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#597975 - 05/18/20 06:44 AM [Beginners Forum] Registering Video [Resolved]
Registered: 08/05/17
Posts: 148
Loc: Italy - Milano
cubalibre Offline
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Registered: 08/05/17
Posts: 148
Loc: Italy - Milano
does anyone have experience? I would like to record audio with BIAB and video with webcam. How can I then synchronize the audio of BIAB with the video?

Win 10 Biab 2019

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#597976 - 05/18/20 06:55 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 12/27/13
Posts: 1828
Loc: St. Louis, MO. USA
sslechta Offline
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Registered: 12/27/13
Posts: 1828
Loc: St. Louis, MO. USA
There's a ton of FREE and low-cost video solutions out there. I've been using Cyberlink PowerDirector for many years as it has the ability to sync audio from a video feed (like a web cam) with a clean audio track (like BIAB). You can then use the good audio track and mute the web cam audio for your final video.

CyberLink PowerDirector

I use Ultimate as I don't like paying monthly fees.

You can also search these forums for video editor solutions as this topic comes up often.
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Steve

BIAB/RB 2020, Pro Tools 2020, Korg N5, Proteus F/X, JBL LSR 4328 Powered Monitors, AKG/Shure Mics.
PC: 1 TB SSD, 2 TB HD, 128 GB Memory

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#597978 - 05/18/20 07:15 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 06/05/12
Posts: 10831
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
VideoTrack Offline
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Registered: 06/05/12
Posts: 10831
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Not sure if anything here might assist?
Note: I have not tried these personally, so please review yourself first for suitability.
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#598019 - 05/18/20 01:31 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 12/10/15
Posts: 931
Loc: Cornwall UK
Mike Head Online   content
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Registered: 12/10/15
Posts: 931
Loc: Cornwall UK
Hi

Well I don’t suppose you are looking for or likely to find a standard single clock source generator, on frame by frame second by second time code locked to both on the domestic market.

But as said above the error can be kept to an acceptable amount even by doing both on separate non common clock devices. Providing you take care to give yourself a good visual to sound synch start point, all la clapper board.
Or as been said by using the live camera sound as a guide.
These ad hoc wild tracks can run for quite a long time close enough.
If you do start to get creep try to edit or lengthen the video by a few frames it is much less noticeable than a glitch in the sound.
Have fun
Mike
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#598026 - 05/18/20 02:31 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: Mike Head]
Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 19830
Loc: Marysville, Mi. USA
rharv Offline
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Registered: 05/30/00
Posts: 19830
Loc: Marysville, Mi. USA
Quote:
Well I don’t suppose you are looking for or likely to find a standard single clock source generator, on frame by frame second by second time code locked to both on the domestic market.


I, for one, was surprised at how many SMPTE timing options were available in RB.
It's video handling is lacking, but you can use various SMPTE time options including drop frame etc. to try syncing it to other sources.
It allows syncing to external SMPTE as well as Auto Sync Chase (or whatever for syncing to another clock starting point).

I haven't stressed tested it recently, but when I first found it I remember testing it with various frame rates.
Of course if things get off time, another option is to use RB to simply make a 32 second audio 31.5 seconds (or whatever) to help it line up.

Lots of ways to approach it.


Attachments
SMPTE.jpg




Edited by rharv (05/18/20 02:34 PM)
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#598154 - 05/19/20 01:35 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 08/21/18
Posts: 999
Tangmo Online   content
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Registered: 08/21/18
Posts: 999
I think answers would require knowing what the content of the video would be.

Do you want to record yourself (or somebody else) playing along with a BIAB backing? Will the visuals of the backing (like the chord sheet) be in the video? That's one or two answers. It's unlikely you'll be able to do this in your camera in one step unless you just shoot it and use the camera sound. If it IS possible, you know more about your camera than I do. smile


Do you want to have visuals of something else you can record with your webcam...like your studio or your garden or your dog or whatever? The above answers will get you there. You'll need basic video editing software (and, of course, a way to get your video onto whatever device you're using to create the final video). You might even already have some installed on your system. Others are free. You just need a way to combine your sound source with your video source...and that happens in a video editor.

