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#447589 - 12/28/17 05:40 AM [Beginners Forum] How to put a drum fill BEFORE Bar1?
Registered: 12/29/16
Posts: 192
Loc: UK
WendyM Offline
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Registered: 12/29/16
Posts: 192
Loc: UK
Hi folks.Hope you all had a happy Christmas.We have despite the snow and icewhich is keeping us in.So I'm working up an SGU,tempo 120 4/4 Even8 Style is RESOLVE.So far so good except I need to start the tune with a quarter bar drumfill.Like many songs we can all think of probably.Ive set the intro to be 1-2-123- so the last quarter is free andput a blue marker in Bar1.But it doesnt play anything prior to Bar1 just kicks right in at Bar1 without the pre-Bar1 fill I asked for with the blue marker.Is there a set procedure to get Bar minus1 (?)last quarter to play a quarter fill or is that not possible in BB?
Wendy
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#447591 - 12/28/17 05:57 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: How to put a drum fill BEFORE Bar1? [Re: WendyM]
Registered: 10/12/16
Posts: 104
Loc: Durham, UK
Kev T Offline
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Registered: 10/12/16
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Loc: Durham, UK
Hi Wendy.

Being somewhat a novice in BIAB/RB (but more experienced in DAWS) I have often done what you're suggesting by loading the BIAB track into RB and finding a suitable drum fill in the Drums section (Track view) and copy/paste the fill to the beginning of the Drum track (result: Count In > Fill > Intro

Forum members with more BIAB experience may well be able to provide a solution within BIAB only but I've had plenty of success doing what you require in RB. I usually move into RB anyway once I've got my basics in BB.

Best wishes to you for New Year.
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#447613 - 12/28/17 07:22 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: How to put a drum fill BEFORE Bar1? [Re: WendyM]
Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 14114
Loc: Australia
Noel96 Offline
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Registered: 10/31/08
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Wendy,

A couple of thoughts spring to mind...

1. Under "Options | Preferences | Count-in" it's possible to set the bar immediately before bar 1 to be a fill-in (it's under the "Lead in type" dropdown menu).

2. Begin your song proper at bar 2
  • set bar 2 to an 'a' or 'b' part marker
  • put the first chord in bar 1 as a 'rest all instruments' chord (e.g. C. - where the dot after C indicates 'rest all instruments'
  • enter a chord on beat 4 and rest all instruments except drums (e.g. click on beat 3 and type ",C.d" - without quotation marks)

The final result would look something like the image below.

Regards,
Noel


Attachments
drum break on beat 4 intro.JPG


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#447614 - 12/28/17 07:31 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: How to put a drum fill BEFORE Bar1? [Re: WendyM]
Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 18075
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Matt Finley Offline
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Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 18075
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
I use method #2 in Noel’s post. Just remember to change the number for Bar for Beginning of Chorus from 1 to 2 if you want to repeat from the top of the song.
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#447645 - 12/28/17 09:36 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: How to put a drum fill BEFORE Bar1? [Re: WendyM]
Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 11007
Loc: Pensacola, Florida
jford Offline
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Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 11007
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While the above works, what you'll get is your click click count in, and then 3-beats of silence before you hear the fill on beat 4.

So another thing you can try. If you turn off the count-in (which unfortunately is still a global, not song specific setting - maybe one day), then use the first two bars of your song to be a new count in and your song will start on bar 3 (and as Matt said, make bar three the first bar of the chorus).

Then in bars 1 and 2, mute all the instruments except the drums (you can use the F5 key to do that). For bar 1, enter "| C.. C.. |" and in bar 2 enter "| C..,C.. C..,C.d |". Then unmute all the instruments in bar 3 using F5. Basically, it's just playing drum shots on beats 1 and 3 of the first bar, then drum shots on beats 1, 2, and 3 of the second bar with a drum fill on beat 4.

That should give you your click in, with the drum fill on beat 4. I'm not at my music machine right now to actually try it, but I believe this should work.

Don't forget to turn count-in back on for your next song.
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#447655 - 12/28/17 09:55 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: How to put a drum fill BEFORE Bar1? [Re: WendyM]
Registered: 12/29/16
Posts: 192
Loc: UK
WendyM Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 12/29/16
Posts: 192
Loc: UK
Thanks guys.A rought test shows it all works,thank you so much BUT it shoves my underlying Audio out of sink. How can i drag it back in line with my BB?
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#447676 - 12/28/17 12:30 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: How to put a drum fill BEFORE Bar1? [Re: WendyM]
Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 14114
Loc: Australia
Noel96 Offline
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Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 14114
Loc: Australia
Wendy,

You could use "Audio | Edit Audio | Time shift in ms".

