https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/01/old-music-killing-new-music/621339/

An extremely good appraisal of the current situation, I think, with a slight disagreement on my part about Baby Boomer opinion. I do think it's the industry's problem more than old-is-good, new-is-bad.

And this is important:

I posted the article a year ago when first published … lots of discussion. I wonder what the past year looks like.

https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=700357

Bud

I play 3 days a week in a resort across from the biggest ocean side park in our city and directly on the public beach. It's outdoors under a big canopy with a restaurant and full bar service.

Since we started our duo, decades ago, our target has always been the 50-year-old plus audience. It's a good, solid, dependable audience here in South Florida. It's retirement heaven.

When playing beachside, all ages come in, teenagers, young adults, families with small children, as well as the retirement age folks.

We have a songlist of over 600 tunes https://www.nortonmusic.com/cats/songlist.html

We do play some 21st century songs, but the majority of our music is from 1955 to the 1990s. We have some older "big band era" music that worked with our market years ago, but we hardly ever play them anymore.

We learn what people request, and when something goes over well, we learn more like it.

I'm no longer surprised to see young adults singing along to songs by The Beatles, Elvis, Johnny Cash, Dion, Springsteen, Lionel Richie, Motown artists, Donna Summer, Lou Rawls, Beach Boys, Four Seasons, Jimmy Buffett, k.d. lang, Otis Redding, Janis Joplin, Kansas, Van Morrison, Santana, Bob Seger and so many others.

They like the newer songs too, but I used to be surprised they sing along and know all the words of the older tunes. Now I just enjoy it.

We mix in other genres, Country, Caribbean, Musica Latina, too. Whatever works, whatever they like, mostly music they know by heart.

We keep track of the requests, and I'm always observing what songs work well and which ones don't. Our aim is to give them what they want, and do a better job at that than our competition. It's working, because I am making a living doing music and nothing but music. I enjoy what I'm doing and don't have to do the ultimate sell-out (for me) -- take a day job.

Insights and incites by Notes ♫

PS Here is the place we play 3 days a week...

Looks good Notes, nice place to play

Just been on your website, I guess this page does need updating as no longer correct.

https://www.nortonmusic.com/expanded.html

Thanks for sharing this Atlantic article. As someone not plugged-in to this industry but interested in it, it enlightened me to a few things. IMHO, anybody who is trying to make a living from writing fresh, new music with an eye toward being popular should understand everything written in this article.

This, over the years, has summed up my general opinion regarding new music [although there are a few exceptions]:
Quote:
"Some people—especially Baby Boomers—tell me that this decline in the popularity of new music is simply the result of lousy new songs. Music used to be better, or so they say. The old songs had better melodies, more interesting harmonies, and demonstrated genuine musicianship, not just software loops, Auto-Tuned vocals, and regurgitated samples."

An entire book could be written on this one quote . . .

And my "evidence" to support this has been too much lack-luster new music on Austin City Limits. And anybody familiar with past iHeartRadio TV specials? Same non-passionate music there too, imho. These 2 datapoints align nicely with the decreasing interest in the Grammy's as explained in the article.

I say what a crying shame. I'd love to experience new high-quality music, but that seems quite rare these days for a host of reasons (litigation being one).

I'm certainly no music pro by any stretch, but of the time I allocate to music, about 40% is spent writing in BiaB, 10% spent listening to music, 10% studying music and the remaining 40% learning to play "the classics" from the 60's, 70's and 80's on my bass.

To "young" muscians trying to make it in today's stacked-against-you music industry I say don't give up.

Be passionate about your art and persevere.

Its not that there is a dearth of good music these days, its that you have to go looking for it.

The major labels are so hidebound by the bottom line that they are afraid to take risks any more like they used to. They only want the sure thing and that is exactly why their product is overwhelmingly stale and boring.

Ironically, the tighter they cling to that bottom line, the more they struggle.

One more example of how bean counters ruin everything.

Thanks MusicLover.

What needs to be updated?

It still works as far as I can tell. Anyone with a version older than 2022 needs it, and people with new versions might also find it useful because it also doubles the resolution (pulses per quarter note) from 120ppm to 240ppm.

