|
Log in to post
|
Print Thread |
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Nov 2020
Posts: 4
Newbie
|
OP
Newbie
Joined: Nov 2020
Posts: 4 |
I'm writing a song in F major.
That means the A minor is IIIm7, and of course is phrygian!
Using Am or Am7 or even Am11 - there shouldn't be a 9.
(because the 9 would be a B natural which is not part of F major diatonic)
But BIAB always adds the 9 (that is the B natural) to the chord,
which is a "wrong" note - a sounds terrible.
Is there a way to enter a (phrygian) minor chord without the 9 (but still the 7 and/or the 11) ???
PS
Also cannnot use Am6, because the 6 would be the f#, and f# is not part of phrygian mode.
Last edited by blackpocus; 11/26/20 08:13 AM.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,856
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,856 |
Welcome to the forum.
Interesting question. I tried Am7(b9) but BIAB doesn't accept that chord.
I don't know.
BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Nov 2020
Posts: 4
Newbie
|
|
OP
Newbie
Joined: Nov 2020
Posts: 4 |
Interesting question. I tried Am7(b9) but BIAB doesn't accept that chord.
Even if that works, it would sound like C 13. We need something like "Am11 no 9" Like some Songs have harmonies like "Em9 no b7". It's getting close to quartal/quintal harmonies, which btw also doesn't work in BIAB.
Last edited by blackpocus; 11/26/20 12:41 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 11,377
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 11,377 |
Are you trying to stay in BIAB or are you willing to go into your DAW. I think you have seen the limitations of BIAB when you try to specify voicings or these model extensions. I agree with you "...don't work in BIAB".
Ya, there are workarounds, but the bottom line is BIAB was simply not designed for this fine detail. That doesn't stop you using the strengths of BIAB to do the grunt work to layout your arrangement and accompaniments. But this fine tuning needs to go to your DAW. And of course forget about RTs. This needs a midi solution. I write and edit my extended chordal arrangements in Scaler2 which gives you this control over the chordal notes. Then I combine the BIAB tracks with Scaler chords in Reaper.
Just a suggestion others may have other ideas.
Dan, BIAB2024, SoundCloud Win11, i7(12thGen), 32GB, 1TB SSD(M.2 NVMe SSD), 2TB Libraries, 1 TB(WD-Black), 2TB SSD(M.2 NVMe SSD)Data, Motu Audio Express, Keystation 61, SL88 Studio, Reaper
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,856
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,856 |
MIDI, yes, or Melodyne for audio.
From within BIAB, the first thing I would try is to turn off Natural Arrangement. It won't give you all the pitches you are looking for, but it may reduce pitches you definitely do not want.
BIAB 2024 Win Audiophile. Software: Studio One 6.5 Pro, Swam horns, Acoustica-7, Notion 6; Win 11 Home. Hardware: Intel i9, 32 Gb; Roland Integra-7, Presonus Studio 192, Presonus Faderport 8, Royer 121, Adam Sub8 & Neumann 120 monitors
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 456
Journeyman
|
|
Journeyman
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 456 |
Not sure exactly the sound you're looking for, but you might try Am/G which would be an inverted Am7. The notes would be G A C E.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Nov 2020
Posts: 4
Newbie
|
|
OP
Newbie
Joined: Nov 2020
Posts: 4 |
Not sure exactly the sound you're looking for, but you might try Am/G which would be an inverted Am7. The notes would be G A C E.
I'm looking for Am7 - phrygian. Phrygian mode doesn't allow the b9 as extension, but the 11. The notes are: a - c - e - g - d. For example: a song in F major using strictly diatonic chords and diatonic harmonies: the melody could be like: a-g-a-bb-c the harmony: Am7 (IIIm7 - phrygian) BIAB generates always (dorian) m7 with the 9, the b-natural ! (That in fact is an unwanted change of the key) The b-natural in the comping and the b-flat in the melody of course clash and sound terrible. I tried C69/A (c-e-g-a-d) and D9sus4/A (d-g-a-c-e), but BIAB in both cases add the B-natural. (For C69 this is simply wrong, because C6 means 6 instead of maj7 - for D9sus4 it's possible) Is there a way to enter the voicings/harmonies I want and F4 doesn't overwrite them ?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 11,377
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 11,377 |
Didn't this answer your question? .... you have seen the limitations of BIAB when you try to specify voicings or these modal extensions "...don't work in BIAB".
