billy. i'm a tech. i wont comment on specific parts in that build as the parts landscape changes rapidly. a grreat thread to read (VERY LONG) is at gearslutz.com, music computers section forum >"today we build our studio pc" thread pinned at the forum top. go to the most recent posts 2019/2020.
would like to know your needs. 1. will you be useing a gonzo load of resource hogging plug ins and/or sample libraries ?? 2. in any song what are the max no of traks you anticipate recording/playing back at what sample rate ?? will you be recording multiple inputs at a time ?? eg 8 mics to 8 discreet traks sorta idea. ? 3. do you have a decent audio interface ?? for mic's etc etc.
one thing i DO notice. if were me get TWO SSD's , one for win and one to record to. i would also invest in a startech or equivalent box (looks like a toaster.) 40 buks. and put a couple of ssd's in it for fast back up. i have one . great for backing up win plus songs etc. FLEXIBILITY.
frankly i could knock a lot of money off that build by buying a refurb pc. i LOVE refurbs. for 1700 buks i could buy 2 nice refurb pc beasts. advantages are. 1. money saveings you can put to other studio gear. eg low latency audio interface. 2. they are cleaned up to boot fast and warrantied.
the KEY with refurbs is to do what i do. i take the biab ultrapak drive to the refurb store, and test it in store with the refurb i like.
another option if you dont mind spending large is to buy a pc SPECIFICALLY BUILT FOR RECORDING STUDIOS. this can be a great solution. (gearslutz again search "custom pc". lots of companies are on GS.)
anyhoo tell me your answers to my q's. re your needs.
best. muso. ps tell me bout the config of your old pc. maybe it just needs an inexpensive upgrade.
+1 on the suggestion for 2 SSDs. If it were me I would also put 64GB of RAM in it. As long as you are spending and building, max it out. Windows 10 Pro will support up to 2 TB of RAM. I'd put in as much as you choose to spend money for to cut down on the swap process. If you max the RAM out you may never even see a swap file! You may have to check what the motherboard will support too. No clue what a 1TB stick of RAM costs, but I suspect there may be a mortgage involved...
I am using the new 1040XTRAEZ form this year. It has just 2 lines.
1. How much did you make in 2023? 2. Send it to us.
So...To answer some of the questions. The power supply in the current unit is from 2009 along with the two 1 TB SATA drives, and CD and case,switches,video card, ethernet card, firewire card. Five year old motherboard and i7 intel.
I installed a clean 2 TB SSD and reimaged and took out the SADA drives back a few months ago because the system was stopping without reason. None of my current virus software can find any issue. Norton, TotalAv...
It did the same thing a couple of times yesterday. Running without issue today.
It is possible but pretty unlikely I may track a drum kit 10 or more microphones plus gates plus midi triggers.
I have in the past recorded bass, drums, guitar, keys.
My NORMAL use is me and one or two others tracking at the same time.
It is pretty rare for me to use up more than 25 tracks
As there is no longer a driver that is stable for my ProFire 2626 I am considering buying this. Nor sure, cost half the price of the computer at 1K.
I can go to 64 gigs of ram but it seems like overkill but could be useful for the minimal video stuff I do.
I will go pull the logs from yesterday.
Last edited by Planobilly; 11/14/2009:07 AM.
New location, new environment, new music coming soon
Seize the moo-ment If you feel like you’ve herd all these cow puns before, you probably have deja-moo
I also was thinking to use this....Rosewill RSV-SATA-Cage-34 - Hard Disk Drives - Black, 3 x 5.25" to 4 x 3.5" Hot-Swap - SATA III / SAS - Cage for backup
The Samsung 970 SSD sets in a slot on the motherboard.
I am also replacing the two 250 HP yamaha outboards with 300HP.. I got no issue with over kill!
Just to make it clear, all internal drives will be SSD.
New location, new environment, new music coming soon
Seize the moo-ment If you feel like you’ve herd all these cow puns before, you probably have deja-moo
billy. 1. have you ever had tested the power supply in your current pc. if its 2009. you just might need a new power supply. happened to me once. if were me i would have a pc tech check it out. 2. if you DO want a change of pc , why dont you consider, as i said a "turnkey option". ie you just "turn the key". everything is included, tested including the audio interface by a custom builder of recording studio pc's. and you get a warranty. and no build worries. yes its a tad expensive, but lots of studios do it.
i'm just concerned. some builds one does diy work. but some have teething problems. also, one want a pc thats quiete. "ssh" lol.
btw. re your needs. you didnt mention any heavy plug in useage. do you use lotsa vsti's and other plug ins ? maybe your occasional "hiccup" is caused by a plug in. difficult to say as i'm not there.
One of the first things I did was check the power supply. When this first started giving me issues a few months back I ran several stress test on the PC. I installed a new larger heat sink on the CPU and that seemed to solve the issue. I also installed a two new Samsung 2TB SSDs and removed the HHD SADA drives. So...I am about 99% sure there is no virus. I did a clean install of Windows 10 pro.
The power is pretty unpredictable here so I have had a large UPS for some time.
