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I'd like to thank those who gave constructive criticism on this post. I accept it well, and have deleted my comments.
Moderator - please delete this thread.
As far as the comments made about my motives - I can assure you the assumed motivation is completely incorrect. Please don't assume.
Last edited by Joe V; 02/02/13 10:17 AM.
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I see no positive purpose on attaching anyone's name to the discussion you seem to be having -- I would go ahead and delete what you wrote and start over differently. If you want to discuss the interface, that is fine -- but don't bring up "personal" stuff just to get attention. I didn't bother reading what you wrote very far.
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Ditto to what Kemmrich said so well.
--Mac
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Quote:
Ditto to what Kemmrich said so well.
Double ditto. Some things are better left unsaid.
Don S.
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"In part, the very appearance of this older-style interface makes it unfamiliar and therefore unappealing to younger users, and may be a barrier to their trying out of and adoption of the program"
This discusssion about the biab GUI has come up time and time again and most of the users here want to see no change to it.
1 If you think about it a great deal of the biab GUI has to be taken up with the input of chords approx 3/4 of the open page, so you cant change that.
2 As regards biab getting younger users I used to be enthusiastic about this too but don't really care any more.
I can't speak for PG music these are entirely my views only.
PG music has a clientelle of generally older people like myself in 50's and have that niche in the market sewen up, so why should they change a winning formula just to get young users on board, if they come aboard on thier own accord well and good but I can't see PG music doing a big change like the biab GUI just to convince them.
And after all a lot of young people have very little money to spend on software such as over $400 as a first time buyer of biab ultra pak.
Musiclover
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Win10Pro,i9,64GB,2TBSSD+20TBHDDs,1080TI,BIAB'24,Scarlett18i8,Montage7,Fusion 8HD,QS8,Integra7,XV5080,QSR,SC-8850,SPLAT,FL21&others,Komp.14,IK suite&others, just a guitar player-AXE FX III &FM9T, FishmanTP, MIDIGuitar2, GK2/3'sw/GI20
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Probably unnecessary to "PERSONALIZE "SCOTT" IN YOUR POST. The GUI has been discussed along the way by many but I must say (even as a 79yrold), that the array of most of these necessary guide "icons" )displayed as they include easily discernable links (paths) that are easily one-click away) from my trembling fingers... are remarkably thought-out and comprehended by all...with a little time and energy. Simply, I like the current approach by PG, and using it our of the box as I do, the opportunities to garner room-wide recognition with its abundance of hot real "clips" from BIAB..with the abilities to reconform it a little bit or alot, is quite effective, for those of us who have upgraded thru the years (or it "centuries")! And, in short, bury me and "my boy BIAB", in a box, in the FINAL box!    
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I agree, not the best idea to hash old post up. Still it would be valid to have this conversation from strickly your views. Me personally i wish that the program was as modern looking as say Sonar or Reaper, but that said i do not want that at the expense of slowing the process down in development. I want to see the very few things that are most reqiested, and actually just one would be great. Fix the darned VSTi timing issue. that would make me happy as a clam.
As far as Scott goes these are really his issues to hash out, not mine. Peter was justified to speak up, and I thought he did so in a very respectuful manner, and the response was respectful. Thoese are THEIR views, and not mine to judge really.
I do know from conversation in the past that Scott wants the same issue as i raised above fixed, and many others do.
Regarding the younger usership, in my opinion there are two factors here. 1. this entire program does not really lend itself to dub step, hiphop, and the like, and i doubt it will (please don't) but for those younger users who make folk, rock, country, jazz, and other musics that BiaB/RB leans on, that skip PG because of interface, well that is there youthful, and maybe slightly narrow minded approach. They if they are really looking for the best tools may come back when they can't find what they want else where.
As far as the pretty girls at the party, they in my opinion are mostly shallow at times, it is the heart and mind of a good woman that makes for a long term relationship. That is what i find in BiaB/RB that keeps me here it allows me to express myself in ways i could not, or at least not nearly as easily with other gals .. er i mean software.
Last edited by Robh; 02/02/13 12:57 PM.
Lenovo Win 10 16 gig ram, Mac mini with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2022, Realband, Harrison Mixbus 32c version 9.1324, Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app, Komplete 49 key controller.
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Hi Robh, I for one would like to see PGMusic expand into "dub step, hiphop and the like". The more consumers that buy the product the more money PGMusic will make. I remember a short time ago people were complaining that there was not enough good country and bluegrass styles! Look what happened! A ton of good country and bluegrass styles. And who knows maybe some of those hiphop people may turn into great jazz artist; don’t forget about the educational side of PGMusic’s software! Or maybe some of us can learn from their styles and incorporate them into ours! Now about pretty girls being shallow. That’s ok as long it is the next morning 
Me, it's not about how many times you fail, it's about how many times you get back up.