Dan, BIAB2024, SoundCloud Win11, i7(12thGen), 32GB, 1TB SSD(M.2 NVMe SSD), 2TB Libraries, 1 TB(WD-Black), 2TB SSD(M.2 NVMe SSD)Data, Motu Audio Express, Keystation 61, SL88 Studio, Reaper
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,565
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,565 |
I don't understand any of this! But I love Friggin' Minor chords!! 
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 11,377
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 11,377 |
New in BIAB 2021
• Auto-Fix "sour" notes - out-of-tune notes in RealTracks will be auto corrected to match chord tones.
Not sure what this is but am wondering if this is an attempt to address voicings and chordal extensions??
Dan, BIAB2024, SoundCloud Win11, i7(12thGen), 32GB, 1TB SSD(M.2 NVMe SSD), 2TB Libraries, 1 TB(WD-Black), 2TB SSD(M.2 NVMe SSD)Data, Motu Audio Express, Keystation 61, SL88 Studio, Reaper
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,320
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 9,320 |
MIDI, yes, or Melodyne for audio.
From within BIAB, the first thing I would try is to turn off Natural Arrangement. It won't give you all the pitches you are looking for, but it may reduce pitches you definitely do not want.
THIS^^^^ Melodyne ( the polyphonic version ) lets you work with audio in the polyphonic world. I have melodyne and have used it to change one note in a piano chord. It works well for this purpose. Better, actually at removing the note totally or changing one note a half step or so..... verses changing the whole chord.... but yes, this is a solution. Sometimes you are just going to have to think and work out of the box to get things done. AS great as BiaB is, there are somethings it simply won't be able to do easily. Another option.... and I've done this as well.... make TWO copies of the song using the same chords. Change the key signature in one of them to allow it to create that ONE CHORD accurately. Then use a DAW to gene splice the correct chord into the proper place in the song where everything else is correct except that one errant chord. Like I said... think out of the box.
You can find my music at: www.herbhartley.comAdd nothing that adds nothing to the music. You can make excuses or you can make progress but not both. The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 1,378
Expert
|
|
Expert
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 1,378 |
I'm certainly risking revealing my profound ignorance of advanced theory with this, but whatever:
Is your melody (or piece of the melody) in an actual Phrygian scale? F Phrygian?
The 3rd degree of a Phrygian scale is flatted, compared to Major. The III chord from harmonizing a Phrygian scale is a flatted Major chord, not a minor chord at all.
If your issue is that certain real tracks may be playing a note that clashes with your melody, then the above advice from others is excellent. It MAY be, though, that your harmony (or the spelling of your harmony) is more at fault.
https://scottdavies.net/chords_and_scales/music.html?root=-1&accidentals=2&q=C+G+A+A%E2%99%AF%2FB%E2%99%AD&hide_instructions=0
or:
https://scottdavies.net/chords_and_scales/music.html?root=-1&accidentals=0&q=C+D+E+G+A+A%E2%99%AF&hide_instructions=0
Confidence is high that any of those that contain a Bb will avoid the B even as a "flavor" note. Confidence is mixed that some may not instead introduce other undesired notes. Confidence is guarded that any particular Real Track may have some of the higher extension "jazzier" chords in repertoire, but who knows?
And if I'm missing or misunderstanding something altogether, feel free to ignore or call me rude names.
Last edited by Tangmo; 11/28/20 12:19 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Nov 2020
Posts: 4
Newbie
|
|
OP
Newbie
Joined: Nov 2020
Posts: 4 |
Is your melody (or piece of the melody) in an actual Phrygian scale? F Phrygian?
I'm writing a song in F major.
That means the A minor is IIIm7, and of course is phrygian!
The melody is phrygian related to the A minor harmony. Don't forget, the a-phrygian scale consists of the same notes as the f-ionian scale ... But the issue here is, that BIAB treats every minor chord as dorian.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 18,352
Veteran
|
|
Veteran
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 18,352 |
- What are your 'Natural Arrangements' setting for the specific song?
- Have you tried generating the song with Natural Arrangements 'On' and did that change your results?
BIAB & RB2024 Win.(Audiophile), Sonar Platinum, Cakewalk by Bandlab, Izotope Prod.Bundle, Roland RD-1000, Synthogy Ivory, Kontakt, Focusrite 18i20, KetronSD2, NS40M Monitors, Pioneer Active Monitors, AKG K271 Studio H'phones
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Songwriting
|
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 1,378
Expert
|
|
Expert
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 1,378 |
OK, I kind of almost barely understand now.  I still think those links might be useful to you to find a substitute spelling. One link is for the notes listed in your sample melody, the other for the notes in that scale you listed. Especially true if you add a slash note. Good luck.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ask sales and support questions about Band-in-a-Box using natural language.