There are many places to buy a computer but the one I will build for 2K cost 4K to buy, more that a "tad" expensive...lol This one has run without issue for over ten years until a few months ago.
I have had a couple of my computer friends who are CCIE's take a look without finding any issues. Whatever is going on is intermittent.
I have two other desktop machines and two laptops. They are all running normally.
There are several reasons I want a new machine. One reason is that I built this one in a standard 4U rack mounted case. It only has room for one fan and is not tall enough to put a radiator cooling system in.
The machine has been cycled on and off somewhere in the neighborhood of 5 to 10 thousand times.I had given some thought to using hot swappable hard drives for backup storage but changed my mind.
Thank you for the feedback.
Billy
Last edited by Planobilly; 11/14/2008:16 PM.
New location, new environment, new music coming soon
Seize the moo-ment If you feel like you’ve herd all these cow puns before, you probably have deja-moo
Billy, I just got over a major computer crash. I tried to solve the problem but it was way over my pay grade so I took to a computer shop that I had complete confidence. They were scratching their heads for two weeks. Even though the power supply was tested it turned out that was the intermittent problem. It happened to "flinch" while they were looking at it. A very quick and very short lack of power messed up my C drive. A change of power supplies solved the problem. So even though the power supply tested OK it really wasn't. Maybe you should change power supplies and see what happens?
Last edited by MarioD; 11/15/2003:44 AM.
Me, it's not about how many times you fail, it's about how many times you get back up. Cop, that's not how field sobriety tests work.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
billy. where i come from there is an old truism amongst techs. Q. how does one tell a good tech ? A. the one with many years of experience who sometimes says "i just dont know". thus i dont know how to advise you further. too many variables. plus the tech is changeing so fast, and one can always run into probs on any config. thus you will find lots of good techs are leery giving advise on diy builds.
but i WILL comment on the following. 1. POWER. as youve commented on interruptions both with local power and your pc, have you found any TIME correlation tween when your local power dipped/whatever /ups kicking in, and hiccups on the pc ? IE SAME TIME. possibly, no matter how small , it takes a small time for your ups to kick in. thus a hiccup. are you talking whole house generac type ups you have ? or local pc ups ? 2. THE NEXT STEP. if youve followed my exchanges with simon on here (a very knowledgeable pgmusic staff person) you will see we both like refurb computers. because one can save a bunch of money, and they are cleaned up/warrantied, and are powerfull "beasts".. i can buy refurb "beasts" for 600 to 700 bucks. i7's//xeons off lease with loads of ram, just need to install 2 ssd's and come with lotds of usb ports for connecting such things as usb audio interfaces etc, so this is another option. i always get a warranty , and signed paper i can return system within a certain time frame if i have probs. or if my audio interface wont work. i also make sure i can return any audio interface. i look for in store fast boot ups into biab and my music software. plus i go into rb and see how many traks. action>>test audio performance.
if you STILL feel doing a diy is the best for you. THEN i would at least get into this "building your own pc thread" loads of experts on it.
I have about 100 vst's on this system. 500 gigs of software. I am normally not using a lot of plugins. I have a UPS on this computer. There is nothing I can tell about the timing of the power outages and the computer issue. It is not hard to predict the future if the past is any indication...more of everything...lol The software just gets bigger every year.
I have no reason to complain about the current machine. I built it somewhere around 2008. Replaced the processor and motherboard about five years ago. Nothing last forever.
I got a Dell refurb last year to run a CNC program for my milling machine. It has been OK.
I got a HP Laptop for my wife with an AMD ryzen. Worst POC I ever bought. That is the second AMD processor I have owned and likely the last. Even after I reimaged and got rid of all the HP bloatware and installed a SSD it is still pretty slow.
It is less of an issue to build a vocal isolation booth than try to deal with the computer noise. I keep the guitar amps in the garage. Some of this is not being used at the moment because of Covid-19.
I also build high quality tube guitar amps.
It is next to impossible to to figure out what is going with a piece of electronics without logging on to the machine.
When I posted the parts list I was just looking for general information.
My lawyers wife is a Cisco Certified Internetworking Expert. Problem is she works about six zillion hours a week...lol I have another really good friend who also is a CCIE. I always get a lesion in Mandarin everytime I talk to Wayne...lol
Over the years I have found it is better to find and fix my own mistakes than try to fix someone else's screw ups. Owning boats and airplanes will make you think like that.
Thanks,
Billy
New location, new environment, new music coming soon
Seize the moo-ment If you feel like you’ve herd all these cow puns before, you probably have deja-moo
I agree about the PS. Just replace it and make it bigger than you think you need. They're not that expensive. Otherwise I would change the whole build to the new AMD Ryzen processor. They're blowing the Intel's into the weeds at less cost. It's not even close, if you follow the stock market this is the reason Intel stock is down about 15% and AMD is up after both reported earnings a few weeks ago.