Cop, that's not how field sobriety tests work.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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Might as well add my vote to keep the GUI as is. I would much rather have more features ie: more than 4 chords to the bar, etc., than changes to the look of BIAB Later, Ray
Asus Q500A i7 Win 10 64 bit 8GB ram 750 HD 15.5" touch screen, BIAB 2017, Casio PX 5s, Xw P1, Center Point Stereo SS V3 and EWI 4000s.
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Quote:
Might as well add my vote to keep the GUI as is. I would much rather have more features ie:
more than 4 chords to the bar, etc., than changes to the look of BIAB Later, Ray
There is no reason why you couldn't have both.
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One reason I can think of right away is cost to development resources on something that is really only eye candy...
I can't figure out why some people insist that the design of this product must be some kind of democratic process. It isn't.
Those wanting a different product are free to try their hand at writing their own offering, aren't they?
--Mac
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Journeyman
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Quote:
I can't figure out why some people insist that the design of this product must be some kind of democratic process. It isn't.
1. PGMusic maintains five different "wishlist" Forums, which seems to mean they are open to suggestions.
2. If the programs were easier to use, you wouldn't have accumulated 35K posts.
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Quote:
One reason I can think of right away is cost to development resources on something that is really only eye candy...
IMHO - simplification, and reducing the number of clicks to perform sophisticated tasks and use case scenarios is much more than eye candy; productivity gains and ease of use help existing customers too
Quote:
I can't figure out why some people insist that the design of this product must be some kind of democratic process. It isn't.
Nobody said it was - there might just be people out there that love the company so much they want to see it flourish, and its products to become even better than they already are
; )
Quote:
Those wanting a different product are free to try their hand at writing their own
offering, aren't they?
I've always said to people "if it's so easy - go ahead and do it"...but should a person that buys and uses a TV be prevented from requesting their cable provider to make an 'ease of use' enhancement to the on-screen menu options ? Well, I would think it unreasonable of the cable company to say "if you want a different on screen menu - you're free to write your own" (actually - I'm sure that would be illegal for some reason or other, especially if you went to the trouble).
So - this is my last post on the BB/RB/RT GUI - just my $2.22 since I really was not involved in previous conversation threads.
I get it - you guys are generally happy with the existing GUI, and would like it to stay that way. Yes, I get it. Thanks for your comments ; )
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On the flip side ..
I've directed quite a bit of development resources on eye candy for a given website or software.
I've also seen the difference in ROI.
Sometimes it's quite worth it.
A program like this is used repeatedly. I still get a certain amount of 'ahh' when I open a modern VST with nice graphics. Makes the experience more enjoyable.
UI/UX
It can make a difference to some.
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
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Quote:
Quote:
I can't figure out why some people insist that the design of this product must be some kind of democratic process. It isn't.
1. PGMusic maintains five different "wishlist" Forums, which seems to mean they are open to suggestions.
So post those suggestions on the Wishlist forum, which as you point out is already provided.
As we've seen in the past, some of our Wishes get honored, others may get honored in future, some may not get honored at all.
I think there is a big difference between Wishlist and long diatribes on other forums that campaign typically one specific issue. And I've personally witnessed many of those posts and complaints about the BB GUI issue get mean, demeaning of pgmusic developers and even resort to the personal attack or demonizations of other human beings that are just uncalled for. Some folks apparently never learned about catching flies with honey and not vinegar.
Quote:
2. If the programs were easier to use, you wouldn't have accumulated 35K posts.
If Band in a Box were real easy to use, it likely wouldn't get used for long as it would not be able to do the things it does. Other autoaccompaniment programs have come and gone, precisely for that reason alone. But some of 'em had prettier looking screens. Jammer certainly did not last long here. Those listening to our creations only hear the music, they can't see the gui of the software used to create that music, eh?
--Mac
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Quote:
Quote:
One reason I can think of right away is cost to development resources on something that is really only eye candy...
IMHO - simplification, and reducing the number of clicks to perform sophisticated tasks and use case scenarios is much more than eye candy; productivity gains and ease of use help existing customers too
I totally agree with you, Joe. For example, simply reorganizing / regrouping the actual menus in a more logical way (using submenus, for example) or (even better) allowing custom organization of menus, would greatly improve the actual GUI, the workflow and the productivity for many users, and probably wouldn't imply too much development resources. There are many other excellent ideas about possible GUI improvements on a recent thread started by Peter Gannon.
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Have to agree with the "redesign" suggestion.
Eye candy is sweet!
I always appreciate programs that have optional User Interfaces or skins as sometimes the stock ones interfere with the functionality, ie. are hard to read or have a cluttered look.
This means that the user can stick with the original if it suits them.
