar plugin so it can eat both strum + picked and be fully tweakable and sound natural...
The transposing is quite common amount guitars and basses. Both are written an octave higher than they sound and this is important depending on what patch you are using. Some patches automatically transpose them for you while others do not, which also can be confusing IF you already transposed them.
Secondly and I say this with all respect your notes are very mundane. You need to liven them up with a few nuances. You might try some of these suggestions: 1-put a quick portamento on a few notes, especially on notes that are on the same guitar string: I can send you a chart on this if you need one. Note that this is not a grace note, it must be a little faster than that. 2-add a little vibrato on a few notes. In your example a very short vibrato would work best. 3-have extreme velocities on those notes: This works only if your sound source has velocity layers. No guitarist has the same initial volume on every note. 4-subtle changes in timing also help. 5-if your sound source allows it choose different picking positions. Picking more toward the guitar's neck will yield a different timbre then picking closer to the bridge. If emulating finger picking and the pointer finger being #1 and the pinky #4 the #3 finger would be closer to the bridge and playing the higher notes while the #1 finger being closer to the neck.
This all I can think of off of the top of my head. I hope some of this will help.
Mario, I think you will appreciate the "manipulations" available in this package. As you pointed out... It can take a lot of friggin and fussin to get it right. Like Misha indicated, BIAB has spoiled us a bit with its ease of integration of high quality sound. These midi tools and VSTi require a bit more effort.= - but when you invest more of your effort, the results are more rewarding.
Here is Picked Acoustic which is an older SG product. It provides both a Melody and a Strumming nki. As I have witnessed in SG products each new generation offers more features. I see this in the file organization in the SG Nylon Picked demo. Here I plucked out a simple arp melody on my keyboard over my current chord progress project. Here is the mp3 to give an idea of the sound (as best I can punch out this morning). No adjustments in the DAW - sound straight from the VSTi.
Here is Picked Acoustic which is an older SG product. It provides both a Melody and a Strumming nki. As I have witnessed in SG products each new generation offers more features.
But they did something weird with Sunburst! They don't give you the melody nki unless you pay for the deluxe version (which of course I did!)
I wish they would change the session series so that all of the older models got the new upgrades including patterns. I guess something more like EZ Keys would be nice where they have the patterns available in any instrument. With that said I hate how broken up into individually purchased products the EZ Keys stuff is. I am spoiled by the UltraPAK approach of BIAB.
Dan, that was an outstanding emulation that would fool many guitarist. If you hadn't told me I would have thought that was "organic"!
Yes working in MIDI is time consuming. That is why some of my showcase posts are far and few between. But I much prefer working in MIDI than in RTs/RDs. YMMV
Yes BiaB is light years ahead of the competition in RTs and RDs in sounds and play ability. But it is light years behind other MIDI products like EZKeys and some keyboards. If you want to work in time signatures other than 2,3,or 4/4 and/or you want to put chords on an 8th or 16th note followed immediately by another chord your out of luck.
Mario, Thanks for detailed explanation. That was a completely random piece of midi that I tried. Not something I was working on. Just to see how well it will take just "any" guitar file.
---
Block-head, pretty smooth. Thank you for sharing. Was this actually (initially) recorded using Picked acoustics or something else? If the answer is no... did you tweak actual composition (besides 12 semitones) for transitions, etc. or did nothing except for P.Acoustic sound preset?
I'm a big fan of Indiginus' instruments, and if you've got the full version of Kontakt, I'd suggest checking them out. Orange Tree's stuff is great as well, but I just find Indiginus' instruments more fun to play. YMMV.
Block-head, pretty smooth. Thank you for sharing. Was this actually (initially) recorded using Picked acoustics or something else? If the answer is no... did you tweak actual composition (besides 12 semitones) for transitions, etc. or did nothing except for P.Acoustic sound preset?
Thanks!
this was just an old midi file I found online. Don’t know when or how it was recorded. No tweaking.
Nice demo track Bloc-Head. It sounds very natural to me.
I'm disappointed to read the MIDI is a file you found on the internet. I hoped you had spent some time figuring out how to make the VSTi play what you want, not what it wants so you could share your expertise with everyone!
I haven’t had the program very long, and so far I’ve just scratched the surface. I still want to try recording straight into cakewalk, and then using Melodyne, convert the audio to a midi file, and play thru the vst.
Nice thread guys. Didn't expect all the interest and input when I posted. Hope we all learned a bit, I know I did.
So who ever is the first to purchase SG - Picked Nylon, be sure to add an entry to this thread to let us know. By the way, I am taking bets on who is the first.
Here is a link to another attempt at demoing my use of the NI "Picked Acoustic" Vsti I made a few edits to the midi file and added Bass, Drums, and Elec-piano...
And while I am here, this vid details much of what we have discussed - adjusting patterns (it can be done to an extent) despite what EvilDragon says. Also articulations like slides, percussion hits and endings are all done with KeySwitches. These illustrated features are common to all Session Guitar products.
Another excellent demo... note that one of the main differences between "Picked Acoustic" and "Strummed Acoustic" is the latter's lack of the "Melody Mode" which is unfortunate...
Another excellent demo... note that one of the main differences between "Picked Acoustic" and "Strummed Acoustic" is the latter's lack of the "Melody Mode" which is unfortunate...
Ya, this was mentioned. SG does not have a consistent package content across the different products. Not sure what the logic in this is?
Sweet! Back off on the guitar volume and mostly reduce its brightness. Make the guitar a bit darker. Bring the vocals more to the front. Drums sound right on. See if you can use a key switch to change the guitar strum pattern (ever so little) between versus and chorus. Just my 2cents. This is really nice though. thanks for sharing.
Sweet! Back off on the guitar volume and mostly reduce its brightness. Make the guitar a bit darker. Bring the vocals more to the front. Drums sound right on. See if you can use a key switch to change the guitar strbetweeum pattern (ever so little) n versus and chorus. Just my 2cents. This is really nice though. thanks for sharing.
Thanks, I appreciate your constructive feedback and advice... I'll play with the mix, and experiment with the "key switch" options.
Here is a poorly mixed draft, but an example of how I use them. There are: Strummed, Picked and Vintage Session guitars on this mixed in with BIAB guitars: Draft
Came across this comparison video. Based on I put my money back into my wallet. I have Picked Acostic and love it. I don't hear that much difference (well that I need) in the new Nylon.
Came across this comparison video. Based on I put my money back into my wallet. I have Picked Acostic and love it. I don't hear that much difference (well that I need) in the new Nylon.
Hmmm, I also own Picked Acoustic (and all other Session Guitars) and I bought the nylon for a couple of reasons, 1) it is a lovely sounding instrument and 2) it comes with a whole bunch of new pre-configured patterns! At $75, it was the easiest purchase decision I made this season!
You have to remember I am a recent retiree so I am going through a bit of a transition. 
