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Posted By: dcuny Love's Forgotton Song - 01/02/15 06:35 AM
I've been absent for a while, but I was stuck sick at home today with a copy of BiaB 2015...

What else to do, but write a song? laugh

Love's Forgotten Song
dreams are only for the young
bright sun as the day's begun
like an open road right in front of us
past the ever bright star
here we are

lovers and the closest friends
once gone never coming back again
you held your hand in mine only yesterday
now that memory is all that remains

so we somehow came apart
still you live in my secret heart
holding deep inside the saddest part of me
i can never quite say goodbye, goodbye

words to our forgotten song
once known but now we sing it wrong
now we can't recall that sweet melody
only comes to me now in my dreams

Song info:
Style is _B140GTB.STY (Bossa Brazilian Quartet (140 RS))
~464:Bass, Acoustic, Bossa Ev 140
~470:Piano, Acoustic, Rhythm Bossa Ev 140
~467:Guitar, Electric, Rhythm Bossa Ev 140
704:Flute, Soloist Bossa Ev 140
BossaBrushes: a: Sidestick Brushes b: Sidestick, Ride

I was originally inspired by R & AM's track 2015 but I ended finding a Bossa Nova RealTrack I liked, so went that route instead. The chord progression is auto-generate using the Melodist feature.

I tried auto-generating some melodies, but nothing struck my fancy, so I went into notation mode and clicked and dragged notes until it sounded melodic. No doubt I've accidentally copied something from a distant memory...

I listened to the song in loop mode and started typing words to fit the syllables - not the typical way I work, but it was apparently quite successful for Phil Collins. I was thinking about those subtitled foreign films, where the lyrics are "proper" English, but feel a bit "stiff"... I think I succeeded! wink

I printed out the melody from BiaB, and entered the melody into Vocaloid. I tweaked it in some places to fit the words a bit better, and then exported .wav files.

I exported the backing tracks from BiaB as .wav files as well, and built the mix in Reaper. The flute solo was cut-and-pasted together, and I fiddled with the mix for a while until ennui settled in.

Then I struggled for a while with SoundCloud, until it decided it wanted to play nice again.

As always, any comment is welcome (although given my extended absence, undeserved). The tempo is probably a bit too fast, and the rhythm stilted in places, but hey...
Posted By: SpaceDog Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/02/15 03:37 PM
Dave,
Very pleasant tune and arrangement. I hope you feel better soon.
SD
Posted By: dcuny Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/02/15 04:52 PM
Thanks, SD!

I'm doing better (just a cold), but now I'm fighting SoundCloud, which has again decided not to play back tracks that BiaB folk have posted. It's gotten irritating enough that I finally sent it a support ticket...

-- David
Posted By: PgFantastic Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/02/15 04:58 PM
Beautiful song, vocal is superb. thanks for sharing!
Posted By: dcuny Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/02/15 07:19 PM
Thanks, Robert.

It was a bit of a challenge to get Avanna to sing "young". It was correct phonetically (j V N, in case you're curious), but different vowels on the preceding word would make her sing "yahng". There are still some words (like "open") that I could go back and tweak, but I should probably leave it alone now.

By the way, I'm still trying to get SoundCloud to play songs (such as your song Peace), but I'm not having any luck. It seems to be hit or miss what SoundCloud is going to play.

I've tried 3 different web browsers and a Chromebook, with no luck on any of them. I got an auto-response from SoundCloud to the effect of "check your browser and make sure you're up to date", which isn't the issue. Since I have similar issues from my work environment, I suspect it's a geographic issue. In any event, I hope they get this resolved soon!

Thanks again!

-- David
Posted By: Janice & Bud Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/02/15 07:56 PM
David, that first verse grabbed us
immediately. Great lyric! How you
folks are able to do such impressive
work with the vocaloid never ceases
to amaze.

The comped flute track works really
well.

It all worked for us. Nice!!

J&B
Posted By: dcuny Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/02/15 09:00 PM
Hi, Janice and Bud.

I'm glad you liked it. The Vocaloid software does most of the work, it's just a matter of convincing the program to sing the words the right way!

Sometimes that turns out to be much harder than it should. I hear there's a new English singing Vocaloid in the works that has an American provider, but from what I've heard, the vocal has a much harder edge than what I'm looking for.

Of course, it's nothing like the vocals on your tracks, but it's a lot better than nothing at all! You two keep blowing me away with your bluesy songs.

Thanks!