Unless you have other reasons to have such a powerful machine like video transcoding, working with huge databases and the like you have no need at all for 64 gigs of ram or anything like that. 25 tracks of audio and a few plugins is nothing. That can be run perfectly on a Surface Go with that weak Intel M processor and 8 gigs of ram. If you don't believe that check out the Molten Music videos about music production on various Surface tablets. He got something like 75 tracks all running plugins using an audio test file using a bunch of daws like Pro Tools, Abelton, Studio One etc on that stupid little Surface Go.
Biab can only use a fraction of what you're talking about. We've all done lots of tests on this over the years checking on Biab generation times on different systems. Once you get to a late model i5, 8 gigs of ram or better, the generation times rendering 7 RT's on a song with say 200 bars is roughly 10 seconds or so. Some might get 8 seconds, some 12, that's it. A monster machine does nothing to speed that up. The only reason for lots of ram in audio DAW work is when you're using a big sample based sound library like Kontakt or Sampletank and you're loading 40 tracks of samples into RAM for fast playback and rendering. Then you could need 50-60 gigs of RAM. You're talking about a few tracks at a time that may need a few gigs at the most.
Check out the new Ryzens vs Intel on YT, you'll be shocked. Especially for high end gaming, it's not just a few percent better it's like 20-25% better and faster. And cheaper. And, not just the CPU, it's much less for the mobo's as well. We all used to think AMD was the cheaper weak sister to Intel. That's history now and from what I've read that's not going to change anytime soon because Intel has boxed themselves into a bit of a corner.
I missed your comment about having two Ryzens and they were both crap. Can't comment on that much but I can say I built my own desktop office machine 3 years ago using the early generation Ryzen 3000 something chip with 16 gigs RAM and it's been fast and perfect. Those are old chips now, the new ones were just released over the last few months.
I use it to log into the office network. As a test at the time I plugged in my Biab HD and it gave me the same generation times I get on my now 6-7 years old i7 with 16 gigs of RAM I use in my little home studio. The full specs on that are in my sig.
There are other things I am doing on the computer beside music. Video for one thing.
Everyone I talk too is saying how good the new AMD Ryzen processors are. The two I have bought have been real disappointments. Perhaps the issues had nothing to do with the processor.
Anyone here actually running a Ryzen 9?
No one here seems to understand the limits of a 4U rack mount case. There is no room to install a larger power supply. There is no place to install another fan without machining the top of the case.
I don't know what I may want to do with a computer in the near future so I set a budget of around $2000 and want the best machine I can build for that amount of money.
My current decision is about which processor and a motherboard. If AMD is truly better then that is what I want. I don't care if it is cheaper or more expensive. Cost is not the driving factor to some extent.
Billy
New location, new environment, new music coming soon
Seize the moo-ment If you feel like you’ve herd all these cow puns before, you probably have deja-moo
Bob, I will always disagree with anybody who says more RAM is overkill or anything similar to that. Since programs run in RAM, if you tend to have 6-7 programs running, you are increasing the demand for a swap operation that eats CPU cycles. As it is I have a hard drive dedicated for JUST the swap file. I don't want my system using the C drive for virtual RAM. And even on the 64 GB computer I run a lot of programs at once and want to keep the swap operation to a minimum. There is a lot of misunderstanding in the general public about RAM and swapping to virtual RAM.
Right now on a "nothing" sort of day I have 2 browsers running, a word pro and a spreadsheet program, and 2 video camera monitoring software.
I am actually thoroughly amazed at how many people don't know what RAM REALLY does. Just like how people think their hard drives are "memory". Man I used to make a lot of money off people like that!!
Last edited by eddie1261; 11/16/2010:27 AM.
I am using the new 1040XTRAEZ form this year. It has just 2 lines.
1. How much did you make in 2023? 2. Send it to us.
Hey Eddie, can you show me where the any key is?...lol
On a serious note, ram is pretty cheap nowadays. Same with high quality SSD's.
A little story about going cheap.
One of my fishing buddies decided he would buy a LP 1200 deep drop reel and a custom rod from the same builder I use. He cried the blues about the cost of the braided line but got it anyway. He refused to spend the $5 dollars a good snap swivel cost.
The first Sword fish we got to the boat broke the cheap snap swivel and we lost the fish.
$4000 for the reel, $700 for the rod, $300 for the line, $30 for the leader, $200 worth of bait, $1000 worth of fuel, ice, food, wear and tear on the boat, 100 miles of beating me around the ocean and then total failure over a damn $5 dollar snap swivel.
New location, new environment, new music coming soon
Seize the moo-ment If you feel like you’ve herd all these cow puns before, you probably have deja-moo
I'm aware of all that Eddie, I just don't work like that but since you do great, the more RAM the better. If I start a project which would be music 90% of the time and some video editing maybe 10% I close all other programs down. Just habit I guess. Since this is a music production forum I'm focused on that. Don't forget, the more stuff that's running when you're trying to record, mix, render audio the more chances of getting glitches. It's stuff like that that causes so many threads that go on and on here until finally at the end the person comes clean with something like what you're doing. They shut the crap down, clean the system up and all is well but it takes days sometimes to finally dig it out of the guy.
