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I am wanting to do instrumental music production (jazz, new age, classical) to make tracks to record my sax with. For Pro use, NOT backing tracks for practice.
How do I best use a midi controller like the Akai MPK 261 with BIAB/Real Band so that I can do my music production on the keyboard rather than the laptop.
Last edited by saxgentleman67; 05/06/20 06:24 PM.
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If for "Pro use" I would recommend that you render your files in BB and Real band into wave and transfer them to a decent DAW. Do your mixing and live recording into the DAW software. That's how I and many others do their recording in this forum.
If you need further clarification, simply ask your questions.
Last edited by Guitarhacker; 05/07/20 03:47 AM.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Thanks. Much appreciated. By "wave" you mean from the audiofile upgrade?
I was hoping not to have to learn a new DAW.
What's the downside to doing it all in Real Band.
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+1 What GuitarHacker says.
I recently completed a CD of 17 tracks all done in this mannner
Worked out band arrangements in BIAB (all real tracks no midi).
Export Biab tracks as Wav files to DAW (LogicPro)
Record me (Guitar) in DAW
Mix/Master (Logic)
Used CD Baby to produce the CD's and EasySong Licensing to handle the copyright.
Came out pretty nice, at least to me.
Allowed me to focus on playing and learning improving my DAW knowledge. A positive experience.
As an aside, I did not use the audiophile version although it was available at time.
Personally I don't think you need to spend the $$$.
We spent a few hours auditioning 2 different BIAB version on 3 different speaker sets ($500 - $5000) and concluded the difference was marginal at best.
That's just our ears and our $.02. YMMV
biab2023(Mac)
Logic Pro X
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Thanks. Much appreciated. By "wave" you mean from the audiofile upgrade?
I was hoping not to have to learn a new DAW.
What's the downside to doing it all in Real Band. Basically nothing. Some people are more comfortable in their DAW of choice. For some people RB IS their DAW of choice. If RB is working for you, then technically there is no downside. You can get the same quality recordings and end results in RB as you can in other DAWs .. it's basically a preference. Mainly from a comfortable workflow point of view. You can do things in other DAWs that you can't do in RB .. and you can do things in RB that you can't do in the same other DAW. If RB starts causing issues or limitations, worry about another DAW then, but until then keep making music. 
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
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..................... Basically nothing. Some people are more comfortable in their DAW of choice. For some people RB IS their DAW of choice. If RB is working for you, then technically there is no downside. You can get the same quality recordings and end results in RB as you can in other DAWs .. it's basically a preference. Mainly from a comfortable workflow point of view. You can do things in other DAWs that you can't do in RB .. and you can do things in RB that you can't do in the same other DAW. If RB starts causing issues or limitations, worry about another DAW then, but until then keep making music. I am a user of another DAW, i.e. Studio One Pro. I do use RealBand on occasion. BUT I have always said if you do not have a favorite DAW then by all means use RealBand. Even if you do have a favorite DAW there are things that RealBand can do that others and BiaB can not do. I learned that from rharv. Thus I agree with him and start with RealBand. A final note; the sound of the finished product has nothing to do with whatever DAW you are using. That sound depends on whatever sound sources and effects you are using.
Me, it's not about how many times you fail, it's about how many times you get back up.
Cop, that's not how field sobriety tests work.
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I agree with everything said. For what you described, a DAW will be imperative. You don't need to learn a new one, if you are already familiar with RealBand, though.
Trying to do everything on a keyboard sounds really difficult, and frankly like it could become frustrating to get the results you're looking for.
Cheers,
Deryk
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Thanks for all the ideas from everyone.
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Trying to do everything on a keyboard sounds really difficult, and frankly like it could become frustrating to get the results you're looking for.
How so? It feels MORE difficult to do it on the computer. I'm a musician much more than a techie.
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Thanks. Much appreciated. By "wave" you mean from the audiofile upgrade?
I was hoping not to have to learn a new DAW.
What's the downside to doing it all in Real Band. No, not the audiophile .... your normal BB will export the files in WAV format. Real Band is a DAW and you are free to use it in that manner. It can generate more tracks than BB will do, and tracks outside of the style you selected in BB. For example, if you want to use LA Hard Rock style, you get guitars, bass, and drums. But in RB you can add things like fiddle, steel, etc to the style. I have a number of songs where that exact thing was done. Doing it on the computer..... yeah, you might not be a techie but there is a certain amount of knowing the computer and how to work with it that is required to get to the "pro" levels with your music.
