Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread
Print Thread
Go To
#455631 02/04/18 11:34 AM
Songwriting
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Enthusiast
OP Offline
Enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
My Band-in-a-Box generates dissonant notes (outside of the scale or chord). Anybody knows a cure?


BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/


MusicHeart #455682 02/04/18 07:10 PM
Songwriting
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,797
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,797
We would need to know more. Dissonance is in the ear of the beholder, and very much genre-dependent. Can you tell us what BIAB style you are using, and/or which RealTrack name and numbers?

If, for example, you always hear a #9 played in a classical or folk track on a major chord, then that could be a bug that should be reported. In a jazz track, probably not.

But there are a few settings, and a trick or two. Tell us more.


BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
Matt Finley #455701 02/05/18 12:44 AM
Songwriting
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Enthusiast
OP Offline
Enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Thanks for your reply. I'm a new user with Band-in-a-Box PlusPAK 2018, Windows 7 64-Bit.

Here's how it started: I loaded "SalsaAfroCuban68Folk_114_Demo", typed or changed some chords and played around a bit. Unfortunately I heard lots of dissonant chords, with notes out of the scale. For example: I typed G7 and the MIDI piano played G7#5 instead, the marimba (MIDI as well) played false notes (e over a G-chord) etc. and had to correct them manually in the note editor. Generating a new melody produced more "mistakes" and generating a real track soloist even more. I tried using only simple triads and got significantly less wrong notes but even in the key of C and a straight forward rhythm (with no syncopation) I could still hear some flats or sharps that shouldn't have been generated.

That's what I tried already, starting with MIDI only:

For the MIDI Bass-Track:
Preferences/Harmony/Harmony Settings: "Change Harmony with New Chords" checked
Song Settings: "Force Song to Simpler Arrangements" checked
Song Settings/Overrides: "Force to Simple Arrangement" (for new songs) checked
(in case related) Play: "User Playalong feature" unchecked and "Wizard uses "Smart" notes" unchecked
Bass/Track Settings: "Force track to simple arrangement: Bass" checked
Bass/Track Settings/Set Natural Arrangement: Disabled for Bass track
Stylemaker/Edit current Style in Stylemaker/Bass: changed the Relative Weight of patterns with passing and chromatic notes to: 1.

No success. The bass still generates "chromatic approach" notes or similar (for example on an Em7-chord it "walks" through a #g instead of a natural g 'cause the next chord is A7). Re-generate and play doesn't really help.

On other tracks I have even more problems (more notes). For example I change from F#m7 to Gdim7 and the organ keeps holding the F#m7 which sound horrible over the Gdim7.

Would be very thankful for an answer.


BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/


MusicHeart #455709 02/05/18 01:35 AM
Songwriting
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 18,838
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 18,838
In case it helps, here's the style that MusicHeart is using.

****** Song Summary *************
Title: SalsaAfroCuban68Folk_114_Demo

File:-AFRFK68.MGU

Key=Bm , Tempo 114, Length (m:s)=3:53
No intro. 36 bar chorus, from bar 1 to bar 36. Repeat x3 choruses
Melody has 694 notes, Melody harmony is < no harmony >(0)
No Soloist track.
Song is saved with Volume, Pan, Reverb, Chorus, Bank0,

Style is -AFRFK68.STY (Afro Folk 6/8 - Afro Cuban 6/8)

Style MIDI Instruments are : Finger Electric Bass (34), Acoustic Piano (1), Marimba (13),
RealDrums in Song: SalsaAfroCuban68Folk: a: SalsaAfroCuban68Folkb: SalsaAfroCuban68Folk


MY SONGS...
Audiophile BIAB 2024
MusicHeart #455741 02/05/18 06:04 AM
Songwriting
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,797
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,797
MusicHeart, one of the first things to do (that everybody forgets) is to enter the key of the song. BIAB makes intelligent decisions based on that. If it's 'wrong' it can lead the program to do odd choices. Try that, and regenerate.


BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
Matt Finley #455929 02/06/18 01:48 AM
Songwriting
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Enthusiast
OP Offline
Enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Thanks for your reply. Key of the song? Is that simple? I mean I tried a lots of styles and all of them generated more or less dissonances but I can't remember if I changed the key of the song. In any case I wouldn't like to let BIAB make "intelligent decisions", I woud like to hear what I have in my head. Using entertainer-keyboards for 20 years I can't remember ever heard a wrong note, unless you program an own style which uses passing notes too. Well, I'll try it with "entering the key and regenerate" and hopefully it helps.

By the way: You're a really great Music maker!

Last edited by MusicHeart; 02/06/18 02:00 AM.

BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/


MusicHeart #455943 02/06/18 03:17 AM
Songwriting
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,797
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,797
Thanks. There are also checkboxes for the song, and for globally, to choose Simple chords. That may also give you what you want, now that you’ve described your goal. Also, you will want to turn off Natural Arrangement for the song, or globally. This last assumes you have BIAB 2017 or later.


BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
Matt Finley #455955 02/06/18 04:03 AM
Songwriting
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Enthusiast
OP Offline
Enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Thank you. In my second post I've listed my OS and BIAB version (2018) and what I've already tried to fix in various preferences and checkboxes. Most of the time I hear the "unwanted guests" (notes) right away and I fix them manually on the note editor. But for some of them I may have to use my headphones and listen very carefully or I have to check out the score in order to fix them. As soon as I'm back home I'll check your tips. All in all I'm very happy with BIAB and of course I'm thankful to have helpful People like you in the Forum!


BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/


MusicHeart #456012 02/06/18 09:40 AM
Songwriting
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,797
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,797
Right, I don’t always go back to reread threads when they start getting longer.

Another example I’ve found (and Dr. Gannon doesn’t agree with my advice) is on dominant seventh chords. I will sometimes hear a flat 9 or sharp 9 when I want a natural 9. So in those cases I generally write the 9 chord to start with, so there is no chance for ambiguity.

Stuff like that.


BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
MusicHeart #456017 02/06/18 09:58 AM
Songwriting
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,301
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,301
Indeed, the first thing I thought of was the key.

It defaults to C so if for example you are typing in chords from the key of Ab, you could certainly have some issues since BB is looking to the scale of C major to choose it's melody lines and chords to a great extent.

I made that mistake on a number of songs when I first started working with BB until I figured it out. So if you're working in Ab, just set the key signature to Ab and you'll be good PLUS.... if for some reason you find you have to change the key to ...lets say Db... all you do is change the key signature and it recalculates the entire song accurately in the new key.


You can find my music at:
www.herbhartley.com
Add nothing that adds nothing to the music.
You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both.

The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
Matt Finley #456136 02/07/18 12:00 AM
Songwriting
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Enthusiast
OP Offline
Enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Well, thank you, your tip helped a lot, but the problem didn't dissapeared completely. I set the key of the song and whenever I see strange notes I go to the affected bars and set the key for each of them. It gets better, sometimes perfect, but it's not 100% reliable. The good thing is that even RealTracks get better.

What do you mean "you write the 9 chord to start with". Where do you write it?
And who is Dr. Gannon?


BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/


Songwriting
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Enthusiast
OP Offline
Enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Thanks for your reply. I do change the key signature whenever ist necessary and it works perfect when the song has only triads or maybe a seventh cord. Things get complicated with jazz chords and especially when the transition from one key to another lasts one or two bars with complex chords. I keep searching. It would be nice if can tell me your settings.

Last edited by MusicHeart; 02/07/18 12:28 AM.

BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/


Songwriting
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Enthusiast
OP Offline
Enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
[quote=Guitarhacker]

I've heard your Music. Nice. The background instruments sound great. I would maybe give a bit more highs to the strumming guitars (+1 or 2 dB at 10kHz) and maybe a bit of "air" (12-14kHz) to the cymbals or drums. But this is a matter of taste. On the male voice I would give some more bass (around 125Hz), reduce the mids (about 3kHz), route it through a smooth de-esser and gently tune it through autotune or similar. The female voice needs a bit 250Hz, smooth de-essing and less 3khz again. This would be my taste.


BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/


MusicHeart #456176 02/07/18 04:01 AM
Songwriting
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,301
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,301
Originally Posted By: MusicHeart
Thanks for your reply. I do change the key signature whenever ist necessary and it works perfect when the song has only triads or maybe a seventh cord. Things get complicated with jazz chords and especially when the transition from one key to another lasts one or two bars with complex chords. I keep searching. It would be nice if can tell me your settings.


Ahh yes... indeed. The key signature is important but if you still have issues and want to try something else, somewhere in the menus is a function called reduce complexity of the chords or something like that. I know it's there because I've seen it but don't often have need for it so I can't tell you right off where to find it. However, it takes the 9th chords and other chords that are jazz chords and reduces them to a more basic chord. Instead of a C9th you will get a simple C chord. Those 7th #5ths and 9ths can throw the chords kind of out of whack with the melody being composed.

Just another option to investigate to solve the issue.


edit: oh... and another option.... costly but it works. Melodyne Editor. The full version not the "Essential" version. Since it's polyphonic, it can grab the notes in the chord. Simply move or delete the "wrong" ones. I have used this several times on some chords that had "wrong notes" in them in BB/RB. It worked extremely well on removing the notes without leaving artifacts. Not so well at moving the notes however. I think the version I have is an earlier, perhaps the first poly version so they didn't have it all worked out like they do now. The version I have works amazingly well on mono melodies like a single instrument like sax or a human voice or bass. I have used it to fix many, many parts in a song that needed to be edited. Also superb for fixing timing issues in audio tracks.

Last edited by Guitarhacker; 02/07/18 04:08 AM.

You can find my music at:
www.herbhartley.com
Add nothing that adds nothing to the music.
You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both.

The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
Songwriting
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Enthusiast
OP Offline
Enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Thanks for the tips. I can fix the wrong notes in my DAW too, but it takes time. I hope people in PG-Music work to fix these issues. Keep on makin' good Music!


BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/


MusicHeart #456262 02/07/18 09:17 AM
Songwriting
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,797
Veteran
Offline
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,797
Dr. Gannon is Peter Gannon, the PG in PG Music. Company founder, excellent musician, and he drops into the forums regularly.

What I meant is, I write a ninth chord instead of a dominant seventh. Ex. D9 instead of D7. If I write D7, I might hear D7b9 or D7#9 or D7add9. But by writing D9, I hear D with a natural 9. However, I run a slight risk of hearing a major seventh...


BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
MusicHeart #467460 04/16/18 01:23 AM
Songwriting
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Enthusiast
OP Offline
Enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 21
Thanks, that's a great tip! I understand BIAB more day by day and do my choices accordingly.


BIAB PlusPAK 2018, Win 64-Bit, ASIO, i7, 16GB, 2*500GB SSD +


You can find Jannis MusicHeart on your favourite Musicstore or at:

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdjjpr_-B8llKxlwUDCf-Lw

https://jannismusicheart.weebly.com/


Previous Thread
Next Thread
Go To

Link Copied to Clipboard
ChatPG

Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.

ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.

PG Music News
Convenient Ways to Listen to Band-in-a-Box® Songs Created by Program Users!

The User Showcase Forum is an excellent place to share your Band-in-a-Box® songs and listen to songs other program users are creating!

There are other places you can listen to these songs too! Visit our User Showcase page to sort by genre, artist (forum name), song title, and date - each listing will direct you to the forum post for that song.

If you'd rather listen to these songs in one place, head to our Band-in-a-Box® Radio, where you'll have the option to select the genre playlist for your listening pleasure. This page has SoundCloud built in, so it won't redirect you. We've also added the link to the Artists SoundCloud page here, and a link to their forum post.