To work out how many milliseconds (ms) to time shift the audio, follow the following example.

Let's say that you've inserted 1 bar of 4 quarter note beats (i.e. 4/4 time sig) at a tempo of 113 bpm.

To find out how long 1 quarter note is in milliseconds, divide the tempo into 60,000. (Since 60,000 ms = 1 minute and the tempo is in beats per minute.)

So if the tempo was (say) 113 bpm, then 1 quarter note will have a length of 60,000/113 = 531 ms.

Since the time signature is 4/4 then 4 quarter notes must take a time of 4 x 531 = 2124 ms

Now if you edit the audio and time shift by 2124 ms, the audio will align.

Formula:

(60,000/tempo) x (beats per bar) = length of bar in milliseconds

Hope this helps,
Noel
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#447690 - 12/28/17 01:14 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: How to put a drum fill BEFORE Bar1? [Re: Noel96]
Registered: 12/29/16
Posts: 192
Loc: UK
WendyM Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 12/29/16
Posts: 192
Loc: UK
Noel,I havent got enough fingers and toes for that.I failed Maths-but Im great at French.lol.Im going to cheat and send the track wavs to my DAW and do it there.Thanks.Wendy
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#447749 - 12/28/17 07:07 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: How to put a drum fill BEFORE Bar1? [Re: WendyM]
Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 14114
Loc: Australia
Noel96 Offline
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Registered: 10/31/08
Posts: 14114
Loc: Australia
Wendy,

I'd love to be able to speak French. As it is, though, that's something that I can only dream about.

In case you want to try shifting the audio in milliseconds, just to play around with a feature of BIAB, the below link will download a little spreadsheet that will automatically do the calculation for you.

All you need do is to enter: (a) the tempo; (b) the number of beats per bar. The length of a bar should then be automatically calculated.

Calculate milliseconds for one bar (spreadsheet calculator)

Regards,
Noel
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#447791 - 12/29/17 04:03 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: How to put a drum fill BEFORE Bar1? [Re: WendyM]
Registered: 12/29/16
Posts: 192
Loc: UK
WendyM Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 12/29/16
Posts: 192
Loc: UK
Hi Noel,thats down to my French/English parents.
I'll tinker with that when we get home after the break.This SGU is oven ready now and itll go on my DAw in Jan.Have a lovely New Years celebraton.You get yours half a day before us.Love seeing the Sydney bridge fireworks.
2017 has been great for me with my new toy BB and the 2018 looks even better.New year's resolution-not to jump in and ask numb questions when i shold do some troubleshooting first.all the best.Wendy


Edited by WendyM (12/29/17 04:05 AM)
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#447817 - 12/29/17 07:22 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: How to put a drum fill BEFORE Bar1? [Re: WendyM]
Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 18075
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Matt Finley Offline
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Registered: 07/12/00
Posts: 18075
Loc: Hudson Valley & Lake George NY
Thinking back on your questions, in my opinion they have all been reasonable.
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BIAB 2019 Win Audiophile; [& 2018 Mac UltraPak]. Software: Cakewalk, Adobe Audition, Ozone, Encore; Win 10 64 Pro. Hardware: custom i7, 16 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Focusrite 18i20(2), TCE Finalizer, Behringer X-Touch, Adam sub & monitors.

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#447919 - 12/29/17 03:28 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: How to put a drum fill BEFORE Bar1? [Re: Noel96]
Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 19067
Loc: Marysville, Mi. USA
rharv Offline
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Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 19067
Loc: Marysville, Mi. USA
(self promotion)
I built an online tool for this type of math.

It calculates tempo/milliseconds/ticks/time in different ways for different needs.
All ya need is a browser.

http://tools.masteringmatters.com/

If you have ideas for other things to add I'll be happy to try.
I thought it was a pretty cool idea and would like to have an idea what kinds of math/calculator stuff other people that record audio would want. I've just added things to it as I found weird math calculations that I thought I may need later.

It's not pretty, but it's pretty handy and it works. If someone wants to 'pretty' it, that would be great.
I am a programmer, NOT a designer .. been told that many times in recent years (grin).





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