PG Music Home Forums General Discussion Off-Topic Recording studios do we still need them

Fun short discussion of home studio versus pro studio. Both sides offer good points and that’s what I’ve done. I have a good-enough studio at home to do demos, but when it comes to laying down tracks for others I go to the real studio.

And +1 for the magazine. That, and Recording Magazine.

This is very interesting, and I actually read a similarly themed article a week or so ago about this.

Love or hate her music, but it's very impressive that Billie Eilish has had the immense success she has, given that it's literally just she and her brother making all of it out of a bedroom. And yet she's won a bunch of Grammy's and had tons of #1 singles.

I personally think with the advance of recording technology and how accessible it is, the days of big budget studios may be coming to a close. You don't need it any more - you can reach the dream in your apartment bedroom with the appropriate setup.

Yep... they are still essential.

I get the whole " but you can make radio ready recordings in your basement " argument. And yes you can.

However, paying someone who actually knows how to do it right, for professional results, is worth every dollar. You get the room that's properly set up for audio, the gear that exceeds the stuff you bought on a budget, and the person at the desk who has forgotten more than most home recording enthusiasts will ever know. Many of the big artists have home studios where they throw together their songs. But their home studio don't look like our home studios. And they can also pay for an engineer to set in on the board for the recording of the songs. We can't.

A classic example is the folks in this forum. Man, no slams or insults are intended here at all. I have heard some stuff on our showcase that I think rivals anything I've heard out of Nashville. Let me pick one person in particular. Floyd recently posted a song he wrote and recorded several years ago. His demo version of the song was really good, as is all his music. Then he mentioned that the song had been covered by a singer from Nashville on one of her projects and he kindly linked to the cover. It was recorded in a Nashville studio by folks who make a living just recording, mixing, and mastering music. There was an obvious difference between the two. In a nut shell, the Nashville recorded version was, shall we say, shinier, and clean, and full, and just sounded like a top drawer professional mix. I'm sure he would agree, and again, no slight is intended, but the average person listening would have easily picked the one that was professionally recorded.

So in summing up my point.... yes, you can do top quality, radio ready music in your bedroom or basement studio with a small amount of quality gear and by taking the time to learn what to do and how to apply it properly. And for our home demo songs and musical meanderings, and even film and TV submissions, that's perfectly fine. But, there will always be a place for the professional studios....at least for the foreseeable future.

Yep it's not impossible to do it from a bedroom studio. Look up Pompalmoose on youtube. They are very similar. They landed a national car TV commercial many years ago with essentially a bedroom production.

Inertia from six decades of recording is hard to overcome and I still like to go with what I know works. In your own home studio, you are the talent, the producer, and the engineer. Possibly also the composer and/or arranger. Definitely the janitor and tech support.

If I’m being paid as a sideman, I do all the prep at home. But then I go into the studio, and I need to forget about all the other roles beside being the hired talent, so my full concentration is on that. They might like my prepared arranging, or have me play something quite unexpected. I can’t be worried about anything but playing.

Leaving aside the obvious question of space, that is if you need to record several live instruments
at the same time you're going to need a professional facility, then any half decent computer and DAW
software will record to the same quality as any studio anywhere. As long as you can hear it, of course.
I'm always surprised at how many people pay out a load of money on a PC and software and then listen to
the playback on a pair of $25 computer speakers.

So, it all comes down to skill. You might be the best musician and songwriter ever, but unless you have
the experience and skill of a producer and engineer, then your song will sound like a demo. Imagine what
The Beatles would have turned out without George Martin and the EMI engineers.

Do we still need professional studios? Not necessarily, but we do need production and engineering skills.
wherever we find them.

I had a friend who had written some liturgical music, and wanted to record it. I put together the backing tracks (BiaB was a big part), and we recorded the vocals and mixed it down in a studio.

She didn't go to the studio just because of the "technical" skills she got from the guy who recorded and mixed the music.

On a prior gig there, he helped her use the microphone, made her comfortable in the studio, and gave her tips that brought out a better performance.

That's why she wanted to record in a studio.

This is an interesting and often debated topic. Here's my dime. (And you KNEW that I would have a strong opinion after all these years of me, right?)

A lot of points can be addressed by asking questions.

"Real" studio:
What can really be done in a "real" studio that can't be done in a properly treated basement? Does a horn player play better in a "real" studio?

Many parts played together:
Really? It's 2020. People have busy lives. You want to let your project sit dormant until you can get many people to coordinate schedules and then pay for expensive studio time when those same people can visit your basement, or record at home, at their leisure and have as many shots at a part as they need? For free. Or beer. I can't imagine anytime in 2020 that all tracks have to be done at once, and I will not even get into isolation and baffling issues. Lay down a reference track, and go forth and overdub my child. I mean, Rog, what have we done, 2 dozen songs together to some degree? And I couldn't pick you out of a police lineup.