We hope you find some inspiration from this amazing collection of User Showcase Songs!

Congratulations to the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!

We've just announced the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!

There are 45 winners, each receiving a Band-in-a-Box 2024 UltraPAK! Read the official announcement to see if you've won.

Our User Showcase Forum receives more than 50 posts per day, with people sharing their Band-in-a-Box songs and providing feedback for other songs posted.

Thank you to everyone who has contributed!

Video: Volume Automation in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®

We've created a video to help you learn more about the Volume Automation options in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows.

Band-in-a-Box® 2024: Volume Automation

www.pgmusic.com/manuals/bbw2024full/chapter11.htm#volume-automation

Video: Audio Input Monitoring with Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®

We've created this short video to explain Audio Input Monitoring within Band-in-a-Box® 2024, and included some tips & troubleshooting details too!

Band-in-a-Box® 2024: Audio Input Monitoring

3:17: Tips
5:10: Troubleshooting

www.pgmusic.com/manuals/bbw2024full/chapter11.htm#audio-input-monitoring

Video: Enhanced Melodists in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows®!

We've enhanced the Melodists feature included in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows!

Access the Melodist feature by pressing F7 in the program to open the new MultiPicker Library and locate the [Melodist] tab.

You can now generate a melody on any track in the program - very handy! Plus, you select how much of the melody you want generated - specify a range, or apply it to the whole track.

See the Melodist in action with our video, Band-in-a-Box® 2024: The Melodist Window.

Learn even more about the enhancements to the Melodist feature in Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows at www.pgmusic.com/manuals/bbw2024upgrade/chapter3.htm#enhanced-melodist

Band-in-a-Box® 2024 DAW Plugin Version 6: New Features Specifically for Reaper®

New with the DAW Plugin Version 6.0, released with Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows: the Reaper® Panel!

This new panel offers built-in specific support for the Reaper® DAW API allowing direct transfer of Band-in-a-Box® files to/from Reaper® tracks!

When you run the Plugin from Reaper®, there is a panel to set the following options:
-BB Track(s) to send: This allows you to select the Plugin tracks that will be sent Reaper.
-Destination Reaper Track: This lets you select the destination Reaper track to receive media content from the Plugin.
-At Bar: You can select a bar in Reaper where the Plugin tracks should be placed.
-Start Below Selected Track: This allows you to place the Plugin tracks below the destination Reaper track.
-Overwrite Reaper Track: You can overwrite previous content on the destination Reaper track.
-Move to Project Folder: With this option, you can move the Plugin tracks to the Reaper project folder.
-Send Reaper Instructions Enable this option to send the Reaper Instructions instead of rendering audio tracks, which is faster.
-Render Audio & Instructions: Enable this option to generate audio files and the Reaper instructions.
-Send Tracks After Generating: This allows the Plugin to automatically send tracks to Reaper after generating.
-Send Audio for MIDI Track: Enable this option to send rendered audio for MIDI tracks.
-Send RealCharts with Audio: If this option is enabled, Enable this option to send RealCharts with audio.

Check out this video highlighting the new Reaper®-specific features: Band-in-a-Box® DAW Plugin Version 6: New Features Specifically for Reaper®

Band-in-a-Box® 2024 DAW Plugin Version 6: New Features Video

The new Band-in-a-Box VST DAW Plugin Verion 6 adds over 20 new features!

Watch the new features video to learn more: Video: Band-in-a-Box® 2024 - DAW Plugin Version 6 New Features

We also list these new features at www.pgmusic.com/bbwin.plugin.htm.

Forum Statistics
Forums66
Topics81,389
Posts732,446
Members38,441
Most Online2,537
Jan 19th, 2020
Newest Members
Ernest J, ingridguerci94, Izzy, BenChaz, Csofi
38,440 Registered Users
Top Posters(30 Days)
MarioD 195
Al-David 124
DC Ron 113
dcuny 87
rsdean 85
Today's Birthdays
CeeDee, SethMould
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5