PG Music Home Forums General Discussion Songwriting How to add more instrument tracks to a song

Hello everyone,

I am new to BIAB. I want to add an additional track to a song I am writing. How do I do that?

Thank you

IMHO the best way to add tracks to BiaB is to drag and drop BiaB tracks into a DAW. If you have the PC version of BiaB you have a DAW in RealBand. If you don't have another favorite DAW then use that. On the MAC I you have Garage Band.

I hope this helps and good luck.

Hello JamesNikolas,

Welcome to the forum and to Band-in-a-Box.

The eight default Band-in-a-Box tracks are named Bass, Piano, Drums, Guitar, Strings, Melody, Soloist and Audio. Generally speaking Band-in-a-Box styles uses the Bass, Piano, Drums, Guitar and Strings tracks for style arrangements leaving the Melody, Soloist and Audio tracks for your use.

Both the Melody and Soloist tracks are capable of handling 16 midi tracks with the restriction that the sound is generated by the default midi synth module. Of course both tracks can also be used for audio.

You also have the Audio track. One "trick" that works well is to use the audio track to record the audio output from other tracks. That frees up those tracks for use again.

Using the F5 bar settings you can direct the Band-in-a-Box program to use up to ten instruments on each of the five tracks it traditionally uses to create arrangements. By recording arrangements to audio and then using the tracks again you can create very dense arrangements.

What I do is kind of clunky but it works. I create my audio track with me playing one of my instruments then save. Go into the sub-directory and rename the audio track.

Repeat.

Then drop into a DAW (Studio One or Audacity) and create my final product.

...Deb

Band-in-a-Box has a limitation of 8 channels - for more than that, if you use Windows, Band-in-a-Box would have come with RealBand. That is a good tool to use in your instance since it doesn't have these limitations.

It's true that BIAB has only 8 channels but those 8 channels can be used over and over to provide a nearly unlimited amount of channels because BIAB can utilize the Audio Channel and Artist Performance Tracks, which are functions and features that allows BIAB to function as a digital multi track recorder. BIAB shares the feature and functionality of Virtual Tracks with hardware digital multi track recorders.

My method is probably clunky, but it works for me, so here goes: *I use primarily the RealTraks, not MIDI - this wouldn't be necessary/work for MIDI stuff*

1) create a song chart in BIAB, and select the Style and/or instruments I want in (up to) the 7 available tracks.
2) I then export the audio files to an external HD I use called "Project Files", and put them in a created folder for the song (usually with the title - let's say the song is called "I Love You", I save the audio files as "I Love You.wav").
3) If I need additional tracks, I go back to BIAB in the created song and replace one (or more) of the existing tracks with the additional instrument (guitar solo, for example).
4) I then export the new tracks to the same folder as the others, making sure to rename the files as something different ("I Love You_Xtra.wav") so as to not overwrite the existing saved audio files. *Any tracks you aren't replacing need to be muted - if they aren't, you'll wind up with a lot of repeat files in the new save)*
5) Then I just import them into Logic and start mixing/etc.

Hope that makes sense and is helpful to someone. This method allows me to keep everything organized (which I struggle with). I save the BIAB SGU file into the same folder as I do the audio files, and once I create a session in Logic, I save that there as well.

Roger,
That's pretty much how I do it also.
Perhaps not pretty, but it does work.

Do you ever use multiple version of "core" instruments (drums, bass, keys)
and mix those together in the same song/style?
Kind of like a take folder in Logic and comping a final track.

Do you ever find that the rendition of a particular part from one rendition doesn't fit the part, even when you've changed only the instrument selection, not the style/tempo etc.

Just wondering.

Thanks,
Bob

I'm guessing you've loaded a style and see several instruments in the mixer and just want to add another. Easy.

Click the REAL TRACKS button.

From the drop down menu, select Real Tracks Picker Dialog.
The Real Tracks picker dialog will pop up.

In the upper left, there will be a listing of your tracks. Select an empty track (you'll know it's empty because there will be no description for it).

Choose a real track. You can filter, or toggle by instrument, type, genre, RT artists, Tempo, Feel, etc.

You can't audition the real track according to your chord sheet, but you can audition it either with a "band" or solo to get a sense of how it sounds.