Many, many problems are also caused by people who "think" they're computer pro's who constantly tweak the crap out of their systems, add 3rd party stuff that's supposed to "help" and the next thing they know their audio is a mess. I've never, ever had any problems at all with my computer based audio setups in 15 years because I run a rock stock Windows system. No tweaks, no outside crap, no nothing. I let MS do automatic updates and that's it. Andrew confirmed that a few years ago when he answered the question who has the most problems with their systems? It was those guys who think they know better.
Hey Eddie, can you show me where the any key is?...lol
Next to the Easy button.
My favorite is the people who only 2 things and they answer every question with those 2 things. One is to "defrag your hard drive". Well, let's look at that. Defragmentation pulls pieces of a file and rewrites them in a contiguous manner. Now, what do those files do? They load. When you are done, they save. They don't go back and forth during operation. So what does the state of the hard drive have to do with OPERATION? It has to do with storage and loading time. But that apparently makes them think they know computers.
The other is "update your drivers." Again, let's look at that. The driver you have worked YESTERDAY. And the day before, and the day before that. Computer logic and troubleshooting does not contain the word "something" or the word "messed up", as in "Something could have messed up your driver." No. Just no. And because a company releases and updated driver does NOT means that the old driver will not continue to function. It may have fixed some minor issue, but if your driver is working fine, was working fine yesterday and the day before, there is NO NEED to run out and update a working driver. Driver fixes are for when something that worked yesterday stops working. But again, people who want to seem "in the know" drop that cliche regularly. Most can't give a working definition of what a driver is, but they know that if you update them your whole computer world gets sunny again!!
The memory issue will always be debated. To apply it to this place, let me offer this nugget to think about. When you regenerate something, this software saves undo data. In a buffer. A buffer consumes memory. I can work on my downstairs computer with 16GB and on my upstairs computer with 64GB, and upstairs I can do FAR many of those regens and saves of undo files before the program say "no mas". Eventually those buffers fill up and the program crashes. Rebooting to clear the memory registers fixes the problem, and on you go.
This is similar in concept to cars going 100 mph. Any car will go 100. The difference is how long it takes to get there and how long you can run at 100. You can use an i3 with 4GB of RAM and surf just fine. It's when you start taxing it that things go south.
I actually had a guy tell me once as I was sitting at his computer that "The error said something about a page error and I wasn't even printing anything!" I was really tempted to tell him to box the thing up and return it to the store because he was too stupid to own a computer.
My best moment ever was the day that I was fixing a very badly infected computer and as I scanned it kept directing me to 3 specific and very deeply buried directories. As I sat there working the woman never put down her bible and rosary, and the whole room was all Jesus pictures and crosses and stuff. When the AV program quit I looked at those directories and found a bunch of files named things like bhhgsdhjgjhasg.mp4 or .mov and I said "The viruses seem to be attached to files in that directory. Let me see what's going on." And I launched one to find some of the most explicit [*****] I had ever seen. I knew immediately what the story was, but she said "Open a few more of those. So I opened 4 random files in those directories, and they were all the same thing. She said "Excuse me while I make a quick call." and she called him and said "Hey the computer guy is here and he found a bunch of virus infected files. Do you mind of we erase all of your [*****] because that's where they are." And then a pause. And then "Oh you bet we will talk about it later." So I erased almost 6 GIGABYTES of [*****] and the computer was fine after that. I have never felt so bad for a customer.
Last edited by eddie1261; 11/16/2011:48 AM.
I am using the new 1040XTRAEZ form this year. It has just 2 lines.
1. How much did you make in 2023? 2. Send it to us.
There are other things I am doing on the computer beside music. Video for one thing. ...I don't know what I may want to do with a computer in the near future so I set a budget of around $2000 and want the best machine I can build for that amount of money.
I was in a similar situation. I've mostly got Dell refurbs for years and wanted to upgrade my Dell Precision T5400 Engineering Workstation a couple of years ago. I too do video editing and also fly flight simulators (Big resource hog). It would take about 30-45 minutes to render a 5 minute 4K video even though the specs were good. I got real lucky on Ebay and found a Dell Precision 7920 Engineering Workstation (basically a server in a PC case) that had stacked features in which it would have cost about $10K at retail price. I found it from a reputable seller and was able to get it for $3K. That 5 minute 4K video now takes only about a minute or two to render. Lots of time saving. Going from 8 to 64 cores really helped on that. Needless to say that flight simming and music production are a breeze on this monster. Once the pricing comes down a little, I could even expand on the CPUs but I think I future proofed it by getting what I did. I shouldn't have to upgrade for years.
Basic specs: 128 GB RAM (2) Intel Xeon Platinum 8153 CPUs @ 2 GHz each, 16 cores each processor for 32 cores total, 64 cores including logical. NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1070 Graphics card - Barely wedged that in the case. C:\ 1TB SSD - Operating System & Apps D:\ 2TB HDD - Media Storage E:\ 250GB SSD - Working drive for music/video projects
There are other things I am doing on the computer beside music. Video for one thing. ...I don't know what I may want to do with a computer in the near future so I set a budget of around $2000 and want the best machine I can build for that amount of money.