-- David
Posted By: Greg Johnson Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/02/15 09:18 PM
You write such pretty songs with some great lyrics! I feel you should get a live vocalist to really show them off. Flute solo works beautifully as do the instrument tracks. Cool song!! Take care. Greg
Posted By: boehm Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/02/15 09:42 PM
Hi David,

nice tune and arrangement. I especially like the repeated parts.
I know about the pronunciation problems of Avanna.
The flute is a hit.
Wish you get along with your own synthetic singer.

Guenter
Posted By: Charlie Fogle Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/02/15 11:46 PM
Sounds really good. The tone of Avanna combined with the melody and instruments you've chosen seems to remind me of something I would hear in an early James Bond movie.

Nice song. I enjoyed listening.

Charlie
Posted By: BruceI Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/02/15 11:59 PM
This is a great sounding track, the first Vocaloid example I think I have heard. It's different, not quite human of course, but quite a pleasant instrument. Much like BIAB RealTracks in a way - if you work at it, the results are often better than you could realistically expect! I was sorta hoping that when the AI's and robots finally become our overlords that we humans would at least keep the singing and songwriting gig, but I guess not. smile

The melody and arrangement (auto chords?!?) are very nice and the flute part really rocks. Unusual process but it worked well!

Thanks,
Bruce
Posted By: dcuny Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/03/15 12:09 AM
Originally Posted By: Greg Johnson
You write such pretty songs with some great lyrics! I feel you should get a live vocalist to really show them off.

Hi, Greg.
Yes, I'd love to have a real vocalist!

But I'll confess that it's nice to be able to revise lyrics at two o'clock in the in the morning and not wake anyone up. wink

-- David
Posted By: dcuny Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/03/15 12:16 AM
Originally Posted By: boehm

Wish you get along with your own synthetic singer.

Hi, Guenter.

Yeah, we fight all the time. laugh

But really, I'm hoping I'll get some time to work on synSinger later this month. I've already put together a prototype to test out a new approach. So far, the results are encouraging.

-- David
Posted By: dcuny Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/03/15 12:33 AM
Hi, Charlie.

I really like the tone of Avanna - voice provider and development team did an awesome job.

Apparently there's a female Vocaloid with an American voice provider in the works, but she's got a harder edge to the vocals.

Thanks for the positive feedback.

-- David
Posted By: dcuny Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/03/15 12:45 AM
Originally Posted By: BruceI
This is a great sounding track, the first Vocaloid example I think I have heard.

Hi, Bruce.

If you're curious, here are a couple more - The Gates of Babylon and Memory Eternal.

Quote:
The melody and arrangement (auto chords?!?) are very nice and the flute part really rocks. Unusual process but it worked well!

Thanks!

-- David
Posted By: Carolyne Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/03/15 02:22 AM
Hi David,
Took a listen to Love's Forgotten Song. Wow...Love it. Killer arrangement! Fun Tempo, original. Great lyric!
Carolyne
Posted By: dcuny Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/03/15 03:03 AM
Originally Posted By: Carolyne
Wow...Love it. Killer arrangement!

Thanks, I'm glad you liked it. I try to make sure there's a distinct change between the various parts, and dropping the drums on the fourth verse was pretty effective. I thing the vocals on the last verse might be a bit low, but I've got to stop fiddling with it at some point. laugh

If you listen, you'll note there's a lot of ducking the piano and guitar under the vocal as well. As lovely as BiaB instruments are, Vocaloids are difficult to understand in the best of times, so I only pull those instruments up during breaks in the vocal or on held syllables... A lot of micro-editing!

-- David
Posted By: FredM Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/03/15 07:41 AM
Hi David,
Like the chill out atmosphere. Nice songwriting.
Enjoyed it !
Fred
Posted By: floyd jane Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/03/15 11:46 AM
"...I was thinking about those subtitled foreign films, where the lyrics are "proper" English, but feel a bit "stiff"... I think I succeeded!"

that is EXACTLY what I thought as I listened!!

The arrangement and mix are terrific - although the "drop" of the instrument levels was "noticeable". Leaving the drums out was an excellent effect. Lowering the piano, sounded like..lowering a piano track. Perhaps it would better to drop it, too and let the guitar take that one alone?...

I enjoy reading what your process is. It's interesting and different - and effective.

I listened a number of times.. and enjoyed it.

One last thing... YOU should be singing your songs. The "girls" are very impressive. But you are better.

floyd
Posted By: gibson Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/03/15 12:32 PM
David,

Them cold bugs produced a wonderful song.