Select the Real Track you want to use and click (towards the bottom) GENERATE TRACK. This will add the Real Track you selected to the band, generated to your chords.

You can do this to add even more tracks (until all are full) or to replace tracks. Just make sure you select in the Real Track picker an empty track or one you want to replace.

I like your approach here Tangmo. Works out a little easier than the way I was doing it. Thanks for posting.

Jeff

<<< My method is probably clunky, but it works for me, so here goes: *I use primarily the RealTracks, not MIDI - this wouldn't be necessary/work for MIDI stuff* >>>

Some may find it interesting to using BIAB as a MTR, Roger Brown's work flow can work with MIDI, MIDI Super Tracks, RealTracks, imported audio and live recorded audio or any combination of these different sound medias without ever leaving BIAB.

<<< Do you ever use multiple version of "core" instruments (drums, bass, keys)
and mix those together in the same song/style? >>>

The same applies to this process.

This method works if you're using a DAW for your production:
Create your basic BIAB full length song and then get your RealTracks into your DAW.
Need another part or a solo for 16 bars? Go back to BIAB (or use the VST plugin) and create just a short section that fits your needs.
Export as needed.
Rinse, repeat as needed.

The closest I get to what you're describing is to, on occasion, have the same instrument on three or so tracks. I do this with strings a lot (violin, viola, cello). It can sometimes create an interesting little "chamber orchestra" thing that I like.

Roger Brown: "5) Then I just import them into Logic and start mixing/etc."

mrgeeze: "Do you ever use multiple version of "core" instruments (drums, bass, keys)
and mix those together in the same song/style?
Kind of like a take folder in Logic and comping a final track."

RayL: "This method works if you're using a DAW for your production:
Create your basic BIAB full length song and then get your RealTracks into your DAW.
Need another part or a solo for 16 bars? Go back to BIAB (or use the VST plugin) and create just a short section that fits your needs.
Export as needed.
Rinse, repeat as needed."

__________


"This method works if you're using a DAW for your production:"

Yes, exactly. Exporting BIAB tracks to a DAW is the standard operating procedure and overwhelmingly the preferred method for most BIAB artists production procedures. It works. It's intuitive and effective. It's comfortable. It provides artists opportunity to recoup some of their investment in complex and what can be costly DAW's and third party plug-ins. It provides the most efficient and effective means of control possible over every recorded track. Using this method, the pros outweigh the cons to the point most artists find no reason to question their work flow. They reason don't fix what isn't broken. I'm not about to argue with success. The BIAB User Showcase has thousands of great recordings. Not just great songs and compositions, but outstanding recordings. Other users produce quality demos daily and some have composed commercial releases. There's a lot of success linked with using a DAW for production.

But what becomes with the artist that neither has the funds, experience, or time to invest in learning extremely complicated DAW's, VST's and plug-ins? The novice who's computer skills aren't to the IT level required to blend and troubleshoot the complexities of multiple software programs to work reliably together with their computer? The hobbyist that only desires to work within and learn a single software program to use for their enjoyment and to share with friends and family but at the same time, produce high quality recordings of sufficient complexity in arrangements to equal works of more advanced producers?

My desire is to help beginners, novices and musicians that want to record great music without having to become IT experts and college graduate grade audio engineers. BIAB has features and functionality that puts it on par with hardware stand alone digital multi track recorders. Nearly every request in the BIAB Wishlist Forum can already be done solely in BIAB today and for intermediate to advanced users, there's no interest, curiosity or appeal to do those techniques in BIAB but rather export tracks to DAW's to do them. For intermediate and advanced users that are already experienced, familiar with and efficient with their DAW, there's sufficient reason to do so. That's not necessarily true for beginners and novices. Daily novices that don't know what an audio interface is, can't connect a keyboard to their computer, don't own a DAW, have a subpar (or so they're told by the advanced) USB microphone they must have that equipment and software in order to produce anything beyond a simple chord chart, single style accompaniment song using BIAB. At this time, they're not being told by intermediate and advanced users nor PG Music that a single open project of BIAB can compile an arrangement of dozens of instruments over dozens of tracks rendered onto a single stereo master audio file comparable to most intermediate and advanced projects released.