Notes ♫

Exactly

Hi Notes,

Well to me anyway if I was a potential buyer of biab and happened to browse to this page on your website, I would come away with the impression that band in a box doesn't support 16 chords per bar. No where does it say that what you refer to only applies to versions older than 2022.

Just thought it a bit strange reading that when I know otherwise.

The problem with the Grammy's, the Oscars, a lot of movies and new music is not just the product itself, it's certain political leanings they represent.

I just checked for the highest earners in music for 2022 and Jay Z, P Diddy and Kanye are listed right behind Springsteen who's number one. Hard to realize as an old guy that the rappers are getting old themselves. They're biggest hits are 20-30 years old now. Otherwise, there is a lot of very good current music out there but many 70 somethings won't bother to look, they just say new music sucks and a lot of it does but expand your mind and look you'll find some pretty good stuff.

I've had conversations with others my age about this. We forget how much totally forgettable crap was on the radio in the 60's and 70's. What's classic and awesome now is the best that was done then but like now, that represented maybe 10% at the most, of what was on the Billboard top 100 in 1969 for example. Here it is:

Billboard Top 100 1969

Just look at this thing. The Ballad of John and Yoko? Not the Beatles best.
My Cheri Amour by Stevie Wonder? Not close to his best either.

Here's a few groups that reminded me why I had to change the channel whenever their piece of crap song came on. Dyke and the Blazers, Charles Randolph, Candi Stanton, Dickie Goodman and this is just me skipping through this stupid list. Not exactly household names. We forget just how bad commercial radio was back then.

The point is what we all agree is great music from that era is AFTER it's been filtered for 50 years and what we and the young people hear now is the best of the best that has stood the test of time. But look at any Top 100 list for those years and it's mostly garbage.

Just like now.

Bob

^^^^^^^^^^

Bingo!

Excellent point!

I reread the responses to my post of this article a year ago and again the responses to this current post. And FWIW my thoughts remain the same.

I could care less about what is on the charts or which songs are award winning ... or the reasons thereof. We listen and produce Americana music. The genre is a huge sub-genre tent and we have no problem finding new (not new to us but newly produced) music on a regular sometimes daily basis.

Yeah, blues, blues rock, folk rock, alt-country and the jazz we like may be old school, retro or whatever. BUT new music in those genres is readily available to us as are zillions of older songs of that ilk that we have not heard.

I've oft said this but via streaming, i.e., access to an estimated 100 million songs, we can at anytime listen to music we love. Apple Music, Spotify and many others curate playlists for you that absolutely nail what you like -- brand new and old. And a simple verbal command to play more or less like that results in a rapid personal shaping of your playlists. Or a simple command confines them to one genre.

Hardly a day goes by that I don't get a fb notification that a favorite artist has a NEW release. Who cares if it charts or what the demographics are of the listeners? I do not intend to disparage in any way those who listen to CD's or radio. I just wanted to mention that there are 77 year old streamers out there!

Bud aka old streaming curmudgeon

OK, I'll have an open mind here and [hopefully] learn something.

For those that think there is a lot of very good current music out there, please provide specific songs released in the last 18 months that can be put in the following categories. Caution: the bar is very high.

1. Lead guitar that rival Carlos Santana, Eric Clapton, Jeff Beck, Mark Knopfler, David Gilmore and Duane Allman

2. Male vocals that rival Paul McCartney, Stevie Wonder, Glen Campbell, Elvis Presley and Paul Rodgers

3. Female vocals that rival Linda Ronstadt, Oliva Newton John, Gladys Knight, Whitney Houston, Sade, Karen Carpenter, Carly Simon, Christine McVie, Annie Haslam and Suzanne Vega

4. Harmonies that rival CSNY, 3 Dog Night, The Beatles, Mammas and Pappas and America

5. Keyboard players that rival Kieth Emerson, Rick Wakeman, Billy Preston, Steve Winwood, Donald Fagen, Greg Rolie, and Jon Carin

6. Drummers that rival Carl Palmer, John Bonham, Kieth Moon, Stewart Copeland, Phil Collins and Steve Gadd

7. Bass players that rival Sting, Sir Paul McCarney, John Entwistle, John Paul Jones and Jaco Pastorious

Great musicians produce great music and I'm sure I've missed many a great musician and your list of all-time greats may be different. But like I say, the bar is high. Remember . . . the last 18 months

What's odd there Thump is that there was not one word about songwriting. Well written songs impress me WAY more than well performed songs.