I was in a similar situation. I've mostly got Dell refurbs for years and wanted to upgrade my Dell Precision T5400 Engineering Workstation a couple of years ago. I too do video editing and also fly flight simulators (Big resource hog). It would take about 30-45 minutes to render a 5 minute 4K video even though the specs were good. I got real lucky on Ebay and found a Dell Precision 7920 Engineering Workstation (basically a server in a PC case) that had stacked features in which it would have cost about $10K at retail price. I found it from a reputable seller and was able to get it for $3K. That 5 minute 4K video now takes only about a minute or two to render. Lots of time saving. Going from 8 to 64 cores really helped on that. Needless to say that flight simming and music production are a breeze on this monster. Once the pricing comes down a little, I could even expand on the CPUs but I think I future proofed it by getting what I did. I shouldn't have to upgrade for years.
Basic specs: 128 GB RAM (2) Intel Xeon Platinum 8153 CPUs @ 2 GHz each, 16 cores each processor for 32 cores total, 64 cores including logical. NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1070 Graphics card - Barely wedged that in the case. C:\ 1TB SSD - Operating System & Apps D:\ 2TB HDD - Media Storage E:\ 250GB SSD - Working drive for music/video projects
This is a really good idea when buying a used machine. There are a lot of corporate places selling off machines of this type. A lot of times the want to move off the Microsoft platform and go to something much more professional like UNIX. If it is mission critical it is probably not running on Windows.
sslecta. omg WELL DONE . do me a favour would you ?? call it tech curiosity. pretty please. lol.
please open up realband and action>> test audio performance. tell me how many traks that beast will do reported by rb will you ?? i bet its huge.
re unix. i would love to see a baby distro OS that ran biab/rb/reaper. well actually what i want is the two major win/apple platforms OS's to be way leaned down to be offered as a pro audio OS. as an option. get rid of everything else but audio support.
Interesting Muso. Never knew that this function was available in RB.
Ran mine at 44.1K and the app reported 332 tracks with the MOTU ASIO driver for the average of 3 runs. Switch over to the Steinberg driver (v2.04 that came with the Yammy Montage) and got 322 on the average of 3 runs.
I am running a MOTU 828MK3 interface but not sure if the difference in ASIO drivers is significant or not. Does that mean that the MOTU driver is more efficient?
There are a lot of corporate places selling off machines of this type. A lot of times they want to move off the Microsoft platform and go to something much more professional like UNIX. If it is mission critical it is probably not running on Windows.
That's odd. I've worked for several large financial companies in St. Louis and they tend to be mixed. I've never seen more than 50% Linux machines in server environments around here.
Back 20 years ago the law firm I was at for a few years ran rack mounted servers that had dual core Zenon CPUs. They bought like 25 of those servers at one time and the team doing the installs opened a few to look at them assuming that if 3 or 4 were okay, they would all be okay. Well, maybe not. On one of them the heat sink came loose during shipping, but the server room was so loud we didn't hear it banging around in the case. We powered them up one at a time, and that one was like 23rd in line, so we powered those last few up almost at the same time and walked out to let them run for an hour. In about 6 minutes we heard an alarm and went in to find that one server freaking out from heat. I sweat you could have cooked on that CPU. And THEN we had to hear about it from the bosses about why we didn't inspect EVERY one before powering them up. (And they were right, We were just being lazy.) Fortunately they had thermal protection so the thing shut down when it got to the same temperature as the SUN and the CPU didn't burn up, but wow, that was a lesson. Those Zenon's at the time were so expensive they required a mortgage and they would have been perfectly right to make us pay for the replacement. Remember, we couldn't prove the heat sink came off in shipping because we didn't inspect anything. (Though of course would could have lied... but that's not me. And the largest law firm in Ohio doesn't lie.)
I am using the new 1040XTRAEZ form this year. It has just 2 lines.
1. How much did you make in 2023? 2. Send it to us.
Nice story Eddie. I did replace the Xeon CPUs on that last Dell I had the T5400. The price wasn't too bad on them since it was an older machine, processors. I did see lots of notes on being very careful on getting the processor properly seated before fastening it all down. Luckily, I had no issues and those processors ran well right up to selling the machine.
If I want more cores and processor speed for my machine, nearly $32,000 for the pair..... Not gonna happen. LOL
wow, thats a really really good report. that many traks. impressive. as i didnt program rb or the interfaces i really dont know the driver impact. but your test certainly implies there IS driver impact.
sslecta. thanks for that. those intel processor prices are crazy. we need more processor manufacturers. more competition. i refuse to pay more than 1k for a computer. also i refuse to use usb protection dongles.
but i pay for everything.
my i5/ssd reports 191 traks. steinberg drivers.