ChatPG's knowledge base includes the full Band-in-a-Box User Manual and sales information from the website.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Update Your PowerTracks Pro Audio 2024 Today!
The Newest RealBand 2024 Update is Here!
The newest RealBand 2024 Build 5 update is now available!
Download and install this to your RealBand 2024 for updated print options, streamlined loading and saving of .SGU & MGU (BB) files, and to add a number of program adjustments that address user-reported bugs and concerns.
This free update is available to all RealBand 2024 users. To learn more about this update and download it, head to www.pgmusic.com/support.realband.htm#20245
The Band-in-a-Box® Flash Drive Backup Option
Today (April 5) is National Flash Drive Day!
Did you know... not only can you download your Band-in-a-Box® Pro, MegaPAK, or PlusPAK purchase - you can also choose to add a flash drive backup copy with the installation files for only $15? It even comes with a Band-in-a-Box® keychain!
For the larger Band-in-a-Box® packages (UltraPAK, UltraPAK+, Audiophile Edition), the hard drive backup copy is available for only $25. This will include a preinstalled and ready to use program, along with your installation files.
Backup copies are offered during the checkout process on our website.
Already purchased your e-delivery version, and now you wish you had a backup copy? It's not too late! If your purchase was for the current version of Band-in-a-Box®, you can still reach out to our team directly to place your backup copy order!
Note: the Band-in-a-Box® keychain is only included with flash drive backup copies, and cannot be purchased separately.
Handy flash drive tip: Always try plugging in a USB device the wrong way first? If your flash drive (or other USB plug) doesn't have a symbol to indicate which way is up, look for the side with a seam on the metal connector (it only has a line across one side) - that's the side that either faces down or to the left, depending on your port placement.
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows® Today!
Update your Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows for free with build 1111!
With this update, there's more control when saving images from the Print Preview window, we've added defaults to the MultiPicker for sorting and font size, updated printing options, updated RealTracks and other content, and addressed user-reported issues with the StylePicker, MIDI Soloists, key signature changes, and more!
Learn more about this free update for Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows at www.pgmusic.com/support_windowsupdates.htm#1111
Band-in-a-Box® 2024 Review: 4.75 out of 5 Stars!
If you're looking for a in-depth review of the newest Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows version, you'll definitely find it with Sound-Guy's latest review, Band-in-a-Box® 2024 for Windows Review: Incredible new capabilities to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs.
A few excerpts:
"The Tracks view is possibly the single most powerful addition in 2024 and opens up a new way to edit and generate accompaniments. Combined with the new MultiPicker Library Window, it makes BIAB nearly perfect as an 'intelligent' composer/arranger program."
"MIDI SuperTracks partial generation showing six variations – each time the section is generated it can be instantly auditioned, re-generated or backed out to a previous generation – and you can do this with any track type. This is MAJOR! This takes musical experimentation and honing an arrangement to a new level, and faster than ever."
"Band in a Box continues to be an expansive musical tool-set for both novice and experienced musicians to experiment, compose, arrange and mix songs, as well as an extensive educational resource. It is huge, with hundreds of functions, more than any one person is likely to ever use. Yet, so is any DAW that I have used. BIAB can do some things that no DAW does, and this year BIAB has more DAW-like functions than ever."
Convenient Ways to Listen to Band-in-a-Box® Songs Created by Program Users!
The User Showcase Forum is an excellent place to share your Band-in-a-Box® songs and listen to songs other program users are creating!
There are other places you can listen to these songs too! Visit our User Showcase page to sort by genre, artist (forum name), song title, and date - each listing will direct you to the forum post for that song.
If you'd rather listen to these songs in one place, head to our Band-in-a-Box® Radio, where you'll have the option to select the genre playlist for your listening pleasure. This page has SoundCloud built in, so it won't redirect you. We've also added the link to the Artists SoundCloud page here, and a link to their forum post.
We hope you find some inspiration from this amazing collection of User Showcase Songs!
Congratulations to the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!
We've just announced the 2023 User Showcase Award Winners!
There are 45 winners, each receiving a Band-in-a-Box 2024 UltraPAK! Read the official announcement to see if you've won.
Our User Showcase Forum receives more than 50 posts per day, with people sharing their Band-in-a-Box songs and providing feedback for other songs posted.
Thank you to everyone who has contributed!
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Forums66
Topics81,559
Posts734,400
Members38,490
| |
Most Online2,537
Jan 19th, 2020
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Dansk
Deutsch - Windows
Español
Français - Windows
Italiano - Windows
Nederlands
Polski
Português
Svenskt
русский
Japanese
Simplified Chinese
Traditional Chinese
Korean