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We have a couple Yamaha MO6 boards
The problem; the synths seem to respond to the first patch change message, but not subsequent ones.
At first I thought it was a PT/RB issue, but the Roland synths don't seem to have this issue.
Troubleshooting steps taken so far:
-Hit Play, which sends first message (works), let song play, sends second message (fail)
-Change first message to be the same data as the second message, to eliminate error on our part of sending errant message (initial change message sends, data is good, but subsequent changes fail)
-Use Event list to manually send the message changes (success)
-Hit play again (first change works, second fails)
Is there some quirk, or necessary order of events to change a patch in Yamaha synths?
Like I said, the Roland (and other MIDI devices) behave as expected, but these Yamaha MO6 synths do not.
Not sure if it is something I am doing wrong communicating with the Yamahas (it's all I can think of besides defect/config issue)
/sign me confused
//I've done this stuff for a lot of years, but these two synths seem to be unique
///Maybe it's just this particular model?
Sending MSB/LSB/Patch data .. tried experimenting with timing (in case we were sending it all to fast) but consistent fail on second patch change as well as third or fourth.
Any ideas?
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
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Did you test from the other direction, by seeing if another DAW works correctly? That would tell you if the synths themselves are just stubborn.
I am using the new 1040XTRAEZ form this year. It has just 2 lines.
1. How much did you make in 2023?
2. Send it to us.
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I have not, but other synths/FX in the same environment seem fine (as I mentioned)
I'll have to try that as yet another step I guess
I was hoping I had narrowed this down to either a Yamaha or specific Yammie model issue via previous testing
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
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Rharv, I not familiar with the MO6 boards but see they have a similiar function as the MODX and Montage boards called "Scenes". These are programmed into the presets and control various functions and send out certain MIDI info that can result in changes like you mention.
The only way around these that I have found is on those presets with "Scenes" is to punch in an unused "Scene" button, make the changes that you want and then save that new modified patch as a new User patch. If you don't save the modified preset, the next time you play it, it will again send out the pre-programmed info contained in the "Scene".
Not sure if that will help or not but its taking me weeks to wrap my head around this function.
Jeff
Win11, Intel i7 7700K 4.2Ghz, 32Gb RAM, 2x1Tb HD, 500Gb NVMe, BIAB/RB 2024, MOTU 828MK3 audio, MOTU Midi Express, Yamaha Montage 7, DX7II, TX802, Motif XS Rack, Roland Fantom XR Rack, Oberheim Matrix 1000, VoiceLive3 Extreme, Kontakt 6, SampleTank 4.3
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Well that is probably going to take me weeks to wrap my head around too.
BUT, it does seem to correlate to the behavior I am seeing.
Thanks Jeff
I've controlled other Yamaha equipment and not had this problem, so maybe it is indeed some weird 'feature' like this on these particular models causing it.
FWIW I've never been comfortable with Yamaha; they can't even start with 1, they have to be different and start at 0 .. <grin>
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
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Hi
"FWIW I've never been comfortable with Yamaha; they can't even start with 1, they have to be different and start at 0 .. <grin>"
_________________________
You have got that the wrong way round!!
have fun
Mike
BIAB2021 UltraPlus,AsusN55S1Tbssd, W10/64,Akai EIEpro Yamaha CVP405,SquireStrat, CoolsoftVMidSynth Novatation Impulse61 Ctr kbd, Cwalk blab Kontakt http://mikesmusic.byethost16.com/
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Yep, really weird Rharv! I've been playing with the Scenes and sending MSB, LSB, PC for some weeks now. Just when I seem to have if figured out, it fails the next time.
What I do know, is that with pre-programmed multi-layer patches, the first layer always plays on Midi channel 1, the second patch plays on Midi channel 2, the 3rd on Midi channel 3 and so forth. This cannot be changed. Buried in these individual layers are CC changes.
The only way around this is to start a new Scene and build your layers from the ground up by using initialized patches that basically have no sounds or CC's assigned to them. Then add the patch sounds and CC's that you need to send to an external synth or DAW.
The problem I'm still having is when sending MSB, LSB, PC data on various channels. The receiving synth seems to be getting the MSB and LSB but not the PC and always defaults to PC #1.
Been all over yamahasynth.com and dealing with a guy there called BadMister. He really knows his technical stuff, but him and I seem to speak different languages! Maybe I should start my question with a "1" or "0"!
Jeff
Win11, Intel i7 7700K 4.2Ghz, 32Gb RAM, 2x1Tb HD, 500Gb NVMe, BIAB/RB 2024, MOTU 828MK3 audio, MOTU Midi Express, Yamaha Montage 7, DX7II, TX802, Motif XS Rack, Roland Fantom XR Rack, Oberheim Matrix 1000, VoiceLive3 Extreme, Kontakt 6, SampleTank 4.3
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OK, now I think you may be talking about Performance patches when you say Scenes.
I never got those working as expected on these synths except to save what I wanted from the 'performance' to its own 'patch'.
Then I could get it to change, but only once in a song.
And yes, Mike, you are right, I said it backwards above. Point is they have to be different than everyone else..
Wish I had one of the files here so I could post it and have you look at it, being a Yamaha guy.
Make your sound your own!
.. I do not work here, but the benefits are still awesome
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Biggest mistake I ever made was buying the original Motif. Fortunately it was my employer's money at the time for my use in their lab, but what an enormous headache.
Sounded great. Logic in the UI and the manual simply alien to me.
Never again.
Yamaha low-end mixers. Everyone in the world that uses a mixer, knows what the mute button is for on a channel. Yamaha - they have to put an 'on' button in their stuff. I'm guessing their high end stuff has proper mute buttons, but their entry level stuff - even up to the 32 channel board I used to have to use to mix with at the church I was going to "ON" button.
Was very tempted to pick up a Yamaha bass a couple weeks back from local classifieds. Problem: Yamaha doesn't put their model number anywhere on their basses except for a sticker (which of course doesn't stick on if the person is using the instrument regularly).
rharv, I realize that this didn't help you at all. In my best Bill Clinton voice, with my thumb nestled in the corner of my index finger and the other fingers- "I feel your pain".
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