---------------------------- basically i use the rb test to give me a basic idea when testing out refurbs and new machines at the pc store. i take along the ultrapak drive with me and do a test in rb. i dont think its a perfect test. but usefull.
perhaps you good folks could vote +1 on my post in the realband wishlist forum where i argue for a expansion of the basic rb audio performance test app. (please give it a read.)
the reason being ive see on various recording forums people running into problems with useing a computer that just wont meet their REAL needs. the idea is a small test app. ideas like an early warning system and sandboxing are also mentioned.
Thanks for that. those intel processor prices are crazy. we need more processor manufacturers. more competition. i refuse to pay more than 1k for a computer. also i refuse to use usb protection dongles.
I agree on the processors. You just need to wait until they become the right age and the prices drop down quickly. It will be a while in my example above. As far as dongles, no biggie here. Luckily, all my software uses the same iLOK one and there's no issues. Pro Tools, Melodyne, etc. I just plug it in when I fire up the tools.
Originally Posted By: justanoldmuso
basically i use the rb test to give me a basic idea when testing out refurbs and new machines at the pc store.
Good idea, another tool you could add to that drive is LatencyMon. It's been referred by Matt and others here in the forums for a few years. It's only a 2 Mb .EXE file.
The only thing about running tests like these is that they are kind of moot. If your system is not performing, do you have to know how much your system is not performing to know you need a new computer or just THAT you need a new computer?
I mean, do you need to know how much you weigh to know you gained weight when suddenly your everyday jeans don't fit?
This comes from a guy who has not work his everyday jeans in a really long time, and never skimped on a computer purchase. Overbuild, overbuy. Don't buy the car with the V6 to pull your motorhome because you think it might be enough car only to find out somewhere 157 miles from nowhere that it isn't. And then pay for a transmission or engine rebuild that cists more than what you would have paid for the V8 to start with. When I built that Pro Tools computer I went right to an i7 (which at that time was the highest "i") and 64 MB of RAM. If I never need that horsepower, great. I want it if I have it. What's 3 or 4 more monthly payments to do it right the first time?
I am using the new 1040XTRAEZ form this year. It has just 2 lines.
1. How much did you make in 2023? 2. Send it to us.
There are a lot of corporate places selling off machines of this type. A lot of times they want to move off the Microsoft platform and go to something much more professional like UNIX. If it is mission critical it is probably not running on Windows.
That's odd. I've worked for several large financial companies in St. Louis and they tend to be mixed. I've never seen more than 50% Linux machines in server environments around here.
Extremely jealous, much better price and rackmount. There you go. EDIT: Just noticed no CPUs/Memory. Those CPUs will cost you.
Yes the processors are pretty pricey.
What I meant about the servers was there seem to be more used windows servers for sale. Sometimes a company will try to run something on windows and find that OS is not robust enough and go to UNIX or Linux. I guess all that depends on how big the company is and if they run their own network.
Billy
New location, new environment, new music coming soon
Seize the moo-ment If you feel like you’ve herd all these cow puns before, you probably have deja-moo
Sometimes a company will try to run something on windows and find that OS is not robust enough and go to UNIX or Linux.
Billy, got it, thanks. I believe the Dell Engineering laptop I have is from one of those big batches of company-returned equipment that they offered cheap as a refurb.
Yes Steve, all kinds of crazy things happen in large companies. Many companies have subcontracted out there IT needs.
IBM came into a large bank and ripped out all the ethernet cable and installed Token Ring when they got the management contract. When the bank got fed up with IBM another company ripped out all the Token Ring and reinstalled ethernet. All the IBM servers and workstations were replaced with Dell. All IBM routers and switches were replaced with Cisco.
This sort of thing happens a lot and all that used equipment gets sold off to people who refurbish it and re sale it.
The idea of getting a $10,000 dollar machine for $3500 is a logical risk.
I got to seriously thinking about buying that sort of refurb. I then decided to go back to the original idea and just build a new machine.
The savings for using a AMD Ryzen does not mean anything to me. They may be better processors but I have never had anything but problems with them. There is certainly nothing wrong with intel.
I have made up my mind to use a i9 intel so the only real question is which motherboard and is the case I had in mind big enough to hold the radiator I want to use.
The other stuff is straightforward...Samsung SSD's DDR4 Cooler Master power supply. Some decision about the best video card for my needs.
Building computers is not rocket science. And anyway, the first thing I always do when I get a name brand computer is format the drive and get rid of all the bloatware.
As to the issue with the current computer, who knows, It is running without issue now, and has for the most part given me no trouble for over 10 years.
Billy
Last edited by Planobilly; 11/17/2009:48 AM.
New location, new environment, new music coming soon
Seize the moo-ment If you feel like you’ve herd all these cow puns before, you probably have deja-moo
Building computers is not rocket science. And anyway, the first thing I always do when I get a name brand computer is format the drive and get rid of all the bloatware
True that! I also like to wipe the C:\ drive every 2 to 3 years as well. While you can do your best to keep your machine clean, it still gets unneeded stuff on it over time.
My thoughts: Power supply is usually the second thing to die in a computer, right after hard drives. Third place is RAM, especially if the computer was upgraded and the ram is a mismatched set.