Do you want to shoot video to cut together in some artistic way...maybe cuts/transitions on certain beats or bars? Maybe added animated text? Something else like that? You'll need more advanced video editing software, most likely. Don't be daunted. It's pretty easy to learn and entry is not horribly expensive, especially if you find you like doing it and want to do more. I know of at least two of "us" that are familiar with cyberlink's editor who may be able to help with workflow, but I imagine most similarly priced editors have very similar basic editing features, even if the bells and whistles differ.

Anyway, it ALL depends on what you want the VIDEO (visuals and sound) to be about as to how you go about it. Describe it as best you can. I'm pretty sure I can give you a step-by-step and some advice to avoid pitfalls to get you there at a pretty high amateur level. I am, however, completely unfamiliar with the video capabilities of RB or various DAWs.


Edited by Tangmo (05/19/20 04:02 PM)
_________________________
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#598158 - 05/19/20 02:52 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 08/21/18
Posts: 999
Tangmo Online   content
Expert

Registered: 08/21/18
Posts: 999
Here's a couple of things to know before you begin to produce your video.

1. What video system does your camera use? This will relate to frame rate (frames per second or fps). It's not absolutely imperative, but if you do every step of the process to the same video system and (thus) the same frame-rate, the project will go smoother start to finish. Do you use the PAL system in Italy? Is that what your webcam shoots? Use that start to finish.

2. No matter which system, digital playback on devices (including streaming) happens seamlessly. Creating a DVD playable on one system with a video created on another may be possible, but it takes longer and the end results (visual and audio) are worse.

It's easier than we are making it sound. Have fun.





Edited by Tangmo (05/19/20 03:39 PM)
_________________________
BIAB 2020 Audiophile. Windows 10 64bit. Songwriter, lyricist, composer(?) loving all styles. Some pre-BIAB music from Farfetched Tangmo Band's first CD. https://alonetone.com/tangmo/playlists/close-to-the-ground

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#598159 - 05/19/20 03:11 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 08/05/17
Posts: 148
Loc: Italy - Milano
cubalibre Offline
Apprentice

Registered: 08/05/17
Posts: 148
Loc: Italy - Milano
Hi Tangmo,
I would like to do this:
I open a Biab song and click on Record Audio. I play my digital piano over this Biab backing track.
While I play, the webcam take my hands on the keyboard, the chords, the improvisation. At end I save the audio file recorded by Biab and I move this into a performance track.
I then convert the entire Biab song whith my piano track into a wav or mp3 file.
I also save the webcam video file into a mp4 file.
My problem is to get a new video + audio file in which the audio is synchronized with the movements of my hands on the keyboard.
I would like to publish this video on youtube as one of the many piano video tutorials.

I have a normal webcam Microsoft LifeCam HD-3000
Biab 2019 - Win10

I plug my piano into a audio card behringer umc204hd


Edited by cubalibre (05/19/20 03:29 PM)

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#598165 - 05/19/20 04:10 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 12/27/13
Posts: 1828
Loc: St. Louis, MO. USA
sslechta Offline
Expert

Registered: 12/27/13
Posts: 1828
Loc: St. Louis, MO. USA
Thanks for the info. The Cyberlink info that Tangmo and I posted about would be able to do this as mentioned above. You would load the camera video and the final BIAB audio track into Cyberlink. Then you would do an "Audio Sync". What this does is shift the audio track left and right until it matches the audio of the camera. Once they are aligned automatically, you would mute the camera audio and your good BIAB song would be the main audio. You would then produce the video to a final .MP4 video file.

Go to 2:10 in the video to see the process.....
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BIAB/RB 2020, Pro Tools 2020, Korg N5, Proteus F/X, JBL LSR 4328 Powered Monitors, AKG/Shure Mics.
PC: 1 TB SSD, 2 TB HD, 128 GB Memory

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#598182 - 05/19/20 06:01 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 08/21/18
Posts: 999
Tangmo Online   content
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Registered: 08/21/18
Posts: 999
OK. As simple as this sounds, it may be a bit of a challenge.

Question: Does your piano play the sound of your playing in such a way that the camera can record it? This would be ideal. Or can you only monitor with headphones? This may still be doable, but not ideal.

Assuming the camera can pick up the sound of your piano and BIAB, I'd suggest using the two bar drum count-in (or creating your own at as high a volume as possible).