I have heard it said that Kriss Kristofferson is not considered a great singer, but boy can he write songs!

I saw him a few years ago local here in Derry, over 80 and still going strong, great backing band behind him, one of Merle Haggards band members if my memory serves me correctly, mostly these days it doesn't

Jesus was a Capricorn...

Jim Webb comes immediately to mind, Eddie

For everyone who thinks there is no good modern music being produced that compares to the likes of Led Zeplin, for example, check out Greta Van Fleet. She even gets accused of sounding too much like them.

Like blues? Larkin Poe. Lukas Nelson does not sound like his dad Willie but is a great musician. I could go on.

I don't think it is logical to try to compare the best of the musicians of the past to the musicians of today or any other time for that matter. There is only one Whitney Houston, and no one is really like here, before or now.

Richie Blackmore will forever be the guitar player associated with Deep Purple. Steve Morse replaced him and stayed with the band for twenty-eight years. Steve is a super good guitar player and as good as any of the guitar players thumper mentioned. Guitarist Simon McBride will join the band as a permanent member; time will tell how we will take to him. Steve is staying home to take care of his wife, who is battling cancer.

The fact that Old songs now represent 70 percent of the U.S. music market does not necessarily make a particular old song great or preclude some new songs from being good.

There are modern guitar players who are much more skilled than some of the more popular guitar players of the past.

As a kid, I could have gone into a record shop and recognized many, if not most, of the artists on the records for sale. The modern-day "record store," something called the internet, has millions of records for sale, and there is no way for me to be exposed to even a small fraction of that. So, there is no way for me to know how much excellent new music exists.

Record companies don't have to promote " old songs," so it is less expensive to sell them and more profitable. I can assure you that profit is the only motivational force in corporate America.

Just my 3 cents worth.

Billy

I agree.

I was in Walmart's record department holding an Elvis's Greatest Hits album. It cost $27 USD. A guy said "I had that on cassette". I answered "I have it on the original vinyl. Since then it has been on cassette, 8-track, CD, and now back on vinyl". The company made a ton of money just reissuing the same songs on different formats. Music Corporations love changing formats!

What can I say? I like what I like.

I just posted about doing some live gigs. Well, Tom T. Hall's 'That's How I Got To Memphis' is in the set list along with Miranda Lambert's 'Tin Man', Morgan Wallen's 'Sand In My Boots' Johnny Rodriguez's 'Pass Me By (If You're Only Passing Through) Kacey Musgrave's 'Mama's Broken Heart' Kelsea Ballerini's 'Hole In The Bottle' etc.

I guess my point is that there is good new music imho, but it's always about the song itself.

And there has to be something said for 'dance groove' music, mostly pop I suppose, but also a lot of country, that makes people move even though the songs themselves don't strike me as being very well written, lyrically or melodically.

I attended a John Legend concert, in 2021 I think it was, big show, superb showmanship obviously, but 'All Of Me' was the only song I knew and really the only song that struck me. And I must not be alone, because he saved it for the end of the show and the audience was on their feet.

I don't see a lot of current music standing the test of time though, like 'Let It Be' has or 'Sweet Baby James' and 'Jolene' have. Is that my own bias? Maybe. But there sure are a lot of young people covering and/or playing that music today.

Last night in a 'past charts' show, my local radio station played Led Zeppelin's "Whole Lotta Love", with a comment like "Atlantic Records released it as a single in the US and Led Zeppelin's manager was livid because Led Zeppelin were an album band".

Thinking back to that era, I virtually never bought singles. Virtually everything was albums and the good music was "underground". Singles were constrained in length and had to be considered 'suitable' for play on the then (in the UK) mostly BBC radio.

The stations playing 'my' kind of music were the Pirate radios, Radio Caroline, Radio Northsea, and to a much lesser extent radio amateurs who used an 'agile' system to avoid being tracked.

Even when I was DJing in the mid 70s to early 80s, most of my media was albums or 12" singles. Just a couple of hundred 7" singles at most.