BIAB is already capable of analysing an audio file to work out what the chord structure is. There are tools on the market that can also process an audio file to work out what each instrument is playing (e.g. RipX to name just one) and some of those tools clearly offer APIs. What I would find really useful is if BIAB could analyse an audio file and not only suggest the chords but also give a shortlist of perhaps 5 Styles that would probably match that audio file. Surely it can't be too difficult to pick out the bass and the drums and use that to suggest some styles?
Yes, we have a humungous list of excellent styles, but that means it can take forever to find a good match. Often I end up giving up and using one of the many great styles on my Tyros 4.
Each year BIAB upgrades offer an ever increasing list of new styles and for me this just means it will take even longer to find a good match for a particular song.
This is an idea definitely worthy of consideration.
+1
+1 for anything that will help us find the right styles quicker!
I've started keeping a list of which styles sound similar to which songs (I know there's something similar already in BiaB but it's not very useful as it just tries to match the style parameters, rather than the actual sound).
A big collaborative list might be handy. It would be a bit subjective, but definitely more helpful than nothing.
SteveM:
This was bandied about on the forum earlier this year, when BIAB2022 was available,
but the discussion got bogged down in AI (artificial intelligence) references.
Regarding your post, I believe that your suggestion "BIAB could analyse an audio file ... and give a shortlist of perhaps 5 Styles that would probably match that audio file." is pretty much what BIAB does now,
although the list of styles it pulls up is more comprehensive.
Even if BIAB had an algorithm (like RipX) to figure out what instruments were playing (and perhaps BIAB already does), it's not much help when it comes to applying the parameters to suggest a style.
Thus the previous AI discussion.
You said: "A big collaborative list might be handy".
That would get my vote with a big PLUS ONE!
LLOYD S
I guess the feature Toontrack has in the superior drummer would be much easier to implement.
To select drum patterns - which could be the base for all this ..
1. you can play a rhythm with keys or mouse..
2. then you get a result list.
This helps a lot.
TO THE OP STEVE // ALL.
haveing used biab/rb n' realtraks/drums/styles over many years and having done more than 90 songs with the pg products ive found there is no alternative if one is doing a serious (rather than a 'rough demo') song that one MUST go thru' every single rt//drum//style ie the thousands of options ie…many hours of work.
otherwise the prob by doing limited searches with keywords is one misses those 'golden nuggets of sound' that would really contribute to a song. just my opinion.
also imho AI/software suggestions will only take you so far.
i realised a long time ago…just gotta suck it up n' put in the hours of work…like we used to do in commercial studios. there are no shortcuts imho.
merry xmas // happiness to all.
om
Yes - you are right.
I guess this is the same for all tools we as musicians use.
For instance - I bought a Yamaha Montage quite some time ago, but I simply had not the energy to work through Manual,
Youtube Videos, the User Interface and even the sounds ..
There were little issues every time - like how to transpose a part ... though this is so logical if you split your keys, that you have to transpose. But its not at the main performance screen.
Things like this are way to often in BiaB its even more crazy.
For me - I work this way ..
First I take some weeks and months to find out all about my VST Plugins, vst effects, software, keyboards, guitar effects and so forth. I try to do it like the pareto principle with 20% time I know 80% of the features .. mostly those I need most .. I organize performances, styles, sounds, effects, rank them and so forth
WHY
Because when I get into my creative moments I dont want to loose track, I want to stay in the flow and this IS REALLY REALLY hard with BiaB. To be honest I NEVER EVER used it for new songs the last year, though I wrote more than 50. I only use it for training myself playing chords, solos at the guitar or keyboards thats it.
Whats the main reason for this?
Hm, easy to answer, ITS SO HARD TO ADD FAVORITES and rank them. The workaround people provide are at CSV, file level and this not with 500 but thousands of styles included .. how should this work.
If for example I want to do a funk song.
I end up adding "FUNK" to the style or song filter .. then get 100s of results ..
Then I almost always loose myself in clicking through tracks soloing to tracks ..
Does not help.
One of my favorite tools EVER to work with was the ensoniq MR61 ..
Though not enough drum styles, worse sounds than TS or ASR, but it was so easy to use ..
1-2-3-4 record .. arrange with a few buttons click click click arrangement done ..
But save to floppy - not appropriate this days ..
But all the montages and this does not help, so I do it now with Cubase and Toontrack Superior Drummer.
Sometimes I take my bass while playing find a bassline- > record, then maybe add guitars or keys or immediately select from the drum sequences provided ..
Sometimes I start with the drums, sometimes with the keys, sometimes with the guitar, almost never with chord progressions, its mostly about good riffs ..
So still am happy I can use BiaB, I bought all styles all upgrades everything .. and its nice .
But I will only begin to really work with BiaB Song Writing if I am able to
1. Search for funk .. and get results
2. audition of tracks while ranking
3. sort by ranking -> select the best
4. come back - try the ranked - if they dont work, continue with the unranked
This way at some point all is ranked.
BEST WOULD BE to rank in different dimensions. But as my proposal said, if I would be able to just press
a key from 0 to 9 which is whatever rank I want it to be - and then use this to structure FAST..
->1 (at my keyboard) <- could be "best country songs" or "best in BiaB" or "style I will write songs for" or whatever ..
This is sooo easy, to implement and use, and its sooooooo helpful for everyone ..., as with nearly every approach towards biab it gives you fast structure to styles, songs or realtracks even midis ..
I think the song title search function in BIAB is not of much help when it comes to help users find a style with matching characteristics/groove of a particular song (what I hears in my head and what I am looking for).
It helps setting the filter parameters; time signature, feel, and tempo to match the song and producing a list of styles with these parameters in no ranking order at all when it comes to match the underlying groove of the song.
In addition to these parameters It would be nice (not sure how) to have some type of search funktion that matches the drums (drum pattern/drum groove ..) of a song (best match).
Easiest would be to drop an mp3 file and BIAB suggests a list of best matching RealDrums.
Selecting one of the RDs drums would then show a list of styles with that RD in the stylepicker
Or even better as a second step to add another level of matching criteria e.g. to add on the bass and find the best matching combination of drum&bass and so on.
Yes, a good idea. Will look into it.