1. Start recording video.

2. Start the BIAB backing.

3. Get the take you want. Repeat as often as necessary. smile

5. Stop recording video and save.

6. Move to Video Editor.

7. Load your video, the mix, (and possibly) your performance track. I'd use the .wav files as the audio will normally be compressed when rendering the video. You should move the audio right on the timeline to give space for the extra video footage at the beginning. They will be on two separate tracks.

There usually is no "snap to grid' feature in a video editor...a good thing imo, in this case. (They will snap to each other). Using the sound from the camera (which will contain the sound of the count-in and the sound of your play) slide the video at increasing high magnification until the count-in on the video sound and the count-in on the mix are in synch.

This much should get you very, very close to completely in synch. And I think you can verify it with the sound from camera playing against the sound from the Mix. I can't see any tiny variation being a detriment to what you are wanting to do.

8. Trim both video and audio where you want them to begin at the same point, and move them both LEFT to the beginning. Trim the endings as you see fit.

9. Mute the sound on the video and set levels for the mix

10. Render complete video.




Now then. Assuming your piano makes no sound the camera can pick up and you must monitor BIAB on headphones:

Find something that can make a sharp, short sound--like two drumsticks striking each other. Clack on one or more beats of the count-in. Then synch your CLACK on the video soundtrack to the corresponding beat on the count-in in the mix. Downsides--you'll have to be pretty much dead on, and you'll have to remember what beats correspond. smile

You can then synch that CLACK in the video sound in the same way I outlined above, sliding tracks at ever-increasing magnification. Clean it up, and render.

Again, this is going to get you very, very close. I don't believe a viewer will be able to discern any tiny out-of-sync unless your CLACK is too far off. So mind your CLACK. wink

One way that might provide some additional verification would be to render the BIAB song as a video. Maybe that extra little bit of eye-ear coordination might be useful.

Anyway. That's the way I'd do what you want to do. I don't think the pros would object too loudly. They would just be glad they have better ways and higher budgets.

_________________________
BIAB 2020 Audiophile. Windows 10 64bit. Songwriter, lyricist, composer(?) loving all styles. Some pre-BIAB music from Farfetched Tangmo Band's first CD. https://alonetone.com/tangmo/playlists/close-to-the-ground

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#598184 - 05/19/20 06:09 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 08/21/18
Posts: 999
Tangmo Online   content
Expert

Registered: 08/21/18
Posts: 999
Steve has a more current version than I had even before I lost it. If it works as advertised, it would replace several of my steps in the first outline. Still, nothing wrong with a good "manual" verification.

It won't do anything if there is no audio on the video, so my second scenario solution is the best I can come up with.
_________________________
BIAB 2020 Audiophile. Windows 10 64bit. Songwriter, lyricist, composer(?) loving all styles. Some pre-BIAB music from Farfetched Tangmo Band's first CD. https://alonetone.com/tangmo/playlists/close-to-the-ground

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#598187 - 05/19/20 06:12 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: Tangmo]
Registered: 12/27/13
Posts: 1828
Loc: St. Louis, MO. USA
sslechta Offline
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Registered: 12/27/13
Posts: 1828
Loc: St. Louis, MO. USA
Originally Posted By: Tangmo
Assuming the camera can pick up the sound of your piano and BIAB.....

Thanks Tangmo, great details! My last reply was based on this assumption.
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BIAB/RB 2020, Pro Tools 2020, Korg N5, Proteus F/X, JBL LSR 4328 Powered Monitors, AKG/Shure Mics.
PC: 1 TB SSD, 2 TB HD, 128 GB Memory

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#598235 - 05/20/20 03:09 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 10/03/17
Posts: 279
Loc: Ohio
DSM Online   content
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Registered: 10/03/17
Posts: 279
Loc: Ohio
I've been using Presonus Stereo One Professional to do this. (I just bought Cyberlink's PowerDirector a few days ago and haven't had a chance to try it.)

Ashokan Farewell

Basically, here is how I did it.

I used my iPhone for the video. BUT, at the same time I recorded with BIAB. Though I have a pickup, the guitar was miked. Hence the headphones.

Saved Ashokan Farewell.

Opened Stereo One.
Used VST3 to bring in Ashokan Farewell.
Imported the video.

Then I stripped off and deleted the audio from the video. Next step was to offset the BIAB version of Ashokan Farewell until audio and video lined up. Exported the audio and video together.