Last edited by Guitarhacker; 05/08/20 09:09 AM.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
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Using a DAW is not that difficult. The hard part is understanding music and what it is you want out of it. A lot of people get stand-offish when it comes to technology but if you know what you want out of it then half the issues are gone.
From my perspective using a DAW seems easier than understanding a keyboard. There is more flexibility in a DAW. I would not recommend getting into Reaper for example as a DAW to initially learn in. But there are many good DAWs out there and some are free with really good features and lots of really good videos about teaching you how to use them. If you are on a PC then Cakewalk by BandLab is a good place to start. Using the basics of Cakewalk is not really that difficult.
However, if you want your music to sound like it is made by a pro you need several things. A good knowledge of music and sound is the most important, a really good understanding of arranging, a good feel for sound and reasonable understanding of your DAW. You don’t need to understand every feature of a DAW but just the parts you use.
My thoughts
Tony
HP i7-4770 16GB 1TB SSD, Win 10 Home,
Focusrite 2i2 3rd Gen, Launchkey 61, Maton CW80, Telecaster, Ovation Elite TX, Yamaha Pacifica 612
BB 2022(912) RB 2022(2), CakeWalk, Reaper 6, Audacity, Melodyne 5 Editor, Izotope Music Production Suite 4.1
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Using a DAW is not that difficult.
From my perspective using a DAW seems easier than understanding a keyboard. There is more flexibility in a DAW. I would not recommend getting into Reaper for example as a DAW to initially learn in. But there are many good DAWs out there and some are free with really good features and lots of really good videos about teaching you how to use them. If you are on a PC then Cakewalk by BandLab is a good place to start. Using the basics of Cakewalk is not really that difficult.
My thoughts
Tony Thanks Tony. I guess it just seems strange and slow to input a bass or piano part into a computer rather than just playing it on a keyboard to put it in. I havn't actually started in on Real Band yet. So do you think that Cakewalk is easier to use or better in some way? I should mention that I am looking at doing some fairly simple music. Piano, Bass, with contemporary grooves and occasionally some layers of other stuff. Also, as far as understanding musical sound are there any resources you would suggest, books, videos, courses, etc? I have had courses in arranging at the college level, but never anything to do with music production, which seems to be a lot more involved and closer to being a studio engineer or something.
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Thanks Tony. I guess it just seems strange and slow to input a bass or piano part into a computer rather than just playing it on a keyboard to put it in.
I havn't actually started in on Real Band yet. So do you think that Cakewalk is easier to use or better in some way? I should mention that I am looking at doing some fairly simple music. Piano, Bass, with contemporary grooves and occasionally some layers of other stuff.
Also, as far as understanding musical sound are there any resources you would suggest, books, videos, courses, etc? I have had courses in arranging at the college level, but never anything to do with music production, which seems to be a lot more involved and closer to being a studio engineer or something.
Me, it's not about how many times you fail, it's about how many times you get back up.
Cop, that's not how field sobriety tests work.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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I began my DAW learning on Band In A Box and Power Tracks by PG music. The simplicity and the fly-by hints plus this forum and others really helped me get off to a good start. I think PG still sells Power Tracks. It's very easy to use and although it's quite limited I don't think it would bother a novice at all. Plus, it's pretty good with midi as long as you are using a hardware midi synth.
Does the noise in your head bother me ?
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I am wanting to do instrumental music production (jazz, new age, classical) to make tracks to record my sax with. For Pro use, NOT backing tracks for practice.
How do I best use a midi controller like the Akai MPK 261 with BIAB/Real Band so that I can do my music production on the keyboard rather than the laptop.
To your original question; Did you install the Akai MPK 261 drivers onto your computer and connect it with a USB cable? Once you do this and choose the Akai as the midi input in RealBand you will be able you play the Akai and RealBand will record the midi data. You will choose a midi output synth and RealBand will play back what you recorded. Cakewalk by Bandlab (free) comes with Cakewalk TTS-1 DXi Synth. Choose the TTS-1 as your output synth and you are off to a start.
Does the noise in your head bother me ?
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For me, I like to stay inside BIAB as much as possible (even if I use loopbe instead of VST inside of BIAB)... Biab is the source and is easy to use as long as you keep the “sound” department out of it. As the DAW enthusiasts rightly say, the sound tweaking possibilities inside BIAB are there, but to prone to glitches or crashes.
But, I stick to BIAB as the midi source. Using the Conductor inside Biab is great for PRO use and for Live playing. It’s easy to manually repeat or skip parts, truncate or elongate a tune... steer it. In MIDI, switching parts is easy, no stuttering, no “catching up”, no beat skipping.