I am fascinated by your, and Guenter's,productions with synthvoices. This shows them to perfection.

Nice tune by the way.

I look forward to more.

Alyn
Posted By: dcuny Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/03/15 03:20 PM
Originally Posted By: FredM

Like the chill out atmosphere. Nice songwriting.

Thanks! Although Jazz and Bossa Nova aren't really my style, BiaB does such a nice job with them it's a lot of fun to work with them.

-- David
Posted By: dcuny Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/03/15 03:49 PM
Originally Posted By: floyd jane

that is EXACTLY what I thought as I listened!!

It helps that Avanna has that sort of sound (although less than non-English Vocaloids). laugh

Originally Posted By: floyd jane

The arrangement and mix are terrific - although the "drop" of the instrument levels was "noticeable".

Thanks for pointing that out. Usually I don't pull the levels down quite so low, but I was worried about intelligibility. I actually went back and re-did all of the vocal tracks to fix a number of intelligibility issues, and I should have re-evaluated the mix a bit better.

Originally Posted By: floyd jane

Leaving the drums out was an excellent effect.

I'm always pleasantly surprised when doing something as simple as that turns out to be so effective.

Originally Posted By: floyd jane

Lowering the piano, sounded like..lowering a piano track. Perhaps it would better to drop it, too and let the guitar take that one alone?...

Ooops. I usually try to fade over a bar or two, and bring in something else as well to make the effect less noticeable. Thanks for letting me know the "slight of hand" isn't working!

I really love the piano bits that I let "peek through", but I might have another go at the mix. I was also thinking of another mix I'd done, where I'd stripped it down a tad too much.

This time, I'll keep a backup of the prior session!

Originally Posted By: floyd jane

One last thing... YOU should be singing your songs. The "girls" are very impressive. But you are better.

Thanks, I'll see what I can do! smile

- David
Posted By: JoanneCooper Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/03/15 04:37 PM
Hey David. It is completely amazing what you and Guenter are doing with these vocaloids. My mind just boggles to even think about it. I enjoyed that. Thank you!
Posted By: dani48 Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/04/15 05:45 AM


Hi, David !:))


...and a Happy New Year to you !!

I love this, simply love it !
I think I am starting to fall
in love with that virtual girl
with that beautiful voice !!!!

....and I love that very nice
chord progression too !!!:))


Cheers
Dani
Posted By: sslechta Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/05/15 06:49 PM
Agree with the others here. Amazed at how the voice development on that software has been progressing over the past year.
Posted By: tommyad Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/06/15 11:41 AM
David, I don't think you're really sick. Everything sounds really strong and healthy on this one. I especially like the flute solo. Get better, Tom
Posted By: dcuny Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/07/15 02:25 AM
Originally Posted By: JosieC
I enjoyed that. Thank you!

Thanks, glad you liked it! smile
Posted By: dcuny Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/07/15 02:27 AM
Originally Posted By: dani48

I think I am starting to fall
in love with that virtual girl
with that beautiful voice !!!!

And she can be yours for a song, too!

Sorry, I couldn't resist the pun! Actually, the sale just ended... frown

Thanks for the nice words.
Posted By: dcuny Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/07/15 02:31 AM
Originally Posted By: sslechta
Amazed at how the voice development on that software has been progressing over the past year.

Well, not my software... That's still waiting for me to get some time to work with it. Just to be clear, this is a Vocaloid, not my own program.

Thanks!
Posted By: dcuny Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/07/15 02:32 AM
Originally Posted By: tommyad
I especially like the flute solo. Get better, Tom

Thanks, Tommy!
Posted By: rsdean Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/08/15 08:28 PM
David,

This is so interesting - great job with the vocaloid. Cool lyric and arrangement.

Bob
Posted By: AudioTrack Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/09/15 03:57 AM
David

You are one of the masters of lyrics sung by virtual singers. Love that style too, it's one of my favorites.

I thought the tempo fitted very well, and I liked the way you doubled the lyrics in places, echoing the phrasing.

Not a bad effort from your 'sick bed', really.

Nice

Trev
Posted By: gruverider Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/09/15 04:19 AM
cool groove ...
Posted By: Jim Fogle Re: Love's Forgotton Song - 01/12/15 10:32 PM
Dave,

Avanna is getting easier to listen to. Wow, she's even started harmonizing and singing backup to herself! What will you have her doing next?

Enjoyable listen. You write nice lyrics.
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