In 1979 Tascam released the first PortaStudio at a retail price of $1,000. It was a 4 track cassette based combination of a compact mixer and tape deck. The intended market was to singer/songwriters, home recording studios and to make recordings suitable for demos. (Sound Familiar?) The portastudio was not designed nor conceived to compete with commercial studio recordings because there were serious limitations to the physical recording quality and audio capture capabilities of cassettes compared to reel to reel tape machines and tape formats with higher IPS speeds, High quality tape head construction, electronic circuit design, construction and quality and nearly every other design feature considered in the three year design and testing of portastudios prior to their release. The $1 thousand price tag in 1979 would be $3,555 today which is a lot until contrasted to the average cost of $5-$8 thousand tape decks sold for that were suitable to home studio use. Although never intended for commercial grade audio releases, by 1982 Bruce Springsteen used one to complete an entire album recorded on one. The Portastudio changed how music is made. Technology today has reached a level where many mainstream artists record tracks in their home studios on equipment and in environments similar to the average BIAB user's home studio. Entire movie scores can now be recorded in an artist's bedroom on a off the shelf laptop.

Using BIAB 'in the box' to create a project removes the ambient, live, non-treated home environment from the recording equation providing pristine studio quality audio recordings. No other DAW necessary if one prefers not to use one but the artist can still produce material from a single software program that equals the audio quality and track count of commercial studios from the 1970's and prior.

Rather than spending months learning computer setup, DAW settings, processes and techniques, watching hours of YouTube videos and building audio engineering production skills, it's my theory if a beginner spends 12-16 hours over a month learning the techniques, menu's, buttons and terminology focusing solely on the operation of BIAB, they will be far more proficient in producing complex and quality arrangements in BIAB beyond the elementary 1-2-3 song production of entering song chords, selecting a key, selecting a style to generate a generic song. I haven't seen that interest, curiosity or appeal develop yet but I see the questions posted daily steering the novices to complicated and expensive alternatives.

Charlie, I think you are spot on with regards to new users. The OP asked how something rather simple was done in BIAB and the thread turned into a multiple choice quiz for workflow.

I was a DAW man before I ever heard of BIAB, but even then the answer to my questions was essentially "change DAWS" and/or "spend money". IMO, the only thing a user of BIAB needs to spend money on is a better bank of sounds for midi than came with the computer. No midi? No more money. If a newbie to music production is having trouble doing something in BIAB, then the answer to that problem is showing/telling them how to do that thing in BIAB.

The PG FX plugins are excellent for basic music production. Bouncing tracks is a great way to build songs and has the enormous advantage of refusing to let (illusory) perfection be the enemy of good. And Track Clutter in a DAW is more daunting (to me, at least) than building a song from the basics up. which is the basis of mixing in BIAB and enhanced with RB. As often as not, I'm bouncing tracks in a DAW! Even with unlimited tracks. I despise endless tweaking.

Nothing wrong with discussing more advanced alternative work-flows, but maybe it's not kind to respond to BIAB questions with a maze of work-flow non-answers. Besides, nothing work-flow related helps anybody make better music. Nor does spending more money on FX or other software. At BEST, these things may only help make it sound better...if one gains the experience of using it.

BIAB, on the other hand, does help anybody make better music.

Hang in there, Charlie.