I use a McMillen midi footswitch to help me with selecting and skipping parts, for repeats and all. Keeps my hands free to play piano or guitar. But the AKAI is an incredible keyboard. I sometimes use the arturia keylab, great stuff, but not really the Akai MPK...
That, and great Kontakt libraries. Some of these kick so much *ss, like Abbey Road Drums or Analogue Drums’ Pizazz, there are instruments out there that never cease to blow my mind.
Biab, Kontakt, Sampletank and lots of nice libraries, from Fluffy audio to Abbey Road drums. Check out these great contemporary Jazz Styles: www.jazzstylezz.com
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... the AKAI is an incredible keyboard. I sometimes use the arturia keylab, great stuff, but not really the Akai MPK...
That, and great Kontakt libraries. Some of these kick so much *ss, like Abbey Road Drums or Analogue Drums’ Pizazz, there are instruments out there that never cease to blow my mind. Do you prefer the Kontakt sounds to the Real Tracks? I havn't bought the akai keyboard yet, but figured it was a good way to enter in the piano, bass parts at least.
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... the AKAI is an incredible keyboard. I sometimes use the arturia keylab, great stuff, but not really the Akai MPK...
That, and great Kontakt libraries. Some of these kick so much *ss, like Abbey Road Drums or Analogue Drums’ Pizazz, there are instruments out there that never cease to blow my mind. Do you prefer the Kontakt sounds to the Real Tracks? I havn't bought the akai keyboard yet, but figured it was a good way to enter in the piano, bass parts at least. They are both good tools to have. I use mostly MIDI and Kontakt is my go to sound source. Many of Kontakt's and third party presets are simply amazing. I use Kontakt with my keyboard, wind, and guitar controllers. I prefer MIDI because I can play what instrument I want when I want it. MIDI is much more tweakable than RTs. I prefer that over cutting and pasting audio, i.e. RTs. But others use RTs with great success and sometimes I use a RT or two in my songs. So it is not an either or situation. Use what is best for you at any given time.
Me, it's not about how many times you fail, it's about how many times you get back up.
Cop, that's not how field sobriety tests work.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
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What Mario said!
Some Kontakt libraries are sooo intricate and detailed. If you use “normal” drum sounds from keyboards or Soundfonts, you won’t believe your ears when using Abbey Road drums or Analogue Drums. Impact Soundworks’ archtop guitar, Scarbee’s Rhodes, Session Horns, simply unbelievable stuff, the Grandeur piano from native...
Mario has an informed balanced view, very open ended, respect... but I have ditched Realtracks altogether and have no regrets.
I much prefer the flexibility of MIDI and sample libraries over realtracks. The charm of real players is, imo, easily compensated by the quality of the samples and the flexibility of MIDI.
The Akai looks like a professional choice to make: not cheap, but really easy to use and with a good keyboard. On the other hand, I once bought a miditech-keyboard, costs nothing, but the keyboard is -unexpectedly- fabulous.
Biab, Kontakt, Sampletank and lots of nice libraries, from Fluffy audio to Abbey Road drums. Check out these great contemporary Jazz Styles: www.jazzstylezz.com
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... the AKAI is an incredible keyboard. I sometimes use the arturia keylab, great stuff, but not really the Akai MPK...
That, and great Kontakt libraries. Some of these kick so much *ss, like Abbey Road Drums or Analogue Drums’ Pizazz, there are instruments out there that never cease to blow my mind. Do you prefer the Kontakt sounds to the Real Tracks? I havn't bought the akai keyboard yet, but figured it was a good way to enter in the piano, bass parts at least. I used to use a controller only style keyboard for this purpose. But, for what you want to do a simple Yamaha (or other accompaniment/synth/keyboard) will do just fine and probably better than a controller only like the Akai you are looking at. I currently use a Yamaha YTP-400 I got for $70 used after my $400 Edirol controller started having issues. It has a pitch bend wheel which you may or may not use. It does the midi input as well as the play back for me to hear as I record. If the Yamaha quits working or has issues I wouldn't buy a controller only again. I will likely replace it with another accompaniment keyboard. There are plenty of these accompaniment keyboards that do a whole lot for not much money. The Yamaha keyboard connects to my computer with a USB cable. The midi data goes back and forth through the USB cable. Once the midi is recorded I can change that, bass line for example, over to the Sampletank Bass, SI-Bass that came free with Cakewalk or any VSTi I choose. I think this is what you are trying to accomplish. I suggest keep it simple to start with. I first went a little complicated only to find out the simple stuff does well enough with a shorter learning curve.
Does the noise in your head bother me ?
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