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#538757 - 05/29/19 09:20 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] How do I change a patch?
Registered: 12/15/13
Posts: 60
Tom Dentist Offline
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Registered: 12/15/13
Posts: 60
I have BIAB 2019.

I have a song. It has an organ. I want a piano.

I put the mixer on mixer (?) The organ slot says organ. I hit the arrow on the right which brings up a menu that changes the patch. No matter what I select, the patch doesn't change, i.e. I still hear organ. I hit F4, generate, the patch doesn't change.

I do the same with the "Patches" tab on the Mixer. Same menu. Same result.

I do the same with the Organ tab along the top. Same menu. Same result.

1. Why are there 3 ways to

a. reach the same menu to change the patch
b. that don't change the patch?

2. How do I change the patch?

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#538767 - 05/29/19 11:49 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: How do I change a patch? [Re: Tom Dentist]
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Noel96 Offline
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Hi Tom,

It sounds like the track involved might have a Realtrack instrument on it. Patches are for changing the sound of MIDI instruments. Since Realtracks are audio, their sound cannot be altered.

To confirm my thoughts, could you please post an image of your open BIAB desktop? If you are not sure how to do that, follow the instructions in the link below.

https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=472139#Post472139

Regards,
Noel
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#538786 - 05/30/19 06:25 AM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: How do I change a patch? [Re: Tom Dentist]
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jford Offline
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Also, if it's MIDI and it came from an imported MIDI file, it's possible the organ patch is hard coded into the MIDI stream, which will prevent you from changing it. You can open the MIDI event viewer (see the "#" icon in the notation editor screen), look for the patch change, and delete it. That will then allow you to assign a different instrument to the melody or soloist track. As Noel said, if it's a RealTrack, then you would just have to change from an organ to a piano RealTrack, which would then be playing much different notes than an organ RealTrack.

If it is MIDI on one of the other tracks (the accompaniment tracks), then you should be able to change the instrument (which is initialy determined by the style); however, there is an setting (I can't remember where it is right now) where a MIDI style always reverts to the instrument defined by the style file that you have to override to change the instrument to one of your choosing. Maybe someone else can chime in on that.
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#538818 - 05/30/19 11:03 AM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: How do I change a patch? [Re: Tom Dentist]
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Tom Dentist Offline
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Thanks for the replies.

This is strictly stock BIAB MIDI instruments, no Real Tracks, imported files, nada.

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#538819 - 05/30/19 11:07 AM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: How do I change a patch? [Re: jford]
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Tom Dentist Offline
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Originally Posted By: jford
. . . however, there is an setting (I can't remember where it is right now) where a MIDI style always reverts to the instrument defined by the style file that you have to override to change the instrument to one of your choosing. Maybe someone else can chime in on that.


That would seem a good thing to point out in the documentation re: the mixer. "This doesn't work unless you do something else first."

I notice that when you use the mixer to change the patch, it does indeed change the displayed name of the patch, in the mixer. It just doesn't change the patch. Cute.

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#538821 - 05/30/19 12:15 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: How do I change a patch? [Re: Tom Dentist]
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jford Offline
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Try this. It will work or it won't.

Go to the MIDI Options on the preferences page. Uncheck the box marked "Style Patch Changes".

I believe this will let you override whatever patch was set in the style.

You will probably have to reload your song for it to take effect.
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#538932 - 05/31/19 12:10 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: How do I change a patch? [Re: Tom Dentist]
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Tom Dentist Offline
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Alas, it doesn't work.

I notice the pop-up help says

"Styles have default patches for each track. If you do not want BIAB to send these patch changes, you can disable this. Note: this is different from the patch changes that you save with your song."

If a song has a default patch, why does BIAB send a patch change? I'm the one who wants to "send" a patch change.

Assuming I succeed, why wouldn't I save it with my song? *What* is "different" from "the patch changes that you save with your song?"

What is the point of overlaying something so simple with this convoluted structure of switching? It's like you went to switch on the light, the light doesn't switch on, and they tell you, oh, didn't you know, you have to uninstall a different switch and reinstall it, because we designed it that way to make things easier for you.

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#538933 - 05/31/19 12:14 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: How do I change a patch? [Re: Tom Dentist]
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jford Offline
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Could you maybe post a copy of the file you are working on (on DropBox or Google Drive or similar)? I would be happy to try it out on my computer this weekend to see if I can replicate or solve the problem.
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#538947 - 05/31/19 01:01 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: How do I change a patch? [Re: Tom Dentist]
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Hi Tom Dentist,

Sometimes a user will want specific patches to be embedded in a song file, other times not. If I'm creating a song file and I'm using patches specific to a Roland SC-55 Sound Canvas module then I would want the patches to be in the song file. If I'm creating a song file and don't care what the specific patches are then I would not put the patch data in the song file. There are legitimate reasons for both choices.
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#538977 - 05/31/19 04:56 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: How do I change a patch? [Re: jford]
Registered: 10/31/08
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Noel96 Offline
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Originally Posted By: jford
Could you maybe post a copy of the file you are working on (on DropBox or Google Drive or similar)?


I agree with John. Our having access to a copy of the file that you're working on would be very useful. What you're experiencing seems to be unusual.

In the meantime, what style is the song based on?

Also, is this a supermidi track you have loaded? (The track name will be be light blue in colour.)

Regards,
Noel
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#539642 - 06/05/19 01:38 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: How do I change a patch? [Re: jford]
Registered: 12/15/13
Posts: 60
Tom Dentist Offline
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Registered: 12/15/13
Posts: 60
Sorry, I was gone over the weekend. Very generous of you, thanks.

These posting things you mention, I don't know what they are, and at the moment I have no further time to waste on this.

All I want to do is change a plain midi patch to a different plain midi patch. I hadn't done it for a long time, on account of this problem. Then it worked; then it didn't.

I'll go back to my former practice of having BIAB generate some parts, save them as midi, and get out of BIAB into some other program just as soon as I'm able.



Edited by Tom Dentist (06/05/19 01:39 PM)

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#539643 - 06/05/19 01:41 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: How do I change a patch? [Re: Tom Dentist]
Registered: 12/20/00
Posts: 11354
Loc: Pensacola, Florida
jford Offline
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Registered: 12/20/00
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Loc: Pensacola, Florida
Tom, if you post a file (say, on Dropbox), we can see exactly what is happening and then at best, have an answer or a possible workaround, or at worst have to report a bug. This would also help other people who may have the same problem, but just haven't asked about it yet. That's all we're trying to do.
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#539646 - 06/05/19 01:48 PM [Band-in-a-Box for Windows] Re: How do I change a patch? [Re: Jim Fogle]
Registered: 12/15/13
Posts: 60
Tom Dentist Offline
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Registered: 12/15/13
Posts: 60
Originally Posted By: Jim Fogle
Hi Tom Dentist,

Sometimes a user will want specific patches to be embedded in a song file, other times not. If I'm creating a song file and I'm using patches specific to a Roland SC-55 Sound Canvas module then I would want the patches to be in the song file. If I'm creating a song file and don't care what the specific patches are then I would not put the patch data in the song file. There are legitimate reasons for both choices.


The documentation says change the patch in the mixer. If it worked, and I didn't like it, I'd change it. If I did, I'd save the file.

Change, or not; save, or not. Are you talking about something else?

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