Paying someone who actually knows how to do it right - room that's properly set up for audio, the gear that exceeds the stuff you bought on a budget, and the person at the desk who has forgotten more than most home recording enthusiasts will ever know:
Good points Herb. But riddle me this. Does that guy care where he gets paid? His house or yours? Other than mics, everything is in box now anyway. That person who has forgotten more than we know can do what he does anywhere. And for enthusiasts, face the unwelcome fact that you ain't gonna sell records anyway.

Inertia from six decades of recording is hard to overcome:
So more of that "The horse and buggy was good enough. Why should I change to a car?" The "Why DARE try to learn something new and try it a different way" thinking? When a mind stops looking to expand and take in new knowledge or techniques it starts to die. Get me started on people who whine about being bored during quarantine. Start a garden. Learn a new instrument. Learn how to cook. Write a book. Do some home repairs. Maybe make a bookcase. With Amazon and home delivery from every store in the universe, the nice man in the truck will deliver whatever you need to your door. Sit and wallow or continue to grow. Old age is not a valid excuse to refuse to keep learning. During quarantine, I wrote 6 songs. I learned 3 new software packages. I came up with a dozen new recipes. I bought a project guitar that I am refinishing. I painted a room. I swapped out 8 old electrical outlets for new ones. We are limited only by the boundaries we create for ourselves. "But I miss my frieeeeeeends". It is 2020. You have a computer. You have high speed internet. How many times during the whining times did you reach out and send them a link to a Zoom conference? I bought a new computer, learned how to use OBS, bought the necessary hardware needed to start streaming and I will soon start a Twitch channel playing with scammers. I need more tweaks on the new PC to do it, like installing a virtual computer and learning how to work with HTML better to make my fake bank so they can connect and try to scam me. I am learning more about that every day. Only lazy and stupid people can get bored.

Any music project can be done virtually. These guys did ROUNDABOUT virtually! ROUNDABOUT!! One of the most complex prog songs ever. Now to be honest, this is a bunch from Staten Island that are among the best players I have ever heard. 2 of them play with the current Blue Oyster Cult lineup.

We really don't NEED studios anymore than we NEED mail 6 days a week, or newspapers. "The way I am used to it" is far different from NEED. News is available online as it happens. That paper is a collection of things that happened yesterday. Mail is junk mail and bills. Bill pay is available online for those who don't fear technology. And if you fear using online bill pay, once again, it is 2020. Learn. Refer back to "how to use your quarantine time" above. Mastering engineers? Yep! A different animal. We need those. Not everybody can master. But you never have to even meet your mastering engineer (though we will all meet our Master someday). You FTP files back and forth until he gets it right. I don't get why it is such a giggle-inducing sense of tee-hee glee for people here to tell us about collaborations like what happens here. Many of us are computer savvy to a large degree and sending a file to get a guitar part or a bass line is second nature to the point of being subliminal. Again, 2020!!! Time to stop with the "Cuz that's how I done always done it" mentality.

One of my friends here was involved with an album a few years back where every song had "Love" somewhere in the title. The last song was Rundgren's "Love Is The Answer." He had an idea to recruit every strong vocalist he knew to sing phrases on the outro. He ended up with 22 people playing and singing on that song. None of them ever saw each other face to face. I think he told me that song ended up being 120 tracks. He ended up winning an award for the engineering on that CD.

Do we NEED studios, as in "Would music making stop without them"? Nope! One last time. It's 2020.

This shouldn’t be personal but you have made it so.

Does “the horn player” play better in a real studio. I said I do. I do not represent anyone else’s experience. And if you think I’m not highly skilled as an audio engineer or possess excellent home equipment with current technology, that would be a mistake. Plus, the amount I accomplished in music of all kinds during the pandemic so far is prodigious. The only thing I haven’t done is play the concerts that were cancelled.

There is plenty of use for home studios and professional studios, both.

So, bottom line is that you are too stubborn to let go of "how I've always done it"? Got it!

You were an educator and have been a pro for years. I would expect you to be able to play at exactly the same high level at Carnegie Hall and a sampan on the Ganges River. If you play better in a "real" studio, it's a mental thing. It may also be something to do with extroversion. I am the ultimate introvert and pretty much despise having to be around other people. Gigs are excruciating for me, having to be on a stage with 9 other people and in front of a crowd. To the point of hyperventilation sometimes. That whole "makin' the scene" thing may be energizing for you. For me it is energy sapping. I don't know you and likely will never meet you short of my car overheating on your street and my knocking on your door asking to fill a bucket with water for the radiator. I swear if I could play shows virtually I would. I actually may ask to play offstage if our band stays together after having the while summer off due to Covid. SO much air came out of the tires because of Covid I can't see me wanting to continue. But that's my mental issue to deal with.

Also, I fail to see how I "made it personal". I threw out horn player where I could have said guitar player, bass player, vocalist.... A little touchy, are we? Note I said "A horn player".

I accept your explanation it wasn’t personal.

Cheers.

This is an excellent point. The studio is often so much more than an acoustically ideal room with great recording equipment.