getting more traks from biab.
unlimited actually.
(until we get more channels in biab than the
current 8. also i find rb redrawing slows me down.)
(i use a seperate folder for each song with all my reaps
and biab audio etc in.)
lets say the song is called WOWSER ROCK lol.
the new folder is named WR + date + author.
eg WRmay20oldmuso lol.
in this folder i also add a text file describing
important song settings // notes .
1. after style picking // arranging your song in biab.
save it of course. so WRv01 gets saved in the WR folder.
PLUS an audio mix called WRbedsv01.
(for bed traks.)
so biab file saved contains your first up to 8 bed traks.
2. DONT CLOSE SCREEN after saveing.
KEEP IT OPEN.
3. now IMPORT stereo mix to audio track in biab and for
safety save this biab file as WRv02 for example.
thus you still have the original style up.
THIS WRv02 will now contain up 8 new instruments
selected via the picker. you now save of course to
biab WRv02 once happy with the new instruments.
at this point you now have in the wowser rock folder
2 biab files WRv01 and WRv02 plus the audio file
WRbeds01.
4. at this point i would drop the 16 traks into my
daw (in my case reaper) together with the rough
guide WRbeds01.
(note making sure that the daw tempo is the same as biab,
and i save all following traks recorded in reaps into the
same folder as biab , in this case WRmay20oldmuso .
you could carry on ad infinitum this way in biab and
then dropping into the daw.
i experiment often multiple times in biab with instruments
then dropping them into reaps and seeing how they work
with the rest of the mix. its really no different than working
in a big studio like people used to do and trying different
arrangements and instruments.
(i really wish that biab would have even just 6 more radio
buttons/channels as i dont like to over produce.
to quote an old producer i once knew ,"if you need a ton
of channels you might be putting lipstick on a pig."lol.
so in the daw rarely do i end up with more than 30 channels.
and even less if my original biab beds mix is attended to in terms
of sound picture and useing the biab mixer that floats often i
just need a few extra traks recorded in reaps plus my vocs.
and the song is done.
(think about this. twas a time when hits were done on 3 trak
studer tape machines. lol. well actually some did cheat by
bouncing tween 2 tape machines and even live adding while
mixing to the second machine. )

another little idea i use is if i have a complex song i use multiple
biab files. eg intro, verse, chorus, lead, verse , chorus, end etc.
so in this case 7 biab song files. and i dump the 8 traks from
each into reaps where i have markers set up for each song
section intro onwards to correspond to my 7 biab files.

ok gotta stop. need my lunch lol.
too many songs not enough time.
go make some music and dig dig dig into biab and create your own
methods.

H

That's what I do. Only difference is, if I like the generation of the song I Freeze all tracks and save as 'I love you 1' and export all tracks to a Folder. THEN unfreeze, select your new instruments. Save as 'I love you 2' and so on.
Ian

dont forget in biab the play along feature can
record on melody trak good for midi drones.
eg synths/bells /whatever .
ive been experimenting lots with the extra traks
on the xtra midi channels on melody trak.

This is essentially what I do too. I export the tracks--and then sometimes regenerate and export again to get more variations. Then I'll try different instruments in BIAB, export tracks. I put them all in a folder and then import them into Studio One. From there, I take the variations for the same instrument and pick and choose sections I like and copy/paste them into a new track.

Have you seen this video on my channel? I experienced the same issue and came up with a creative way to solve it and at the same time making my music sound so much better.

https://youtu.be/kDjx_WMXwAs

Henry,
First of all welcome to the forum! Heard a couple of your tracks and the one that you posted in User Showcase recently. Good stuff!

A few days ago I watched the video you mentioned above. We have very similar setup and methods. Yes.., it is valid workaround, however...
To solve specfically this and several other acrobatics 2 components are needed.

1) more available mixer tracks in BIAB (16 sounds like a perfect number:))
2) bar freeze (aka bar to bar regeneration)

There had been several heated discussions about adding mixer tracks, the latest is here:

https://www.pgmusic.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=600974&page=2

Dr.Gannon replied to that topic by saying it is technically possible. Not sure if it will be implemented soon or not(or at all)... It is my biggest wish for BIAB... If you think it will be usefull to you, and I have a feeling it can be, kindly support this idea in the forum link above.

Misha.

Misha, I definitely support the idea of more tracks. It would go a long way in filling out a song. Especially if you're going to use loops like I did in my Disco song. I would say I don't hear a lot of music in the forum where people use a lot of tracks. A lot of the stuff is Acoustic based or Jazz based with maybe with a soloist. However, I do think that if there were more tracks available people would discover new songwriting capabilities outside of those genres. It looks like PG Music is trying to broaden it's base with the addition of loops, some of the newer RealTracks, plugins, DAW Integrations, etc.. so I'm guessing they would also like to capture a newer fanbase. Without the addition of more tracks capturing that base will be difficult. I like 16. I agree that's a good number. Would settle for 12 :-)

As far as Bar Freeze I'm kinda indifferent to that one since I freeze a lot of patterns I like anyway and edit in my DAW. But it's definitely something worth exploring.

Henry