Borrow a known good power supply and test it in your system. And also, run Memtest86 for a few passes to see if it can catch a RAM error.
Originally Posted By: bobcflatpicker
My computer build list for the last 15 years has been to wait until my son builds himself a new one and gives me his old one.
I didn't realize what a good long term investment it was to teach him how to build computers starting when he was 7 or 8.
Since he's still a gamer, everything he builds is really high end.
Brilliant move!
Originally Posted By: Matt Finley
I’ll bet ‘acting up’ is more likely from software than hardware.
There is a new power supply in transit. Five years ago, I installed the new motherboard and the new i7 processor and the new 32 gigs of DDR3, none of it is mismatched. A clean install of Windows 10 Pro on a new Samsung 2 TB SSD was done by me when this issue first came up several weeks back. All the software was re-downloaded from the vendors including a new 2020 version of BIAB...WIN-BBA 2020 721.
I hope the power supply is the issue and it gets solved with the new power supply.
I have run a bunch of test including mem testing. I ran a couple of stress test and heated things up pretty good with no failure.
The issue is intermittent. This computer becomes a backup and I am building a new one. If it finally fails that will be great and whatever is causing the issue will be found.
Hardware issue? Software issue? Who knows. I also live in the Bermuda Triangle....well...just sayin...lol One thing I can say for sure, my buddy Wayne, a CCIE, who was one of the principal network engineers on the Hong Kong airport project spent three hours the other night looking into the issue without results.
I am done trying to make it fail on demand. Now that I am in the process of building a new computer this one will most likely run for the next twenty years without issue...lol
My only issue is a decision between a Ryzen 9 3900x 12 core 3.8 and a intel i9 9900 8 core 3.6. The cost is irrelevant. I have not been happy with the AMD processors I got in the past but everyone is telling me they are the best now.
Cheers,
Billy
New location, new environment, new music coming soon
Seize the moo-ment If you feel like you’ve herd all these cow puns before, you probably have deja-moo
This computer I am on right now will stutter on bootup maybe every 7th or 8th time. When that happens I unplug the power supply, count to 10, reconnect it, and it boots just fine. If THAT isn't proof that the power supply is the issue I don't know what would be! I have a spare but this isn't bad enough yet to bother with changing it. It's very cumbersome to unplug everything, pull it out of the tight space where it sits, etc... I'll do it eventually.
I am using the new 1040XTRAEZ form this year. It has just 2 lines.
1. How much did you make in 2023? 2. Send it to us.
This computer I am on right now will stutter on bootup maybe every 7th or 8th time. When that happens I unplug the power supply, count to 10, reconnect it, and it boots just fine. If THAT isn't proof that the power supply is the issue I don't know what would be! I have a spare but this isn't bad enough yet to bother with changing it. It's very cumbersome to unplug everything, pull it out of the tight space where it sits, etc... I'll do it eventually.
I would replace that power supply ASAP. If you wait you may also have to replace a mother board, CPU, etc.
Me, it's not about how many times you fail, it's about how many times you get back up. Cop, that's not how field sobriety tests work.
64 bit Win 10 Pro, the latest BiaB/RB, Roland Octa-Capture audio interface, a ton of software/hardware
billy. would you be kind enough plz to post the following stats when you get your new ryzen or intel i9 computer up and running ? (ms = millisecs). 1. how long to boot into win desktop from totally cold in msecs. 2. how long to boot into biab from clicking on the biab icon in win desktop. msecs. 3. same for realband boot in msecs from icon click. 4. in realband action >> test audio performance. how many tracks reported max. ?
reason is, docs have me isolating at home after surgery. so i cant visit my favorite computer stores to do testing.
billy. would you be kind enough plz to post the following stats when you get your new ryzen or intel i9 computer up and running ? (ms = millisecs). 1. how long to boot into win desktop from totally cold in msecs. 2. how long to boot into biab from clicking on the biab icon in win desktop. msecs. 3. same for realband boot in msecs from icon click. 4. in realband action >> test audio performance. how many tracks reported max. ?
reason is, docs have me isolating at home after surgery. so i cant visit my favorite computer stores to do testing.
thanks and best to you. muso.
ps eddie. i agree , get that computer looked at.
Just as an experiment the current machine boots up in 19 seconds with entering the four number password, 16 seconds to log on screen. BIAB in a little less than 5 seconds. All the software loades pretty fast except Studio One and Pinnacle. Pro Tools also loads a bit slow. Reaper loads pretty fast Sonar loads fast. From the standpoint of running A DAW, the i7 intel with 32 gigs of ram has been fine. I am not recording stuff with more than 25 or 30 tracks. I also have never recorded full kit live drums with all the microphones that that takes.
I am in no rush to build a new machine and still investigating options.
Billy
Last edited by Planobilly; 11/18/2007:37 AM.