For me, learning more about music and how to play it better on sax, wind synth, flute, guitar, bass, drums, keyboards and vocals is something that will occupy me for the rest of my life. I don't have the time to learn to be a great recording engineer too. What EQ should I use on that voice, what mic is best, what FX setting should I use, and so on. Add to that, keeping up with the latest gear, the expense of all the gear, and the learning curves involved.

As far as I'm concerned, it's very difficult to be both a Stan Getz and a George Martin. Some may have that talent, I don't know if I have that potential or not, because I'd rather learn how to play another new instrument.

Besides, I make a little "extra" money by recording studios hiring me to add to their client's recordings.

Insights and incites by Notes

One thing is for certain that you'll see here but not likely in other discussion forums is BIAB RealTracks and RealDrums have taken care of most of the technical issues, room ambiance, interference, noise floor, room treatments, mics, amps, cables, engineering, quality effects, plus the person doing the audio engineering that would be encountered in a commercial studio. Another point, though it appears to me it's not always taken advantage of, BIAB tracks even provides commercial grade, professional cross fades, transitions, solo intros and endings and mixing to some degree.

The material we have available from BIAB audio is post - live recordings by top grade session musicians that are of equal or greater quality of anything most here on the forum would ever receive in a live recording studio using these same musicians. We don't have to worry in any way the technicalities and quality or expertise of the recording process used to create these tracks even though they perform exactly the same as if the session players were with us in any studio, of any size and quality, anywhere...

We have a distinct advantage not available to many home recording artists.

Charlie,
+1

Thank you Charlie. Great point.

Take this with a boat load of salt...

Firstly a caveat: I have recorded my bands and others off and on over the years dating back to the 60's - mostly live but sometimes in a home "studio." I have some familiarity with studios dating to 1966 when a buddy and I leased a studio, formed a "company" (with much audacity) and recorded garage bands. Also our grammy nominated friend Randy Howard was a N'ville session luminary having recorded with the likes of Garth Brooks and many others. From him I learned a bit of the "real" studio routines, etc. But this was back then...

Janice and I had left our band and had not recorded for 10 years when we discovered BiaB in 2012

I had missed out on the digital revolution but upon buying my first Mac in 2011 I got curious about a freebie that came with it - GarageBand. That lead to BiaB and Logic Pro X. I had a TON of things to learn at a rather advanced age Fortunately via PG Music we quickly became friends (real friends) with our frequent collaborator floyd and through his infinite and continued patience I learned some digital world production chops (and a LOT about writing).

Get to your point Bud.

All meaning we've created productions in our home that have been licensed 26 times by a large world wide (143 countries) company Mood Media and several other companies. We were offered a contract by Crucial Music (accepted) and we have songs featured on Songtradr's short curated genre playlists. Braggadocio? Zero intention. Only that all of these productions use multiple RT's and RD's and were done at home by what some would consider, perhaps rightfully, rank amateurs. Would they have been better done in a "real" studio? I guess so dependent upon how we define "better." And if done in a studio I suppose they would meet whatever some folk's perception is of a "real" studio sound. I'm not naive enough to say they are comparable but they work for us and apparently for a lot of folks who pay us to use them.

I say go with whatever fits your wallet and comfort zone.

Bud

Just set up my little home studio not so long ago and love it.

If trying to lay down a few tracks I can take as much time as I like, and believe you me, it does take quite a few takes to get it right.

Would cost me a fortune if hiring a real studio, but then I am not a pro.

Its an interesting thread.

I think all of this becomes a question of money and what the end product needs to be.

If money was no question I find it a lot more fun to be in a studio in LA or Fort Worth or Nashville...you get the picture.

Having a great studio session player like someone you never heard of or someone like Brent Mason is a real experience.

Fifteen of us flew into Dallas one evening and spent all night and half the next day creating a song that meant absolutely nothing to anyone else. We drank a few beers and had a wonderful time. It is a totally different experience when all you have to do is play and let the engineer deal with all those bells and power faders...lol

I think it goes without saying I can get a more technically correct recording from Sony studio that uncle Joe's Pro Tools Heaven. The end product most likely will not be worth a dime more.

The availability of skilled session musicians in a place like Nashville or LA is unbelievable.

With the advent of high speed internet and good video programs like Zoom , Skype, and Google Duo, a lot of those same musicians can show up at your house and you don't have to put up with them walking outside to smoke dope...lol

No matter what sort of studio you are using it is a absolute requirement to have really good musicians. It matters little if they come out of BIAB or your next door neighbor. And yes I know some less than skillful musicians have become well known but there are ten zillion you will never hear of.

If you are skilled at using music software you can get high quality music at home. But...your computer will never smile at you when you play one of those really cool licks!

Cheers,

Billy

I'm a player, and spend my time improving my playing skills on saxophone, flute, guitar, bass, wind synth, keyboard synth, and drums. I'm also a singer and I spend my time improving my singing skills. I make my own backing tracks so I also spend a lot of time arranging.

I haven't the time to learn all about what those experts do on the other side of the aquarium glass. That's another lifetime learning profession, and if they do their job at the top of their game and I do my job at the top of my gain, the end result would sound better than anything I could do in a home studio.

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