Not being a programmer I have no idea how difficult it is to write the code to accomplish this but,know from personal experience, I was drawn to BIAB in spite of the "retro" interface.
The features are amazing, the interface, not so much.
I think the reason most of the older users, of which I am one, age wise at least, don't want the interface to change is that we're afraid we will have to relearn the program.
An example of poorly implemented change is judged by the reaction to Windows 8.
Microsoft's failure to offer some continuity and familiarity along with the updated interface has baffled and angered many who have tried to use it.
I'm sure if PG does decide to update their interface, they will do it the right way.
Carkins
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Sorry, Mac. Didn't mean to rile you. I will be most careful from here on. (No need to remind us that you were not riled.... we know.)
But just so you know, I never engage in "long diatribes." my diatribes are short and pointed... and I am pretty satisfied with the GUI...
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I like my diatribes with chocolate sprinkles!
Lenovo Win 10 16 gig ram, Mac mini with 16 gig of ram, BiaB 2022, Realband, Harrison Mixbus 32c version 9.1324, Melodyne 5 editor, Presonus Audiobox 1818VSL, Presonus control app, Komplete 49 key controller.
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Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
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Update Your PowerTracks Pro Audio 2024 Today!
The Newest RealBand 2024 Update is Here!
The newest RealBand 2024 Build 5 update is now available!
Download and install this to your RealBand 2024 for updated print options, streamlined loading and saving of .SGU & MGU (BB) files, and to add a number of program adjustments that address user-reported bugs and concerns.
This free update is available to all RealBand 2024 users. To learn more about this update and download it, head to www.pgmusic.com/support.realband.htm#20245
The Band-in-a-Box® Flash Drive Backup Option
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Did you know... not only can you download your Band-in-a-Box® Pro, MegaPAK, or PlusPAK purchase - you can also choose to add a flash drive backup copy with the installation files for only $15? It even comes with a Band-in-a-Box® keychain!
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Backup copies are offered during the checkout process on our website.
Already purchased your e-delivery version, and now you wish you had a backup copy? It's not too late! If your purchase was for the current version of Band-in-a-Box®, you can still reach out to our team directly to place your backup copy order!
Note: the Band-in-a-Box® keychain is only included with flash drive backup copies, and cannot be purchased separately.
Handy flash drive tip: Always try plugging in a USB device the wrong way first? If your flash drive (or other USB plug) doesn't have a symbol to indicate which way is up, look for the side with a seam on the metal connector (it only has a line across one side) - that's the side that either faces down or to the left, depending on your port placement.
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows® Today!
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows for free with build 1111!
With this update, there's more control when saving images from the Print Preview window, we've added defaults to the MultiPicker for sorting and font size, updated printing options, updated RealTracks and other content, and addressed user-reported issues with the StylePicker, MIDI Soloists, key signature changes, and more!
Learn more about this free update for Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows at www.pgmusic.com/support_windowsupdates.htm#1111
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If you're looking for a in-depth review of the newest Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows version, you'll definitely find it with Sound-Guy's latest review, Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows Review: Incredible new capabilities to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs.
A few excerpts:
"The Tracks view is possibly the single most powerful addition in 2024 and opens up a new way to edit and generate accompaniments. Combined with the new MultiPicker Library Window, it makes BIAB nearly perfect as an 'intelligent' composer/arranger program."
"MIDI SuperTracks partial generation showing six variations – each time the section is generated it can be instantly auditioned, re-generated or backed out to a previous generation – and you can do this with any track type. This is MAJOR! This takes musical experimentation and honing an arrangement to a new level, and faster than ever."
"Band in a Box continues to be an expansive musical tool-set for both novice and experienced musicians to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs, as well as an extensive educational resource. It is huge, with hundreds of functions, more than any one person is likely to ever use. Yet, so is any DAW that I have used. BIAB can do some things that no DAW does, and this year BIAB has more DAW-like functions than ever."
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The User Showcase Forum is an excellent place to share your Band-in-a-Box® songs and listen to songs other program users are creating!
There are other places you can listen to these songs too! Visit our User Showcase page to sort by genre, artist (forum name), song title, and date - each listing will direct you to the forum post for that song.
If you'd rather listen to these songs in one place, head to our Band-in-a-Box® Radio, where you'll have the option to select the genre playlist for your listening pleasure. This page has SoundCloud built in, so it won't redirect you. We've also added the link to the Artists SoundCloud page here, and a link to their forum post.
We hope you find some inspiration from this amazing collection of User Showcase Songs!
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There are 45 winners, each receiving a Band-in-a-Box 2024 UltraPAK! Read the official announcement to see if you've won.
Our User Showcase Forum receives more than 50 posts per day, with people sharing their Band-in-a-Box songs and providing feedback for other songs posted.
Thank you to everyone who has contributed!
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