Very time consuming but I am happy with the results.

Please note, this was my first attempt doing this. Since then I have silenced the count in.

...Deb


Edited by DSM (05/20/20 03:18 AM)

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#598298 - 05/20/20 03:15 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 08/05/17
Posts: 148
Loc: Italy - Milano
cubalibre Offline
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Registered: 08/05/17
Posts: 148
Loc: Italy - Milano
Hi Tangmo,

I'm experimenting with method 1. Stay tuned.
I will refer :-)

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#598425 - 05/21/20 02:25 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 08/21/18
Posts: 999
Tangmo Online   content
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Registered: 08/21/18
Posts: 999
Good luck. Have fun. I'll be watching this thread.
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#598492 - 05/22/20 05:22 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 10/09/16
Posts: 951
Loc: Central Ohio
edshaw Offline
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Registered: 10/09/16
Posts: 951
Loc: Central Ohio
There a a bunch of screen capture systems out there. Basically, run the sound and dub the audio-visual with webcam and mike. I doubt you can do better than this open source product. Learning curve is a little daunting until you get the hang of it. The upside is that once you master it, you wind up with streaming ability and the capacity to record the streams.

https://obsproject.com/

https://obsproject.com/wiki/OBS-Studio-Quickstart


Edited by edshaw (05/22/20 07:12 AM)
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#598663 - 05/23/20 08:21 AM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: Tangmo]
Registered: 08/05/17
Posts: 148
Loc: Italy - Milano
cubalibre Offline
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Registered: 08/05/17
Posts: 148
Loc: Italy - Milano
I tried Tangmo solution 1 to synchronize audio and video.
I had to bring out the PC audio and the piano as well as in the headphones also on the speakers during the recording.
Also on the speakers so that audio (backing + leave piano) could be recorded through the microphone of the Web Cam.
It would have been much simpler to record the audio output of the PC directly through the Stereo Mix device which I do not have and cannot make appear in Win 10 recording devices
My mobo has an integrated sound card and is a bit old and there are no more updated drivers for Win 10.
I'm thinking of buying a SoundBlaster and putting it in a free slot on my PC: Anyway, by bringing the audio on the external speakers I managed to achieve the aim.
I also exalted Biab's count-in by beating in sync with it with a spoon on a pot :-)

Thank you all.


Edited by cubalibre (05/23/20 08:23 AM)

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#598702 - 05/23/20 02:37 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 08/21/18
Posts: 999
Tangmo Online   content
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Registered: 08/21/18
Posts: 999
I'm very glad you achieved the aim. I'm smiling at the spoon and pots, though. No doubt you learned a lot in the process and that's what can be carried forward. I really want to see this when it's ready to be seen.
_________________________
BIAB 2020 Audiophile. Windows 10 64bit. Songwriter, lyricist, composer(?) loving all styles. Some pre-BIAB music from Farfetched Tangmo Band's first CD. https://alonetone.com/tangmo/playlists/close-to-the-ground

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#599389 - 05/27/20 05:22 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: edshaw]
Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 5994
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Jim Fogle Online   happy
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Registered: 08/20/11
Posts: 5994
Loc: Winston-Salem, NC USA
Originally Posted By: edshaw
There a a bunch of screen capture systems out there. Basically, run the sound and dub the audio-visual with webcam and mike. I doubt you can do better than this open source product. Learning curve is a little daunting until you get the hang of it. The upside is that once you master it, you wind up with streaming ability and the capacity to record the streams.

https://obsproject.com/

https://obsproject.com/wiki/OBS-Studio-Quickstart


To add to Ed's suggestion, YouTube has a bunch of videos on settings up, learning and using OBS Project. Check it out +++ HERE +++
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#599411 - 05/27/20 08:58 PM [Beginners Forum] Re: Registering Video [Re: cubalibre]
Registered: 10/09/16
Posts: 951
Loc: Central Ohio
edshaw Offline
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Registered: 10/09/16
Posts: 951
Loc: Central Ohio
That's a good link, Jim. With respect to tutorials, the Open Source has not been known for providing video tutorials. It is a smaller market. Some might say a tight little group of technically proficient users, often Linux owners. You really had to look for good instruction videos. This OBS just might be a sign that things are changing, there.


Edited by edshaw (05/27/20 08:59 PM)
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