New location, new environment, new music coming soon
Seize the moo-ment If you feel like you’ve herd all these cow puns before, you probably have deja-moo
That computer will get a CPU upgrade to an i5, and then I will take it in to my guys and have them clone the C:\ drive to an SSD. I also plan to put a better video card in it. I run 2 monitors of 27" and the computer only has one HDMI out, so the second runs on a adapter. I'll have them install an AMD or something with 2 HDMI outs on it. First though the CPU. I checked with them and they said as long as I get the same generation I can put an i5 gen 4 in it.
I am using the new 1040XTRAEZ form this year. It has just 2 lines.
1. How much did you make in 2023? 2. Send it to us.
And this thread inspired me to get some work done. My office and music "scratchpad" computer is out getting an i5 processor upgrade, the 1TB SATA C:\ cloned to a 1TB SSD, and an upgraded video card to add a second HDMI video port so both monitors run on an HDMI rather than one on HDMI and the other on a VGA port with an adapter. That leaves me with an i5 with 16GB of RAM, an SSD OS/programs drive, and both monitors connected to HDMI ports on a video card with far more VRAM than the onboard HDMI.
I am using the new 1040XTRAEZ form this year. It has just 2 lines.
1. How much did you make in 2023? 2. Send it to us.
Add updated printing options, enhanced tracks settings, smoother use of MGU and SGU (BB files) within PowerTracks, and more with the latest PowerTracks Pro Audio 2024 update!
Download and install this to your RealBand 2024 for updated print options, streamlined loading and saving of .SGU & MGU (BB) files, and to add a number of program adjustments that address user-reported bugs and concerns.
Did you know... not only can you download your Band-in-a-Box® Pro, MegaPAK, or PlusPAK purchase - you can also choose to add a flash drive backup copy with the installation files for only $15? It even comes with a Band-in-a-Box® keychain!
For the larger Band-in-a-Box® packages (UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition), the hard drive backup copy is available for only $25. This will include a preinstalled and ready to use program, along with your installation files.
Backup copies are offered during the checkout process on our website.
Already purchased your e-delivery version, and now you wish you had a backup copy? It's not too late! If your purchase was for the current version of Band-in-a-Box®, you can still reach out to our team directly to place your backup copy order!
Note: the Band-in-a-Box® keychain is only included with flash drive backup copies, and cannot be purchased separately.
Handy flash drive tip: Always try plugging in a USB device the wrong way first? If your flash drive (or other USB plug) doesn't have a symbol to indicate which way is up, look for the side with a seam on the metal connector (it only has a line across one side) - that's the side that either faces down or to the left, depending on your port placement.
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows® Today!
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows for free with build 1111!
With this update, there's more control when saving images from the Print Preview window, we've added defaults to the MultiPicker for sorting and font size, updated printing options, updated RealTracks and other content, and addressed user-reported issues with the StylePicker, MIDI Soloists, key signature changes, and more!
A few excerpts:
"The Tracks view is possibly the single most powerful addition in 2024 and opens up a new way to edit and generate accompaniments. Combined with the new MultiPicker Library Window, it makes BIAB nearly perfect as an 'intelligent' composer/arranger program."
"MIDI SuperTracks partial generation showing six variations – each time the section is generated it can be instantly auditioned, re-generated or backed out to a previous generation – and you can do this with any track type. This is MAJOR! This takes musical experimentation and honing an arrangement to a new level, and faster than ever."
"Band in a Box continues to be an expansive musical tool-set for both novice and experienced musicians to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs, as well as an extensive educational resource. It is huge, with hundreds of functions, more than any one person is likely to ever use. Yet, so is any DAW that I have used. BIAB can do some things that no DAW does, and this year BIAB has more DAW-like functions than ever."
Convenient Ways to Listen to Band-in-a-Box® Songs Created by Program Users!
The User Showcase Forum is an excellent place to share your Band-in-a-Box® songs and listen to songs other program users are creating!
There are other places you can listen to these songs too! Visit our User Showcase page to sort by genre, artist (forum name), song title, and date - each listing will direct you to the forum post for that song.
If you'd rather listen to these songs in one place, head to our Band-in-a-Box® Radio, where you'll have the option to select the genre playlist for your listening pleasure. This page has SoundCloud built in, so it won't redirect you. We've also added the link to the Artists SoundCloud page here, and a link to their forum post.
We hope you find some inspiration from this amazing collection of User Showcase Songs!
Our User Showcase Forum receives more than 50 posts per day, with people sharing their Band-in-a-Box songs and providing feedback for other songs posted.
One of our representatives will be happy to help you over the phone. Our hours of operation are from
6:00AM to 6:00PM PST (GMT -8) Monday thru Friday, and 8:00AM to 4:00PM PST Saturday. We are closed Sunday. You can also send us your questions via email.
One of our representatives will be happy to help you on our Live Chat or by email. Our hours of operation are from
6:00AM to 6:00PM PST (GMT -8) Monday thru Friday; 8:00AM to 4:00PM PST (GMT -8) Saturday; Closed Sunday.
Dansk
Deutsch - Windows
Español
Français - Windows
Italiano - Windows
Nederlands
Polski
Português
Svenskt
русский
Japanese
Simplified Chinese
Traditional Chinese
Korean